CHINESE Medium Altitude Long Endurance DRONES

Discussion in 'China' started by J20!, Jul 21, 2017.

  1. Wisemarko

    Wisemarko Regular Member

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    Drone Strike Video Here:

    How the UAE’s Chinese-Made CH-4B Drone Is Changing the War in Yemen
    An airstrike that killed a senior Houthi leader shows that the Emirates is growing more assertive in its military operations.
    Rawan ShaifApril 27, 2018, 12:34 PM
    [​IMG]
    Saleh al-Samad, the president of the Houthis’ Supreme Political Council, sits behind bulletproof glass at a rally in Sanaa, Yemen, on Aug. 20, 2016. (Mohammed Hamoud/Getty Images)

    On Monday evening, video began circulating online of a black-and-white drone feed monitoring a two-car convoy driving north along Road 45, east of Hodeidah, Yemen. In the video, the drone’s target — a blue Toyota Land Cruiser — turns onto a side street. Seconds later, it is struck by a Chinese-made Blue Arrow 7 missile.

    The driver of the second vehicle slams on the brakes. He and his companions rush to the lead car, now in flames. “Identify the target,” an officer orders, monitoring the drone feed from an operations room in the United Arab Emirates. The survivors start to move away from the wreckage. “Kill them! Kill the people!”

    At 2:02 p.m., the second strike hits. The command room erupts in applause. “Good hit guys, good hit! We got this son of a dog’s car,” an officer cheers in footage reviewed by Foreign Policy.

    Saleh al-Samad, the president of the Houthis’ Supreme Political Council, was killed in the drone strike, delivering the deathblow to an already stagnant Yemeni peace process. Samad was regarded as a conciliatory figure within the Houthi rebellion and had sought to reach a negotiated settlement to Yemen’s civil war. He was scheduled to meet with Martin Griffiths, the U.N. special envoy for Yemen, on April 28.

    The exact date of the strike is still unclear, however. The Houthis announced Samad’s death on Monday, and several Western news outlets reported that he was killed the prior Thursday. But Samad was reportedly at a funeral on Saturday, indicating the strike that killed him likely took place on Sunday, April 22.

    Samad’s death comes as Yemen enters its fourth year of civil war. In 2014, the Houthis took control of the country’s northwest, including the capital, Sanaa. The following year, a Saudi-led coalition, which includes the UAE, started military operations to unseat the Houthis in a conflict that has resulted in more than 10,000 deaths in Yemen.

    The strike, which is the first successful assassination of a senior figure in the Houthi rebellion, highlights the growing military assertiveness of the UAE. Since 2016, the Gulf nation has been trying to establish itself as the West’s primary counterterrorism partner in the region while simultaneously bolstering its military capabilities through arms deals with Beijing.

    “They are working incredibly hard to be the new entrepreneurial contractor in the region, both politically and militarily,” says Farea al-Muslimi, an associate fellow at Chatham House. “They no longer want to remain on the sidelines. Yemen is one of the battles where they think they can improve both their credentials and capabilities.”
     
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  2. J20!

    J20! Senior Member Senior Member

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    A rare pic of the 42-meter wingspan monster in flight. The "Divine eagle" is a very high altitude long endurance UAV, but I'll post it here:

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    An older pic:

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    This AEW focused UAV sports two ultra wide-band anti-stealth APAR's from the CETC 14th Institute. It would be very interesting to get the range and endurance statistics for this unique airframe.
     
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  3. J20!

    J20! Senior Member Senior Member

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    Might as well change this thread title to Chinese Drones... It's just a mock-up, bu this one is by no means a MALE UAV/UCAV. Is it a "loyal wingman" for 4th and 5th gen fighters, or an AI point air defense platform?:

    http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...-dark-sword-fighter-like-combat-drone-emerges

    Image Of China's Stealthy 'Dark Sword' Fighter-Like Combat Drone Emerges
    The image shows a mature design that leverages existing elements found on other Chinese tactical aircraft.

    [​IMG]

    TYLER ROGOWAY




    We have talked in-depth about how China is barreling forward with advanced unmanned combat air vehicle (UCAV) development—and this is just based on what the Chinese government wants us to see. Now a new photo has surfaced that appears to show a full-sized 'Dark Sword' UCAV. The concept has been talked about and shown in renderings and models for over a decade and a subscale remote controlled demonstrator was supposedly flown as well. But this is the first time evidence of a far more mature and substantive iteration of Dark Sword has been seen.


