HAL Prachand - Light Combat Helicopter (LCH)

[Armand2REP]

In anti armour role, Apache could carry 16 Hellfire missiles and 30mm canon. Whereas LCH could carry 4 Helina and 20 mm canon.

So in a anti-tank warfare scenario, Apache would always beat LCH (in its current) form in any given day due to its payload.

3/4 LCH > 1 Gold plated Apache

 

[Deathstar]

3/4 LCH > 1 Gold plated Apache

Here catch is the longbow radar of Apache imo

 

[abingdonboy]

Here catch is the longbow radar of Apache imo

Yes and no. Can that Longbow sensor data be shared outside of the 50-70 Apaches India will eventually operate? If not then it’s a complete waste of resources.

furthermore with DRDO working on a FCR for the LCH the utility of this “USP” depletes with every passing year.

this is a gold plated fleet have no doubt about it, their actual value in such limited numbers is still not clear.

 

[Chinmoy]

3/4 LCH > 1 Gold plated Apache

No it is not................

Apache is a proven design with better avionics, sensor and weapon package. Its lethality and survival in anti armour role is second to none. LCH would have to mature enough to reach the stage of present day Apache. So need of both the system in current scenario is there in India.

One cant replace a Prithvi launcher with a Pinaka launcher. So saying 3/4LCH>1 Gold plated Apache is good only on financial aspect, not in capability aspect.

@abingdonboy .... Apache is compatible with the current AFWA system and it could share and get battlefield updates with Armoured commanders and surveillance system, both land based and air borne.

 

[Suryavanshi]

I think no one is getting to the point here or may be no one wants to.

There was more than one reason to go for Apache both political and Technical.
We had to appease America by giving them some kind of deal and Apache turned out to be the most reasonable.
Besides the political need there are reasons already mentioned by users here.
Apache has a completely different role compared to LCH. In a war scenario they are most likely to operate from Punjab and Rajasthan so mostly against tank columns. Where as LCH is meant for High Altitudes like Siachen, Kashmir and Indo China border.

When tender for Heavyweight helicopter was floated LCH was still in nascent stage where it had taken its first flight. There was an urgent need of this helicopter when Pakistan was pursing viper platform.
And LCH was nowhere near full operational Capability and still isn't right now.
We will get our 22 Apache by 2021 while 55 LCH would have at least taken some 2024 to 2027. Knowing how HAL works it could've taken more.

LCH is like LCA its test bed for future platform and also a force multiplier.
With Development of Helina, indigenous engins, home grown radar and sub system LCH will become even more lethal.

And U know what, as soon as the first LCH gets inducted we will be hearing about HCH (Heavy Combat Helicopter) u know it's coming.

Apache will be the last Foreign combat helicopter I can say that for sure.

Apache is our present and LCH is both present and future.

So the comparison doesn't makes sense to me.

 

[Haldiram]

====================================

The helicopter was already built by taking your money from taxes

 

[Suryavanshi]

Also turks have plans to make a Heavy helicopter.

Without EUs help they can't do shit but if they do manage to fix their issues they may roll it out in 10 years time.
Which means Porkis will also be getting it.

https://defence-blog.com/news/turki...-develop-new-heavy-attack-helicopter.html/amp

 

[Armand2REP]

No it is not................

Apache is a proven design with better avionics, sensor and weapon package. Its lethality and survival in anti armour role is second to none. LCH would have to mature enough to reach the stage of present day Apache. So need of both the system in current scenario is there in India.

Yes it is........

Apache is an antiquated design with several technical upgrades to keep it relevant. It is lethal but it is also a helicopter making it vulnerable. It can be shot down just as easily as an LCH which makes having 3-4 LCH instead of one Golden plated Apache a much more cost effective solution. The more platforms you have the more eyes are on the battlefield to spot and engage targets. Having a handful of Apaches isn't enough to cover one sector of a battle. If you have enough LCH, you don't need Apache.

One cant replace a Prithvi launcher with a Pinaka launcher. So saying 3/4LCH>1 Gold plated Apache is good only on financial aspect, not in capability aspect.

But you can replace an Apache with several LCH. It is actually a more flexible option as LCH can fly in the desert or the mountains where Apache is limited to low alitude operations. You might fight a war and the Apache never even comes into play.

 

[Flying Dagger]

Having 3-4 LCH will also mean having higher op cost more maintenance crew pilots required to keep it flying.

LCH is still developing and will take it's time to mature while Apache is a proven system . Indian army do not have any credible attack heli and Apache is going to plug the gap


The situation is similar to what Rafale is for Airforce a stop gap till AMCA fructify. Tejas isn't replacement of Rafale similarly LCH isn't replacement of Apache.

Apache can take some hits while LCH can't nor it is technologically as capable as Apache.

With Apache IA and IAF will get the hand on experience which will be passed on to design stage of nxt gen attack heli by HAL .

