IAF Tanker Contract - New RFI out

AJSINGH

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three years and still waiting , good for nothing finance ministry wont let it pass
damm them
 

bhramos

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Indian Refueler Program May Be Rebid

NEW DELHI - India's purchase program for six midair refuelers may be rebid after questions arose regarding bid cost and competitiveness, Indian Defence Ministry sources said.

"The procurement proposal had been progressed in accordance with the Defence Procurement Procedure-2006 and thereafter referred to the Ministry of Finance, who has expressed certain reservations relating to the competitiveness of the bids and the reasonableness of the price," says a Dec. 14 Defence Ministry release, quoting the official reply of Defence Minister A. K. Antony to India's Parliament.

Though the release does not specify the program is facing serious problems, Defence Ministry sources said that because of objections from the Finance Ministry, the program will be quashed and rebid next year.

Four years ago, a request for proposal was sent to U.S.-based Lockheed Martin and Boeing, EADS and Ilyushin of Tashkent.

Lockheed Martin and Boeing did not respond to the tender, leaving only Ilyushin and EADS in the fray.

Ilyushin's bid was lower than that of EADS but the Air Force favored buying the A330 multirole tanker over the IL-78 of Ilyushin, which it had been using. The matter was referred to the Finance Ministry, which rejected the Air Force request, saying the lowest bidder should be the obvious choice.

Indian Refueler Program May Be Rebid - Defense News
 

p2prada

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I see arm-twisting in the plot. The Russians were surprised at the IAF decision to choose EADS. So, it is expected that they leave no stone unturned to force a rebid.
 

abhi

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Russian military to receive Il-476 heavy transport planes in 2012

The Russian Air Force will start receiving Il-476 heavy transport planes in 2012, the commander of the Russian Air Force’s military transport aviation said on Friday.

The Il-476 is a significantly modernized version of Russia’s Il-76 Candid transport plane, featuring a fully-digital flight control system
, new avionics and PS-90A-76 engines with improved fuel efficiency systems.
“I think the Il-476, which will eventually replace the Il-76, will start arriving in the military transport aviation sometime in 2012,” Lt. Gen. Viktor Kachalkin said.

The plane will be built at the Urals-based Aviastar-SP aircraft-manufacturing plant.

The Russian Defense Ministry plans to buy at least 38 Il-476 in cargo and aerial tanker versions in line with the state arms procurement program for the period of 2011-2020.

According to various sources, there are up to 300 transport aircraft in service with the Russian Air Force, including An-12 Cub, An-72 Coaler, An-22 Cock, An-124 Condor and Il-76 Candid planes. Most of the aircraft entered service in the 1960s and 1970s and are considered outdated by modern safety and noise pollution standards.
Russian military to receive Il-476 heavy transport planes in 2012 IDRW.ORG

This could answer people who were sceptical about the support for IL-76/78. We can now possibly order these newer variants and expect deliveries in near future ( more on airbus' timeframe)
:twizt:
 

neo29

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by choosing european ... it wud be music to boeing and lockheed martin.
logically MoD chose airbus so that it can have capability to refuel US fighters. i dont know if il-78 has capability to refuel US fighters though.
if that is the case it will make european and US makers in the mmrca real happy.
 

Sridhar

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Thursday, December 31, 2009

*Flash* - MoD Cancels EADS Airbus Refueller RFP as Finance Min Objects To High Price

The Indian Air Force (IAF)'s proposal put up with the Ministry of Defence (MoD) to purchase purchase of six flight refuelling aircraft(FRA), has been cancelled due to its high price as objected to by the Ministry of Finance. The Request For Proposal (RFP) or tender was retracted after it reached its final stages of obtaining the approval of the Cabinet Committee on Security(CCS) by the MoD.

The spanner in the works was put by the Finance Ministry, who did not support the proposal as the final negotiated cost of aircraft offered by EADS (European Aeronautic Defence and Space Company), a European consortium, was overpriced. The cost is said to be nearly 10 times higher than IL-78 air-to-air refuellers of Russian origin, which presently are in the IAF's inventory. The mid-air refuellers form two squadrons in the IAF, which help fighter jets to be airborne for a longer duration by refuelling them in mid-air.

