In India why does the girls's family pay dowry?

Khagesh

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Band , bajaa, barat!

And the way money is wasted where people only drink Scotch and not eat the lavish spread actually makes me so sad.

I hardly eat. They shoved a whole tandoori chicken on my plate and forced me to eat it and next day I was sick.

I went to enjoy and came out a cropper.

But the love and affection was overwhelming.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
 

Khagesh

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I think both of you have good points. There must be a whole truth that encompasses both your positions.
 

Ray

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I think both of you have good points. There must be a whole truth that encompasses both your positions.
I have seen enough to realise that it is compatibility that makes a difference and not status and dowry.

The old Hindi film stuff of a poor man marrying a rich man or vice versa does not work. Nor does caste, community, religion, status or wealth etc.

Look at Dr Subrahamanium Swamy's family. He is a Hinduvta chap. His wife is a Parsi. His daughter is a Hindu. His son in law is a Muslim. Yet, it appears they are compatible. Total confusion as per Indian standards, and yet no quibble and confusion or divorce.

It is only when families and those who marry have a near similar values, then and then only it works, even though daily pressures still causes issues. But then, that is natural.

Imagine a wealthy businessman with dollops of black money, cars, houses, marries off his daughter with a huge dowry, because of caste and political consideration to a boy, whose father is a politician but steeped in Gandhian philosophy. Will that girl be able to influence the politician to do at the bidding of her father do stoop to allowing her father to make black money using the politician's influence? There will surely be discord and disgust causing great heart burns and dislike. It could lead to divorce. Do people marry with divorce on their mind?

I am a bit queasy when it comes to make marriage some event of the market place or a business proposition since it reduces a very important aspect of life, and I would say, very holy event, to a very low level of a 'transaction'.
 
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Khagesh

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I have seen enough to realise that it is compatibility that makes a difference and not status and dowry.

The old Hindi film stuff of a poor man marrying a rich man or vice versa does not work. Nor does caste, community, religion, status or wealth etc.

Look at Dr Subrahamanium Swamy's family. He is a Hinduvta chap. His wife is a Parsi. His daughter is a Hindu. His son in law is a Muslim. Yet, it appears they are compatible. Total confusion as per Indian standards, and yet no quibble and confusion or divorce.

It is only when families and those who marry have a near similar values, then and then only it works, even though daily pressures still causes issues. But then, that is natural.

Imagine a wealthy businessman with dollops of black money, cars, houses, marries off his daughter with a huge dowry, because of caste and political consideration to a boy, whose father is a politician but steeped in Gandhian philosophy. Will that girl be able to influence the politician to do at the bidding of her father do stoop to allowing her father to make black money using the politician's influence? There will surely be discord and disgust causing great heart burns and dislike. It could lead to divorce. Do people marry with divorce on their mind?

I am a bit queasy when it comes to make marriage some event of the market place or a business proposition since it reduces a very important aspect of life, and I would say, very holy event, to a very low level of a 'transaction'.

Ray sir,

Intentions, capacity and loyalty of Dr Subrahamanium Swamy is doubted even within his own party. To me personally he looks like a new mullah with the loudest azan. Usually such people are put up in political parties by the rivals to basically steal the thunder and create discord. Kejri is a like case who cried corruption all the while but we know his truth. And Vinod Rai was suspected even by friends but Vinod Rai is not flaunting his truth even today when his truth too is known to all discerning people.

OTOH you forget that all businessmen are driven by their existential passion to trade and accumulate monetizable resources. If the country runs on black money they would become black money business leaders. If the country runs on white money they would become white money business leaders. Kind of like in the Army where an Army leader would immediately begin to plan for the destruction of his opponent whatever the kind of inputs he has.

In Real Estate for example about 40% receivables (buyer's payments) are in black because that is the kind of cash people are carrying. A businessman would be forced to plan for his outflows in that black money itself. If the buyer's payments come in the white then the payouts would be in white too and the balance sheet sizes would increase consequently bumping up the securitizable resources. This will allow the same businessman to raise loans and keep up his business. You have to remember, by definition, a successful businessmen is one who uses the other mans money to create the output needed.
 

Khagesh

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The compatibility off course is the most crucial factor in joint success. Just like an uncoonfused mind ensures success, even if in the wrong sort of endeavour.

But in all cases we have to remain truthful even if we choose to speak a lie. :D
 

Ray

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The compatibility off course is the most crucial factor in joint success. Just like an uncoonfused mind ensures success, even if in the wrong sort of endeavour.

