China warns Obama about Dalai Lama

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badguy2000

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Is obama coming to China for financing his stimulus plans??. What a joke!!.

Many chinese take it for granted that they are doing a favor by buying US treasuries. Hello, a wake-up call to all chinese, China is doing so to save its own ass. You people should come out of any delusions that you are funding the US by holding their debt. They can any time can print money out of this debt in no time. The sore loser will be China with its $2 trillion reserves and US treasury bonds and the paper it will be holding will not be even the worth of tissue paper that you use in your toilet. Keep dreaming.
USA's hegemony is based on the credit of US dollar.
If USA print green notes disabstemiously and cause the collapse of the dollar credit,then CHina would lose its loan but USA would lose its hegemony.....

the hegemony would still be shifted to China ,after the credit of US dollar collapses.
 

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the hegemony would still be shifted to China ,after the credit of US dollar collapses.
You don't have any hegemony to start with. Stop dreaming.

Us hegemony is not just dollar but also its military. You don't have the scale of US military to challenge its hegemony.
 

ppgj

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USA's hegemony is based on the credit of US dollar.
US hegemony is because US$ is the most favoured currency for trade. it makes payment in its own domestic currency hence is at an advantage. it also knows by pushing t-bonds, all dollar reserves come back to US!!
if the dollar is replaced by some other currency it will lose its hegemony.

If USA print green notes disabstemiously and cause the collapse of the dollar credit,then CHina would lose its loan but USA would lose its hegemony.....
with a trillion dollar waiver, you think china will be fine? what about the chain reaction it will set off? you will go tumbling down. it is in your interest to prop up the dollar.

the hegemony would still be shifted to China ,after the credit of US dollar collapses.
it will be chaos in china. with US's loss of hegemony, your's will also be lost. besides others like EU, Russia will be breathing down.
 

tarunraju

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lol, it's funny how the Chinese think with the fall of USD their rise is certain, and how they choose to be totally ignorant of the EU and Euro.
 

Vladimir79

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USA's hegemony is based on the credit of US dollar.
If USA print green notes disabstemiously and cause the collapse of the dollar credit,then CHina would lose its loan but USA would lose its hegemony.....

the hegemony would still be shifted to China ,after the credit of US dollar collapses.
If the value of the US dollar plummets, so will the yuan. The yuan is pegged to it. If China makes their currency free floating, it will collapse. If China tries to withdraw their FOREX, the value will collapse. Either way you are screwed. If USA goes into depression, so does the rest of the world and China will be the hardest hit Mr. Biggest Trading Partner.
 
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Considering India's economy scale is roughly one third of china's and china holds 600 bn US bond, india should buy $200 bn instead of $20bn.

Now, where is the rest of money?:india:
India is not going to buy worthless assets, China is the one trapped into buying worthless US paper not India, and India definetly is in no race with China to acquire worthless US IOU's I don't expect /hope India to buys anymore of this worthless junk either.
 

Emperor

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These US bonds are of pretty low interest and will give you more or less no secured returns for your corresponding investments.

Once the dollar is removed from the uriversal trading system,all these assests would be useless.
by the way why would any one want to invest in 0 coupon US debt bonds when investing the same in India will give atleast 10- 15% appreciation .
At any time India needs a 100 billion investment.India is a black hole for investments.The more you invest and you will still find a place to invest again.

China bought the US debts only due to one main reason.i.e of strategic value but less of monetary value.The card here is Taiwan. Simply put,Taiwan is a 600 billion dollar worthy place for China.

While coming to the topic,I had a question for China :D

Is there any country on earth left without receiving a warning from China?
China warns EU.
China warns India.
China warns Russia.
China warns Japan.
China warns ASEAN.
China warns US............. Yawn.............. :tease:
 

badguy2000

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If the value of the US dollar plummets, so will the yuan. The yuan is pegged to it. If China makes their currency free floating, it will collapse. If China tries to withdraw their FOREX, the value will collapse. Either way you are screwed. If USA goes into depression, so does the rest of the world and China will be the hardest hit Mr. Biggest Trading Partner.
that is why I say that your head is full of "one-way" mentality.....

here are all your viewpoints:

CHinese demography will be full of disaster, because CCP won't change its "one-kid policy" for ever......

