If India has to go for a two fronts war against China and Pakistan...

Discussion in 'Defence & Strategic Issues' started by Sabir, Aug 1, 2009.

  1. K Factor

    K Factor A Concerned Indian Senior Member

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    Doesn't matter. Nowadays, with aerial refueling and proper mission planning, its possible.

    Who wants to destroy China's entire industry? Who wants to waste bombs and missiles on cheap battery and ipod rip-off making factories, and the ones making toys?


    Strategic bombers are not needed nowadays, as Israel demontrated during Osirak. They did not have strategic bombers, but they penetrated the best AD in the ME with the proper mission planning and coordination.
     
  2. K Factor

    K Factor A Concerned Indian Senior Member

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    We should also keep in mind one thing that full scale war is difficult between China and India given the nature of the terrain around the border with them.

    We are most likely to see major action with IA armor, AF and Navy in the west, while it will be restricted to limited Kargil style infiltration and fighting on the east with China.
     
  3. Pintu

    Pintu New Member

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    First apologizing for making an Off topic Post ,I am extremely sorry for it,

    I agree on the points made by Shotgunner , according to me the war will be limited , I do not expect it turning into a full scale battle , but it will be limited to short border conflict, however involvement of short range missile and Fighter Jets from both sides can not be ruled out , and moreover again the geographical location (i.e. the terrain and existence of Himalaya) is a hindrance according to me for a prolonged battle between two nations and what TB says , I would like to add that it is not the situation of 1962 , also I do not see any possibility of using nukes by both sides and again for Pakistan's involvement, I can not determine on that , however I feel it might be diplomatical effort for going against us, rather going military, it depends on if Civilian Authority gains full control over Army and ISI.

    Regards
     
  4. musalman

    musalman پاکستان زنده باد

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    If there is a war between China and India. I would say that will be enough for Pakistan :) Pakistan I think might not be involved except for providing China alot of Logistic Support e.g. provide them fuel from the middle east, which is the most essential part of the war. 2ndly our ordinance factories will make alot of money by providing ammunition to China.

    This war will ruin Indian economy so why should Pakistan be involved.


    Other things which I have noticed by the worthy writers is that he is of the view that in case of war Pakistan Airforce, Navy and Army will be easy for India. They are doing nothing to counter Indian threat. "Occupying Sindh and Librating Baluchistan" do you really think it will be easy ????? Especially when there is no sessionist movement in Sindh, Sindh interior and Southern Punjab are highly radicalized with alot of "Allah's " armies :) For your information Sindh has the highest percentage of wahabis in Pakistan. Had this been that easy Indians would have done that in 80s 90s and would not have backed off after the parliament firing and now the Bombay incident. For God sake we flew our vintage aircraft F7 and the next day all threats were over and there was no tension on the border.

    3rdly even if Pakistan gets involved in the war meaning US UK and the NATO minus Turkey will be involved in Indian side, meaning a full scale nucelar war. North Korea will side with China and Pakistan meaning Japan and South Korea will be involved too.

    My view is that even China India war is impossible. India and China are not stupid to ruin their economies :)
     
  5. sayareakd

    sayareakd Moderator Moderator

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    if this war happens then this will be great war (WW-III)
     
  6. Sabir

    Sabir DFI TEAM Senior Member

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    yes, agreed with you. if Pakistan dont get involved the war will be very limited....if Pakistan get involved India's first priority would be to nutralise Pakistan at any cost and that is in very short time. If India fails in it...India has no chance (of course considering other countries are not coming in India's rescue).

    In one to one situation China India will be a deadlock.
     
  7. badguy2000

    badguy2000 Respected Member Senior Member

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    a sino-india war can have 3 mods:


    1. a short-term conflicts like that in 1962.

    2. a limited war like Japan-Russian war in 1905.

    3. a full war like WW II.

    in a full war, India has no chance to defeat china.

    however, if in a limited 1962-style conflict or a limited war like Russia-Jap war, India might win a Japanese-style victory in 1905
     
  8. musalman

    musalman پاکستان زنده باد

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    If u say so :) but I really have doubts in 1 and 2 too. Stalemate yes wining no
     
  9. badguy2000

    badguy2000 Respected Member Senior Member

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    Japan did win a narrow victory against Russia in the Russia-Japan war in 1904-1905,provided with following favorable conditons

    1.Great Siberia Railway had not finished and Russia had lots of difficulties in mass-deploying troops in Far East.
    In fact, when Russia had to ask Japan for peace,Russian still had powerful troops in European Russia but could not transport them to battlefields in Far east.

    2.Japan won the surrectitius support form UK, USA and even China.

    3. a revolution happened in Russia in 1905.


    without any of the above conditions, Japan could not make more powerful Russia to make concession and accept ceasing-fire treaty.

    today, India can hardly have the conditions as favourable as Japan had during Jap-Russia war in 1904-1905.

    1.now, tibetan railway has been finished and CHina can easily mass-deploy troop in Tibet.