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    Dark Sword, which originates from Shenyang Aircraft Corporation, has a low observable (stealthy) configuration that differs drastically from more common flying-wing advanced unmanned aircraft designs. Whereas those are optimized for endurance, altitude performance, broadband low observability, and payload, Dark Sword is designed for sustained speed and agility.

    [​IMG]
    UAVGLOBAL.COM/CHINESE INTERNET
    Dark Sword has been around in concept form since the mid-2000s, and supposedly a sub-scale demonstrator has been tested, but nothing as elaborate or mature as what is seen in the most recent photo.




    Past renderings depict a conical planform with lifting-body attributes. Non-maneuvering, but possibly retractable canard foreplanes are present on its nose section. A wide, splayed tail section with canted vertical stabilizers and swept wings round out the rest of the design and a single-engine is fed by a sharp, forward-swept, chin-mounted intake.

    This new image appears to feature a real-life, practical interpretation of the Dark Sword concept using proven low-observable design elements that have been flown on other Chinese stealthy aircraft designs. Most notable is the presence of a Diverterless Supersonic Inlet (DSI). You can read all about this technology in this past feature of mine, but suffice it to say it was minted by Lockheed here in the United States in the 1990s and is a key feature on the F-35, yet China has run with the concept to an even greater degree.

    Currently, China's J-20 and J-31 stealth fighters leverage DSI technology, as does the latest variants of the JF-17 export fighter. It has even been incorporated on the second iteration of the J-10, the PLAAF's 'bread and butter' multi-role 4th generation fighter.

    [​IMG]
    LOCKHEED MARTIN/CHINESE INTERNET
    DSI was patented by Lockheed and tested on an F-16 in the min 1990s before ending up on the F-35. Today, China uses it on a slew of fighter aircraft like the J-10B seen on the left.


    A DSI allows for supersonic flight without the use of complex maneuvering ramps that slow air to subsonic speeds before it hits the engine face. It also removes boundary layer air from the aircraft's fuselage, providing the engine with stable and consistent airflow throughout the aircraft's flight envelope without the necessity of non-stealthy splitter plates and other structures. Finally, it provides for radar cross-section reduction in multiple ways. First off, by not needing the aforementioned elaborate splitter planes and maneuvering ramps or bleed air doors which are not conducive to low-observability on the RF spectrum. The DSI's 'bulge' and upturned leading edge also help to obscure the highly reflective engine face incoming radar waves.

    The presence of a DSI on a more mature and full-scale version of Dark Sword is telling as it gives us a firmer idea of the aircraft's performance. DSIs allow for supersonic flight up to about Mach 2. This fact helps dispel a lot of the erroneous and far-fetched rumors about Dark Sword, including that it is some sort of hypersonic super-weapon, which simply isn't the case.

    In addition, saw-tooth edges can be seen on the Dark Sword's gear doors, which look very similar to the J-20's setup. Sawtooth edges and edge alignment, in general, are design elements that have been used since the dawn of stealth to minimize radar reflectivity where there are seams and operating fissures on a stealthy aircraft's skin.

    This is an especially useful design element when it comes to optimizing a stealthy aircraft to evade X-Band and similar fire control radars, or at least to deny their ability to attain an engagement quality track. A high-speed tactical UCAV design like Dark Sword would prioritize low-observable design optimization in just such a way as it trades high-performance for broadband stealth against a wider range of radar operating bands. Its tail surfaces and other elements are already less than optimal when it comes to evading lower-frequency radars, but considering its speed, optimizing survivability against air-to-air and common ground-based fire control radars is most important.

    The airframe also seems to wear a silver paint job similar to what the now operational J-20 wears. This includes lighter grey edges where composite low-observable structures are fitted or where embedded antennas are installed. Whether this is just representative or an actual feature of a working design remains unknown.

    [​IMG]
    CHINESE TELEVISION
    Maybe the best image of the J-20 as of late.


    So, in essence, what we have here is stealthy unmanned airframe that can likely supercruise (fly faster than the speed of sound without the use of afterburner), or at least its design intends to do so dependent on available engine technology and hit top speeds up to around Mach 2.

