Hinduism a scientifically proven religion !!

[The Messiah]

Thanks for the BG music bro.

Your welcome.

 

[Vyom]

I do find solace in bashing the caste system. Please share with us how castes were created and provide more details?

I notice the bait, but anyway let me try and assume that you are not opinionated.

The caste system that we presently see is not the work of single entity or a scriptural source. Initially, going by the scriptures, the society was divided into four categories - the Brahmins, the Kshatriyas, the Vaishs and the Shudras. This was varna or categorization. What we witness today is caste system, which as I mentioned, came into effect to identify the lineage of the people, and this is not limited to India. It is prevalent across the world, that is why you see names such as Elizabeth the Second or Robert Downey Jr. just off the top of my mind.

Now that in itself cannot be termed an evil. What became evil is the fact that people began to see caste as something that in marriage would bring a girl to home who would already have the knowledge of the customs and rituals. Even more than that people started discriminating each other on the basis of caste, considering their superior or considering others not worthy to mingle with, and so on and so forth.

So in nutshell, caste system itself cannot be called evil. If people realize its purpose which is limited to knowing the lineage of a person, then there is no problem at all.

 

[civfanatic]

And to your info They played active role in forming Republic of India and have even taken part in Republic day parade for their help rendered during 1962 WAR and they are first in most disaster relief and they have constructed more Houses for flood victim's than any other organization.

For your info the Hitler Youth rendered extensive relief during the later years of WWII for Germany, but somehow the Germans today do not have a very positive image of the Hitler Youth despite their help, and I don't see why we should have a positive image of the RSS just because of some charitable work they have done. I think you should first understand what the RSS stands for and what their aspirations are.

 

[civfanatic]

Your post doesn't even deserve answer.

Hinduism started many thousand years back and RSS not even 100 years. If every Hindu will think like you then India will become Islamic state and blasphemy law against Hindu will be there.

RSS is doing what is important. They talk about country and religion and not the other way. Nothing has changed about Hinduism. It's same like thousand year back.

You say my post does not deserve answer and yet you still answer it. Why not spare the sanity of this forum and refrain from posting altogether?

Yes Hinduism is thousands of years old and it has survived all those years. Why? Because of RSS?

RSS is bent on a "reconquista" of India. The RSS were much more open about their goals in the past (the second leader of RSS was an open admirer of Hitler and thought India should copy his methods), but sensible voices in India forced them to cut back on how radical they appear to the public. I am glad that India is a secular democracy and extremist elements like the RSS cannot grab power so easily, otherwise we might have turned into another theocracy like Saudi Arabia.

 

[Iamanidiot]

You say my post does not deserve answer and yet you still answer it. Why not spare the sanity of this forum and refrain from posting altogether?

Yes Hinduism is thousands of years old and it has survived all those years. Why? Because of RSS?

RSS is bent on a "reconquista" of India. The RSS were much more open about their goals in the past (the second leader of RSS was an open admirer of Hitler and thought India should copy his methods), but sensible voices in India forced them to cut back on how radical they appear to the public. I am glad that India is a secular democracy and extremist elements like the RSS cannot grab power so easily, otherwise we might have turned into another theocracy like Saudi Arabia.

I shudder to think of a Hindu Theocracy in the old mould

 

[blueblood]

Hooo fine how many saba have you attended ?

I ask you 1 small think if what you say is true that RSS is sooooooo into ultra nationalists and preach only so called "radical side" of Hinduism i dont know where you got the word and also if they cant be eliminated as they enjoy popular support of Hindu, please answer the following.

* Which all other MUSLIM country provide Haj subside ? [How did RSS let this happen ?]
* How did APJ kalam je become president in 86% Hindu population ? [Show me where the so called ultra-nationalists opposed him ?]
* Our Muslim brothers population in INDIA raised about 4% from independence why the same is not happening in other places eg Pak or BD where it actually declined more than 17% ?? [Why did ultra-nationalists not opposed it ?]
* How come Muslim brothers are allowed to offer Namaz on road with out any trouble even travelers wait for them to complete before crossing road ? and do you know who stopped The Zakat Foundation of India from banning this please search you will be surprised [Why did the hate preacher RSS allow this ?]

* Why does a Hindu cant have more than 1 wife and others can and why can we bring UC Code ? [Why the Evil RSS did not protest ?]

I can quote many more but whats the point ?

AND I AM PROUD INDIAN FOR ALL THE ABOVE POINTS, EXPECT FOR UCC AND I AM SECULAR NOT SUCKULAR AS SOME

What are you implying with this mindless babble?