The purchase of heli whether Apache for IA/IAF or Romeo for IN is a good decision considering the pressure Trump was creating it serves the politics and trade talk as well.

LCH is a stepping stone and with 200 around planned more will enter production 70 odd Apache will play their part too.

 

[Armand2REP]

Having 3-4 LCH will also mean having higher op cost more maintenance crew pilots required to keep it flying.

Yes but you will need more because helicopters get shot down easily. Case in point for the news today...

Houthi rebels shoot down SKA Apache

 

[abingdonboy]

I think some a misunderstanding the conversation.

22+39(IA) Apaches is a done deal but this is about ordering more than that and also trying to rationalise that decision.


3-4 LCHs vs 1 Apache is a deal any commander would take. Yes the individual sensors on the LCH may not be as powerful as the Apache but then having 3-4 LCHs able to leverage more tactical options and cover a wider area not to mention offer more assurances of mission success thanks to larger redundancy is a great prospect.


Also don’t forget only 50% of the Apaches IA/IAF are getting come with FCRs so the rest will be reliant on sensor data from the ones with it.

 

[abingdonboy]

Also turks have plans to make a Heavy helicopter.

Without EUs help they can't do shit but if they do manage to fix their issues they may roll it out in 10 years time.
Which means Porkis will also be getting it.

https://defence-blog.com/news/turki...-develop-new-heavy-attack-helicopter.html/amp

So?

You think HAL won’t work on a heavy attack helo once the LCH is inducted? It’s not rocket science and India has already mastered most of the tech.


These things aren’t like fighter jets by the way, where a new fighter needs to be countered. I’m 100% sure with the revamp going on in the AD networks of the IAF and IA that Pakistan’s aerial assets would all be smoking craters within a few days of an all out war

 

[Suryavanshi]

So?

You think HAL won’t work on a heavy attack helo once the LCH is inducted? It’s not rocket science and India has already mastered most of the tech.


These things aren’t like fighter jets by the way, where a new fighter needs to be countered. I’m 100% sure with the revamp going on in the AD networks of the IAF and IA that Pakistan’s aerial assets would all be smoking craters within a few days of an all out war

But my nigga I wrote this in the post before the one u have quoted.

And U know what, as soon as the first LCH gets inducted we will be hearing about HCH (Heavy Combat Helicopter) u know it's coming

I think U didn't read my reply before that.

 

[Suryavanshi]

What I'm trying to get at here is the fact that we should maintain a technological Edge over Our terrorist neigbour.

Say whatever u want but Pakistan doesn't fuck around with Defence as much as we do.
Their procurement serve the best in Field applications in regards to India.
Many a times it happnes that we buy a defence equipment in response to their procurement. We are moving away from that phase so the next thing should be a 10 year edge on our side.

 

[Armand2REP]

Having 3-4 LCH will also mean having higher op cost more maintenance crew pilots required to keep it flying.

Having a single type will reduce costs and logistics footprints. Having an indigenous platform that you can control is far more reliable than the US who can sanction at the drop of a hat. One only needs to look at Turkey whose supply chains are starting to crumble.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Having a single type will reduce costs and logistics footprints. Having an indigenous platform that you can control is far more reliable than the US who can sanction at the drop of a hat. One only needs to look at Turkey whose supply chains are starting to crumble.

You made a valid point don't matter how heavily sensor equipped helicopter is. But still because of it's slow and low altitude flight it's vulnerable to SAM and even to old age surface to air guns.

 

[Holy Triad]

You made a valid point don't matter how heavily sensor equipped helicopter is. But still because of it's slow and low altitude flight it's vulnerable to SAM and even to old age surface to air guns.

Aaaaand it was piloted by "SAUDI" pilots...

Nuff said...

the dimwit meccawalas used the cutting edge typhoons against the raghead-starved houthis

Nd still managed to lose the war.


Tactics and training MATTERS the most!

 

[Suryavanshi]

Aaaaand it was piloted by "SAUDI" pilots...

Nuff said...

the dimwit meccawalas used the cutting edge typhoons against the raghead-starved houthis

Nd still managed to lose the war.


Tactics and training MATTERS the most!

I don't think any amount of tactics can help u against a stinger.

 

[Holy Triad]

I don't think any amount of tactics can help u against a stinger.

Modern apaches are equipped with ircm's which can easily evade older manpad,provided pilots were well trained.

Few examples,
https://www.quora.com/Can-IR-SAMs-destroy-Apache-helicopters


Being said that,any heli is susceptible to other conventional sam's abd aam's.

Even in this attack,the name of the missile used is still unclear. My guess is,usually the houthi abduls use 'modified' Russian aam missiles supplied by irandians. Recently they 'developed' fatir n taqib sams based on soviet era sa 6 missile (which took down a mq9).

https://southfront.org/houthis-unve...-target-saudi-and-u-s-aircraft-photos-videos/

 

[avknight1408]

Found a video of houthis downing the Apache on Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFoot...2019/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share