F-16 supply to Pakistan to continue, says US

[JayATL]

Comon man you can't seriously believe the quotes you posted...



Right coz when push comes to shove the Pak army will say "Oh no - we promised we wouldn't use those against India"



Despite US's continual influence in Pakistan, has insurgent involvement decreased? Pakistan offers insurgent groups by far the most direct aid cf any other nation.

But perhaps it will take another terrorist leader a couple of klicks from a military barracks to convince you of that fact.

do you understand that it not just contractual terms but US through its software can track and also negate those aircrafts to a great extent? that it's personal are on the ground preparing those aircrafts?

what pakistan does with terrorists has nothing to do with facts here. You are bringing something that has no bearing with what the terms and facts are about this sale.

 

[Bhadra]

No superpower or those who feel they are so, would like India to be powerful since the superpower space is getting too crowded for their liking.

Threat to a country is essentially in existence of potential. Intention can come in any-time. Since when has India also been a friend of USA and vice versa ? Countries are supposed to play their self interests.

Balancing factor is a function of rationality which Pakistan rulers are very far from. That is what is the fear and not a few more F**k"Soulahas"

 

[Twinblade]

If it ain't the Dumb and dumber bros here... go read or research what the stipulations are ...I've even added links to it in my previous post. stop talking through your ....

you guys are the mirror twins of those dumb Pakistanis on their forums with their dumb American conspiracies all day-- all the while jumping up in excitement when America gives you all the cool toys. Bi-polar posters .

Ok. First of all, try mirroring some common posting etiquettes, it improves the quality of discussion on the forum and lets you be heard meaningfully without coming across as an angry 14 year old with an access to keyboard.

Now lets see, after following flightglobal, aviationweek and airforce monthly for a few years now, I have failed to notice any similar news articles. The only articles pertaining to the things you mention come from an anonymous Turkish pilot mentioning about the black box components on turkish f-16's which was picked up by the nut jobs on censoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensored, spread across Keypubs, Defencetalk, BR, F-16.net, IDF, PDF, Israel defence forum and almost every known forum, where it has been debunked, ridiculed and packed off as one of the "Cool-story Bro" moments.

Lets see your first link,
PAF to get F-16s with tough stipulations
Here is the reporter

samiullah66 is based in Lahore, Punjab, Pakistan, and is a Stringer for Allvoices.Report Credibility

Nice looking chap ain't he , now Allvoices is nothing more that a blogging service marketed as Citizen news. Effectively, If I were to unleash half a kilo of home made mutton do pyaza and half a dozen rumali rotis now flavoured with Old monk which I consumed last night, through my rectal cavity, onto my keyboard and publish it on Allvoices, even that would be picked up by someone like you and cited as gospel truth.

Besides for Pakistani f-16's to be unable to target Indian fighters, the f-16 radars should be updated with wartime Indian IFF return codes as "friendlies". So what you are indirectly suggesting that either the entire IAF, IN, IA air borne assets are equipped with IFF that show up as friendlies on f-16's radar, for the ANI report from the second link that you quoted nothing more than assurances from US state department.

 

[Twinblade]

do you understand that it not just contractual terms but US through its software can track and also negate those aircrafts to a great extent? that it's personal are on the ground preparing those aircrafts?

Care to explain how this magical software works your honour ?

 

[sayareakd]

guys not to worry those cannot be used in offensive manner against us, once they cross over to our side of border, weapons on f16 are useless, they wont fire and pilot wont be going back with plane.

 

[JayATL]

Ok. First of all, try mirroring some common posting etiquettes, it improves the quality of discussion on the forum and lets you be heard meaningfully without coming across as an angry 14 year old with an access to keyboard.

Now lets see, after following flightglobal, aviationweek and airforce monthly for a few years now, I have failed to notice any similar news articles. The only articles pertaining to the things you mention come from an anonymous Turkish pilot mentioning about the black box components on turkish f-16's which was picked up by the nut jobs on censoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensoredcensored, spread across Keypubs, Defencetalk, BR, F-16.net, IDF, PDF, Israel defence forum and almost every known forum, where it has been debunked, ridiculed and packed off as one of the "Cool-story Bro" moments.