    Such an aircraft would be especially well suited for making supersonic dashes across the Taiwan Strait during a conflict as opposed to flying medium or long-endurance surveillance missions. It's also possible that the design could also be intended to find its way to China's upcoming catapult and barrier equipped aircraft carriers.

    Whether based on land or at sea, Dark Sword appears to be uniquely well suited to operate under a 'loyal wingman' or 'tethered' concept of operations in addition to an independent one. Under such a setup, Dark Sword would be able to speed ahead of manned fighters on command to collect data and targeting information, or even engage targets itself. Such a capability would be useful to stealthy and non-stealthy manned fighters alike. But for the latter, it could be a huge force multiplier, providing high-end counter-air defense and strike capability without the cost of procuring droves of high-end stealthy manned fighters.

    What we don't know is if the aircraft shown in the photo is an elaborate mockup, an actual flying article, or something in between. We also don't know when the photo was taken as it is more likely than not the project is much farther along now than what is indicated by the image. Remember, the Chinese show us only what they want to.

    Above all else, this development serves as another reminder of how China is surging ahead when it comes to advanced unmanned combat aircraft capabilities, while the U.S. acts as if the concept doesn't even exist even after it proved to be a game-changing breakthrough a decade and a half ago.

    Without a doubt, there is development being done in the classified realm on advanced unmanned systems, but at this stage, that is problematic in itself, especially when it comes to providing significant funding for such programs, as the very concept relies on volume of airframes above all else. It also makes tailoring an air combat fighting doctrine to accommodate such an awesome shift in capabilities nearly impossible, which is hugely wasteful and even negligent as it deeply impacts procurement decisions. It's not worth relitigating this complex and multi-faceted but seldom talked and highly misunderstood issue in this article as we have explained it in great depth before. You can access that feature here.

    In the end military culture, big business that serves it, and other special interests at play within the defense-industrial complex have kept advanced unmanned combat aircraft at bay seemingly to protect existing manned programs, at least in terms of having major defense programs of record. Yet they will all have to come to terms with the fact that manned platforms are not the future of aerial warfare and our enemies could care less about existential debates about the ethics of unmanned and autonomous weaponry.

    At this point, it is quite possible that the Pentagon will be caught off-guard by its potential enemies' ingenuity when it comes to this technology in the same way they were by far less advanced weaponized hobby-like drones. That was another capability many of us were screaming about for years, with those warnings apparently falling on deaf ears among the Pentagon's decision makers until the threat had become all too palpable. Oh, and swarms of small drones is another area where China is rushing forward developmentally.

    Let's not let history repeat itself again as peer states with mature, high-end, penetrating tactical drone capabilities is far more frightening strategically speaking than some thug jihadis with quadcopters that can drop improvised grenades.


    Anjian has been displayed as a concept at airshows since the 2006 Zhuhai Airshow, even featuring at the Paris Airshow a few times.

    Mock-ups and fan-art:

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    Last edited: Jun 6, 2018
  4. Armand2REP

    Armand2REP CHINI EXPERT Veteran Member

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    _________________________________________________________________
     
  5. J20!

    J20! Senior Member Senior Member

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    Its actually one the Saudi's CH4B's not a Wing Loong I, they operate both:

    Article translate from French

    http://www.eastpendulum.com/wing-loong-i-ch-4b-un-drone-arme-saoudien-abattu-pres-du-yemen
    Wing Loong I? CH-4B? Saudi Arabian drone "shot down" near Yemen

    BY
    HENRI KENHMANN
    2018-07-15
    415 VIEWS

    The information was published yesterday in the Twitter account of "Yemen Observer", according to which a Saudi drone model "WD-1K Wing Loong" would have been shot down by Yemeni anti-aircraft forces, this Thursday, July 12, near the city Al-Raboah (?) in the border province of Asir.

    The attached video shows armed people examining the wreckage of what appears to be a drone in gray livery. Despite the very low resolution of the images, we can still distinguish the wing, the central cell, some equipment embedded as the rest of the optronic sensors, pylons and at least two small air-sol ammunition.

    Several questions then arise around the news. What is this "Yemeni anti-aircraft defense", is it the Shiite Houthi rebels, other insurgent organizations or loyalist forces? Where exactly did the said drone crash and what is the real cause of its crash?

    If few elements are available today to give more precision to the event, we can at least assume that the drone in question is not the Wing Loong as the source claims, but rather the CH-4B acquired by Ryad if it really comes from Saudi Arabia.

