India, China to hold discussions on doubling bilateral trade to $100 billion

[vanwilder]

fair point,sound very strategic.but i doubt that indian elite entrepreneurs would not care about the money under their nose for driving up chinese manufacture's cost.do you think so?

China's manufacturing costs have gone up and soon it will not be a lucrative area to trade with.

Why increase trade with China?

Let it wither away since less exports will create problems for China and they will learn which side of the bread is buttered. As it is, they are worried with the labour cost and aspirations going up in China and manufacturers moving out to Vietnam etc.

Therefore, it is ideal to put the heat on!

There is already a pressure to stop iron ore being exported to China, with which they are undertaking manufacture. Let them take it from Australia and deplete their resources.

 

[vanwilder]

just stick to what you are,a authentic patriot.

I use Bosch power tools.

They have lasted me for ages.

My local electrician uses Chinese stuff and yet prefers to use my tools when he works in my house.

More effective and so, less on electricity consumption!

 

[nimo_cn]

What is the point of increasing the bi-lateral trade if it only increase China's trade surplus. And all we do is export raw ores. We need to put a full stop to this. We should also make them buy finished goods from India not just raw ores.

Only if you can offer any finished goods needed by Chinese.

 

[nimo_cn]

I am into business. I know what comes to India from China. In my area of business it's fasteners only some special kinds, other normal fasteners are cheaper in India and the quality better, people import power tools, but only to make a fast buck in the booming market. They don't give any warranty on it. Electronic goods, again the cheap ones,.toys, again cheap ones. Welding machines, again cheap and no warranty. Similar welding products are made in india, comes with warranty and used in all construction activities. Chinese welding machines are bought by those who have a small budget and have to basically junk the machine after a project. Usually smal fabricators. Another field is plastics. Again cheap ones.

The Chinese advantage is capacity, govt support and manipulation of currency.

So sad, Indians are unwilling to buy the self-claimed high-quality goods produced by Indians.

 

[nimo_cn]

I use Bosch power tools.

They have lasted me for ages.

My local electrician uses Chinese stuff and yet prefers to use my tools when he works in my house.

More effective and so, less on electricity consumption!

Ray, no one ever claimed Chinese stuff are better than German stuff. But we surely believe Chinese stuff are the most cost-effective ones, that is the main reason we can export loads of them to the rest of the world, isn't it? Not everyone can afford Bosch power tools, that is why China comes into the picture.

What is the point of discrediting Chinese goods while many of your countryman are buying and using them everyday? Do you want to tell us that you are smarter than them, or you are richer than them, or both?

 

[vanwilder]

maybe,you have covered some reasonable points.but i also have something to say.even there are many peasants in the rural areas and migrant workers in the cities living in the poverty,but whoes labor's and resident enviroment is far much better than those who are crouching in the slums\begging on the bombay's street.at least,they can feed themself on their own.and there's not any caste system in china,nor is lacky call.

The only advantage that China has when it comes to selling these products is price advantage which they have artificially sustaining by paying less to the chinese labor who have to work in slave like working conditions and by artificially pegging Yuan against dollar. The moment these two artificial advantages are removed, Chinese products will not only be pricey but also crappy as they are now. The only quality products come out of China when they are the products manufactured by the inter nation companies like Apple, Dell etc.

 

[nimo_cn]

I am yet to see a cheap Chinese generator here used extensively in "infrastructure" development. It's either kirloskar which is Indian or companies like seimens.

The Indian ministry certainly disgrees. did you even finish the reading before posting?

In view of this, the ministry was working on a specific strategy to discourage unrestricted Chinese imports, particularly of power and telecom equipment, Khullar had said.

 

[nimo_cn]

The only advantage that China has when it comes to selling these products is price advantage which they have artificially sustaining by paying less to the chinese labor who have to work in slave like working conditions and by artificially pegging Yuan against dollar. The moment these two artificial advantages are removed, Chinese products will not only be pricey but also crappy as they are now. The only quality products come out of China when they are the products manufactured by the inter nation companies like Apple, Dell etc.

Talking about cheap labor force, India has millions of them who are even cheaper than Chinese peasant workers.

 

[Armand2REP]

Doubling the bilateral trade is only going to double or even triple the trade deficit = unacceptable.

 

[vanwilder]

that's just a formulation not a job,so dont mind it too much.

Doubling the bilateral trade is only going to double or even triple the trade deficit = unacceptable.

 

[amoy]

Even up to date most Chinese consumers rank auto brands like this (though also made in China often enough) -
1- German
2- Japanese
3- Korean
China's homegrown brands mostly are in Class 3

Then why did Japan or Korea or China tried to compete with those leading countries (US, Germany...) in manufacturing when they were no match in R&D? Affter many decades Japanese/Korean goods started to be regarded as 'quality' products and are exported to those once leading countries.

Think about this - Kodak and Fujifilm had to sell films at prices much lower in China than in many other markets. Why? One of reasons was there was a Chinese competitor "Lucky".