Lets see your first link,
PAF to get F-16s with tough stipulations
Here is the reporter


Nice looking chap ain't he , now Allvoices is nothing more that a blogging service marketed as Citizen news. Effectively, If I were to unleash half a kilo of home made mutton do pyaza and half a dozen rumali rotis now flavoured with Old monk which I consumed last night, through my rectal cavity, onto my keyboard and publish it on Allvoices, even that would be picked up by someone like you and cited as gospel truth.

Besides for Pakistani f-16's to be unable to target Indian fighters, the f-16 radars should be updated with wartime Indian IFF return codes as "friendlies". So what you are indirectly suggesting that either the entire IAF, IN, IA air borne assets are equipped with IFF that show up as friendlies on f-16's radar, for the ANI report from the second link that you quoted nothing more than assurances from US state department.

2009: F-16s come with strings attached | Pakistan-Papers | DAWN.COM

Also following interview by a PAK airforce pilot

Q 28: One of the stories going around is that the Block 52s are coming with strings attached: (i) the PAF can only base them in one airbase, Jacobabad; (ii) they cannot be used for offensive operations beyond Pakistan's borders; (iii) some sort of monitoring mechanisms will be put in place to monitor the location of each aircraft and (iv) PAF cannot take them outside Pakistan without the permission of the US. Are these correct?

A: To some extent, yes. However, it is important to understand the background to these conditions.
When the PAF asked for the Block 52, the initial US reaction was "no". Their main concern was that if this potent technology could be released to Pakistan, sooner or later, it would end up in the hands of the Chinese who would reverse engineer it. It was the PAF that offered a solution. We could place the Block 52s in a separate airbase where the Chinese would have no access. This meant an airbase that had no Chinese aircraft. We could not base them in Sargodha because we would not deny the Chinese access to our most important airbase. Jacobabad was a forward base which had been revamped by the Americans for Operation Enduring Freedom, including a new first-class runway, so it was the first choice. The US agreed to this proposal provided that it would have the right to monitor the aircraft.
http://www.paffalcons.com/specials/paf-viper-pilot.php

More:

Washington has demanded what it calls unprecedented steps to safeguard the advanced F-16C/D models, their spare parts and munitions from third parties — especially China, which has closed military ties to Pakistan.
"¦The initial security plan for the F-16s was presented to Congress on July 20 by John Hillen, the assistant secretary of state for political-military affairs, who described it as "extraordinary" and "unprecedented."
In testimony to the House of Representatives' International Relations Committee, Hillen highlighted segregation of the aircraft from third country-origin aircraft and munitions, semi-annual F-16 inventories and more frequent looks at associated systems by U.S. personnel.
Hillen, in his testimony, disclosed the United States was withholding unspecified technologies "that would usually go with an F16," including ones that would let it "be used in offensive ways to penetrate air space of another country that was highly defended."
In addition, F-16 flights outside of Pakistan, including exercises with others, "must be approved in advance by the U.S. government," he said
http://www.india-defence.com/reports-2321

MORE

US F-16's to Pak come with a 'no use against India in future' rider


http://news.oneindia.in/2010/06/14/usf-16s-to-pak-come-with-a-no-use-against-india-infuture.html


Finally, PAF is not allowed to attack India ( indian airspace)with these aircrafts BUT CAN DEFEND in its own airspace .

 

[Twinblade]

2009: F-16s come with strings attached | Pakistan-Papers | DAWN.COM

Also following interview by a PAK airforce pilot




More:

Glad to know that you are armed with the super power of Google, but you must understand the quotations beyond the words and into the real world scenarios.

Hillen, in his testimony, disclosed the United States was withholding unspecified technologies "that would usually go with an F16," including ones that would let it "be used in offensive ways to penetrate air space of another country that was highly defended."

Those technologies are related to EW, not missiles. Pakistani F-16's lack the advanced EW modes and threat libraries necessary to operate in a heavlily defended IADS. It was only this October that sales of 10 ALQ-211 AIDEWS (Advanced Integrated Defensive Electronic Warfare Suite) pod for Pakistani f-16's was approved, and that too came after years of begging around and what they got was basically a RWR used on helicopters.

In addition, F-16 flights outside of Pakistan, including exercises with others, "must be approved in advance by the U.S. government," he said

That bit is just one condition out of several dozen which prevents technology proliferation to China.

