China Stealing Russian Designs Again?

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
Chinese will produce a 2nd or 3rd gen plane and try to pass it off as a 5th generation plane.
Chinese are able to do so because when countries start working on 5th generation they do not protect 3rd and 4th generation technologies so vigrously .
 

mehrotraprince

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 3, 2010
Messages
198
Likes
348
Country flag
China is good at reproducing what Soviets gave them before the split when they had complete ToT transfer. In fact China still builds some 50s garbage that needs to be upgraded with Russian engines. The two things Russians left out of the ToT for the J-11 were engines and radars. China still has not been able to successfully clone. All of PLAAFs fighters that are considered "modern" by Chinese standards are powered by Russian engines. China touts HQ-9 as some kind of success yet still buys S-300 from Russia for both land and naval air defence. China didn't even enter the FT-2000 into the competitive bid for Turkey's LRSAM. They tried to sell it state-to-state to stay out of competition, guess they can't take the heat against the Aster-30 and PAC-3 in a live fire. =xD
Absolutely right, China always avoid competition at international markets, bcoz they know that their products will never be chosen bcoz of the quality. So they follow either state-to-state method or by soft loan method. Their military products don't stand a chance against US, Western countries or Russia. Its good that India don't follow Chinese path rather they rely on Joint Ventures, Indigenous technology or just buy from international market.
 
Last edited:

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
One more example of Chinese propoganda machine.

BEIJING — As the nation held its collective breath, China's first astronaut, Yang Liwei, floated back to the motherland, having orbited Earth 14 times in the Shenzhou 5, or Divine Capsule.
Enlarge This Image


It was October 2003, and the national broadcaster CCTV carried live coverage of the momentous event, from Mr. Yang's famous pleasantries uttered in space — "I feel good" — to the instant that workers opened the capsule door to reveal the pale but smiling face of a hero, offering irrefutable evidence that China's maiden manned space voyage had gone off without a hitch.

Or had it?

In a lecture he gave to a group of journalism students two weeks ago, a top official at Xinhua, the state news agency, said that the mission was not so picture perfect. The official, Xia Lin, described how a design flaw had exposed the astronaut to excessive G-force pressure during re-entry, splitting his lip and drenching his face in blood. Startled but undaunted by Mr. Yang's appearance, the workers quickly mopped up the blood, strapped him back in his seat and shut the door. Then, with the cameras rolling, the cabin door swung open again, revealing an unblemished moment of triumph for all the world to see.

The content of Mr. Xia's speech, transcribed and posted online by someone who attended the May 15 lecture at Tianjin Foreign Studies University, has become something of a sensation in recent days, providing the Chinese a rare insight into how their news is stage-managed for mass consumption.

Titled "Understanding Journalistic Protocols for Covering Breaking News," the speech was intended to help budding journalists understand Xinhua's dual mission: to give Chinese leaders a fast and accurate picture of current events and to deftly manipulate that picture for the public to ensure social harmony, and by extension, the Communist Party's hold on power.

Officials at Xinhua and Tianjin Foreign Studies University did not return calls seeking comment, making it impossible to confirm details of the talk, but many of the points Mr. Xia made are borne out in Xinhua's coverage of the events he discussed.

Although it does not mention the staging of the landing for the cameras, Mr. Yang's autobiography, published this year, describes the injuries he suffered during the flight, including the cut to his lip caused by a microphone. He also says that the pressure from the infrasound resonance during take-off was excruciating.

"All of my organs seemed to break into pieces," he wrote.

Mr. Xia's journalism lecture, accompanied by a PowerPoint demonstration, included other examples of Xinhua's handiwork, most notably coverage of ethnic rioting in the far west of China last summer that left nearly 200 people dead.

Mr. Xia reportedly explained how Xinhua concealed the true horror of the unrest, during which the victims were mostly Han Chinese, for fear that it would set off violence beyond Urumqi, the capital of the Xinjiang region. Uighur rioters burned bus passengers alive, he apparently told the class, raped women and decapitated children, displaying their heads on a highway median.

"Under those circumstances, it would have exacerbated ethnic conflicts if more photos were released," he said.

But Xinhua also has another purpose — intelligence gathering — and two days later the agency's reporters sprang into action, leaving a government-organized media tour to sneak into a hospital to photograph the bodies of those slain during a wave of bloodletting by Han Chinese after the initial burst of unrest. Those deaths, he told the class, were reported to Beijing but did not make it into official news reports.

It was after receiving such unadulterated "internal reference news," he said, that President Hu Jintao flew home early from a meeting of the Group of 8 leaders to deal with the crisis.

