DRDO Phalcon style AWACS

[vishwaprasad]

Pak has received 3 more Eyrie awacs from Sweeden.... Now they have complete edge over us in this field and we are still happy with just 3 phalcons and 1 netra awacs

 

[Dark Sorrow]

I see no problem. I think all Boeing Wedgetails started life as commercial airliners and then converted by Boeing to Wedgetail configuration. In the case of the RAF Wedgetail orders, it made a deal with Boeing to let a British firm do the conversion in England under Boeing supervision.

https://www.defensenews.com/industr...ng-over-potential-26b-wedgetail-aircraft-buy/

That would require renegotiation, then why not just buy new aircraft tailor made to carry radar.

 

[asianobserve]

That would require renegotiation, then why not just buy new aircraft tailor made to carry radar.

There is no specialized aircraft designed only to carry AWACS radar perhaps other than E-2 Hawkeye. All the rest are based on modified commercial or military aircraft. There is not enough demand for that kind of specialized aorcraft.

 

[scatterStorm]

And this...

Boeing tanker jets grounded due to tools and debris left during manufacturing
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-tanker-jets-grounded-due-to-tools-and-debris-left-during-manufacturing/?amp=1

No doubt Boeing has been lax lately or maybe some of its workers are showing unhappiness with its aggressive cost-cutting and labor-busting schemes. But I'm confident they will sort out these issues.

Boing is a big player in the market, maybe there is faults in there software and they paid someone to cook up this theory of lazy ass work on there jets. This just diverts attention from bad software logic and version controlling than a person leaving his tools in the jet engine.

 

[scatterStorm]

Pak has received 3 more Eyrie awacs from Sweeden.... Now they have complete edge over us in this field and we are still happy with just 3 phalcons and 1 netra awacs

Relax, there's much more to just owning and flying jets than pure strategy and good detterent. A salvo of Ks-172 (two might be enough) to drop there awacs and I believe we have those missiles. I am pretty sure IAF has a strategy for them already. We have greenpine ground radars, so as soons as an awacs lift off from there airbase, we will get info.

Recently IAF taunted PAF by saying ... they were late in airspace by 10min!

 

[Prashant12]

India will add 2 more aircraft to strengthen AWACS capabilities

Armed with deep penetration and long-range radars, AWACS control the battle theatre in times of hostilities by providing advance information about movement of air assets of the adversary.

The deal is worth around $ 2 billion, with the radar mounted on Russian platform.
A day before the February 26 air strike by India on a Jaish-e-Mohammed training facility in Balakot in Pakistan, the country’s defence ministry moved the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) for acquisition of two more PHALCON airborne warning and control systems (AWACS) aircraft from Israel to match Pakistan’s growing capabilities, according to people familiar with the matter.

The deal is worth around $ 2 billion, with the radar mounted on Russian platform.

With the air strike, and the dogfight between Indian and Pakistani jets the day after, highlighting the importance of aerial supremacy, the Indian Air Force plans to approach the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) after the new government takes over in late May, for the purchase of 21 upgraded MiG-29 air defence fighters from Russia to arrest the growing shortfall in fighter squadrons. This deal is expected to be worth around ₹4,500 crore. Russia has completely switched to Su-30 platforms and MiG 29 fighters have been lying mothballed with MiG-MAPO corporation.

Four people directly involved in the process said that the need for PHALCON AWACS was felt as Pakistan has seven of them in service as compared to five in service with IAF. After the Balakot strike, the requirement was felt more acutely with Islamabad deploying two AWACS round-the-clock in the north and the south, while India had AWACS up for only 12 hours a day along its northern and western borders. Both sides put AWACS to good use during the February 27 air skirmish in the Nowshera sector of Jammu.

Armed with deep penetration and long-range radars, AWACS control the battle theatre in times of hostilities by providing advance information about movement of air assets of the adversary as well as directing air defence to prevent any breach of home air space.

According to the people cited above, Pakistan has three SAAB-2000 and four Shaanxi Y-8 turbo-prop airborne early warning systems; it reportedly lost two SAAB aircraft in a terrorist attack on PNS Mehran in Karachi on May 22-23, 2011. The SAAB radars provide a 270-degree coverage of the enemy positions but the platform has height restrictions due to turbo-prop engines.

In comparison, IAF has three Israeli built PHALCON AWACS and two more DRDO built early warning systems mounted on an Embraer jet platform. The Israeli aircraft is fitted with the top-of-the-line Green Pine radar system that can look into enemy territory up to a range of 300 to 500km . It is this aircraft that successfully directed the air operations against a package of 24 Pakistan Air Force fighters on February 27 in Nowshera, the people added.

First Published: May 01, 2019 07:42 IST

https://www.hindustantimes.com/indi...apabilities/story-rR6RKwAYGeuBuYbr2eYWWN.html

 

[Armand2REP]

It makes you wonder where the Il-76s are coming from. Russia has only managed to finish a single one out of Ulyanovsk in the last 10 years.

 

[mystic avatar]

Hasn't satellite based radars such as our RISAT has made AWACS already obsolete? Or do they serve other purpose besides radar surveillance?

 

[Snowcat]

Hasn't satellite based radars such as our RISAT has made AWACS already obsolete? Or do they serve other purpose besides radar surveillance?

If such things were true, US wouldn't have been operating any AWACS aircraft , and I think satellites are moving way too to be used during such scenarios.

 

[Bhadra]

If such things were true, US wouldn't have been operating any AWACS aircraft , and I think satellites are moving way too to be used during such scenarios.

