HAL Prachand - Light Combat Helicopter (LCH)

[Chinmoy]

Yes it is........

Apache is an antiquated design with several technical upgrades to keep it relevant. It is lethal but it is also a helicopter making it vulnerable. It can be shot down just as easily as an LCH which makes having 3-4 LCH instead of one Golden plated Apache a much more cost effective solution. The more platforms you have the more eyes are on the battlefield to spot and engage targets. Having a handful of Apaches isn't enough to cover one sector of a battle. If you have enough LCH, you don't need Apache.



But you can replace an Apache with several LCH. It is actually a more flexible option as LCH can fly in the desert or the mountains where Apache is limited to low alitude operations. You might fight a war and the Apache never even comes into play.

Seriously??????????


Upgrading a platform makes it antique? Then I must say that none of the forces in world today is using state of art weapons. US on top of that is the biggest antique user.

Apache is a twin engine Copter as opposed to LCH. It means even it gets hit, its survival rate would be double of LCH. Moreover a active group of 4 LCHs would mean a spare of 4 engine opposite to a 2 engine which one Apache would require. Show me cost effectiveness in here.

Now leaving alone the longbow RADAR, the antique(!) ASQ-170 TADS developed in 1980 has an effective visual range of 50 kms (I have attached the document along with for your reference). Now show me same effectiveness in LCH.


Against 30 odd Apaches, we would be having 100 LCH. So its not like that we are diverting funds to unwanted system. We do need teeth in our attack which as of now LCH alone is unable to deliver. 100 odd LCHs are not just menat to be for mountain warfare, they are for western desert too. But saying that since we have LCH, we don't require Apache is a faulty logic.

 

[Aaj ka hero]

Apache is a twin engine Copter as opposed to LCH

Sir, what do you mean by this?
light combat helicopter is single engine.

 

[Chinmoy]

Sir, what do you mean by this?
light combat helicopter is single engine.

I meant the survival rate in case of a confrontation. Even if Apache gets hit and have an engine failure, being a twin engine the chances of its survival would be higher then LCH in same scenario.

 

[Suryavanshi]

I meant the survival rate in case of a confrontation. Even if Apache gets hit and have an engine failure, being a twin engine the chances of its survival would be higher then LCH in same scenario.

Yoooooo but isnt LCH double engine as well.

The LCH is powered by two Turbomeca Shakti turboshaft engines (1430 shp each) driving a four-blade main rotor and four-blade tail rotor.

https://bharatshakti.in/comparison-indias-lch-chinese-z-10-turkeys-t-129-attack-helicopters/

 

[darshan978]

I meant the survival rate in case of a confrontation. Even if Apache gets hit and have an engine failure, being a twin engine the chances of its survival would be higher then LCH in same scenario.

Lmao your bluffs got busted haha
Go first read somewhere else then pretend to be eXpErT

 

[Chinmoy]

Yoooooo but isnt LCH double engine as well.


https://bharatshakti.in/comparison-indias-lch-chinese-z-10-turkeys-t-129-attack-helicopters/

My bad.... Sorry for the goof up.

 

[Holy Triad]

Guys,take a chill pill

The objective of this thread is to discuss about a platform which is under development (td phase to be precise) which is only expected only to be enter production maybe in 2021.(if everything goes well)

By then,the platform would have gone through multiple(minor) changes such as ease of maintenance,sevice lines etc.


Apache is bought (primarily) as a stop gap measure,nothing more to read into it. Check the no. of platforms ordered and expected for future orders. Only half of them have longbow

Why such hurry you may ask?
1. Lessons learned from Kargil war
2. Chink border

Many foreign,domestic,even our dfi experts stressed out that lack of attack helicopters will decrease our future firepower.

In addition to hilly areas, iaf wanted attack helis for base security purposes(just go to the apache thread and check out for its deployment zones)

Apache is a heavily armoured gunship which will flyout of combat zone even if it is lost its one of the engines(which is very unlikely,bcoz just check out the level of armour for the engine cowl alone)

Its engine armour doubles as a heat cover which reduces the ir signature.

Which cannot be said same for lch.

Stop comparing lch with apache,both belong in different league. Both has its own merits and own demerits.

Both are designed with different objectives in mind.

Apache is expensive and bit complicated to repair.
Lch designed to be agile and easy to maintain.

Yes,@Chinmoy made a goof up and everyone piled on to it. And everyone clinged on to it.

But the issue of Survivability is really out there
Read this point again,

not like that we are diverting funds to unwanted system. We do need teeth in our attack which as of now LCH alone is unable to deliver. 100 odd LCHs are not just menat to be for mountain warfare, they are for western desert too. But saying that since we have LCH, we don't require Apache is a faulty logic.

If the gormint were to divert funds from lch to apache,then only,the last two pages argument is valid.

Remember,apache was selected by our military considering operational requirements,not by some 'matajis' favorite bizzynuss man.

Like many of us here,@Chinmoy is a strong proponent of drdo/desi programs. Just check his earlier posts.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Apache were bought to give some pay check to the Americans. Just like those NASAM system.

