Doom and Gloom of China's Economy

Armand2REP

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China new ship orders plummet by 43pct YoY

China Knowledge reported that China new ship orders plunged 42.8 % to 29.05 million deadweight tonnes in the first nine months of this year.

The figure included 10.23 million DWT of marine ships.

In the period from January to September, the country output of completed ships 51.01 million DWT of which 14.97 million DWT was marine ships. China's outstanding orders had amounted to 168.86 million DWT at the end of September down by 14.5%YoY.

Steel Guru : China new ship orders in Jan to Sep down by 43pct YoY - 232372 - 2011-10-26

:rofl:
 

cir

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Fixing trade imbalance: Import curbs on China likely as deficit grows
31 Oct, 2011, 06.44AM IST, Amiti SenAmiti Sen,ET Bureau

NEW DELHI: India's widening trade gap with China has triggered an alarm in the government, forcing it to brood over a host of measures to restrict imports from the country.

The commerce department has hammered out a "China Strategy" that calls for higher tariffs on most Chinese goods while proposing a complete ban on specific items, like power and telecom equipment. It also suggests making it mandatory for Chinese firms to enter into joint ventures with Indian companies before they could import heavy equipment and machinery from the country.

The move comes as India's trade deficit with China, its biggest trading partner, jumped 160% to $23.9 billion in the five years to 2010-11. Trade deficit is the gap between what is imported and exported and a rise in spread indicates India's increasing dependence on China.

"China has already taken over our power sector and is ruling the low-end market for mobile phone handsets," a senior official in the commerce department told ET on condition of anonymity. "If we do not step in now with suitable policy measures, our trade gap with China will rise further."

While imports of Chinese goods rose to $43.5 billion in 2010-11 from $17.5 billion in 2006-07, exports lagged far behind, up to just $19.6 billion from $8.3 billion over five years.

Indian officials say China acknowledges that trade imbalance is a problem, but it has done little to address it. The commerce department said Beijing has ignored seven specific requests from Delhi to ease imports of Indian goods that could have narrowed the trade gap significantly. These requests, made by Commerce and Industry Minister Anand Sharma during his Beijing visit last year and reiterated during Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao's New Delhi visit last December, included import relaxation for Indian pharmaceuticals, agricultural produce, IT products and heavy machinery.

"China promised us almost two years back that it would work towards helping us bridge the trade deficit, but has not yet taken any significant step," the official quoted earlier said.

China's lack of response forced the commerce department to plan measures aimed at restricting imports and boosting exports of value-added products, the official said, adding that the ministries of finance, power, telecom and home would be consulted once the strategy is ready.

The department also plans to encourage substitution of Chinese goods with those items from South Korea and Japan that face low tariff barriers.

Experts, however, say restricting Chinese imports will not be easy. "Even if we ignore the WTO rules and its ramifications, there is just too much peer pressure," said Biswajit Dhar, director general of RIS, a Delhi-based think tank for developing countries.

"In the G-20 forums, countries are constantly harping on ways to keep market open and such steps would be frowned upon." Besides, experts say, such measures could scare off foreign investors from India. "Restriction on Chinese investments could raise concerns that they could be extended to other countries as well," a trade analyst said. But Indian officials do not agree.

"We are aware of all existing rules and policies and there are ways around everything:laugh::laugh:," the official said. Reliance Communications, the telecom firm led by Anil Ambani, signed a deal in March to borrow $1.93 billion from China Development Bank. This included $1.33 billion for refinancing 3G spectrum fee payment and $600 million for equipment import from Chinese vendors. Check out Brand Equity's Most Trusted Brands List 2011
 

cir

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CSCL says buys 8 container ships for $754 mln
HONG KONG | Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:00am EDT

Oct 29 (Reuters) - China Shipping Container Lines Co Ltd said it ordered eight 10,000 TEU vessels from two Chinese shipyards for a total of $754.24 million to improve economies of scale and strength competitiveness.

Its wholly-owned unit China Shipping Container Lines (Hong Kong) Co Ltd had ordered four container ships with options for two more each from Hudong Zhonghua Shipbuilding (Group) and Dalian Shipbuilding Heavy Industries, CSCL said in a statement late on Friday.

The ships with a capacity of 10,000 twenty-foot equivalent units (TEU) worth $94 million each would be delivered no later than November 30, 2013.
 

Armand2REP

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China 'ghost cities' fuel economic fears
Updated: 07:50, Saturday November 26, 2011

China's 'ghost cities' show that the country's economic boom could be more fragile than it appears.

Kangbashi is a showcase city, laid out spaciously on the grasslands of northern China.

It was dreamt up by the local secretary of the Communist Party as a monument to the country's new-found prosperity.

The place is dominated by impressive public buildings - a marble-clad library, a state-of-the-art theatre and a giant convention centre.

In the centre of town a 70m-high statue of two fighting horses looms over Genghis Khan Square.

The only thing missing is the people.

Kangbashi was built to house one million residents, but so far only 20,000 have moved in.

