Dell Dumping China, Moving Likely to India

[amoy]

The 30% that was is a stupid case (chassis), which is just a frame of steel, can be easily made here, PSU is more electricals than electronics, can be made here too, as for monitors, Samsung has an LCD plant in India which makes LCD TVs. So the resources are there to make LCD monitors. Dell sources its LCD panels from Samsung.

that sounds confirming my point - Dell isn't anything indispensible in today's world

 

[tharikiran]

Dell has nothing to lose,because Dell indeed has nothing but low-end manufacturing.

do you reall think CHina would care a guy leaves China, that has nothing but low-end manufacturing ?

I don't understand what this "Dell has nothing but low end manufacturing" means.
Is lenovo doing/using some cutting edge technologies to manufacture a freakin PC ??????

I never talked about one company leaving China. I am talking/interested about this trend. Will this grow larger and gain momentum ?
Will a host of other foreign companies feel the same as Google and Dell ?

It's all about the market. Isn't it? We got plenty of that and it's all untapped.

 

[badguy2000]

I don't understand what this "Dell has nothing but low end manufacturing" means.
Is lenovo doing/using some cutting edge technologies to manufacture a freakin PC ??????

I never talked about one company leaving China. I am talking/interested about this trend. Will this grow larger and gain momentum ?
Will a host of other foreign companies feel the same as Google and Dell ?

It's all about the market. Isn't it? We got plenty of that and it's all untapped.

you should read the wesbsite of lenovo first.
http://www.lenovo.com/in/en/index.html

Dell is more like a selling network,because Dell in fact even has not much "lowend manfuacturing". what Dell has is just "assembling"

 

[tharikiran]

you should read the wesbsite of lenovo first.
http://www.lenovo.com/in/en/index.html

Dell is more like a selling network,because Dell in fact even has not much "lowend manfuacturing". what Dell has is just "assembling"

Dear, why are you fixated about Dell.No body's talking about Dell.
Let's say all these foreign companies are not doing great business in China .Domestic companies are giving them a run for their money. Let's say China has got nothing to lose.

Now, all these companies decide to move out of China and into a market like India.
Do you get my point.We are talking about this trend dear.I am not at all talking about any one specific company.I am talking about the political/economic/social environment.
If it's not good, the companies will be left with no choice.

 

[nimo_cn]

Now, all these companies decide to move out of China and into a market like India.
Do you get my point.We are talking about this trend dear.I am not at all talking about any one specific company.I am talking about the political/economic/social environment.
If it's not good, the companies will be left with no choice.

Oh, dear, enlighten me pls. Of all the companies that left China recently how many of them left China because of India?

Google, already dominated India's market. And its recent so-called pullout of China can hardly be called a actual pullout. All Google has done is redirecting the access to Google.cn to Google.hk.com. Dont you see it, Google is unwilling to leave China.

Go Daddy, thanks to DFi, i know this unheard-of company. I will not be surprised if its spouse "Go Mummy" leaves China tomorrow. And tell me is this "Go Daddy" turning to India now?

Then Dell, to be honest, if Dell does pull out of China completely, then i will ask if there is anything wrong with Chinese economy. But is Dell leaving China completely for India, for your mysterious better political/economic/social environment.

 

[tharikiran]

I think only time will answer these questions.
Whether companies move to India/Brazil or not.

 

[Yusuf]

Ok, the talk is about companies leaving china. Its not necessary that they will set shop in India. So pls don't derail this thread with the usual non sense. Why can't people be objective in thinking. last warning here.

 

[Iamanidiot]

flight of chinese jobs can be anywhere and the destination need not be necessarily be india

 

[thakur_ritesh]

I am a little confused, why do Indian friends become so excited about this?
Last time i check, some Indians laughed at China for this low-end manufacturing.

Nimo,

That is senseless jingoism if you heard Indians laughing off china for its low tech manufacturing base. A country like ours where the official poverty rate is as high as 27-37% (if the recent measure coined by the tendulkar report was to taken up) to unofficially as high as 70% then the same jingoes will any day be more than happy to accommodate the same low tech manufacturing base a fact realized by the GoI and we see the change happening since our merchandize exports have zoomed from 45b usd to 175b usd with in a span of 5odd years (and this when we were hit by slow down last fiscal, and this one as well).