Chinese Yuan will follow the plummet of dollars,because CCP won't change its "peg policy" forever.....

guy.....your one-way mentality is really very amusing...
 
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BG by the time CCP changes their policy they will be knee deep in quick sand bragging about holding trillions in worthless assets that no one else in the world wants is a good example of this.
 

badguy2000

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BG by the time CCP changes their policy they will be knee deep in quick sand bragging about holding trillions in worthless assets that no one else in the world wants is a good example of this.
even if our 2 trillion USD all were to become worthleses, so what? our powerful industry base would be still there adn our full industry chains would be still there .... our capacity to create wealth would be still there. in sevearal year, We can earn all back.

instead, one US dollar lose its credit, USA would lose its capacity to blackmail other's wealth forever and lose its hegemony forever.

In fact, even if US dollars were to collapse, it would just means that USA were selling its global hegemony to China at the price of 2 trillion US dollars.
 
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even if our 2 trillion USD all were to become worthleses, so what? our powerful industry base would be still there adn our full industry chains would be still there .... our capacity to create wealth would be still there. in sevearal year, We can earn all back.

instead, one US dollar lose its credit, USA would lose its capacity to blackmail other's wealth forever and lose its hegemony forever.
If US adopts a protectionist policy your industrial base won't mean anything US factories will be selling goods worldwide. The industrial base is what USA had at the turn of the century during the industrial revolution 100 years ago if you expect miracles from that you are 100 years behind in your views.
 

badguy2000

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If US adopts a protectionist policy your industrial base won't mean anything US factories will be selling goods worldwide. The industrial base is what USA had at the turn of the century during the industrial revolution 100 years ago if you expect miracles from that you are 100 years behind in your views.
guy..pls study more economics first before you draw such clueless conclusion so easily....

high-end and low-end manufacturing would not come back to USA forever, unless yankees would accept the salary as low as Chinese workers..that is the stone-cold fact.

Furthermore, Chinese high-end industry like auto,shipbuilding and aircarft-building are also getting more and more competitive day by day..if yankees has a easy rest and can not keep ahead of china in the value-chain, USA would become the sleeping hare. if so..USA would have nothing and become another Russia.
 

Emperor

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even if our 2 trillion USD all were to become worthleses, so what? our powerful industry base would be still there adn our full industry chains would be still there .... our capacity to create wealth would be still there. in sevearal year, We can earn all back.

instead, one US dollar lose its credit, USA would lose its capacity to blackmail other's wealth forever and lose its hegemony forever.

In fact, even if US dollars were to collapse, it would just means that USA were selling its global hegemony to China at the price of 2 trillion US dollars.
I hope you are posting on this thread from living in China.Recently it was concluded that the rapid rise in industrial production in China might be a cause for its growth rate of 9% this quarter, but all those products were over produced.A simple example is that GM produced and sold a way more than a million vehicles in China of which atleast 70% were bought by the public owned companies.Despite the huge production rise of automobiles china failed to see any significant rise in its oil usage.What does that simply mean?
China can over produce as many products from steel based to automobiles as long as it has raw materials in hand and low cost labour at work.But in terms of gross usage of the products it failed to acheive a significant growth ,which literally signifies the fact that all the bought products were to be laid rest in garages and warehouses.You may construct 1000`s of skyscrapers ,but whats the point of having an occupancy rate of 48%? The recent funding and extra loans provided by gov only gave rise to over production,but sincerely failed to create new industries in other sectors where needed.
How long can the chinese boom sustain when china still have more than 300 million unemployed and 200 million migrating workforce?All the current industries are well employed and are operating at 100% or more capability despite the requirement.
I am not against Chinese growth,but I would like to put that growth in a perspective such that it is what needed by the country.Dumping of over produced goods in the foreign markets is not the correct answer.When these markets raise the taxing or even ban those goods will create a disaster or big dent in the chinese economy.
And can you care to elaborate how can a 2 trillion forex can transfer the american hegemony to chinese?and what way?
China exports more than it imports.It sends a signal outwards that any nation that has issues with China can simply block the trade.Who is at loosing end?

So far China is bound to be a coastal navy and majority of its airforce is of 3rd gen or even less.And its army???? no comment.

