Dokhlam Standoff 2.0 : PLA Troops Re-deploy (Oct 2017)

[Kalki_2018]

Not related but should be noted somewhere.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...dType=RSS&feedName=worldNews&utm_source=quora

chinese tried a stunt and then fled in panic..

http://www.business-standard.com/ar...return-to-south-china-sea-118022000890_1.html

 

[rockrocky]

Another Doklam-like standoff likely this year, says Chinese daily

 

[AMCA]

Another Doklam-like standoff likely this year, says Chinese daily

China is giving daily doses of psy war and our media is busy helping them, copying and pasting everything chinese daily says about india.

 

[hit&run]

Another Doklam-like standoff likely this year, says Chinese daily

Chinese and their warning farts. These cowards only fight in their media OpEds and win imaginary battles there.

At borders they only get man-handled, jump stone bulwarks and wave banners.

Chini media and their propaganda garbage dump a.k.a Porki defecation forum has made North Korean media look way better.

 

[indus]

Tango or not, India must remain steadfast with China; Beijing's call for 'friendship' could be another ploy
India Prakash Katoch
Mar 19, 2018 12:27:35 IST

Two signals from China caused an eclectic change in India’s outlook towards China. In December 2017, China’s Special Representative Yang Jiechi delivered Chinese president Xi Jinping's message to Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi that both countries should aspire to become "friends for generations" and "partners in rejuvenation.

The second signal was Chinese foreign minister Wang Yi briefing media in Beijing (March 2018), "Despite some tests and difficulties, the China-India relationship continues to grow. ...China is upholding its rights and legitimate interests.... Chinese dragon and Indian elephant must not fight each other but dance with each other.... If China and India are united, one plus one will become eleven instead of two. With political trust, not even the Himalayas can stop us from friendly exchanges.”
India’s response was erratic, to say the least. A government memo asked leaders and government functionaries not to attend Tibetan diaspora events marking 60 years of Dalai Lama’s exile and thanking India for giving shelter to Tibetans. With External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj attending foreign ministers meet in China before the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation summit in Qingdao (June 2018), which will be attended by Modi, it's all the more reason to interpret Chinese signals cautiously. Besides, the fact that Tibetan prime minister Lobsang Sangay was invited for Modi’s swearing-in ceremony, wouldn't it have been prudent to quietly orchestrate postponing the 'thank you' event to the end 2018, giving time to observe the Chinese behaviour?

India also cancelled the annual Asian Security Conference by Institute of Defence Studies and Analysis (IDSA) citing “administrative reasons”, this year’s theme being "India and China in Asia: Making of a New Equilibrium". Whether or not there was fear of discussions that could displease Chinese participants, the cancellation does indicate undue appeasement; a sign of weakness.

Significantly, while Yang delivered Xi's message to Modi, the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) was permanently establishing itself in north Dokalam. Defence minister Nirmala Sitharaman eventually admitted Chinese presence in the region but efforts continue to play it down. A post on social media talked of PLA shivering in minus 17 degrees in temporary shelters. Another talked of satellite photographs misinterpreted and that China had no Plan B at Dokalam, which must have tickled the Chinese pink. Incidentally, Yang was a state councilor under Chinese premier Li Keqiang in 2013 when the latter visited India in the wake of the 19-kilometre deep PLA intrusion at Raki Nala in the Depsang Plains of eastern Ladakh.
Yi’s call for tango too raises many questions. Dance to whose tune — China’s? Doesn’t his statement about upholding China’s rights and legitimate interests imply all illegal claims (Dokalam, Arunachal Pradesh, and other areas), and isn’t this a threat? What is the basis of trusting China — a call to Tango? Where was China when Russian president Vladimir Putin was pushing for stronger India-China-Russia relations over a decade ago? Would Yi call that 1+1+1 equals 111?

The Chinese excel in attacking the leadership of target country — witness Pakistan, Nepal, the Maldives, Sri Lanka, Laos, Cambodia, and even Indonesia. This is extremely easy in politically divided India. That is why Ambassador Luo Zhaohui was parleying with the Opposition and threatening India during the Dokalam standoff, while Indian communist leaders — welcomed and funded by Beijing and the Communist Party of China — are now sending "heartfelt congratulation and best wishes" to Congress president Rahul Gandhi. Quite apparently, China wants India to join CPEC, something the Indian Opposition may have promised to do if they come to power, surrendering the sovereignty of India notwithstanding.
Chinese are also past masters in winning over diplomats posted in Beijing. Remember Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel deploring then ambassador to China, KM Panikkar, in his letter to Jawaharlal Nehru on 7 November, 1950. Another former ambassador to China serving as National Security Advisor of India during the UPA II rule was building perceptions for India to withdraw from the Siachen area that would enable China and Pakistan to join hands in Ladakh at an immense strategic disadvantage to India.