Xiao Qiang, an adjunct professor at the University of California, Berkeley, who often lays bare details of elements of Beijing's propaganda machine on the Web site China Digital Times, said the seeming frankness of Mr. Xia's words reflected how unapologetic Xinhua was in its mission and its methods.

"He's basically telling these students that journalism in China is a big show, it's fabricated, but in the end it's all justified for the higher purpose of stability," Mr. Xiao said.

The practice of massaging the message has become more nuanced since the days when disfavored leaders were simply airbrushed out of group photos or details of a disaster — like the extent of the damage caused by the 1976 earthquake in Tangshan that claimed a quarter million lives — could simply be kept from the public.

These days, Xinhua and the Communist Party's propaganda department to which it reports have become far more sophisticated, but the challenges they face have also become more daunting in the Internet age. Although government censors still require China's main news portals to carry Xinhua dispatches on delicate matters like street protests or official corruption, censorship is de facto far less comprehensive online than in traditional media.

Postings about Mr. Xia's journalism lecture were quickly deleted, for instance, but new transcripts kept appearing. By late Thursday, at least 50 accounts came up in a Google search.

For Mr. Xiao, the fact that the original posting had appeared at all was encouraging and suggested that some Chinese journalism students were still idealistic.

"Perhaps it shows that at least one of these young students was shocked by what he heard," he said.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/04/world/asia/04china.html?ref=world
 

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
Good question... they faked their space walk. Probably faked their manned mission too.
Its quite possible . Chinese propaganda machine is so effective.

We should learn it from them and start giving them a dose of their own medicine.
 

ziruru

New Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2010
Messages
3
Likes
0
china do nothing but steal scientific accomplishment of other nations.
 
Last edited:

nandu

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
1,913
Likes
163
Russia blocks sale of engines for Sino-Pak fighters


The FC-1 fighter of China.

MOSCOW : Russia has blocked the sale of 100 RD-93 engines to China for FC-1, the joint Sino-Pak fighter, which could emerge as a rival for its MiG-29 fighter in the global markets, according to a news report.

"The new contract with China for the sale of 100 RD-93 engines has not been signed," Kommersant reported on Monday quoting its sources in the military-industrial complex.

The deal for the supply of second batch of 100 RD-93 manufactured by Moscow-based Chernyshev Machine building Plant for FC-1 (Pakistani version JF-17) was to be signed with China back in May, however, CEO of RAC MiG and Sukhoi Aircraft Holding Mikhail Pogosyan has torpedoed it, Kommersant business daily reported.

"One of the sources confirmed that Pogosyan has virtually blocked the deal with China by writing to the Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation (FSMTC) and Rosoboronexport (ROE) state arms exporter that FC-1 is a direct rival of Russian MiG-29 fighters in several foreign markets," the daily said noting that Russian and Chinese fighters are in the race for an Egyptian contract.

"I am not against the re-export of individual technologies, but it should be done in agreement with the producers of finished-product, so that this re-export does not damage their interests," Pogosyan told Kommersant.

"Re-export is allowed by the government decision and we don't have a practice of consulting producers of finished products.

Under the inter-governmental bilateral agreement in November 2007, China was allowed to re-export RD-93 as part of FC-1 fighter to Egypt, Nigeria, Bangladesh, Saudi Arabia and Algeria," press service of state arms exporting monopoly ROE was quoted as saying by the daily.

The Kommersant reminds that Chernyshev Plant, a part of United Engine Corporation, has supplied 100 RD-93 engines to China under the $238 million deal signed in 2005.

A framework agreement for the sale of 500 such engines for the Sino-Pak joint fighter was also signed at that time and Beijing was ready to buy up to 1,000 engines for over $3 billion, if Russia agreed to offer its modernised version with greater thrust.

http://www.brahmand.com/news/Russia-blocks-sale-of-engines-for-Sino-Pak-fighters/4356/1/10.html
 

tony4562

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Oct 2, 2009
Messages
836
Likes
49
The deal will go through, it's all just posturing. FC-1 does not really compete with Mig29 which in its current form as Mig35 is a way more sophisticated and more expensive fighter than FC-1. Further more supplying engines for FC-1 could represent billions of dollars in revenue something the Russians are surely salivating with.

The head of Sukhoi may not like the deal, understandably, but there are people in Russia who stronly support it, for example the head of Klimov. In the end, it's the opinion of Putin and perhaps Medvedev that really matters. I'm pretty sure a around of talk between Putin and Hu will resolve any impasse.
 