US became the global power with the backing of european nations which do have a strong economic,political and military background.What does china have except the economic might which it boasts? Its political system is full of fraud and corruption.And militarily? it still has to show off.We are not talking about the blood nosed china in the sino-vietnam war. are we? :D

The terminology is simple.US will be last super power of this world.The demise of US will be a way to a multi-polar world with more regional powers rather than a solo global power.
And the control is surrounding around these regional powers.
 
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guy..pls study more economics first before you draw such clueless conclusion so easily....

high-end and low-end manufacturing would not come back to USA forever, unless yankees would accept the salary as low as Chinese workers..that is the stone-cold fact.

Furthermore, Chinese high-end industry like auto,shipbuilding and aircarft-building are also getting more and more competitive day by day..if yankees has a easy rest and can not keep ahead of china in the value-chain, USA would become the sleeping hare. if so..USA would have nothing and become another Russia.
USA is not worried about low or high end manufacturing coming back to USA
USA has Mexico to do it, China is not making anything that makes them indispensable to USA.

U.S. dumps China for Mexico - Nov. 3, 2009

Mexico beats China in American assembly for export factories - BloggingStocks

U.S. sets duties on Chinese steel goods as cases mount - The China Post

Mexico Becomes World's Cheapest Country for Manufacturing U.S. Goods ~ Washington's Blog

Hastalavista China
 

Koji

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This is due to rising shipping costs which makes Mexico more viable to the US. When the energy prices drop again, you'll see it shift back to China.

Also, if you look at the numbers, Mexico fails in comparison to China in export to the US. The temporary shift is insignificant.
 
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I doubt it the manufacturing and labor are cheaper this has nothing to do ith transport costs, USA saves with all three with Mexico, with many US car manufacturers moving to Mexico this trend away fom China to Mexico will only accelerate until all US manufacturing is out of China.

Mexico Vs. China

Mexico Vs. China

Mexico’s standing as a leader in the global manufacturing market has been long established, even amidst increased global competition. Many Fortune 500 companies and other multi-national companies have turned to Mexico in an attempt to cut costs while maintaining U.S. standards of quality and efficiency.

Since the inception of the twin plant or maquila industry in the 1960’s, global companies have established labor intensive assembly operations in Mexico while paying substantially less for labor, components and real estate compared to the United States and many parts of Europe.

In the early 1990’s, the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) was established, making Mexico even more attractive for foreign direct investment by reducing and often eliminating existing tariffs -- resulting in larger volumes of trade between North American countries. In 2007, trade between the United States and its NATFA partners (Mexico and Canada) stood at $908.9 billion, growing from $613.6 billion in 2001 -- a 48 percent increase.

For more than 30 years following the creation of the maquila industry, Mexico enjoyed an environment that was relatively free of global competition in the race to make products for consumption in North America. But in 2001, the competitive landscape changed.

After 15 years of aggressive negotiation, China was granted membership in the World Trade Organization (WTO). Since then, manufacturing operations have grown exponentially in China, catapulting it to a globally significant player in the exportation of manufactured goods, placing it in direct competition with Mexico.

In 2001, U.S.-Mexico trade stood at $232.9 billion, almost double that of U.S.-China trade. In 2006, China surpassed Mexico in total trade with the U.S. for the first time, and in 2007, U.S. trade with China ($386.7 B) was approximately 13 percent higher than trade with Mexico.

A closer look at the data, however, shows that U.S. exports to Mexico are still more than double the level of US exports to China -- which is probably an indication of the close manufacturing relationship that continues to exist between the U.S. and Mexico.

A recent survey by Deloitte Research indicates that China and Mexico are the top two potential destinations for foreign direct investment by U.S. manufacturers. Thirty-eight percent of respondents indicate they are contemplating China for manufacturing operations and an additional 25 percent are considering Mexico. As a result, a high level comparison of Mexico versus China is merited.

The wage comparison tends to attract the attention of most multi-national corporations. Direct labor wages in China currently stand at $0.90 per hour, which in most cases includes room and board. Mexico’s direct labor wage is $2.50 per hour, including taxes, meals, transportation, and medical benefits -- as well potential productivity and punctuality bonuses. A closer look at the labor force of the two countries reveals a substantial difference in productivity.

Per capita GDP in Mexico stands at $7,467, more than six times greater than China’s per capita GDP of $1,240. Research also shows that Mexico’s labor force may be more technologically savvy. There are only 62 computers and 220 cell phones per 1,000 people in China, while there are 228 computers and 600 cell phones per 1,000 people in Mexico.