Vijay Gokhale, India’s present Foreign Secretary has also served in Beijing albeit he has red-flagged China’s connectivity push.

But all said and done, don’t we understand that China is behind the increased belligerence of Pakistan, turning the Maldives and Nepal against India; Pakistan targeting Indian villagers to increase pressure on the Modi government; or the Pakistani prime minister rushing to Nepal to coordinate a joint China-Pakistan-Nepal pressure group against India, and the like. With absolute power, Xi is challenging the US on multiple fronts. Chinese protégé North Korea is testing nuclear reactors for making weapons-grade plutonium.

Some views are being expressed that the India-China rapprochement would wean the communist nation away from Pakistan, which is naïve considering China uses Pakistan against India, employing the ancient strategy to 'kill with a borrowed knife'. Besides, Pakistan is already a Chinese province and strategically vital for China. The view that the Chinese are constrained to team up with India because of the downturn in the Chinses economy too is flawed because the Chinese economy is four times that of India, and India will hardly terminate trade relations in case of border clashes; considering we haven’t even withdrawn the most favoured nation status to Pakistan.

India needs to remain steadfast, even though the NDA II has continued with the UPA policy of deliberately keeping India armed forces ill-equipped. India still has surprises for China in case of larger conflagrations while in small-sized conflicts, the military can be counted upon to blunt PLA intrusions. The obsolete weapons don’t mean they don’t fire, and Xi knows this from China’s invasion of Vietnam in 1979. But if India wants peace, it must prepare for war. In geopolitics, no negotiations work from the position of weakness. Xi wants China-centric Asia which requires subjugating India. Instead of getting mesmerised by the serpent's gaze, we should focus on its fangs.

Finally, there is no reason for India to be obsequious to Beijing as China will mount all-round pressure in trying to force New Delhi to join CPEC and install a government that dances to Xi’s tune. At the same time, relations that don’t impinge India’s national interests must be pursued.

The author is a retired lieutenant-general of the Indian Army

 

[indus]

Envoy to China speaks, India’s tough talk on Doklam ahead of PM visit
Modi will visit Qingdao in China for the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation summit on June 9-10, Bambawale has confirmed. While it was known that Modi is likely to visit China, this is the first time the dates have been announced officially.

• Written By Shubhajit Roy | New Delhi |
• Updated: March 25, 2018 7:29 Am

In his first candid comments on Doklam after taking charge last November, Indian envoy to China Gautam Bambawale said Saturday that the crisis started because the Chinese military changed the status quo in the region. His comments come ahead of Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s trip to China in June. Modi will visit Qingdao in China for the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation summit on June 9-10, Bambawale has confirmed. While it was known that Modi is likely to visit China, this is the first time the dates have been announced officially.

In an interview to Hong Kong-based newspaper South China Morning Post (SCMP), Bambawale said: “If anyone changes the status quo, it will lead to a situation like what happened in Doklam. I can tell you very frankly and you can quote me on this. The Chinese military changed the status quo in the Doklam area and therefore India reacted to it. Ours was a reaction to the change in the status quo by the Chinese military.”

He said that while political-level communication between the two countries had resumed, military-to-military communication at “headquarters-level” had not started, and there should be better communication “down the line.”
Sources said that Bambawale’s comments are a reaffirmation of India’s position on Doklam, despite Delhi’s outreach to Beijing on the Tibetan issue. The comments are sharply worded and make it clear that the Indian response on the border had been “political” and not just “military,” they said.

The Indian envoy made the comments during his Hong Kong visit, his first outside Beijing. India and Hong Kong signed the Double-Taxation Avoidance Agreement during the visit.

Highlighting the need for China and India to be “frank and candid” to reduce their ongoing tensions, he said: “In the sense that if the Chinese military are going to build a road, then they must tell us ‘we are going to build a road’. If we do not agree to it, then we can reply that, ‘look, you’re changing the status quo. Please don’t do it. This is a very very sensitive area.’”

The Indian envoy refuted recent reports that the Chinese military is stepping up infrastructure build-up in Doklam area. “Maybe behind the Chinese maybe putting more military barracks to put in more soldiers, but that is well behind the sensitive area. Those are the things you’re free to do and we are also free to do, because you’re doing it inside your territory and we are doing it inside our territory,” he said. This has also been India’s official position for the past six months.

Confirming Modi’s China visit, Bambawale said: “During that (PM’s visit), we will definitely have bilateral meeting between PM Modi and (Chinese) President Xi Jinping,” he said.