OMG, that can not really be the answer. The ultility of AWACS Vis a Vis Satellite must lie somewhere else rather than "Since US is doing...".

 

[Armand2REP]

Hasn't satellite based radars such as our RISAT has made AWACS already obsolete? Or do they serve other purpose besides radar surveillance?

RISAT uses SAR which is for ground mapping. It is useless for tracking airbourne objects.

 

[gryphus-scarface]

RISAT uses SAR which is for ground mapping. It is useless for tracking airbourne objects.

Also RISAT-1 is in a sun-synchronous orbit, so it will have some time when it isn't able to see Pakistan or any other necessary area. As you said AWACS also has accuracy which is necessary for Fire Control.

 

[Bhadra]

If such things were true, US wouldn't have been operating any AWACS aircraft , and I think satellites are moving way too to be used during such scenarios.

As a layman I understand though both can carry radars and detect the air / maritime traffic and aircrafts, AWACS is C4I platform is much more than a radar. It carriers large paraphernalia such as computers, communications, EW Equipment and even active weapon platforms not only to detect and acquire but identify, analyse and control a response to the situation . It has human elements to perform all function on the platform

The Most important thing is that AWACS can direct own response and control it which satellite by itself may not be able do. It is a potent defensive as also offensive platform

 

[Absolut_Vodka]

Hasn't satellite based radars such as our RISAT has made AWACS already obsolete? Or do they serve other purpose besides radar surveillance?

I think you mean to say EMISAT but it can do enemy Radar mapping, it can act as receiver to ground based Tx'tters. You can install a greater sensitivity receiver as opposed to high gain antenna which requires more power and can give away sat's position. Ground based radars usually form a bubble around monitored airspace and can be tracked through sat.

AWACS usually sees 360 degree and forms cylindrical beam pattern around it. Fighter jets too have a cone shaped beam pattern with radar movement of couple of degrees. These assets don't point directly to sky.

 

[asianobserve]

Two of the UK’s five on-order Boeing E-7 Wedgetail airborne early warning and control aircraft will be converted commercial airliners, the Ministry of Defence has confirmed.
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/a...nd-hand-jets-as-part-of-wedgetail-buy-458127/

 

[Chinmoy]

Hasn't satellite based radars such as our RISAT has made AWACS already obsolete? Or do they serve other purpose besides radar surveillance?

Satellites like RISAT use RADAR imaging to provide specific image of an area at any given time under any condition. Now it is good for surveillance and recce purpose. But AWACS is a whole platform which performs additional task of command and control center along with surveillance.

You could consider AWACS as an ATC with battlefield management capability and RISAT as a RADAR to keep out an eye for any incursion into your space.

 

[Gandaberunda]

Hasn't satellite based radars such as our RISAT has made AWACS already obsolete? Or do they serve other purpose besides radar surveillance?

AWACS are also used to fed radar info to the front line fighter jet in combat formation. The attacking posture jets operate by switching off the radar and depend on info fed through AWACS as used in Copa 2004 drill with Americans

 

[Punya Pratap]

Meanwhile, the below news coming from the UK

https://www.janes.com/article/88545/uk-to-buy-second-hand-737s-for-wedgetail-aew-c-project

UK to buy second-hand 737s for Wedgetail AEW&C project
Tim Ripley, London - Jane's Defence Weekly
15 May 2019
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Artist's impression of Wedgetail, the platform for which the UK will buy second hand. Source: Crown Copyright
Two of the five Boeing 737NG airframes for the UK's future E-7 Wedgetail airborne early warning and control (AEW&C) project will be second-hand former airliners, according to correspondence between Defence Procurement Minister Stuart Andrew and the House of Commons Defence Committee.

Andrew also told the committee that the first two aircraft will start conversion work at Marshall Aerospace's Cambridge site in 2021 and the final aircraft will be complete in early 2026.

In October 2018, then-defence secretary Gavin Williamson announced that the UK had selected the Wedgetail, and in March 2019, he confirmed a USD1.98 billion deal with Boeing to buy five E-7 aircraft.

"Boeing has sourced two 737NG from the commercial market and secured a further three production slots on [its] Seattle production line in 2021 and 2022 to meet our needs," Andrew wrote in a letter dated 25 April and seen by Jane's on 10 May.

"The conversion of these five aircraft to the E-7 AEW&C standard will be undertaken at Marshall Aerospace's facilities in Cambridge," he said. "Boeing have significant experience of the conversion from the 737NG to E-7, having previously set up conversion facilities in three separate countries. They have already started work with Marshall Aerospace, bringing in an experienced team who were involved in the previous conversions, to ensure the lessons have been learnt and are applied."

Andrew said he anticipated the modification of each aircraft to take an average of 24 months. The Ministry of Defence (MoD) would robustly monitor the project to assess progress, he added.

The procurement minister revealed that the UK Wedgetail project is now expected to cost more than the USD1.98 billion Williamson cited because it does not include several support elements. "The initial contract principally covers the aircraft procurement and conversion," said Andrew

 

[neeraj_]

If such things were true, US wouldn't have been operating any AWACS aircraft , and I think satellites are moving way too to be used during such scenarios.

USA already has plans to replace their AWACS as they believe in a war like situation with nation like China or Russia who have credible airforce with AWACS killer missiles AWACS will be vulnerable .

 

[shuvo@y2k10]

Question is can the DRDO radar be fitted to some of the aeroplanes of jet airways many of which are lying idle in airports parking lots around India? This option needs to be explored.

Source : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jet_Airways