But in all cases we have to remain truthful even if we choose to speak a lie. :D
Fortunately, we did not have a chance to lie since we had our heads screwed firmly on our shoulders.

Never clasped at the moon and the stars and instead remained firmly to ground and its realities.

Never took dowry nor gave any. Maybe we were blessed.

Have held our heads high.
 

Khagesh

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Fortunately, we did not have a chance to lie since we had our heads screwed firmly on our shoulders.

Never clasped at the moon and the stars and instead remained firmly to ground and its realities.

Never took dowry nor gave any. Maybe we were blessed.

Have held our heads high.
Our community also has only a minimal amount of dowries. Then if the girl is smart she wouldn't allow even the small amount intended for dowry to reach the groom. My wife told me after an year of marriage that they had planned for a car to be given also. But I and my family was not wealthy enough so basically she thought not to bring the car along. Today when I ask her if her father would be willing to give cash instead, now that I am doing better, she still says no. :p

But yes, a strong man will hardly treat a dowry as an issue and two strong people (man & woman) would make it entirely redundant. However I believe our strength too stands on the legs of those, who invested in us. This strength is not meant for being flaunted, rather to serve. And it is a service to at least recognize that all are not equally fortunate, nor all can be fortunate at exactly the same age. In such a situation if there is a good matching w.r.t. guna-grah-nakshatras-achar-vichar-laxanas-families-timely hex-timely progeny-consents, then a little bit of money should not be allowed to come in the way. How much is little bit should be allowed to be decided by the girls father. The girl's father would in turn be advised to keep an eye out for the strength of the moral fiber in the groom and his family. After all it is his daughter that would be joining the groom's family. Any slack, drop the guy, not worth the risks involved.

What do you think Ray Sir should I speak directly to my FIL, for the car that was intended.

Ok just kidding. :lol:
 

Ray

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Our community also has only a minimal amount of dowries. Then if the girl is smart she wouldn't allow even the small amount intended for dowry to reach the groom. My wife told me after an year of marriage that they had planned for a car to be given also. But I and my family was not wealthy enough so basically she thought not to bring the car along. Today when I ask her if her father would be willing to give cash instead, now that I am doing better, she still says no. :p

But yes, a strong man will hardly treat a dowry as an issue and two strong people (man & woman) would make it entirely redundant. However I believe our strength too stands on the legs of those, who invested in us. This strength is not meant for being flaunted, rather to serve. And it is a service to at least recognize that all are not equally fortunate, nor all can be fortunate at exactly the same age. In such a situation if there is a good matching w.r.t. guna-grah-nakshatras-achar-vichar-laxanas-families-timely hex-timely progeny-consents, then a little bit of money should not be allowed to come in the way. How much is little bit should be allowed to be decided by the girls father. The girl's father would in turn be advised to keep an eye out for the strength of the moral fiber in the groom and his family. After all it is his daughter that would be joining the groom's family. Any slack, drop the guy, not worth the risks involved.

What do you think Ray Sir should I speak directly to my FIL, for the car that was intended.

Ok just kidding. :lol:
If my parent spent on me, of if I spent on my children so that they are educated and not left to fend for themselves on the street, it is because I would not want our family prestige to be demeaned that we failed.

Or why else parents so micro manage their children in every aspect of their lives as they grow up? Do they take it to be an investment or a part of parental love and even duty?

I keep reading in the newspapers of cases where girls refuse to marry and instead want to carry on studying.

Here is a case
15-year-old girl refuses to marry, step-mother allegedly sets her on fire

KOLKATA: Three persons, including the step-mother, have been arrested in West Bengal's Hooghly district after they allegedly set on fire a minor girl who refused to be forcibly married, police said on Friday.

Class IX student Roshanara Khatoon was set on fire on Thursday morning, allegedly by her step-mother and two others of her family. The 15-year-old girl failed to turn up for the scheduled pre-nuptial ceremony, preferring instead to study at that time.......

The attack took place in Khanakul, Hooghly district, some 87 km from Kolkata.

15-year-old girl refuses to marry, step-mother allegedly sets her on fire
So, you see even Muslim girls who are more subservient have aspirations to be someone themselves while parents wanted to get her off their hands.

India is changing.

The rationale for dowry does not exist any more because of the amended Act, where ancestral property is to be distributed equally, irrespective of gender.