Sources told The Indian Express that the dates of the visit were finalised after the PMO signed off on the visit following Foreign Secretary Vijay Gokhale’s visit to Beijing on February 23. A day ahead of the visit, Gokhale wrote a note to the Cabinet secretary asking him to order all government officials to skip events organised by the Tibetan government-in-exile as part of their “Thank you India” campaign. This was seen as an attempt to mend fences with Beijing.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Tango or not, India must remain steadfast with China; Beijing's call for 'friendship' could be another ploy
India Prakash Katoch
Mar 19, 2018 12:27:35 IST

Two signals from China caused an eclectic change in India’s outlook towards China. In December 2017, China’s Special Representative Yang Jiechi delivered Chinese president Xi Jinping's message to Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi that both countries should aspire to become "friends for generations" and "partners in rejuvenation.

The second signal was Chinese foreign minister Wang Yi briefing media in Beijing (March 2018), "Despite some tests and difficulties, the China-India relationship continues to grow. ...China is upholding its rights and legitimate interests.... Chinese dragon and Indian elephant must not fight each other but dance with each other.... If China and India are united, one plus one will become eleven instead of two. With political trust, not even the Himalayas can stop us from friendly exchanges.”
India’s response was erratic, to say the least. A government memo asked leaders and government functionaries not to attend Tibetan diaspora events marking 60 years of Dalai Lama’s exile and thanking India for giving shelter to Tibetans. With External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj attending foreign ministers meet in China before the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation summit in Qingdao (June 2018), which will be attended by Modi, it's all the more reason to interpret Chinese signals cautiously. Besides, the fact that Tibetan prime minister Lobsang Sangay was invited for Modi’s swearing-in ceremony, wouldn't it have been prudent to quietly orchestrate postponing the 'thank you' event to the end 2018, giving time to observe the Chinese behaviour?

India also cancelled the annual Asian Security Conference by Institute of Defence Studies and Analysis (IDSA) citing “administrative reasons”, this year’s theme being "India and China in Asia: Making of a New Equilibrium". Whether or not there was fear of discussions that could displease Chinese participants, the cancellation does indicate undue appeasement; a sign of weakness.

Significantly, while Yang delivered Xi's message to Modi, the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) was permanently establishing itself in north Dokalam. Defence minister Nirmala Sitharaman eventually admitted Chinese presence in the region but efforts continue to play it down. A post on social media talked of PLA shivering in minus 17 degrees in temporary shelters. Another talked of satellite photographs misinterpreted and that China had no Plan B at Dokalam, which must have tickled the Chinese pink. Incidentally, Yang was a state councilor under Chinese premier Li Keqiang in 2013 when the latter visited India in the wake of the 19-kilometre deep PLA intrusion at Raki Nala in the Depsang Plains of eastern Ladakh.
Yi’s call for tango too raises many questions. Dance to whose tune — China’s? Doesn’t his statement about upholding China’s rights and legitimate interests imply all illegal claims (Dokalam, Arunachal Pradesh, and other areas), and isn’t this a threat? What is the basis of trusting China — a call to Tango? Where was China when Russian president Vladimir Putin was pushing for stronger India-China-Russia relations over a decade ago? Would Yi call that 1+1+1 equals 111?

The Chinese excel in attacking the leadership of target country — witness Pakistan, Nepal, the Maldives, Sri Lanka, Laos, Cambodia, and even Indonesia. This is extremely easy in politically divided India. That is why Ambassador Luo Zhaohui was parleying with the Opposition and threatening India during the Dokalam standoff, while Indian communist leaders — welcomed and funded by Beijing and the Communist Party of China — are now sending "heartfelt congratulation and best wishes" to Congress president Rahul Gandhi. Quite apparently, China wants India to join CPEC, something the Indian Opposition may have promised to do if they come to power, surrendering the sovereignty of India notwithstanding.
Chinese are also past masters in winning over diplomats posted in Beijing. Remember Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel deploring then ambassador to China, KM Panikkar, in his letter to Jawaharlal Nehru on 7 November, 1950. Another former ambassador to China serving as National Security Advisor of India during the UPA II rule was building perceptions for India to withdraw from the Siachen area that would enable China and Pakistan to join hands in Ladakh at an immense strategic disadvantage to India.

Vijay Gokhale, India’s present Foreign Secretary has also served in Beijing albeit he has red-flagged China’s connectivity push.

But all said and done, don’t we understand that China is behind the increased belligerence of Pakistan, turning the Maldives and Nepal against India; Pakistan targeting Indian villagers to increase pressure on the Modi government; or the Pakistani prime minister rushing to Nepal to coordinate a joint China-Pakistan-Nepal pressure group against India, and the like. With absolute power, Xi is challenging the US on multiple fronts. Chinese protégé North Korea is testing nuclear reactors for making weapons-grade plutonium.