    Indeed, although the kingdom has indeed bought at least three models of Chinese military drone, namely Wing Loong I, Wing Loong II and CH-4B, and all three are armed, but the shape of pylons found on site is more reminiscent of those used by the CH-4B than the Wing Loong.

    Indeed, it can be seen that the pylons of the crushed drone are in one piece integrated and profiled, while those of Wing Loong I and Wing Loong II are assembled with a trapezoidal support piece plus a separate long rail.

    The rapid verification of the pylon of the CH-4 drones entered into service in the Saudi, Iraqi and Jordanian forces also confirms this point.

    In addition to the pylons, the drone ammunition paint also suggests that these small missiles carried by the machine are those of the AR family proposed for export by the Chinese aerospace group CASC, manufacturer of the drones Cai Hong (CH- x).

    Note that this is not the first time that the CH-4 is confused with a Wing Loong, even if these two drones do not absolutely come from the same manufacturer and are not related by far or near. At the ceremony to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the King Faisal Air Academy flying school of the Royal Saudi Air Force (RSAF) in January 2017, where the CH-4B under the Saudi color was publicly presented for the first time, some guests have already confused it with a Wing Loong I, also in service in the RASF.

    [​IMG]

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    A CH-4B of the Royal Saudi Army

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    A Jordanian CH-4B

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    Iraqi personnel load ammunition on one of their CH-4B

    [​IMG]
    AR-x ammunition proposed by CASC group for its Cai Hong drones
    There are also questions about the main cause of the crash and the exact location. It is difficult to say whether the drone was hit by a missile or anti-aircraft gun shells, and the wreckage does not appear to show any signs of burning after an explosion on the ground while the CH-4 tanks may contain up to 280 kg of kerosene in a smooth configuration, or at least 95 kg for a 10-hour range.

    Knowing that the armed variant CH-4B can reach a ceiling of 7,000 meters altitude and 5,000 meters cruising, which is out of reach for a MANPAD type QW-2 or FN-6, for example, and that The explosion of a SAM missile of sufficient range would have caused more damage to what is seen here, so it is not excluded that the drone crashed alone due to improper handling or a technical problem.

    As for the location where the wreckage of the drone was found and filmed, some sources give the coordinates 17 ° 32'N 43 ° 19'E, which corresponds to a rocky area near the city of Al-Raboah, at less than 300 meters from the border between Saudi Arabia and Yemen and inside the soil of this first. But it is difficult to confirm this for the moment.

    To be continued.

    Henri K.
     
  6. J20!

    J20! Senior Member Senior Member

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    Additional weapons integrations trials for the Wing Loong II in the Gobi desert, including a new laser guided bomb specifically designed for UAV's:



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    Last edited: Oct 15, 2018
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  7. scatterStorm

    scatterStorm Regular Member

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    Can you tell me expected altitude figures for black sword? Besides the tail control surfaces will paint it's RCS profile easily unlike other stealth drones like X47-B which doesn't have any and is harder to get detected.

    I am assuming that this tech demonstrator is likely to experiment with very high altitude (exo atmospheric) with hypersonic speeds.
     
  8. Butter Chicken

    Butter Chicken Senior Member Senior Member

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    The Assistant AF Commander of the Royal Jordanian Air Force isn’t very happy with his Chinese CH-4B armed UAVs. The RJAF looks set to retire them.

     
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  9. Armand2REP

    Armand2REP CHINI EXPERT Veteran Member

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    Jordan puts Chinese UAVs on sale
    Jeremy Binnie, London - Jane's Defence Weekly
    04 June 2019

    The Royal Jordanian Air Force (RJAF) has put its Chinese-made armed unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) up for sale, indicating its disappointment with their performance.

    [​IMG]The RJAF is looking to sell its CH-4B UAVs a little over a year after it unveiled the type at the SOFEX show held in May 2018. (IHS Markit/Patrick Allen)

    In a notice posted on its website on 3 June, the RJAF said it was looking to sell six CH-4B UAVs, a type made by the China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation (CASC). The RJAF acquired the type in 2016 along with AR-1 laser-guided missiles and FT-9 guided bombs. The Jordanian aircraft are capable of operating beyond line of sight as they are fitted with satellite communications equipment.

    https://www.janes.com/article/89036/jordan-puts-chinese-uavs-on-sale

    :pound::pound::pound:
     
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  10. IndianHawk

    IndianHawk Senior Member Senior Member

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    Nothing new. Even Pakistan didn't use Chinese AWACS at all against India and relied totally on saab eryie . Chinese know how to build a lot of airframes but beyond that things are very sub par.