Mexico’s strengths tend to favor companies that manufacture highly customized products that are particularly sensitive to shipping costs and lead times. Production in Mexico will also tend to favor bulkier, heavier products that are destined for consumption in North America.

Because of its considerably lower labor cost, China typically favors labor intensive, commodity type products. While China’s labor assets are enormous (the population is almost thirteen times larger than Mexico’s), their skills are typically less developed than their Mexican counterparts. As a result, China is typically better suited for high volume, low mix manufacturing operations.

While it is not true in every instance, the following list provides an overview of the types of industries that tend to favor one country over the other.
 

badguy2000

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I hope you are posting on this thread from living in China.Recently it was concluded that the rapid rise in industrial production in China might be a cause for its growth rate of 9% this quarter, but all those products were over produced.A simple example is that GM produced and sold a way more than a million vehicles in China of which atleast 70% were bought by the public owned companies.Despite the huge production rise of automobiles china failed to see any significant rise in its oil usage.What does that simply mean?
China can over produce as many products from steel based to automobiles as long as it has raw materials in hand and low cost labour at work.But in terms of gross usage of the products it failed to acheive a significant growth ,which literally signifies the fact that all the bought products were to be laid rest in garages and warehouses.You may construct 1000`s of skyscrapers ,but whats the point of having an occupancy rate of 48%? The recent funding and extra loans provided by gov only gave rise to over production,but sincerely failed to create new industries in other sectors where needed.
How long can the chinese boom sustain when china still have more than 300 million unemployed and 200 million migrating workforce?All the current industries are well employed and are operating at 100% or more capability despite the requirement.
I am not against Chinese growth,but I would like to put that growth in a perspective such that it is what needed by the country.Dumping of over produced goods in the foreign markets is not the correct answer.When these markets raise the taxing or even ban those goods will create a disaster or big dent in the chinese economy.
And can you care to elaborate how can a 2 trillion forex can transfer the american hegemony to chinese?and what way?
China exports more than it imports.It sends a signal outwards that any nation that has issues with China can simply block the trade.Who is at loosing end?

So far China is bound to be a coastal navy and majority of its airforce is of 3rd gen or even less.And its army???? no comment.

US became the global power with the backing of european nations which do have a strong economic,political and military background.What does china have except the economic might which it boasts? Its political system is full of fraud and corruption.And militarily? it still has to show off.We are not talking about the blood nosed china in the sino-vietnam war. are we? :D

The terminology is simple.US will be last super power of this world.The demise of US will be a way to a multi-polar world with more regional powers rather than a solo global power.
And the control is surrounding around these regional powers.
guy, the steel for auto manufacturing is just a peanut of the steel consumption in China.
Every year, only several dozn million ton steel are consumed by auto manufacturing sections in CHina, of total 600+ million tons steel consumption i

40-50% of global steel and concrete are produced and consumed in CHina.


do you really know where the most of them go ?

let me show it to you.

1. high-speed railway

High-speed railway is being built in china at the record-breaking speed and scale in the human history.
In 5-10 years, CHina will finish 12,000+ KMs long HS railways. at that time ,70% of gloabl HS railways will be in china.

HS railway cost steel and concrete very much. 1000-KM-long Beijing-Shanghai highspeed railways need 6 million tons steel,about 1/10 of indian total yearly steel production.


2.expressways...


Chinese expressways are still slim less than Yankee's . but in 3 years at most, the lengh of Chinese expressways will catch up with Yankee's easily .
In 5 years, 1/3+ of global expressways l will be in CHina.


3.buildings
everday unnumbered new urban area are being under construction
it is reported that every year at least 250 million tons steel are poured into the construction of new urban area.
India yearly steel production is only 60 million tons ,only 1/4 of that.

 

badguy2000

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I doubt it the manufacturing and labor are cheaper this has nothing to do ith transport costs, USA saves with all three with Mexico, with many US car manufacturers moving to Mexico this trend away fom China to Mexico will only accelerate until all US manufacturing is out of China.

Mexico Vs. China

Mexico Vs. China

Mexico’s standing as a leader in the global manufacturing market has been long established, even amidst increased global competition. Many Fortune 500 companies and other multi-national companies have turned to Mexico in an attempt to cut costs while maintaining U.S. standards of quality and efficiency.