I live in Bhopal with nearly 40% muslim population, did my schooling in a missionary school and 4 RSS members live within 150 feet from my home and shakha takes place at the park behind my home less than 200 m away.

Have you ever attended the Shastra puja on vijaydashmi?

"Kathmullo ki kya pehchaan, hari langot pakistan." Have you ever witnessed 5000 swyamsevaks shouting this while marching through the streets of the city?

If no then don't even bother replying. Wake up and see that the world is not exactly black and white but grey.

 

[pmaitra]

I notice the bait, but anyway let me try and assume that you are not opinionated.

The caste system that we presently see is not the work of single entity or a scriptural source. Initially, going by the scriptures, the society was divided into four categories - the Brahmins, the Kshatriyas, the Vaishs and the Shudras. This was varna or categorization. What we witness today is caste system, which as I mentioned, came into effect to identify the lineage of the people, and this is not limited to India. It is prevalent across the world, that is why you see names such as Elizabeth the Second or Robert Downey Jr. just off the top of my mind.

Now that in itself cannot be termed an evil. What became evil is the fact that people began to see caste as something that in marriage would bring a girl to home who would already have the knowledge of the customs and rituals. Even more than that people started discriminating each other on the basis of caste, considering their superior or considering others not worthy to mingle with, and so on and so forth.

So in nutshell, caste system itself cannot be called evil. If people realize its purpose which is limited to knowing the lineage of a person, then there is no problem at all.

Well, I am opinionated because your response is trying to justify caste system. Bait or no bait, I will counter your post with a simple example of Satyakam Jabala from the Upanishads. Please read up on it. The very premise that you cite about 'customs' and 'rituals' is already nullified even before caste system came into being, with adequate justification.

So why keep justifying this evil. It is evil of the worst kind, and to my mind, there is no doubt about it.

 

[Vyom]

Well, I am opinionated because your response is trying to justify caste system. Bait or no bait, I will counter your post with a simple example of Satyakam Jabala from the Upanishads. Please read up on it. The very premise that you cite about 'customs' and 'rituals' is already nullified even before caste system came into being, with adequate justification.

So why keep justifying this evil. It is evil of the worst kind, and to my mind, there is no doubt about it.

So if a person carries a stone in his hand, it becomes evil because he can hit someone with it? Is it really the stone at fault or the person misusing it? There is use of stone and there is misuse and that is the same for caste or anything else. If you can pick it up from here then it is good, otherwise there is not much to discuss.

P.S. A discussion requires the use of open and un-opinionated mindset. If, as the Confucian proverb goes, your pot is already full with stale food then there is no place for fresh meal.

 

[pmaitra]

So if a person carries a stone in his hand, it becomes evil because he can hit someone with it? Is it really the stone at fault or the person misusing it? There is use of stone and there is misuse and that is the same for caste or anything else. If you can pick it up from here then it is good, otherwise there is not much to discuss.

No, I am not talking about stone. It was already established that heredity has nothing to do with learning rituals and customs. Evidence, I have already provided. Open mind or not, what is there, is there.

P.S. A discussion requires the use of open and un-opinionated mindset. If, as the Confucian proverb goes, your pot if already full with stale food then there is no place for fresh meal.

Similarly, if a pot is being emptied of its stale food, why try to put the stale food back in there? Stale food here is the caste system, IMHO.

 

[KS]

No, I am not talking about stone. It was already established that heredity has nothing to do with learning rituals and customs. Evidence, I have already provided. Open mind or not, what is there, is there.



Similarly, if a pot is being emptied of its stale food, why try to put the stale food back in there? Stale food here is the caste system, IMHO.

I agree with Vyom here.

Caste is just an identity.

You can choose to be proud of your caste and at the same time equally respect the other person's pride in his caste as yours. But the problem happens when we start discriminating based on caste which is the real evil.

 

[pmaitra]

I agree with Vyom here.

Caste is just an identity.

You can choose to be proud of your caste and at the same time equally respect the other person's pride in his caste as yours. But the problem happens when we start discriminating based on caste which is the real evil.

Yes, of course. The reality, however, is different. Caste gives bragging rights and the not so infrequent violence and injustice that we keep hearing about. The problem you mentioned is a real problem and I wonder if it will go away anytime soon. Sad but true.

 

[KS]

Yes, of course. The reality, however, is different. Caste gives bragging rights and the not so infrequent violence and injustice that we keep hearing about. The problem you mentioned is a real problem and I wonder if it will go away anytime soon. Sad but true.