 

[The Messiah]

Even up to date most Chinese consumers rank auto brands like this (though also made in China often enough) -
1- German
2- Japanese
3- Korean
China's homegrown brands mostly are in Class 3

Then why did Japan or Korea or China tried to compete with those leading countries (US, Germany...) in manufacturing when they were no match in R&D? Affter many decades Japanese/Korean goods started to be regarded as 'quality' products and are exported to those once leading countries.

Think about this - Kodak and Fujifilm had to sell films at prices much lower in China than in many other markets. Why? One of reasons was there was a Chinese competitor "Lucky".

Chinese still using films in cameras ?

 

[Ray]

How is the quality of Lucky compared to Kodak or Fujifilm?

Non serious and non professionals don't mind poor quality if they can save pennies!

Wing Sung pens of China are no match to Parker, Mont Blanc. Waterman or Sheaffers, but still great as far as I am concerned, because of sentimental reasons since I use to use it in my school days and did many an examinations with them! And they were cheap. Real cheap!

 

[Daredevil]

Ray, no one ever claimed Chinese stuff are better than German stuff. But we surely believe Chinese stuff are the most cost-effective ones, that is the main reason we can export loads of them to the rest of the world, isn't it? Not everyone can afford Bosch power tools, that is why China comes into the picture.

What is the point of discrediting Chinese goods while many of your countryman are buying and using them everyday? Do you want to tell us that you are smarter than them, or you are richer than them, or both?

The people who buy the chinese goods are most likely the 'first timers' who think they can get it done cheap. But it won't take long to realize their folly of going cheap and buying Chinese good. I think everyone has to go through this ordeal to realize how crappy the Chinese goods are. Being a large country, I think there will be demand for Chinese goods for a while before everyone realizes the folly through word-of-mouth. I think Americans already realize it. They won't buy chinese goods unless made by an American brand.

 

[Daredevil]

And people also learnt that Chinese made products means low quality, its only the people who are unaware are buying such products. I think enough awareness among them will keep away from Chinese products. Some 3 years ago, there was huge demand for Chinese mobiles in Indian among low-earning sections but today they are nowhere to be seen. Now, the market in low-segment is completely served by Indian companies, Chinese are totally kicked out. But the irony here is that all these Indian companies get their mobiles manufactured in China but they make sure that they pass quality control checks. And therefore these mobiles are of more quality and run longer than Chinese mobiles and hence they got kicked out..

Also, people overtime has learnt some bitter truths about Chinese goods through the news, be it killer pet food, tainted tooth pastes, melamine laced milk, itch causing chairs and the list end less. But the time is running out for the Chinese goods as people start realizing the real worth of these goods, I mean in quality.

 

[amoy]

The existence of a homegrown competitor Lucky for example, though inferior in quality, made incoming giants like Fuji or Kodak price theirs lower for a market share. Regardless of probably lesser quality (like Wing Sung mentioned), one has to grow competence with a start-up from 'crappy' goods. And it takes time, like for Samsung, LG, Panasonic or Hitachi. Also the presence of lesser options doesn't only provide access to products for consumers on a budget, but also keep those 'superiors' pricing strategy in check.

Why can't India compete with finished products (however crappy) instead of raw materials like iron ore for the trade balance?

 

[agentperry]

The existence of a homegrown competitor Lucky for example, though inferior in quality, made incoming giants like Fuji or Kodak price theirs lower for a market share. Regardless of probably lesser quality (like Wing Sung mentioned), one has to grow competence with a start-up from 'crappy' goods. And it takes time, like for Samsung, LG, Panasonic or Hitachi. Also the presence of lesser options doesn't only provide access to products for consumers on a budget, but also keep those 'superiors' pricing strategy in check.

Why can't India compete with finished products (however crappy) instead of raw materials like iron ore for the trade balance?

there are many Indian companies who are in the market for long and many new are making an entry. the big difference between high level of entrepreneurship is govt willingness to support non performing asset. its damn sure that company wont fall in any case. but in India its opposite. govt dont come out for bailout, so every thing needs to be done by themselves. THERE IS NO BAILOUT.

godrej, voltas, videocon are there, doing good business. many new companies are there who are taking advantage of cheap chinese labor like micromax. mcromax is now going global with products designed in Indian r&d centers

 

[Tolaha]

Why can't India compete with finished products (however crappy) instead of raw materials like iron ore for the trade balance?

Chinese are good in providing cheaper power and infrastructure equipments. India has given access to Chinese companies to bid and win tenders in these areas. IT and medicines are India's areas of strength. But the Chinese government has put up artificial barriers that our private companies are not able to scale upto. This is something against the basic spirit of fair trade. But then, fairness hasn't been your area of strength! ;-)

 

[Yusuf]

So sad, Indians are unwilling to buy the self-claimed high-quality goods produced by Indians.

You probably didnt understand what i wrote. Sorry i dont know Mandarin to be more clear to you.

 

[nimo_cn]

You probably didnt understand what i wrote. Sorry i dont know Mandarin to be more clear to you.

You don't need to know mandarin, I understand you and your fellows quite well. The point you want to make is Indians are performing better, but the sorry fact is you are the one who is concerned with the growing trade deficit.