Its a great setback for EADS as this is the second time the Governmnet cancelled the high-valued deal after reaching the final stage (two year duration) due to genuine reasons. It is expected that the new global tender will be floated within a month, according to sources.

The one billion dollar deal was progressing as per the Defence Procurement Procedure (DPP)-2006, but Defence Minister A K Antony had informed in Parliament, in the last session, that the Finance Ministry's approval was awaited.

The six EADS Airbus 330 refuelling tanker transport aircraft were exceeding the estimated price of the deal. The IAF had indicated its choice of the aircraft over the existing IL-78 refuelling tankers, which is why the Russian aircraft were not allowed to participate in the bid. The EADS 330 aircraft are capable of refuelling all types of fighter aircraft, which are in the inventory of the IAF and those yet to join.

Copyright: People's Post

Chindits: *Flash* - MoD Cancels EADS Airbus Refueller RFP as Finance Min Objects To High Price
 

sob

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In any Govt. Tender there are two components, one is the Technical bid and the other is the financial bid.

If the tender papers had called in for a Tanker in multi mission mode, in that case IL 78 would have been disqualified, so where does the question of cost comparison come in. You cannot compare the cost of a product which does not meet the technical requirements of your tender.
 

ironman

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Centre cancels contract for midair refuellers for fighter aircraft

Josy Joseph / DNA
Wednesday, January 6, 2010 0:26 IST

New Delhi: In a development that could severely hamper the Indian Air Force’s (IAF’s) ability, the government has cancelled a $1.5-billion contract for midair refuellers for fighter aircraft. Midair refuellers extend the reach and endurance of the aircraft.

Defence ministry sources said the contract was cancelled after the finance ministry raised several objections to the acquisition. The ministry’s objections, sources in the military said, were due to a lingering L1 (lowest item in a contract) syndrome in the government.

The air force pleaded hard with AK Antony to not cancel the contract after a few years of trial and evaluations, but the defence minister decided not to oppose the finance ministry.

Under the norms of contract of government of India, the cheapest item that satisfies the parameters must be bought.

The air force is upset at the cancellation. When it comes to the military, technological capabilities and sophistication make a huge difference, “but that is immaterial if the finance ministry is to be trusted”, a source in the force said. “For every bit of sophistication, we have to pay a price, and that makes a huge difference in the battlefield,” he said.“It would take us a few years now to select a tanker, unless they force us to buy the Russian tanker,” an IAF officer said.

“We need to break the logjam” on opting for the cheapest, another air force officer said. He pointed out that the contract for the purchase of 12 helicopters for transporting VVIPs, such as the president and the prime minister, was also facing resistance from the finance ministry. The ministry has argued that the deal is far more expensive than what was projected. However, since there is no “L1 trouble” in the chopper deal, it may “finally go through”, the officer said.

The finance ministry had also objected to the acquisition of the costlier Airbus 330 multi-role tanker transport aircraft six years after the air force bought the Russia-made Ilyushin-78. But, sources said, the force justified the buy in a detailed written reply, saying Airbus was technologically superior than Ilyushin-78 and that the overall cost of the European product would be competitive. IAF pointed out that Airbus was fuel efficient and most of its civilian parts could be serviced in India.
 

ironman

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Sad.. very sad.. these ministry babu's are becoming migraine to these acquisitions. Doesn't have a mere idea about technical differences... all they knew about buying selling, is from subji market .. sasthe mein milthe hey kya?:rofl:
 

StealthSniper

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Whenever we try to get something for our urgent defence needs, their is always resistance and not a transparent reason why something is cancelled and delayed. India needs to get it's act together and be more systematic and follow a strict guideline on procurement and inducting of systems or our political and corrupt system will be the demise of our armed forces.
 

Tamil

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it always happen in every area in India, when u want a new & high end tech they stop you and said buy the cheapest. its the tradition of our politicians.
 

Soham

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by choosing american ... it wud be music to boeing and lockheed martin.
logically MoD chose american so that it can have capability to refuel US fighters. i dont know if il-78 has capability to refuel US fighters though.
if that is the case it will make european and US makers in the mmrca real happy.
Airbus is not American. :wink:
 

Ritwik

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Can anybody enlighten me as to the price difference between the two contenders ?
 