IAF and MOD is having so many budget issues for important stuff but still bought some golden plated stuff. Because of this type of careless attitude india suffers.

Such as tender for replacement of cheetah chetak till the time total count of life lost because of those junk reaches hundred government will not do anything.

 

[Knowitall]

Apache were bought to give some pay check to the Americans. Just like those NASAM system.

IAF and MOD is having so many budget issues for important stuff but still bought some golden plated stuff. Because of this type of careless attitude india suffers.

Totally agree people here really think that IAF will fly apaches through AD zones both the Indian and pakiatani sides have active air defence our jets can escape from it not a helicopter.

Say we destroy all the ad sites in the first few hours of war.

We still dont need Apache if we have achieved air superiority only then can apache operate and when we have air superiority why use apache at all its much better to use jaguar and even the old migs to bomb enemy tank formation they will do the job much faster and in a better way.

On the Chinese side we already have our tailor made lch.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

IAF deliberately hijacked the purchase of apache which was initiated by the indian army and IAF fought it's way through to force army to give up on those helicopter.

The Apache is meant for armoured battles in scout and attack roles. They have to operate in close co-ordination with and close support of ground defence. The Army Aviation Corps has the expertise to fly choppers. There needs to be complete integration of the choppers with the Army in terms of training as well as command and co-ordination with land forces. It will be easier to develop tactics and doctrine together," retired Lt Gen Deependra Singh Hooda, former Northern Army Commander, told IANS.

Army veterans are of the argument that any equipment is better held with one particular service for better operations, logistics and maintenance. "With two different services, there will be bureaucratic hassles even for training purposes," added Hooda.

But their is no doubt that after hijacking these helicopter from army IAF fleet will have one golden bird.

 

[Knowitall]

IAF is good at making a fool out of everyone both apache and lch shall be under the army as they are supposed to be used ground in operations.

IAF is the only service where the love for import maal knows no bounds dhanoa ji put a rafale model outside his house was it needed tejas ka to nahi lagaye.

They have no roadmap at all tejas ke liye bhi people are not realizing but these guys have still not signed the 83mk1a contract.

HAL pagal thodi na hai ki production speed up karke line idle kar dega they need to keep people busy so they are slowing production.

Only navy has and continues to make me really proud they always take the right step in the right direction.

Government se itna pressure padhne ke baad akal ayi hai IAF me.

 

[BabuBisleri]

American AMASE (Apache Modular Aircraft Survivability Equipment),when the air defense missile comes, Apache has to rely on it to survive .

Not every Apache has it.

 

[Armand2REP]

dhanoa ji put a rafale model outside his house

Which is across the street from Cong HQ... it was a political statement.

 

[Knowitall]

Which is across the street from Cong HQ... it was a political statement.

There was no need to do so. The last thing we want is our military men moving into the corrupt shit called politics.

Bjp is more than enough to handle Congress and their cheap politics.

What statement does it show that he loves rafale everyone already knows that.
That he supports bjp thats quite evident too.
Or does he want to show he gives no fucks to congress well thats something even congress knows his briefs and statements made that clear.


Anyways what I meant was why so much love for rafale why not for our tejas thats it.

 

[Armand2REP]

Or does he want to show he gives no fucks to congress

This one...............................

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

There was no need to do so. The last thing we want is our military men moving into the corrupt shit called politics.

Bjp is more than enough to handle Congress and their cheap politics.

What statement does it show that he loves rafale everyone already knows that.
That he supports bjp thats quite evident too.
Or does he want to show he gives no fucks to congress well thats something even congress knows his briefs and statements made that clear.


Anyways what I meant was why so much love for rafale why not for our tejas thats it.

Cos Tejas was not opposed by INC. And they targetted IAF top brass of corruption too indirectly. He just fought back in a way he could.

 

[Knowitall]

Cos Tejas was not opposed by INC. And they targetted IAF top brass of corruption too indirectly. He just fought back in a way he could.

Tejas was not opposed by Inc. haha anything good for india and congress is always opposed to it.

If inc was not against tejas you would have seen 2 squadrons minimum already.

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

Tejas was not opposed by Inc. haha anything good for india and congress is always opposed to it.

If inc was not against tejas you would have seen 2 squadrons minimum already.

Tejas was pushed down the throat of IAF by Manohar Parrikar. He was a IIT guy who knew how industrial development takes place. Even if we had some other BJP guy in place of MP, they would have withered infront of IAF opposition. Congress predicament is understandable.

He was the one who created IOC and FOC and gave the seal of Mk1A. He is the sole creditor for that program. Now IAF is happy with its performance.

 

[Longewala]

30 years back I read about the cobra attack copters being bought by Napakis with envy.

Today we are buying Apache aka Cobra ka baap, plus well over a hundred desi copters that are possibly more tailored and better for Indian fronts than the cobra, and complaining about it.

It's like going from Karsan Ghavri and Madan Lal to Bumrah and Umesh Yadav....

 

[Shashank Nayak]

Any idea what exactly is the problem with HELINA anti tank missile, that IA has not inducted it yet.. Trials have been ongoing for more than a decade and many of them successful