In so far as your car is concerned, now that you have cohabited with your wife, hopefully without violence, I think you father in law will give you a car without your even having to nudge and wink if he really feels that you are requiring a car but you somehow cannot organise your finances for the same. :)
 

rockey 71

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If my parent spent on me, of if I spent on my children so that they are educated and not left to fend for themselves on the street, it is because I would not want our family prestige to be demeaned that we failed.

Or why else parents so micro manage their children in every aspect of their lives as they grow up? Do they take it to be an investment or a part of parental love and even duty?

I keep reading in the newspapers of cases where girls refuse to marry and instead want to carry on studying.

Here is a case


So, you see even Muslim girls who are more subservient have aspirations to be someone themselves while parents wanted to get her off their hands.

India is changing.

The rationale for dowry does not exist any more because of the amended Act, where ancestral property is to be distributed equally, irrespective of gender.

In so far as your car is concerned, now that you have cohabited with your wife, hopefully without violence, I think you father in law will give you a car without your even having to nudge and wink if he really feels that you are requiring a car but you somehow cannot organise your finances for the same. :)
Does this have anything to do with our being Muslim or Hindu? We all live within the same sociocultural parameter.
 

Ray

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Does this have anything to do with our being Muslim or Hindu? We all live within the same sociocultural parameter.
You are right.

If you are talking about the Muslim girl who refused to marry, the stereotype is that the Muslim girls are more bound to the conservative form where they have little options but to conform.

There is this Muslim lady who works with prostitutes in Calcutta and ensures their education and breaking away from their shoddy state who has been called many times by the clergy and told not to interfere with the family wishes (mother wants the daughter to join the profession and be a cash cow).

And if you are talking about it not being the parents bounden duty to educate and make their children fit for the modern world and taking them being done so as an investment that has to be recovered indicates that there is no genuine love for their children and their well being.
 
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sgarg

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Dowry is a bad system. It is one of things which needs to be removed from the society. There is no religious justification of dowry. However people give gifts willingly in all cultures which seems fine to me.
 

sgarg

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The gifts help the couple settle down by reducing immediate financial burden.
 

sgarg

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Pomp and show during marriage and lavish gifts are absolutely against vedic thought.
 

Jatt.Hindustan

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Good luck, your 'rational' values go up vs our honor.

We give dowry because we do not leaving our daughters empty handed.

Dowry is a bad system because British said so. I understand your sentiments completely, Gurus recieved dowry so Idc what u say lol

Guru Gobind Singh Ji was married at 11 so gl convincing Singh that but gora sahib said child marriage barbaric.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾ।।ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ।।
 
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SADAKHUSH

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The bottom line is this tradition is very taxing on most of the families which created long term social problems in the society. We have to look at our traditions and weigh the pros and cons of the same if it is leading to girls not being married because of no money for dowry than it should be abandoned. I for one refused to accept or demand even a single paisa and we were fortunate that none of my Brother-in-Law demanded.
 

Jatt.Hindustan

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The bottom line is this tradition is very taxing on most of the families which created long term social problems in the society. We have to look at our traditions and weigh the pros and cons of the same if it is leading to girls not being married because of no money for dowry than it should be abandoned. I for one refused to accept or demand even a single paisa and we were fortunate that none of my Brother-in-Law demanded.
Ok but your decision to domicioe in canada already shows a 2 digit iq level.

What your gotr?
 

Simple_Guy

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Marriage in medieval Europe

The arrangement of marriage was done by the children's parents. In the middle ages, children were married at a young age. Girls were as young as 12 when they married, and boys as young as 17. The arrangement of the marriage was based on monetary worth. The family of the girl who was to be married gives a dowry, or donation, to the boy she is to marry. The dowry goes with her at the time of the marriage and stays with the boy forever.
Famously, Bombay was given as dowry by the Portuguese to the British, in the marriage of their princess Catherine to Charles II of Britain.
 

SADAKHUSH

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Ok but your decision to domicioe in canada already shows a 2 digit iq level.

What your gotr?
Now we have a virtual examiner rating the IQ level of fellow forum member who happens to live thousands of miles away. I am not going to question your level of intelligence but leave you alone and let you do my part of job. Thanks and have a good day.
 

Jatt.Hindustan

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Now we have a virtual examiner rating the IQ level of fellow forum member who happens to live thousands of miles away. I am not going to question your level of intelligence but leave you alone and let you do my part of job. Thanks and have a good day.
You are probably a tamil as no northerner refuses to give gotr. That is fine, it is asur desh.
 

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