Just like we like to say Islam is not the problem, but its followers are...caste is not the problem...the bigots who choose to discriminate based on caste are the problem.

I think it as my identity but respect the other person's pride in his identity and do not discriminate based on that. Why should I let go of my identity just because some one else mis-uses his ?

 

[The Messiah]

Just like we like to say Islam is not the problem, but its followers are...caste is not the problem...the bigots who choose to discriminate based on caste are the problem.

I think it as my identity but respect the other person's pride in his identity and do not discriminate based on that. Why should I let go of my identity just because some one else mis-uses his ?

Thats nice way of suger coating it. Now come back to reality.

Bigots exist everywhere so why give them the tools to discriminate ?

 

[p2prada]

Yes, of course. The reality, however, is different. Caste gives bragging rights and the not so infrequent violence and injustice that we keep hearing about. The problem you mentioned is a real problem and I wonder if it will go away anytime soon. Sad but true.

Caste is no different from our current form of social hierarchy. A Doctor has a higher standing than a call center employee. That's about it. The same way a Brahmin had a higher standing than a guy in a farm. Unfortunately it got to the Brahmin's head and fvked it all up for everyone else.

If the Doctor does the same today, then this current system also wouldn't be any different from the caste system.

A democratic system like we have today can kill the caste and hierarchical divide as power passes on between different people unlike the monarchy system that idolized only the educated masses and the soldiers while neglecting the rest.

 

[S.A.T.A]

The popular fable of the Elephant and the Blind men from the pancatantra best illustrates the conundrum that has challenged all and any intellect that has strived to understand the define Hinduism.In the story six blind men encounter an elephant,blind in vision as they are,they try to construct the reality of the entity before them by touch alone, ultimately each concludes that thing was a rope,a fan,a wall,a pillar,a tree trunk etc.

The fable doesn't say whether the blind men later discussed their conclusion among one another,on how they came to describe the same thing so variously,perhaps one of them said that he was once a weaver and hence thought it was rope,perhaps another was a mason and thought it was a wall,the man who thought it was pillar was perhaps was an artisan and the one who thought it was the trunk of tree was a lumberjack.

If they indeed did exchange their findings with one another,they would have agreed that their conclusion was as a matter of fact a product of their perception,strung together by their experience and weaved by their the intellect thereafter.

Is Hinduism then a treatise of scientific precision,is Hinduism the narrative of a grand civilization,is Hinduism a discursive philosophy, is Hinduism a compendium primitive superstition,may be as they say, its a way of life that encompasses all the above.

On observation we will realize that none of these categories truly capture the true nature of Hinduism,fully or in its entirety, or the panorama of philosophical and social narratives that come to represent modern Hinduism.

Like the six blind men,ingrained in our intellect is a space where we construct all our ideas, ideologies and existential beliefs.This space exists entirely due to our certain intellectual disposition,generated by our education,our social background,other formative intellectual pursuits whose exercise have influenced that disposition.

So the individuals who see the scientific Hinduism,the spiritual Hinduism,the transcendental Hinduism or the Hinduism of superstitions,is essentially giving shape to an idea,whose 'reality' subsists only within the realm relative to his intellectual space.For him who conceives the elephant as the Wall or the other who thinks its a pillar,that is the absolute extent of the reality relative to him.


So does there exist a Hinduism that is real, pure and untainted by listless rituals and moribund traditions,or is our vexation over pure and tainted,real and concocted versions of Hinduism a reflection of our insecurities over what we believe to be true or we believe ought to be real.The fact remains Hinduism provides enough space and depth for all concept and conviction to find an active resonance,yet it does not allow itself to be monopolized by any of them.

When this is the case where is the scope for compartmentalizing Hinduism into true and false.How is the Hinduism of the Advaita,of the absolute undivided, indivisible Atman,any more real and truer than the Hinduism of the Dvaita,of the manifest separation of Paramatma and Jeevatma,and the eternal journey of the latter,transcending time and space,to unite with the former.Is the Vedanti yogi,who has renounced all attachment and possessions,taking up refuge in the solitude of unbound,any more a real Hindu,than the person who,in the path set by the Bhakti tradition, has completely given over to the worship of a personal deity,which is the absolute core of his very being.

Hinduism does not recognize nor encourage the persistence of a belief where there is monopoly on the pursuit of truth,the Rgvedic verse Ekam Sad Vipraha Bahuda vadanti,illustrates the fact that there is space for manifold expression of the one truth.