Acres of apartment complexes - many of them luxurious by Chinese standards - are deserted. Store fronts are boarded up.

When they first began building Kangbashi, there was a frenzy of investment. The local government contributed a GBP200m ($A318.79m) road network. Nearly all of the homes that now lie empty were sold off-plan.

The buyers were China's cashed-up new middle class. The country's poorly-regulated stock markets, along with controls on investing overseas, have made second, third and even fourth homes a popular store of wealth.

But from the very outset, Kangbashi defied all economic logic. There's no industry in the city, and no real reason to live there.

Now Kangbashi - along with other 'ghost cities' dotted around China - has come to symbolise what many believe is a dangerous property bubble that could be primed to pop.

The scale of China's housing boom is staggering. Over the past five years the country has built nearly 40 million new homes. In some cities the price of housing has tripled in the same period.

Chinese economist Zhang Bin said: 'If you look at financial crises, they're always accompanied by property bubbles.

'Lower property prices would definitely be more sustainable and healthy, but a sharp drop would mean a big contraction in the economy and problems like unemployment.'

In Kangbashi, many think the bubble has already popped.

Businessman Wang Pen spent his life savings buying a two-bedroom apartment. He says its value has fallen by 20 per cent since the start of the year.

But Mr Wang finds it difficult to believe that the good times will ever stop rolling.

'When I bought this one three years ago I was still poor, so it's a bit small,' he said.

'Now I'm thinking of getting another place, something bigger.'

If the bubble bursts on a nationwide scale, it could be disastrous, not just for China, but for global economic recovery.

China is now the world's second-biggest economy, and by some estimates nearly half of its GDP is in some way linked to property.

Alistair Thornton, Beijing-based economist with HIS Global Insight, said: 'Property is the core of the Chinese economy.

'With the eurozone weak and the US stagnant, a sharp contraction in the world's largest growth engine would have a dramatic effect. It's not a good story.'
 
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Armand2REP

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Most Chinese Builders Face Payment Delays

Nov. 25 (Bloomberg) -- Most Chinese builders face payment delays from developers as the pace of construction slows from three months earlier amid tighter credit and a slowdown in home sales, Credit Suisse Group AG said in a report.

About 80 percent of construction companies said developers were behind on payments, and property companies expect them to put up more up front investments for projects, the brokerage said, citing a survey with builders. About 27 percent of the builders said developers wanted to slow down the construction process, up from 13 percent three months ago, it said.

"The China property market correction has just begun, and completion slippages and sales weakness will likely follow," Credit Suisse analysts Wenhan Chen, Jinsong Du and Duo Chen said in a report sent today, maintaining their "underweight" rating on the nation's real estate market. "With the property market remaining sluggish and the credit environment still tight, we expect developers' cash flows to deteriorate further."

Most Chinese Builders Face Payment Delays, Credit Suisse Says - Businessweek
 

tony4562

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China new ship orders plummet by 43pct YoY

China Knowledge reported that China new ship orders plunged 42.8 % to 29.05 million deadweight tonnes in the first nine months of this year.

The figure included 10.23 million DWT of marine ships.

In the period from January to September, the country output of completed ships 51.01 million DWT of which 14.97 million DWT was marine ships. China's outstanding orders had amounted to 168.86 million DWT at the end of September down by 14.5%YoY.

Steel Guru : China new ship orders in Jan to Sep down by 43pct YoY - 232372 - 2011-10-26

:rofl:

It's still like 100 times more than India has, your ancestral land and the land you really identify with.
 

tony4562

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China 'ghost cities' fuel economic fears
Updated: 07:50, Saturday November 26, 2011

China's 'ghost cities' show that the country's economic boom could be more fragile than it appears.

Kangbashi is a showcase city, laid out spaciously on the grasslands of northern China.

It was dreamt up by the local secretary of the Communist Party as a monument to the country's new-found prosperity.

The place is dominated by impressive public buildings - a marble-clad library, a state-of-the-art theatre and a giant convention centre.

In the centre of town a 70m-high statue of two fighting horses looms over Genghis Khan Square.

The only thing missing is the people.

Kangbashi was built to house one million residents, but so far only 20,000 have moved in.

Acres of apartment complexes - many of them luxurious by Chinese standards - are deserted. Store fronts are boarded up.

When they first began building Kangbashi, there was a frenzy of investment. The local government contributed a GBP200m ($A318.79m) road network. Nearly all of the homes that now lie empty were sold off-plan.

The buyers were China's cashed-up new middle class. The country's poorly-regulated stock markets, along with controls on investing overseas, have made second, third and even fourth homes a popular store of wealth.

But from the very outset, Kangbashi defied all economic logic. There's no industry in the city, and no real reason to live there.

Now Kangbashi - along with other 'ghost cities' dotted around China - has come to symbolise what many believe is a dangerous property bubble that could be primed to pop.

The scale of China's housing boom is staggering. Over the past five years the country has built nearly 40 million new homes. In some cities the price of housing has tripled in the same period.