Some views are being expressed that the India-China rapprochement would wean the communist nation away from Pakistan, which is naïve considering China uses Pakistan against India, employing the ancient strategy to 'kill with a borrowed knife'. Besides, Pakistan is already a Chinese province and strategically vital for China. The view that the Chinese are constrained to team up with India because of the downturn in the Chinses economy too is flawed because the Chinese economy is four times that of India, and India will hardly terminate trade relations in case of border clashes; considering we haven’t even withdrawn the most favoured nation status to Pakistan.

India needs to remain steadfast, even though the NDA II has continued with the UPA policy of deliberately keeping India armed forces ill-equipped. India still has surprises for China in case of larger conflagrations while in small-sized conflicts, the military can be counted upon to blunt PLA intrusions. The obsolete weapons don’t mean they don’t fire, and Xi knows this from China’s invasion of Vietnam in 1979. But if India wants peace, it must prepare for war. In geopolitics, no negotiations work from the position of weakness. Xi wants China-centric Asia which requires subjugating India. Instead of getting mesmerised by the serpent's gaze, we should focus on its fangs.

Finally, there is no reason for India to be obsequious to Beijing as China will mount all-round pressure in trying to force New Delhi to join CPEC and install a government that dances to Xi’s tune. At the same time, relations that don’t impinge India’s national interests must be pursued.

The author is a retired lieutenant-general of the Indian Army

Everything China says is a ploy. I don't think our people are dumb enough to fall for it.

If China "extends a hand of friendship", you may assume they're working on funding some insurgency somewhere, or giving more money to Porkistan. Every time China wants to "work together", you can 100% guarantee that they're working to undermine our interests somewhere in the Indian Ocean.

The only thing you can guarantee is that China will find every way to backstab us. The CCP cannot be trusted, but at least like Pakistan, they're transparently treacherous, unlike the West, who hide it so well.

 

[nimo_cn]

Chinese state TV station was recently broadcasting a documentary serial about low level Chinese soldiers, the first episode of which focused on female rocket artillery operators serving in Tibet. that episode from a side confirmed that, during the 70 days standoff in 2017, for the first time PLA had got the opportunity to deploy and fire long-range rocket artillery along China-India border. It showed footages of the five female operators firing live shell and hitting target 100-KM away, which could mean the maximum range of the rocket artillery is over 100 KMs.

 

[Tanmay]

Chinese state TV station was recently broadcasting a documentary serial about low level Chinese soldiers, the first episode of which focused on female rocket artillery operators serving in Tibet. that episode from a side confirmed that, during the 70 days standoff in 2017, for the first time PLA had got the opportunity to deploy and fire long-range rocket artillery along China-India border. It showed footages of the five female operators firing live shell and hitting target 100-KM away, which could mean the maximum range of the rocket artillery is over 100 KMs.

Are we in flat deserts of Rajasthan or mountainous areas of Arunachal Pradesh and Leh

 

[hit&run]

Chinese state TV station was recently broadcasting a documentary serial about low level Chinese soldiers, the first episode of which focused on female rocket artillery operators serving in Tibet. that episode from a side confirmed that, during the 70 days standoff in 2017, for the first time PLA had got the opportunity to deploy and fire long-range rocket artillery along China-India border. It showed footages of the five female operators firing live shell and hitting target 100-KM away, which could mean the maximum range of the rocket artillery is over 100 KMs.

Indian can replicate same range and attrition. It is not about capability but Objective. China will gain nothing in its any misadventure against India.

Like it or not India is at advantage in both capability (+ & -) and objective (+ +); will call China out when it comes to our territorial interests. Only factor that can go to China's advantage of more aggressive outlook if India election a weak leader.
................
i still remember days when China leaning watcher would preach Indians not to Change status Quo or change the border Dynamics and be desperate.Ironically India used to be a soft non assertive entity but was still seen impulsive and irrational . Glad that situation has changed like ad nauseam preach to respect small neighbours by Chinese.

Anyone with good grasp on this changing narrative will find it interesting that being assertive can positively change the profile in the eyes of an observer who otherwise treated India quixotic as it behaved dull and defensive.

 

[ezsasa]

Chinese state TV station was recently broadcasting a documentary serial about low level Chinese soldiers, the first episode of which focused on female rocket artillery operators serving in Tibet. that episode from a side confirmed that, during the 70 days standoff in 2017, for the first time PLA had got the opportunity to deploy and fire long-range rocket artillery along China-India border. It showed footages of the five female operators firing live shell and hitting target 100-KM away, which could mean the maximum range of the rocket artillery is over 100 KMs.

What does rocket artillery actually mean in PLA parlance?MLRS or arty like 155mm?

Maybe you could post the video here?

 

[Hiranyaksha]

China offers land to Bhutan to settle dispute


China Bhutan exchange views on boundary issues