    Sent from my C103 using Tapatalk
     
  11. nimo_cn

    nimo_cn Senior Member Senior Member

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    what else is Jordan selling?
    British trainer plane, Spanish cargo plane, American attack helicopter.
     
  12. HariPrasad-1

    HariPrasad-1 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Which is the country which had bought Chinese drone some time ago now wants to sell due to its poor quality? Is is Jordan or some other country?
     
  13. rockdog

    rockdog Regular Member

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    Yes, here:
    Egypt purchased 32 additional Chinese upgraded Pterodactyl-1D UAVs
    https://www.armyrecognition.com/nov...nal_chinese_upgraded_pterodactyl-1d_uavs.html

    New York Police bought 14 DJI drones and trained 29 officers
    https://www.wetalkuav.com/uk-police-dji-drones/

    UK Police Take to the Skies With DJI Drones
    https://www.wetalkuav.com/uk-police-dji-drones/

    IDF TO CONTINUE USING DRONES THAT US ARMY DEEMED UNSAFE
    https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/US-Army-order-troops-to-stop-using-Chinese-made-DJI-drones-501741
     
  14. HariPrasad-1

    HariPrasad-1 Senior Member Senior Member

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    J 15 production stopped. What say?
     
  15. rockdog

    rockdog Regular Member

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    Thanks for telling me J15 is a Drone.

    And J15 touch & go testing on new Carrier 17 happened this month, i don't think J15 is stopped.
     
  16. rockdog

    rockdog Regular Member

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    Thanks for telling me J15 is a Drone.

    And J15 touch & go testing on new Carrier No.17 happened this month, i don't think J15 is stopped.
     
  17. rockdog

    rockdog Regular Member

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    J15 training school on Huludao,latest video ...




    CVN-17 touch & Go tested.

    [​IMG]
     
  18. Illusive

    Illusive Senior Member Senior Member

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    Except for the first link all are civilian short range drones.
     
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  19. Armand2REP

    Armand2REP CHINI EXPERT Veteran Member

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    Stuff that is 20-30 years old, the Chinese drones are brand new.

    :pound::pound::pound:
     
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  20. shiphone

    shiphone Senior Member Senior Member

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    oh? again, it need your own effort to 'collect information'...CH-3/4, Winglong-I are the 'past'...nowadays, try the keyword 'Winglong-II' /‘CH-5’and 'UAE', 'Saudi', etc...lol...

    middle-east market is the direct impetus of these new ,bigger ,more capable UAV projects...and the orders are big as well.

    eg.
    ----------------
    UAE revealed as Wing Loong II launch customer
    Christopher Biggers, Washington, DC - Jane's Defence Weekly
    26 January 2018

    p1713485.jpg

    The United Arab Emirates (UAE) air force has almost certainly acquired the AVIC Wing Loong II medium-altitude, long-endurance unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV). Satellite imagery shows three UAVs matching the Wing Loong II’s dimensions at the UAE’s remote Qusahwirah Air Base near the border with Oman and Saudi Arabia on 22 October 2017.

    According to AVIC, the strike-capable Wing Loong II has a length of 11 m and a wingspan of 20.5 m. The dimensions and capabilities of the platform compare closely with the US-built MQ-9 Reaper. The UAE does not possess the MQ-9, nor does Jane’s have knowledge of foreign MQ-9s operating from Qusahwirah, suggesting the UAVs visible in the imagery are Wing Loong IIs.

    China’s Xinhua news agency reported on 28 February 2017 that AVIC had secured a major export order for the Wing Loong II from an unidentified country even before the aircraft had taken its first flight, which happened a day earlier.

    The report gave no indication when the customer would receive its first UAVs, but AVIC announced earlier in January that intensive testing during the previous 10 months had shown that the system “has met user requirements and possesses full operational capability”. This involved simultaneously controlling two aircraft from the same ground station.

    Never publicly acknowledged by the UAE, Qusahwirah Air Base has been a mystery since Google Earth released the first satellite imagery of the expanded facility.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019

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