Crusader53

Regular Member
Joined
May 26, 2010
Messages
772
Likes
38
Russia will likely holding off on the deal until after the MMRCA is selected. Then expect it to go thru.....
 

x0700

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 4, 2010
Messages
30
Likes
5
the worry for Russia seems to be the mig29 market rather than Indian interests
Russia should learn that they are dealing with copycats and cheats, and they should bar their tech going down the drain
:angry_10:
 

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
the worry for Russia seems to be the mig29 market rather than Indian interests
Russia should learn that they are dealing with copycats and cheats, and they should bar their tech going down the drain
:angry_10:
You are absolutely correct . From Indian point of view we should all be happy with pakistanis getting more and more JF17. Russians are trying to control market share that will be grabbed by Chinese copies. They want to keep their market share with them. Its pure business nothing else.
 

nandu

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
1,913
Likes
163
Chinese J-15 (Sukhoi su 33 copy) spotted flying again

Chinese copy of Sukhoi su 33 (J-15) have been recently spotted flying again and pictures have re-emerged in internet blogs , it seems J-15 is still powered by the original two AL-31F which also powers Chinese J-10 and Sukhoi su 30 MKK aircraft's ,china is also constructing test base for the Navy, similar to Ukraine's Navy carrier fighter NITKA as test center.

carrier-based fighter aircraft flight test center is most likely located in Liaoning Huludao area.Huludao already have, "Chinese Navy Flight School,"But Huludao Xingcheng, Jiyuan Navy land-based aircraft carrier construction of the airport did not find signs of the runway test center. Han and the founder of Ping Kefu said, "building a new trial airport is very expensive, equal to land the aircraft carrier construction. At present, only Ukraine, United States, the existence of such a test center."





http://idrw.org/?p=2310
 

x0700

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 4, 2010
Messages
30
Likes
5
You are absolutely correct . From Indian point of view we should all be happy with pakistanis getting more and more JF17. Russians are trying to control market share that will be grabbed by Chinese copies. They want to keep their market share with them. Its pure business nothing else.
in fact, i am liking the idea of having Pakistan equip itself with the JF17, as long as western tech is kept out of the platform, although it will be a nuisance in the war due to the numbers and BVR capability.
 

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
Russian Combat Aircraft Makers Fear Competition with China




MOSCOW- Russian aircraft makers MiG and Sukhoi have spoken against the sale of RD-93 jet engines to China citing the threat of strong competition from cheaper Chinese models of fighter aircraft.

Russia's state arms exporter Rosoboronexport planned to sign a contract with China on the delivery of 100 RD-93 engines for FC-1 fighters, which are direct competitors of the famed MiG-29 Fulcrum aircraft.

Mikhail Pogosyan, the head of the MiG and Sukhoi corporations, said the re-export of technologies must be approved by the original manufacturers to avoid unfair competition.

The FC-1 Xiaolong (Fierce Dragon) is a single-engine multi-role fighter aircraft developed jointly by China and Pakistan. It is designated as JF-17 Thunder by Pakistan.

A Russian aircraft industry source said the FC-1 is inferior to MiG-29 in performance, but sells for about $10 million, while the price of a MiG-29 is about $35 mln.

MiG-29s are currently competing with FC-1s in an Egyptian tender on the delivery of 32 fighters. In addition, Egypt has launched negotiations with Pakistan on the licensed production of FC-1 aircraft.

Russian Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation (FSMTC) approved the re-export of RD-93 engines to Egypt as part of the FC-1 fighter package in November 2007.

Rosoboronexport has said a decision to allow the re-export of technology could be made only by the government, and the manufacturers have never been consulted on the issue.

Russian weapons manufacturers are also facing increasing competition from China on other arms markets.
Russian S-300 and Chinese HQ-9 air defense systems have been competing in a Turkish tender since 2007.
Russian and Chinese armored personnel carriers competed in an Indonesian tender in 2007.

In 2009, Myanmar chose Russian Mig-29s over Chinese J-10s and FC-1s. Russia has also accused China of producing its own copycat versions of some Russian-made weaponry, including the Su-27SK fighter jet, in violation of intellectual property agreements.

http://www.pakistankakhudahafiz.com/2010/07/18/russian-combat-aircraft-makers-fear-competition-with-china/
 

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
First glimpse of Chinese fighter, or Russian rip-off?

