India-China: The real military equation

[ice berg]

Kargil was 14 years back in 1999.
China hasn't seen a decent battle since 1979, so they don't need to lecture us.

Actually the Sino Vietnam conflict ended in 89 with divisional engagements in 84. I dont blame you though, most indians here seem to think sino-vietnam war ended in 79. Been a defence forum, at least get some basic facts right. Do carry it on with your discussion. :cool2:

 

[badguy2000]

Battle of Triangle Hill - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Attrition must be the Chinese strategy today as well, I would guess. in an all out war.

after winning the battle, Mao's confidence increased much and declared that CHinese troops had proven to be able to pour millions of shells at a small area in days and could not be defeated in the battlefield..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

So, You have no idea about what you should speak out ?...

Lets point out faults in your quoto, In mountain warfare WLR are near useless coz of terrain geography so does UAV ceiling is restricted, All depends over artillery observers who are individuals..

First know what you talking about..

well, UAV and radar can detect the location of enemy,and send the information to artillery by data link or satellites......then artillery reacts and destroy the enemy according to the target information.....

 

[W.G.Ewald]

So, You have no idea about what you should speak out ?...

Lets point out faults in your quoto, In mountain warfare WLR are near useless coz of terrain geography so does UAV ceiling is restricted, All depends over artillery observers who are individuals..

First know what you talking about..

Forward observers' skills essential during artillery training > Combined Arms Training Center Camp Fuji > News Article Display

"The forward observer's job is to provide data and feedback on targets to the gun positions," said Lt. j.g. Darius A. Luna, a naval gunfire liaison officer currently assigned to 3rd Bn., 12th Marines and the officer in charge of the fire support coordination center during ARTP 12-3. "It is critical to have an accurate target location to ensure that the rounds hit the intended target."

Forward Observers Get Hands on Training | Article | The United States Army

"We are all forward observers, but this event let us know how a Ranger and a Marine call in for fire support differs," said Valley. "It really only comes down to verbiage. The words that each group uses may be different but everything else, the distance, degrees and mils are all the same."
At the end of the exercise the training was considered a success by those who worked together.

[PDF]http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a213307.pdf[/PDF]

 

[Yusuf]

While I agree with the article by the Naval Officer, in the event of border war it will be India which will have to expand the scope of war by taking the war to the Indian Ocean. In effect, Indian navy is a deterrent for China where Indian Navy during a border war with China could well sink Chinese merchant ships.

Well the string of pearls were devised by China to precisely beat this strength of Indian Navy dominance of the region.

 

[mikhail]

as I know, during Kagil conflict, India's 152 MM cannon shell stock soon wore out and had to import such cannon shells urgently ........

If India arm industry even can not deal with such a small conflict,how can it deal with the massive war against CHina??????

but you didn't give a simple reply to my question which was about countering Indian Navy in the IOR!well i know that you don't have a suitable reply for this question as every sane person knows that the PLAN can't do jack if the IN blocks the malacca strait in case of a full fledged wa:cool2:r.

 

[ice berg]

While I agree with the article by the Naval Officer, in the event of border war it will be India which will have to expand the scope of war by taking the war to the Indian Ocean. In effect, Indian navy is a deterrent for China where Indian Navy during a border war with China could well sink Chinese merchant ships.

Well the string of pearls were devised by China to precisely beat this strength of Indian Navy dominance of the region.

Good luck explaining that to Panama, Singapore etc why their ships were sunken.
P.S I take it that you dont know that most of the chinese merchant ships are registered abroard and carrying host countries flags?

It never seizes to amaze me the lack of basic knowledge about chinese affairs on DFI, even among mods.

Your guys have alot homework to do.

 

[ice berg]

but you didn't give a simple reply to my question which was about countering Indian Navy in the IOR!well i know that you don't have a suitable reply for this question as every sane person knows that the PLAN can't do jack if the IN blocks the malacca strait in case of a full fledged wa:cool2:r.

The PLAN needs to do nothing. The USN and other countries affected will be pounding you back to stone age.
Chinese ships aint just using chinese flags. You need to stop ALL ships passing through the strait.
Good luck on that. fanboy.

 

[Yusuf]

Good luck explaining that to Panama, Singapore etc why their ships were sunken.
P.S I take it that you dont know that most of the chinese merchant ships are registered abroard and carrying host countries flags?

It never seizes to amaze me the lack of basic knowledge about chinese affairs on DFI, even among mods.

Your guys have alot homework to do.

I know what's what. Indian Navy has seized ships of North Korea with missile parts destined for Pak in the past.

I know what the maritime rules are. During war, india may well use certain tactics that hurt the Chinese economy. Why do you think China is stringing the pearls and why is China looking to make a land route to ship energy supplies via Gwadar port?

 

[ice berg]

I know what's what. Indian Navy has seized ships of North Korea with missile parts destined for Pak in the past.

I take from your post that you dont know the difference between intel concerning one spesific ship destined for Pakistand and thousounds ship passing through Indian ocean every day?

I know what the maritime rules are. During war, india may well use certain tactics that hurt the Chinese economy. Why do you think China is stringing the pearls and why is China looking to make a land route to ship energy supplies via Gwadar port?

None of which answer my question how you gonna stop chinese ships using other countries flags.

 

[ice berg]

There are only one country with balls big enough to stop all trafic in indian ocean. An hint, it is not India. :cool2:

 

[roma]

The PLAN needs to do nothing. The USN and other countries affected will be pounding you back to stone age.
Chinese ships aint just using chinese flags. You need to stop ALL ships passing through the strait.
Good luck on that. fanboy.

firstly in time of war india will warn other nations not to act as trojans - the usa , uk all decent countries would never do so - those 4th -class desperados that insist on going ahead will face the consequences

and your beautiful idea of the train route through pakistan in that sense makes it even eaiser for india

less ships to inspect and if india a decides to bomb - why, after all it would be on Paki territory !! - so no explaining to do !

your land route through pak actually makes things easier from many angles !