 

[LETHALFORCE]

guys not to worry those cannot be used in offensive manner against us, once they cross over to our side of border, weapons on f16 are useless, they wont fire and pilot wont be going back with plane.

sent from Russia via ukraine

Air to air refuelling: PAF gets third aircraft from Ukraine | Business Recorder
[h=1]Air to air refuelling: PAF gets third aircraft from Ukraine[/h]

 

[trackwhack]

guys not to worry those cannot be used in offensive manner against us, once they cross over to our side of border, weapons on f16 are useless, they wont fire and pilot wont be going back with plane.

Saya can you explain

 

[JayATL]

Glad to know that you are armed with the super power of Google, but you must understand the quotations beyond the words and into the real world scenarios.

Those technologies are related to EW, not missiles. Pakistani F-16's lack the advanced EW modes and threat libraries necessary to operate in a heavlily defended IADS. It was only this October that sales of 10 ALQ-211 AIDEWS (Advanced Integrated Defensive Electronic Warfare Suite) pod for Pakistani f-16's was approved, and that too came after years of begging around and what they got was basically a RWR used on helicopters.


That bit is just one condition out of several dozen which prevents technology proliferation to China.

Ahh- got it. so I give you several sources and all you do is come out with Twilight Zone Blade 's theories as your counter argument. I'm glad that you think you are legend in your mind, a Guru of insight on what the real terms are on this F16 deal. terms that I have articulated through research being not exactly what is shown in your idiot crystal bowl.


this all started with the likes of you thinking Americans were being anti Indian. having no clue about what the terms were and now after I have baby sat you guys and educated you... the facts still remain


these aircrafts have mandates of not being an offensive force towards India. Of being housed in a completely private airbase and having American personally who prepare the aircraft, monitor all its sorties from the base.

 

[p2prada]

What are you here ?

A member of DFI.

Do you know facts or you just spout out "yes and no and false" verbiage just because...

I guess you did not get past the first 3 words of my post.

Let me tell you a little story.

One day a young lady decided 'enough is enough' and blew up a bit of sand in a desert. The next day a bunch of other old timers from other places decided to make this little thing called 'Nobody can blow up sand except us' club and decided to keep the young lady out of this club. Then they said anybody can join the club as long as they promise not to blow up sand. Many joined this club. But the young lady was still outside the club. Fast forward a few years and the lady blew up a lot more sand. Red faced the old timers decided to let the young lady in the club as well.

Paper treaties are for paper diplomats. Go figure. At war, PAF will use F-16s against India. Go figure.

If you still don't get it, then forget I even posted here.

 

[RedDragon]

China also need to provide more weapon to our friend Pakistan for them to fight with terrorist and keep themselves safe.

 

[Dovah]

China also need to provide more weapon to our friend Pakistan for them to fight with terrorist and keep themselves safe.

But first you need them to supply you their US made weapons so that you can rip them off.
Symbiotic or parasitic?

 

[LETHALFORCE]

China also need to provide more weapon to our friend Pakistan for them to fight with terrorist and keep themselves safe.

any more flamebaits will get an infarction

 

[RedDragon]

But first you need them to supply you their US made weapons so that you can rip them off.
Symbiotic or parasitic?

Not necessary. Only their friendship is needed.

 

[RedDragon]

Weapon to fight with terrorist, help them, help us.

 

[p2prada]

China also need to provide more weapon to our friend Pakistan for them to fight with terrorist and keep themselves safe.

I would be happier if you actually "sold" your weapons to Pak rather than "give" them away for nothing.

 

[pmaitra]

Paper treaties are for paper diplomats. Go figure. At war, PAF will use F-16s against India. Go figure.

If you still don't get it, then forget I even posted here.

Golden words.

It beggars question what would happen if Pakistan were to use these 'code-locked' F-16s against India? Will they disintegrate into thin air the moment they crossed into Indian airspace?

 

[Blackwater]

Golden words.

It beggars question what would happen if Pakistan were to use these 'code-locked' F-16s against India? Will they disintegrate into thin air the moment they crossed into Indian airspace?

probably pakis cant fire missile from Sweet-16

 

[pmaitra]

probably pakis cant fire missile from Sweet-16

Pakis should not be underestimated.

Think about this possibility. They get these code locked planes from US and then they get the Chinese to decode it and the Chinese learn US coding techniques and control frequencies and the Pakis can use these F-16s however they want. Remember, the Chinese are very good at cracking stuff.