Then i don't think China has anything to lose either. There are plenty of PC companies want to stay in China, such as Lenevo, HP, Acer, ASUS, ....

And i don't believe Dell will "dump" China like someone said in a near future. China has one of the largest PC markets in the world, which is still growing fast. It is said, within 2-3 years, the population of Chinese netizens will reach 500 million( now it is 380 million), you can imagine how many computers will be sold in China in the next several years.

But I think it is understandable for Dell to shift part of its operation to other countries, say India, which as well as China has cheap labor, and a growing personal computer market.

BTW, i am surprised this news sourced from the PM of India.

No one is going to leave china per se since the brand and company presence will be there and no one does that since the potential of a billion (+) people as consumer base someday is huge but that does not mean the same company cant export (in china’s case imports) its product line from some other country to china, and if markets like India are picked up as an alternative then that is a cause of concern since India has shown the capability of presenting it self as a manufacturing hub for the times to come though our red tape and rather slow government decisions can hamper the process, but still there remain other options to move out if they so please.

The Indian PM said what he did since he is testing the waters post google pull out and the intent is to set in the panic amongst the fence sitters who are not happy with the treatment that is being meted out to them, and I am sure there remain many such fence sitters. Today there is one google, which has brought about a change in the attitude of dell and godaddy, imagine if this was to catch like a wild fire and then one day 100s if not 1000s singing the same tune of pull out. Investment is all about sentiment and once there is loss of confidence people look for alternatives.

Imagine BG saying 60% of computer hardware in “Made in China”, what if the same 60% was to be made in some other part of the world and when the panic spreads then your small time suppliers will also not be in a position to bear the shock since their investments would be huge and orders coming in would have dwindled to the extent that they will not be even in a position to meet the costs, so what will happen to the dream of china as a manufacturing base?

Let alone high tech and the industrialization that our friend BG likes to talk about there wont be anyone to even manufacture the present low tech stuff.

PS: all said and done your government is not that foolish and if this were to pick up to this lartge extent, then they will indeed sit down and negotiate and will wait for a more opportune time in the future to carry on with the restrictions. your government has shown that in the past when they left communism to take on capitalism.

 

[Armand2REP]

For foreign business, the fundamentals of China have changed. No longer is it the big market open for the taking. CCP has attacked these companies to the point where there is little margin for profit and growth extremely expensive and time consuming. The low consumer spending of the country is being diverted to China first policy which makes the future look bleak. There is already high market saturation in many industries which are already turning into dead ends. The impending trade war between the US and the EU which will follow are going to have retaliation ten times worse than it is now. Google is just the tip of the iceburg of what is to come.

The exporters are going to be the first to go. With tariffs placed on their goods flowing into the US, they won't be able to make a cent in an already low market. China already lost 100,000 jobs and $1 billion due to the tire tariff. If you place that across all US export industries, that figure jumps to $200 billion and 20 million jobs. If the EU joins in that will double. Chinese exports will be cut in half and 50% of foreign companies will take off. The other 50% will be forced out with Chinese retaliation for the actions. Poof... there goes a third of the Chinese economy.

 

[Iamanidiot]

Armand you make it look so easy .A question what about the local chinese companies.Do the chinese version of an L&T,Mahindra&Mahindra,TATA might still have leverage in the world right

 

[Armand2REP]

Armand you make it look so easy .A question what about the local chinese companies.Do the chinese version of an L&T,Mahindra&Mahindra,TATA might still have leverage in the world right

The scenerio I painted is based on US and EU unilateral tarrifs that are proposed by US Congress. If China bows to Western pressure to seriously appreciate the RMB it won't come to pass. China will just have to deal with the less competiviness of their products which will be cut 1% for every percent of appreciation according to CCP complaints. India too is tired of Chinese currency manipulation, if the US and EU go that way India is sure to follow. China trying to sell automobiles is a joke already, $5 billion last year exported mostly to the third world. They can't rely on third world exports when the biggest economies are bytch slapping them with huge tariffs.

