Did Islam Ruin Afghanistan ?

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pankaj nema

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I believe that what is happening in Afghanistan is the result of Karma
No peace happiness or prosperity

On the Internet there are several accounts of Somnath temple

" Mahmud of Ghazni himself smashed with a hammer the Shiva Lingam of Somnath temple and demonstrated his power. The broken pieces of the Shiva Lingam and the magnificent door of the temple were taken to Ghazni for the construction of a mosque. The stones of Shiva Lingam became stairs of his new mosque so that it get trampled and dishonored."
 

shinoj

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Pakistanis are one breed that would never sit in Silence. Heck we gave them such nice fertile land of Punjab, but they cant even manage that. They have come poking into Afghanistan also. There are truely a Dogs Tail.
 

JBH22

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I believe that what is happening in Afghanistan is the result of Karma
No peace happiness or prosperity

On the Internet there are several accounts of Somnath temple

" Mahmud of Ghazni himself smashed with a hammer the Shiva Lingam of Somnath temple and demonstrated his power. The broken pieces of the Shiva Lingam and the magnificent door of the temple were taken to Ghazni for the construction of a mosque. The stones of Shiva Lingam became stairs of his new mosque so that it get trampled and dishonored."
So much for the Ghazis now they are butt---- by all superpowers for the last 3-4 decades. Pathetic country with pathetic people.

I have no sympathy for Pakistan or the other neighbours, they got what they deserve.
 

Blackwater

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Pakistan and India are fighting their own proxy wars in Afghanistan.
Pakistan started way back in 70ties India Inorder to conter Pakistan did much later.

But India did not ruin afghan on other hand pak did
 

Neo

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Pakistan started way back in 70ties India Inorder to conter Pakistan did much later.

But India did not ruin afghan on other hand pak did
India helped USSR and therefor indirectly ruined the country. Our dealing with Afghanustan is our right as the country went into chaos and civil war posing a threat to our western borders.
 

bose

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Pakistan favoured Pasthu speaking peoples of Afghanistan... in return of strategic depth... now you see Uzbeks, Tajiks, Hazaras and Shias are all against Pakistan...
 

SPIEZ

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As it was the gate way towards prosperous India, it was constantly at the helm of intruders and invasions. I strongly believe it was Islam that even saved the Afghans in the first place.

I would also like to have a look the arguments against this.
 
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PredictablyMalicious

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India helped USSR and therefor indirectly ruined the country. Our dealing with Afghanustan is our right as the country went into chaos and civil war posing a threat to our western borders.
Soviet Afghanistan would be much better than it is today. THe Communists know how to break the skulls of Islamists and talibaboons. Women would have been more empowered than now. THe Soviets would have created a semblance of order and structure in Afghanistan and built its urban infrastructure.
 
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Neo

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Pakistan favoured Pasthu speaking peoples of Afghanistan... in return of strategic depth... now you see Uzbeks, Tajiks, Hazaras and Shias are all against Pakistan...
Pashtuns form the majority in Afghanistan and have ethnic ties with Pakistan.
GoI supports Tamil Tigers in Sri Lanka, does she not?
And shias are not against Pakistan, 30% of our population is shiah.

How come Tajiks, Hazaras and Uzbeks took refuge in Pakistan during the invasion?
They could have fled to Iran. Even during the second wave of refugees during US carpet bombing they came to Pakistan instead of going to Tajikistan, Uzbekistan or Turkmenistan. No they fled to Pakistan!
 

shinoj

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As it was the gate way towards prosperous India, it was constantly at the helm of intruders and invasions. I strongly believe it was Islam that even saved the Afghans in the first place.

I would also like to have a look the arguments against this.

Allright, The Native Hindu and Budhist Population were butchered against the Central Asian Invaders , their Culture, their Prosperity destroyed. I cant imagine how Islam saved Afghans.

And in return for what ?

Now see what it has bought the Country to.
 

Razor

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Yes Pakistan sided with the US as India sided with USSR providing logistic and medical support. Guess who was CIA's main ally back then?
Osama bin Laden!

The article does not say Russia attacked Afghanistan but does explain how Russians were manipulated to go into Afghanistan by USA!!

In 1998, after the successful destabilization of Afghanistan, Zbigniew Brzezinski, formerly President Carter's National Security Advisor, admitted that covert U.S. intervention began long before the USSR sent in the requested troops. "'That secret operation [National Security Council Directive 166] was an excellent idea," he explained. "The effect was to draw the Russians into the Afghan trap."[2]

Afghanistan became a battleground between two cold war super powers and got raped badly.
Islamism was the weapon designed and used by CIA!
Your article reinforces what I said in my first post.
And it shows that your first post implicating that the Soviets "attacked" and "gang raped" Afghanistan is a lie or your incorrect interpretation of history.

You say above that India supported the USSR by providing logistic and medical support; this is again a lie. India refused to get involved in that war (you can check credible sources.)

Your post itself says that the Soviets were manipulated into this war with Afghanistan, which was a plan of Mr. Zbig (he hates the Russians with a passion) and so your first post therefore simply peddles the usual Western propaganda and Russia-hating.
 
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SPIEZ

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Allright, The Native Hindu and Budhist Population were butchered against the Central Asian Invaders , their Culture, their Prosperity destroyed. I cant imagine how Islam saved Afghans.

And in return for what ?

Now see what it has bought the Country to.
What do you mean?

It's constantly at the helm of 1 (proxy) war after another. Think of this, first the Russians than the Americans.

Think of this which other country has survived so many wars Iraq? Iran. Iran has possibly scatted through after the Iran-Iraq war mainly because Iraq went rouge after.

Had it been the pacifist Buddhists (no offence meant) the whole population could have been wiped out.
 