The supreme Atman is non dual and all phenomenon manifest themselves as the representation of Maya with the Atman as its substratum, yet this Maya is not unreal,even if its a mere representation.The Upanishads often use the example of a rope and sake to illustrate the nature of Atman and Maya,while to the ignorant mind,in the shroud of darkness,the rope appears as the snake.here both the rope and snake are representations,the snake represents to the ignorance,the rope represents knowledge, yet the rope must exist as the substratum for it to be represented(or misrepresented)as a snake.

Even Adi guru Shankara while describing the jagat(the universe of phenomena) as Maya,does not say they don't exist.In his Dakshinamurthistotra he describes Maya thus:

The name 'maya' is given to an appearance which
cannot be accounted for. It is not non-existent, because it
appears; neither is it existent, because it is nullified.

Hinduism,as represented by all its traditional school of philosophy,recognizes the fact that supreme consciousness is the underlying basis of all the myriad dualities,these dualities must be first embraced and understood,before we can penetrate the truth beneath its beguiling surface,merely dismissing the dualities because the scriptures say it is not real,is a false approach and would lead to superficial realization

.If the millions of personal deities worshiped by Hindus represent the single undivided changeless supreme consciousness,then these deities and their worship are as real as the supreme Brahman.This explains why Adi Guru Shankara besides reviving Hinduism and setting up many Gnana peetam,was also prolific in setting up many temples,where various gods and goddesses where consecrated and priests ordained to conduct daily worship received special instructions for the same,from the great master himself.

Perhaps Hinduism is,as somebody wise had said before,is a study in the impenetrable intricacies of the human mind,its philosophies,its rituals,its beliefs,its general outlook,is a microcosm of the vast depths and vivid vistas of the human consciousness.Our consciousness is a barely explored terrain of a vast unexplored continent,which is riddled with features yet unexplained,shapes,sounds and forms yet unknown,secrets not yet deciphered.

Our consciousness is such a landscape,where the magnificent and ordinary,the vividly imaginative and dull inertia,depravity and kindness,rationality and irrationality,where eternal curiosity and universal knowledge,and many other subtle and unexplored of attributes, jostle and compete with each other in the eternal churning of the individuals consciousness,to lend it individuality,yet none of these attributes in themselves complete his individuality.Hinduism represents this eternal truism.

Brahma satyam jagan mithya jivo brahmaiva naparah,
anena vedyam sac shastram iti vedanta dindima

Brahma is the reality,the world is an illusion,
the individual self is nothing other than the Brahma,
That by which this truth is known is the truest science,
the science of all sciences,thus proclaims the Vedanta

...Adi Guru Shankaracharya.

 

[DaRk WaVe]

Every religion claims its the best, though i feel that Hinduism has its unique spiritual dimension BUT i don't get why people end up justifying their ancient absurdities that are irrelevant in modern era. Religion used to be a cohesive force when societies were isolated form each other but in the present environment religion is corroding the cohesion of societies.

 

[LurkerBaba]

Every religion claims its the best, though i feel that Hinduism has its unique spiritual dimension BUT i don't get why people end up justifying their ancient absurdities that are irrelevant in modern era. Religion used to be a cohesive force when societies were isolated form each other but in the present environment religion is corroding the cohesion of societies.

The irony is that the thread starter is an atheist

I haven't seen all the videos, but one them was about the advanced metallurgy used in Iron Pillar at Qutub Minar and advanced practices of Astronomy (which is more or less correct)

These videos are about Indian civilization itself, but then again Hinduism a big umbrella term

 

[Vyom]

Every religion claims its the best, though i feel that Hinduism has its unique spiritual dimension BUT i don't get why people end up justifying their ancient absurdities that are irrelevant in modern era. Religion used to be a cohesive force when societies were isolated form each other but in the present environment religion is corroding the cohesion of societies.

Religions never claim to be best, their proponents do, and it is at them that any blame lies squarely. One has to have the capability to distinguish between genuine and farce, and when even the literates are unable to do that, completely due unfounded attachment, how can you blame the society at large which is generally misinformed and misguided or both.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

religion need not be proven by science..it is based on faith..we don't need a zakir ali naik in Hinduism to argue Hinduism is scientifically proven..

 

[sesha_maruthi27]

Science and Religion are two different terms and ideas. Do not compare both. We INDIANS have something which is more powerful than the technology that other countries have, which is known as "VEDIC SCIENCE". But the scientists in INDIA are afraid of testing it and they also lack the support of the central government.