 
Last edited by a moderator:

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
Russia Fears Competition From Chinese Fighter Jets
Posted by Erin Sansone | July 16th, 2010 | Russia
By WENDELL MINNICK, USMAN ANSARI And NABI ABDULLAEV – Just two weeks before Beijing plans to showcase its JF-17/FC-1 multirole fighter to potential buyers, a leading executive of Russia's aircraft industry is trying to keep the planes from getting off the ground.
In a recent letter, Mikhail Pogosyan, the general director of Sukhoi Design Bureau and Russian Aircraft Corp. (RAC) MiG, asked Russia's Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation (FSMTC) to block the Chernyshyov Machine-building Enterprise from delivering 100 RD-93 engines.
"I am not against the export of separate technologies, but it should be agreed with those who make final products that such export would not harm them," Pogosyan told the Russian business daily newspaper Kommersant on July 6.
Pogosyan fears the single-engine JF-17, which costs up to $20 million per copy, could undercut sales of the $30 million, twin-engine MiG-29 Fulcrum.
FSMTC controls and supervises military cooperation with non-Russian governments.
A senior MiG executive confirmed the sending of the letter, but would not disclose other |details.
The engines are to power the Pakistani JF-17 Thunder and the Chinese FC-1 Xiaolong (Fierce Dragon), the nearly identical aircraft developed in a joint effort by China's Chengdu Aircraft Industries Corp. and the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC).
China plans to show two JF-17s at the Farnborough International Airshow later this month — the planes' debut at international defense exhibitions — in hopes of drumming up export sales.
In 2005, China placed a $238 million order for 100 RD-93 engines from Chernyshyov, a Moscow-based subsidiary of the state-owned OPK Oboronprom holding company.
A contract for another 100 engines had been expected soon.
On July 6, Kommersant quoted a military industry source as saying, "The new contract with China for the sale of 100 RD-93 engines has not been signed."
As well, China's Guizhou Aero Engine Group is reportedly working on an alternative to the RD-93, dubbed the WS-13 Taishan.
The Russians are worried about China's burgeoning defense aerospace industry, which is targeting markets once dominated by Soviet and Russian products.
In another demonstration of Russia's concern over competition with China, the administration issued a July 7 tender on the state procurement website for a study on the strategy and tactics of Chinese exporters of arms and military equipment, their success and competitive advantages.
The Kremlin offers $6,500 for a research paper that will be used to prepare a report for President Dmitry Medvedev. The authors will be expected to study Russian-Chinese military and technical cooperation, including the state regulatory mechanisms, to identify factors that give Chinese exporters competitive advantages. Separately, authors of the paper should study how Chinese exporters operate in the markets that Russia traditionally considers its own.
Moreover, Russian officials say, China is doing it by intellectual theft.
At the 2009 Dubai Airshow, an official from Rosoboronexport, Russia's state arms export agency, accused China of stealing the designs for the Su-27 (J-11B) and called China's L-15 trainer jet a cheap copy of Russia's Yak-130.
"Everyone in the defense industry should be concerned about the Chinese push into the market," he said.
In China, said Dean Cheng of the Washington-based Heritage Foundation, "R&D does not stand for 'research and development,' but rather 'receive and duplicate.'"
Some Chinese officials appear unconcerned over Russian complaints that China is stealing its customers.
"I hope that is the reason," said Maj. Gen. Zhu Chenghu, director general of the Strategic Studies Department of the Chinese Army's National Defense University.
Russia has a lot to protect. In 2009, MiG exports reached $325 million and its order portfolio now exceeds $3 billion.
Last year, the MiG-29 beat out China's FC-1 and J-10 for a 20-fighter order from Myanmar. This year, the MiG-29 is competing against the JF-17/FC-1 for an Egyptian tender of 32 fighters. The FSMTC has already approved the re-export of RD-93 engines if China wins the Egyptian tender.
Dmitry Vasilyev, an arms export analyst with Moscow's Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies, said the JF-17's relatively small pricetag makes it more attractive.
"Two engines needed to equip one fighter costs about $5 million, and engines usually make up about one-quarter of the total price of a fighter," Vasilyev said.
In fact, he said, it looks as if the Chinese government is offering the fighter for less than its production cost — "dumping" them on the world's arms market.
Russia and China have already clashed in the international market over air defense missile system exports. The Russian S-300 anti-aircraft system is competing with the Chinese HQ-9 system for a three-year-old Turkish tender.
Pakistan is watching the engine dispute with concern. One observer gave even odds that Pogosyan would succeed in his efforts to block the engines.
"Russian military-industrial oligarchies are powerful and have immense say in the Russian governmental structures," said retired Pakistan Air Force Air Commodore Kaiser Tufail.
That would hurt Pakistan's domestic fighter program, Tufail said. Waiting for the Chinese WS-13 engine would require a whole range of test trials in different configurations and could lead to a two-year delay.
It does not help, Tufail said, that "China is not going whole hog with the JF-17 for reasons of their own."
China is not building the fighter for its own air service; that role will be filled by the more capable J-10 aircraft.
Wendell Minnick contributed to this report from Taipei, Usman Ansari from Islamabad and Nabi Abdullaev from Moscow.http://defensenews.com/blogs/farnborough/2010/07/16/russia-fears-competition-from-chinese-fighter-jets/
 

badguy2000

Respected Member
Senior Member
Joined
May 20, 2009
Messages
5,133
Likes
746
hehe, leading ones' sour grapes or fear is the best encouragement to a latecomer. in fact I am very happy to hear that . it is a enjoyment to hear's Russia's complaint.