 

[s002wjh]

I know what's what. Indian Navy has seized ships of North Korea with missile parts destined for Pak in the past.

I know what the maritime rules are. During war, india may well use certain tactics that hurt the Chinese economy. Why do you think China is stringing the pearls and why is China looking to make a land route to ship energy supplies via Gwadar port?

i think thats mainly due to US. pretty much every countries ship accross the strait of mala, china can certainly fake its ships as other countries ship, or hire other country to ship goods or route the good via ship to taiwan/S.korea -> china. also what if those goods are from china to europe/middle east/africa etc, then india basically block europe imports. its too hard to selective block certain ships, and allow other to pass.

now if this is US blocking strait of mala, no one could do much, but if this is another country blocking area, bottleneck the flow, random inspection etc then alot countries has issues with it.

 

[mikhail]

The PLAN needs to do nothing. The USN and other countries affected will be pounding you back to stone age.
Chinese ships aint just using chinese flags. You need to stop ALL ships passing through the strait.
Good luck on that. fanboy.

yep we have the balls to stop any ship in the IOR region specially those which will carry fuel and oil!and no given the west's stance against communist china nobody will oppose our move not even the U.S.N. as the U.S.A. wants a weaker china afterall and a full fledged war with India will definitely make china weak economically,so the U.S.N. won't do a jack about that,on the contrary it may supply us with the latest model of tomahawk missile to obliterate any PLAN ship in the IOR!got it mr.50 cent:cool2:

 

[mikhail]

There are only one country with balls big enough to stop all trafic in indian ocean. An hint, it is not India. :cool2:

yep it is India!you think U.S.N will risk fighting a major non-NATO ally over its current largest adversary and rival china!well if you still want to live in that wet dreams of yours then God bless you my child!

 

[badguy2000]

but you didn't give a simple reply to my question which was about countering Indian Navy in the IOR!well i know that you don't have a suitable reply for this question as every sane person knows that the PLAN can't do jack if the IN blocks the malacca strait in case of a full fledged wa:cool2:r.

1. how can Indian navy tell Chinese marchant ships,while most of merchant ships ,including CHinese ones, are flaged with other's countries,such as Greece and Lybria....? by flags??
it is a hard decision for India.
During WWI and WWII, Japanese navy and Germany navy was worried by the problem.
During WWI, Germany decided "Unrestricted submarine warfare" and pushed USA to the side of UK .
During WWII, Japanese navy decided to keep a blind eye on USA merchant shps protected with Soviet red flags,which transported weapons and oil from USA to Vladivostok,Soviet.

2.India and China are land neighbour and new Delhi is within the range of rokcets and cannon,let aone missles and aircrafts.

3

 

[badguy2000]

yep it is India!you think U.S.N will risk fighting a major non-NATO ally over its current largest adversary and rival china!well if you still want to live in that wet dreams of yours then God bless you my child!

hehe, guy, Sino-USA trade is 10 times larger than India-USA trade....

think it over with your head instead of your ass.

 

[Yusuf]

Since 1945, the UN Security Council determines the legal status of blockades and by article 42 of the UN Charter, the Council can also apply blockades.[5]

According to the not ratified document San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994,[6] a blockade is a legal method of warfare at sea but is governed by rules. The manual describes what can never be contraband. The blockading nation is free to select anything else as contraband in a list, which it must publish.

The blockading nation typically establish a blockaded area of water, but any ship can be inspected as soon as it is established that it is attempting to break the blockade. This inspection can occur inside the blockaded area or in international waters, but never inside the territorial waters of a neutral nation. A neutral ship must obey a request to stop for inspection from the blockading nation. If the situation so demands, the blockading nation can request that the ship divert to a known place or harbour for inspection. If the ship does not stop, then the ship is subject to capture. If people aboard the ship resist capture, they can be lawfully attacked.

 

[mikhail]

hehe, guy, Sino-USA trade is 10 times larger than India-USA trade....

think it over with your head instead of your ass.

actually its the chini people who think with their ass!you think the U.S.A. will miss a golden opportunity like this to weaken and hurt the chini economy,yeah it may hurt them in the the short run but in the longer run they'll be the ultimate winner as a full fledged war with a powerful country like India will severely disrupt the progress growth of the chini economy and will hamper your wet dream of overcoming the U.S. to become world's largest economy.remember an old english saying "the enemy(read:-India) of my enemy(read-china) is my friend(U.S.A.)!

 

[mikhail]

1. how can Indian navy tell Chinese marchant ships,while most of merchant ships ,including CHinese ones, are flaged with other's countries,such as Greece and Lybria....? by flags??
it is a hard decision for India.
During WWI and WWII, Japanese navy and Germany navy was worried by the problem.
During WWI, Germany decided "Unrestricted submarine warfare" and pushed USA to the side of UK .
During WWII, Japanese navy decided to keep a blind eye on USA merchant shps protected with Soviet red flags,which transported weapons and oil from USA to Vladivostok,Soviet.

2.India and China are land neighbour and new Delhi is within the range of rokcets and cannon,let aone missles and aircrafts.

3

so in case of a war you're just gonna nuke Delhi and you think we won't retaliate!the moment our satellite catches any missile taking off from china,we'll do exactly the same targetting beijing and shanghai!so at the end of the day we'll ensure MAD.if we're going down we'll take china also with us.Period!