 

[Iamanidiot]

I have known cases of the bad quality of automobiles parts and especially turbines.I have known power plants getting choked because of them quality control seems to be an issue in China.Anyway Armand isn't it suicidal to push the other companies out of retaliation.That seems outright stupid on CCPs part.When I observe CCP it seems to need a growth rate of 10% to legitmize it its rule

 

[Iamanidiot]

Armand another does the CCP have leaders who have public charisma at par with a peoples support base of a Mao or Deng.The CCP nowadays looks like a bunch of colourless technocrats who are only able to placate the public

 

[Armand2REP]

I have known cases of the bad quality of automobiles parts and especially turbines.I have known power plants getting choked because of them quality control seems to be an issue in China.Anyway Armand isn't it suicidal to push the other companies out of retaliation.That seems outright stupid on CCPs part.When I observe CCP it seems to need a growth rate of 10% to legitmize it its rule

You would think it is stupid, but they have already started the process of kicking them out. The final version of CCP controlled economy is all Chinese companies and no Western. They wanted to do it slowly and take their technology as they kick them out, but the tariffs will force the issue much sooner.

 

[Iamanidiot]

but developing R&D to sustain it is not done overnight.You need to do it gradually.What about the quality of science education in China.How competitive are the kids generally.I have some extremely intelligent chinese and most below average when compared to indian engineering grad.How competitve are they in the international market.Do they have the talent to do good R&D in science and tech

 

[Armand2REP]

but developing R&D to sustain it is not done overnight.You need to do it gradually.What about the quality of science education in China.How competitive are the kids generally.I have some extremely intelligent chinese and most below average when compared to indian engineering grad.How competitve are they in the international market.Do they have the talent to do good R&D in science and tech

The only competitive Chinese are Western trained, but CCP don't think that far ahead. They still think they are the all knowing with management skills to run it all. But we know they do not from they way they run foreign acquisitions that they run into the ground. There science is a product of their education which is rote learning, cheating, and grade inflation. Their H-index score hasn't gone up and it won't without fundamental education reform.

 

[Iamanidiot]

Rote learninng isn't endemic to the Chinese alone armand even indians are made to do in the elementary.But Armand the Chinese certainly will be having a creamy layer which can ake the R&D to the nxt level.Out of a nation of 1 billion there may be good competitive people isn't it Armand.What are the topmost engineering and science universities.Do they have institutes like the indian version of IIT's and IIM's.If they are present how competitive are they

 

[badguy2000]

For foreign business, the fundamentals of China have changed. No longer is it the big market open for the taking. CCP has attacked these companies to the point where there is little margin for profit and growth extremely expensive and time consuming. The low consumer spending of the country is being diverted to China first policy which makes the future look bleak. There is already high market saturation in many industries which are already turning into dead ends. The impending trade war between the US and the EU which will follow are going to have retaliation ten times worse than it is now. Google is just the tip of the iceburg of what is to come.

The exporters are going to be the first to go. With tariffs placed on their goods flowing into the US, they won't be able to make a cent in an already low market. China already lost 100,000 jobs and $1 billion due to the tire tariff. If you place that across all US export industries, that figure jumps to $200 billion and 20 million jobs. If the EU joins in that will double. Chinese exports will be cut in half and 50% of foreign companies will take off. The other 50% will be forced out with Chinese retaliation for the actions. Poof... there goes a third of the Chinese economy.

you should tell your wise advice to the MNCs such as GM,Volks Wagen,Simens....


BTW, GM which bankrupted once recently now looks on China as its last life-saving straw

Japanese Kawaski Heavy industry avoided bankrupcy,just because orders from CHinese highspeedrailway projects saved its ass.

 

[tharikiran]

you should tell your wise advice to the MNCs such as GM,Volks Wagen,Simens....


BTW, GM which bankrupted once recently now looks on China as its last life-saving straw

Japanese Kawaski Heavy industry avoided bankrupcy,just because orders from CHinese highspeedrailway projects saved its ass.

See, today the market is China. If the conditions change to worse, the market will change to some other place.Some other place will be saving asses then.Market is the GOD/BOSS and not China.