    2.I doubt any county ,including USA and Russia, would provide financial support to India in public in a war against China ,just as UK and USA did with Japan in 1905.Instead, They would be happy to watch such a war.

    3.revolution in China is not feasible.
     
  10. Jarnee

    Jarnee New Member

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    Will be total annhilation of 2 oldest civilizations

    If at all this happens, The 2 oldest civilizations of the world , 2 major Races will go extinct. White Man will be happy to the core...we are both anyways poluting a lot for rest of the world and they have started pushing us to adopt to Emission norms etc.
    Dont know why for the first time America is selling technology of its smartest wepons to India?.
    Both great Nations India and China have co-existed from centuries.. there was always great exchange of knowledge and Trade.
     
  11. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    I was guided on this thread.

    I wonder if I have posted here and I don't wish to wade through the 11 pages either.

    It is not the issue of whether we can win a war against China. All I will say is that neither can they!
    To fight a successful battle, one has to have a minimum of artillery fire power, logistics and air power to back up the infantry assault.

    Unless there are roads, no matter how whether infantry captures the initial areas with all the artillery and air power, the artillery cannot move up. Now, there are these Passes held by us. If these Passes are held and not captured, the Chinese cannot move their artillery up to support the next phase since these passes overlook such roads. The deployment precludes an easy victory for the aggressor for these Passes.

    Let us say that the Chinese do capture the Passes and are moving ahead with infantry and artillery. What about our airforce? In that narrow corridor since they will still be confined to the road and just its peripheries since there are mountains on either side, the IAF will create mayhem.

    The Chinese airforce will operate from Tibet, It is high altitude and so the payload will be much less. IAF has no such problem since they will operate from the plains of Assam!

    Therefore, it is a zero win issue with China notwithstanding sabre rattling.

    If India really wants to keep China on the hop, they should do what the Chinese did to India - assist the insurgencies brewing in China.

    And they are aware of the Tibetans acting as the fifth column assisted by the Xinjiang people, who want to shake off the Chinese yoke!

    Where it will matter is the sea and oceans and the chokepoint of Straits of Malacca. That is why we are looking at platforms like the Arihant!

    China is already on the backburner on Tibet and Xinjiang and they are hugely worried!

    If India wants to sort out China, they should do what China did to India - support the insurgencies brewing in China!
     
  12. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Sir, how will India fight on two fronts. One against Pakistan and the other agsibst China?
     
  13. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    We are capable of the same and it has been wargamed many a time.

    The force levels are adequate.

    The terrain is also catered for!

    That is all I would say for the moment.
     
  14. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    According to me, just holding the Chinese is good enough for India to claim victory. For the Chinese if it can't I flict huge losses to India in terms of territory will be a huge loss of face in it's quest to be a super power.
     
  15. SATISH

    SATISH DFI Technocrat Stars and Ambassadors

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    Ray sir,
    Sir you mean to tell me that Chinese will end up like the Soviets when they went on to fight the Afghans?
     
  16. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    That's a wrong comparison.
     
  17. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    I would say that if we want to attack, it is not quite an issue.

    But it has to be in conjunction with many issues that I cannot discuss here!

    Right now, like China, we are interested in our economic development and war is far off our mind!
     
  18. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    If China wants to attack, she is welcomed.

    She will have to watch her back since those people who are at the back are just itching to teach China a lesson!
     
  19. ajay_ijn

    ajay_ijn Regular Member

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    Sir i have a doubt. In the event of war, Is there possibility of using large number of tanks in Indo-China border. is the terrain suitable for tank battles, armored units punching through enemy lines, attacking rears, sorrounding them etc.

    I know that Sikkim and few other areas have such terrain but can tanks move in as freely as they can do in plains and do same strategy and tactics apply in such terrain too?

    also when we look at India map. that narrow piece of land or also called as Chickens neck, between China & bangladesh, that connects north east India to rest of the country. Is that really vunerable. Is there a possibility of north east getting cut off during war if enemy mounted an invasion there?
     
  20. afriend

    afriend Regular Member

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    According to me following should be taken care of to ensure we have a safe enviornment.

    1. Inteligence:- Proper inteligence network should be in place to monitor the defence installations of our neighbours. We should put emphasis on our satelite technology and monitor the movements on a day to day basis. This should be the first step in todays world.

    2. Defence Mechanisms:- We should analyse whatever possible ways in which we are going to be attacked, and put up our defence mechanism ready. This might have done already but it should be put up and upgraded on an ongoing basis. Prepardens for any war is equally important as preaching peace.

    3. Attack Mechanism:- Should evaluate the entire defence requirment india should put in more efforts into buying along with indeginious production, more fighters, aricraft carriers, subrimens, and missiles. And should be starategically placed with proper defence systems, so that we can respond to any eventuality that may arise.

    I hope we are doing stuff to keep india safe. And i am sure we will give them a good fight that our enemys have never imagined off.. but i hope we are all prepared for it NOW, rather than pushing it away.
     

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