SPIEZ

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What do you mean?

It's constantly at the helm of 1 (proxy) war after another. Think of this, first the Russians than the Americans.

Think of this which other country has survived so many wars Iraq? Iran. Iran has possibly scatted through after the Iran-Iraq war mainly because Iraq went rouge after.

Had it been the pacifist Buddhists (no offence meant) the whole population could have been wiped out.
Infact, sadly the buddhist empire in Afghanistan was completely vanquished.

Source: Islamic conquest of Afghanistan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

shinoj

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What do you mean?

It's constantly at the helm of 1 (proxy) war after another. Think of this, first the Russians than the Americans.

Think of this which other country has survived so many wars Iraq? Iran. Iran has possibly scatted through after the Iran-Iraq war mainly because Iraq went rouge after.

Had it been the pacifist Buddhists (no offence meant) the whole population could have been wiped out.
After the advent of Islam in Afghanistan, it never had any substantial period of stability and prosperity. That is what i mean. How many Wars it had to endure? It was all after the advent of Islam. That is really the point. After embracing Islam it had not gained anything.
 

SPIEZ

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After the advent of Islam in Afghanistan, it never had any substantial period of stability and prosperity. That is what i mean. How many Wars it had to endure? It was all after the advent of Islam. That is really the point. After embracing Islam it had not gained anything.
I didn't gain anything much anyways!

However, Afghanistan survived only because of it's conversion to Islam. You should probably have heard about Afghanistan during British Rule when it was actually properous. In fact it wasn't bad before the Soviet Invasion.
 

shinoj

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There are too much Intellectual Bullshit in answering one simple Question and Honestly this sort of indecisiveness amongst us Indians has costed us Big time in the Past . We have ended up losing Vast Teritories to others like Punjab, Kashmir and so on.

We need to ask this simple question to ourself. DO we have faith in Ourself and Hinduism so that we can become a Mega Power in the Region and protect all the Weak Again.
 

bennedose

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I think two things helped ruin Afghanistan
1. The cold war
2. Pakistan's use of Islam for taking part in the cold war hoping to get traction and help in screwing India

If you read Sarila's deeply researched book on partition, the British favoured the idea of keeping tha "loyal north western mussalman" under their umbrella in order to thwart Soviet expansion. The same idea was ontinued by the Americans and Pakistan. There is a grat video of Pakistan PM Suhrawardy in the US asking for arms aid while throwing Pakistan's lot with the US in the cold war.

In PAF Air Commodore "Nosey" Haider's autobiography hementions the fact that even back in the late 1950s and early 1960 the PAF was atatcking Pashtun "rebels" - so a conflict has been ongoing since then, But Afghanistan had very good rlations with India (as it does now) and at partition NWFP would hev voted to join India if that was phusiclly possible. These are all known historic facts.

Jinnah himself was unhppy with the "moth eaten" Pakistan he got. One of the prime reasons for the 1947-48 conflict to take over Kashmir from Maharaja Hari Singh was that it was a way to get Pashtun tribesmen to attack Kashmir and take pressure off Pakistan. Thr tribesmen spent too much time raping women in Kashmir before taking Srinagar giving the Indian army time to push them back until Nehru gave a walk over, went to the UN and called for a cease fire.

But the Britis way of keeping Afghanistan quiescent was to have a buffer zone between Punjab and Afghanistan - the "NWFP" and the tribal leaders were all pad off/bribed. Still Afghanistan was a forward looking and progressive conuntry until the US and Pakistan coluded, using bin Laden and Saudi money to bring revolution to Afghanistan. Both the US and Pakistan are responsible here - not just the US.

The interesting part for me lies here:
1. Pakitan was set up as a "Paki" (pure) state for Muslims
2. the Pakistani constitution was revoked in favour of the "Objectives resoution" that sought to bring in sharia
3. Kashmir was attacked repeatedly in the name of being a Muslim majority state
4. Zia ul Haq joined the cold war stating that Pakistani support could be given ecretly (He said "For Muslims it is alright to tell a lie for a good cause")
5. The "Taliban" were students of Pakistani madrasas trained in Pakistan and they too over Afghanistan
6. The same Taliban are now attacking Pakistan

So while the Islam connection is strong - it is not islam that cretaed the mess in Afghanistan, but Islam as used by Pakistani generals and leaders to play geopolitical games and ally with a US that does not give a flying fuk whether islam or Muslims are happy or are suffering as long as their Pakistani slave army is doing their job.

Note that all the games played by the Pakistani army and leaders did not get hem Kashmir or get them peace.

Afghanistan was abolutely fine with Islam until Pakistan was created as a western vassal state. In until Ranjit Singh Afghanstan always dominated what is Pakistani Punjab.

The British used loyal Mussalmans as a tool for their cold war. Those loyal Pakistani mussalmans used Islam to try and screw everyone. I am now happy to note that they are being exposed to true sharia by the Taliban. Pakistan is the problem. Proper Islamization of Pakistan will solve the problem.
 
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Pratap

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I didn't gain anything much anyways!

However, Afghanistan survived only because of it's conversion to Islam. You should probably have heard about Afghanistan during British Rule when it was actually properous. In fact it wasn't bad before the Soviet Invasion.
Can you shed some light on"prosperity of Afghanistan" during British rule? I learn some strange things everyday.
 

Pratap

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What do you consider as "saved" or "intact" in Af-stan ? What was "left/saved" due to Islam ?
This is quite delusional. :tsk:
Nothing. Islam accompanied by brutal Pashtun expansion resulted in destruction of Indo Aryan speakers like Hindkos and Kaffirs of Nuristan.
Hindu culture was mercilessly destroyed in Afghanistan by Pashtuns who are invaders there in first place.
 
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