Chinese economist Zhang Bin said: 'If you look at financial crises, they're always accompanied by property bubbles.

'Lower property prices would definitely be more sustainable and healthy, but a sharp drop would mean a big contraction in the economy and problems like unemployment.'

In Kangbashi, many think the bubble has already popped.

Businessman Wang Pen spent his life savings buying a two-bedroom apartment. He says its value has fallen by 20 per cent since the start of the year.

But Mr Wang finds it difficult to believe that the good times will ever stop rolling.

'When I bought this one three years ago I was still poor, so it's a bit small,' he said.

'Now I'm thinking of getting another place, something bigger.'

If the bubble bursts on a nationwide scale, it could be disastrous, not just for China, but for global economic recovery.

China is now the world's second-biggest economy, and by some estimates nearly half of its GDP is in some way linked to property.

Alistair Thornton, Beijing-based economist with HIS Global Insight, said: 'Property is the core of the Chinese economy.

'With the eurozone weak and the US stagnant, a sharp contraction in the world's largest growth engine would have a dramatic effect. It's not a good story.'

So far when people talk about the so-called ghost cities, they almost universally quote that place (never heard of) in the remote inner mongolia as an example. Guess there just ain't other such places around. Inner Mongolia is to China is like Alaska to the US, hardly the epicenter of China's economy. What ever happens there, has virtually no impact on the national level.
 
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Armand2REP

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Chicoms keep saying that the people will come, how many years do we have to hear that? The property bubble in Ordos has burst with prices dropping 70% according to PBOC. All of that coal wealth has been wiped out in a matter of months. It is just a view of things to come as the rest of the bubbles pop.
 

tony4562

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Chicoms keep saying that the people will come, how many years do we have to hear that? The property bubble in Ordos has burst with prices dropping 70% according to PBOC. All of that coal wealth has been wiped out in a matter of months. It is just a view of things to come as the rest of the bubbles pop.
Ordos is not even among the top 100 cities in China. The fact that you keep dragging this non-issue into the discusssion, just shows you really have nothing else to say. How pathetic.
 

DMF

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Kangbashi, first time to learn this name, ha, a much famous town out of China now, a town in inner Mongolia, a very small place, the leaders of a county by the name E'ER'DO'SI, rich natural resources made the decision to make a new place to move the county center to a new place, so they built up a small city in a town nearby, when the city completed with shipping centers and schools and hospitals, may they move in this city.
But I think china's real estate bulb will not burst, because now it's not that people can not pay to buy the flats inside the buildings , it's because the price is continue to going up, the government have to restrict it. If the government removes the restrictions, the price will go up again. The land owner is the government, they sell the land by auction at very high prices, the bank is government and the government is the bank in China, the bank will never burst.
Now the concern for China is the up-grade of industries. The government has the leverage to guide the development of China. After this crisis, China will be at better position than before
 

Armand2REP

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Ordos is not even among the top 100 cities in China. The fact that you keep dragging this non-issue into the discusssion, just shows you really have nothing else to say. How pathetic.
Ordos has a $17 billion GDP, that not only easily puts it in the top 100 but one of the richest per capita in the country.
 

DMF

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Haha, ordos, not e'er'dosi, as a Chinese, very shy not know the city name; also don't know how to write Kangbashi in Chinese.
 

tony4562

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The flats of Ordos will eventually be filled. This type of housing is, however, something the vast majority of India's general population can only dream of.
 

tony4562

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Ordos has a $17 billion GDP, that not only easily puts it in the top 100 but one of the richest per capita in the country.
It does have high GDP per head mainly because of its small population and abundance of natural resources (the city is famous for the kashmir it produces, i think), sort like Kuwait. But 17 billion is nothing. Just in the yantze delta region there are at least a dozen cities that have higher GDP than Ordos. My family for example came from the city of suzhou, hardly the best-known city in China, but it has a GDP of about 120 billion dollars. The other day I compared Suzhou with major indian cities on google earth, and to my astonishment Suzhou is area-wise larger than all indian cities, including Mumbai. This just illustrates how backward India really is.
 

Dovah

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The other day I compared Suzhou with major indian cities on google earth, and to my astonishment Suzhou is area-wise larger than all indian cities, including Mumbai. This just illustrates how backward India really is.
This just shows how stupid you really are.
 

Bangalorean

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The other day I compared Suzhou with major indian cities on google earth, and to my astonishment Suzhou is area-wise larger than all indian cities, including Mumbai. This just illustrates how backward India really is.
Are you a fool? The GDP of Mumbai city is around the same as that of Shanghai. So, either your Suzhou is a huge collection of zero-productivity shacks, or you are lying.
 

Dovah

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Are you a fool? The GDP of Mumbai city is around the same as that of Shanghai. So, either your Suzhou is a huge collection of zero-productivity shacks, or you are lying.
Yup,
GDP Shanghai= $233bn
GDP Mumbai= $209bn.

So, either your Suzhou is a huge collection of zero-productivity shacks,
Most probably.
 

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