Armand2REP

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I don't know what MoD intends to do in the mean time. The Chinese have been waiting for years on their planes and won't finish for years down the road. Russians aren't ready to start reproducing Ilyushins as they haven't finished moving out of Tashkent. Airbus is ready to take orders now.
 

Sridhar

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Govt to relaunch hunt for mid-air refuellers

BY :TNN
In a setback to IAF’s plans to further boost its ‘strategic reach’ capabilities, the government has decided to re-float the tender for acquiring six new mid-air refuelling aircraft for fighter jets after scrapping the virtually finalised $1.5-billion contract with European aerospace major EADS.
‘‘The RFP (request for proposal) will be re-floated and will go EADS, Boeing (US) and Ilyushin (Russian), among others, for a global competition now,’’ said a defence ministry official on Wednesday.
Defence minister A K Antony, on his part, told Parliament last month that the finance ministry had ‘‘expressed certain reservations relating to the competitiveness of the bids and the reasonableness of the price’’ for the IAF project to acquire the six new flight refueller aircraft.
IAF had selected the Airbus A-330 MRTT (multi-role tanker transport) aircraft of EADS after a thorough evaluation quite some time back but the file was stuck in the finance ministry, which felt they were overpriced. With Antony not intervening in the matter, the government has now cancelled the entire acquisition process. IAF, incidentally, was not too keen to buy more Ilyushin-78, six of which it had acquired from Uzbekistan a few years ago, since it said the A-330s better met its tanker requirements.
Be that as it may, the four-engined IL-78s, which can each carry over 75 tonnes of fuel to tank up fighters during flight, have proved to be a major force-multiplier for IAF.
IL-78s have made it possible for IAF fighters like the multi-role Mirage-2000s, the deep penetration Jaguars and the air-dominance Sukhoi-30MKIs to operate with extended ranges and flight-times.
Sukhois, for instance, have a cruising speed range of 3,200 km and can carry around eight tonnes of armaments. This strategic capability gets a further boost with air-to-air refuelling by IL-78 tankers, enhancing their radius of operations by more than double, making it possible for them to strike targets deep inside China. Incidentally, Pakistan inducted the first of its four mid-air refuellers, contracted from Ukraine, just last month.


Govt to relaunch hunt for mid-air refuellers idrw.org
 

sandeepdg

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The A330 MRTT is a very new platform and much more advanced than the IL-78, though the IL-78 can carry more than the A330. But then A330 is a multi role aircraft which can be converted into a Medvac with 130 stretchers or a full fledged troop transport with a capability to carry up to 380 passengers as well as a full size cargo aircraft with a much larger range than the IL-78. Though what I am concerned about is the 10:1 price comparison with the IL-78. I find that a bit had to digest !! Does anybody have any idea about the price quoted for an A330 MRTT ?
 

Sridhar

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Ritwik and sandeep here you go

However, the Finance Ministry is said to have objected to the selection as the Airbus 330 MRTT deal would cost upwards of Rs 8,000 crore against the estimated budget of Rs 5,000 crore set by the Defence Ministry. On the other hand, the fleet of Russian built IL-78 would cost only Rs 4,800 crore.

FinMin opposes IAF choice for refuelling aircraft
 

himanshugoswami

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what other options do we have if not the A330? i believe there is a long waiting period for the ILs, the MoF has nuked the A330s and the only other player left is boeing.....what other options does IAF have, any ideas? To me it looks like being stage managed to give the Americans yet another slice of the Indian Defence pie.
 

neo29

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This is kinda absurd. This means whatever the iaf and MoD chooses in the best interest of the country, the finance ministry will reject it cause its costly ??????
Now i am really worried about future of mmrca.

they should have sat together and discussed all these issues before choosing the contender.

these politicians are simply wasting time. someone please put some sense into them .
 

bhramos

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It happened in past,now and in future too.
i mean past P-8, now M-777 guns and in future Boieng tanker will win.
its not problem of finance,its a problem of Made in USA mark.
 

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