Since the inception of the twin plant or maquila industry in the 1960’s, global companies have established labor intensive assembly operations in Mexico while paying substantially less for labor, components and real estate compared to the United States and many parts of Europe.

In the early 1990’s, the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) was established, making Mexico even more attractive for foreign direct investment by reducing and often eliminating existing tariffs -- resulting in larger volumes of trade between North American countries. In 2007, trade between the United States and its NATFA partners (Mexico and Canada) stood at $908.9 billion, growing from $613.6 billion in 2001 -- a 48 percent increase.

For more than 30 years following the creation of the maquila industry, Mexico enjoyed an environment that was relatively free of global competition in the race to make products for consumption in North America. But in 2001, the competitive landscape changed.

After 15 years of aggressive negotiation, China was granted membership in the World Trade Organization (WTO). Since then, manufacturing operations have grown exponentially in China, catapulting it to a globally significant player in the exportation of manufactured goods, placing it in direct competition with Mexico.

In 2001, U.S.-Mexico trade stood at $232.9 billion, almost double that of U.S.-China trade. In 2006, China surpassed Mexico in total trade with the U.S. for the first time, and in 2007, U.S. trade with China ($386.7 B) was approximately 13 percent higher than trade with Mexico.

A closer look at the data, however, shows that U.S. exports to Mexico are still more than double the level of US exports to China -- which is probably an indication of the close manufacturing relationship that continues to exist between the U.S. and Mexico.

A recent survey by Deloitte Research indicates that China and Mexico are the top two potential destinations for foreign direct investment by U.S. manufacturers. Thirty-eight percent of respondents indicate they are contemplating China for manufacturing operations and an additional 25 percent are considering Mexico. As a result, a high level comparison of Mexico versus China is merited.

The wage comparison tends to attract the attention of most multi-national corporations. Direct labor wages in China currently stand at $0.90 per hour, which in most cases includes room and board. Mexico’s direct labor wage is $2.50 per hour, including taxes, meals, transportation, and medical benefits -- as well potential productivity and punctuality bonuses. A closer look at the labor force of the two countries reveals a substantial difference in productivity.

Per capita GDP in Mexico stands at $7,467, more than six times greater than China’s per capita GDP of $1,240. Research also shows that Mexico’s labor force may be more technologically savvy. There are only 62 computers and 220 cell phones per 1,000 people in China, while there are 228 computers and 600 cell phones per 1,000 people in Mexico.

Mexico’s strengths tend to favor companies that manufacture highly customized products that are particularly sensitive to shipping costs and lead times. Production in Mexico will also tend to favor bulkier, heavier products that are destined for consumption in North America.

Because of its considerably lower labor cost, China typically favors labor intensive, commodity type products. While China’s labor assets are enormous (the population is almost thirteen times larger than Mexico’s), their skills are typically less developed than their Mexican counterparts. As a result, China is typically better suited for high volume, low mix manufacturing operations.

While it is not true in every instance, the following list provides an overview of the types of industries that tend to favor one country over the other.

I will reply to it tommorow...it is too late and have to sleep....

if the freight is the only factors deciding the location of manufacturing-hub, then CHina would no chance to be like it today.

when the location of manufacturing-hub is concerned,3 factors should be taken into considerations:

1. the cost of labour. because cheap labour means the cheap labour cost .
2. the literacy of labour,because it decides the quality of labour. more illteratcy means less efficiency and more training cost.

2, the infrastructure,because it decides the logistics cost. the more developed the infrstructures is, the less the logistic cost is .
for example, tranporting cargos from Beijing to SHanghai must be cheaper than tranporting the same cargos from Delhi to Bangalor,because CHina has much better transport system.

3. industry-chains,because it decides the purchasecost. if manufacturing is in a country with broken industry chains, it means that you have to import most raw orunprocessed materials and components. it will increase the purchasecost much.


BTW. now, Mexico's per nominal GDP is about 10000+ USD while CHina's is 3500 USD......
well, I notice that the article was written in June,2008.
now one year has passed, and Chinese manufacturing occupies more shares of global manufacturing than the crisis broke out.
 

Daredevil

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[mod]Everyone back to the topic. Anymore off-topic posts will be deleted[/mod]
 

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