At least, Russia doesn't express such sour grapes or fear to guys that can threaten its position such as India or other countries.


one day when Yankees also express such sour grapes or fears to CHina, I will be more happy!
 

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
By WENDELL MINNICK, USMAN ANSARI And NABI ABDULLAEV – Just two weeks before Beijing plans to showcase its JF-17/FC-1 multirole fighter to potential buyers, a leading executive of Russia's aircraft industry is trying to keep the planes from getting off the ground.

In a recent letter, Mikhail Pogosyan, the general director of Sukhoi Design Bureau and Russian Aircraft Corp. (RAC) MiG, asked Russia's Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation (FSMTC) to block the Chernyshyov Machine-building Enterprise from delivering 100 RD-93 engines.

"I am not against the export of separate technologies, but it should be agreed with those who make final products that such export would not harm them," Pogosyan told the Russian business daily newspaper Kommersant on July 6.

Pogosyan fears the single-engine JF-17, which costs up to $20 million per copy, could undercut sales of the $30 million, twin-engine MiG-29 Fulcrum.

FSMTC controls and supervises military cooperation with non-Russian governments.

A senior MiG executive confirmed the sending of the letter, but would not disclose other |details.

The engines are to power the Pakistani JF-17 Thunder and the Chinese FC-1 Xiaolong (Fierce Dragon), the nearly identical aircraft developed in a joint effort by China's Chengdu Aircraft Industries Corp. and the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC).

China plans to show two JF-17s at the Farnborough International Airshow later this month — the planes' debut at international defense exhibitions — in hopes of drumming up export sales.

In 2005, China placed a $238 million order for 100 RD-93 engines from Chernyshyov, a Moscow-based subsidiary of the state-owned OPK Oboronprom holding company.

A contract for another 100 engines had been expected soon.

On July 6, Kommersant quoted a military industry source as saying, "The new contract with China for the sale of 100 RD-93 engines has not been signed."

As well, China's Guizhou Aero Engine Group is reportedly working on an alternative to the RD-93, dubbed the WS-13 Taishan.

The Russians are worried about China's burgeoning defense aerospace industry, which is targeting markets once dominated by Soviet and Russian products.

In another demonstration of Russia's concern over competition with China, the administration issued a July 7 tender on the state procurement website for a study on the strategy and tactics of Chinese exporters of arms and military equipment, their success and competitive advantages.

The Kremlin offers $6,500 for a research paper that will be used to prepare a report for President Dmitry Medvedev. The authors will be expected to study Russian-Chinese military and technical cooperation, including the state regulatory mechanisms, to identify factors that give Chinese exporters competitive advantages. Separately, authors of the paper should study how Chinese exporters operate in the markets that Russia traditionally considers its own.

Moreover, Russian officials say, China is doing it by intellectual theft.

At the 2009 Dubai Airshow, an official from Rosoboronexport, Russia's state arms export agency, accused China of stealing the designs for the Su-27 (J-11B) and called China's L-15 trainer jet a cheap copy of Russia's Yak-130.

"Everyone in the defense industry should be concerned about the Chinese push into the market," he said.

In China, said Dean Cheng of the Washington-based Heritage Foundation, "R&D does not stand for 'research and development,' but rather 'receive and duplicate.'"

Some Chinese officials appear unconcerned over Russian complaints that China is stealing its customers.

"I hope that is the reason," said Maj. Gen. Zhu Chenghu, director*general of the Strategic Studies Department of the Chinese Army's National Defense University.

Russia has a lot to protect. In 2009, MiG exports reached $325 million and its order portfolio now exceeds $3 billion.

Last year, the MiG-29 beat out China's FC-1 and J-10 for a 20-fighter order from Myanmar. This year, the MiG-29 is competing against the JF-17/FC-1 for an Egyptian tender of 32 fighters. The FSMTC has already approved the re-export of RD-93 engines if China wins the Egyptian tender.

Dmitry Vasilyev, an arms export analyst with Moscow's Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies, said the JF-17's relatively small pricetag makes it more attractive.

"Two engines needed to equip one fighter costs about $5 million, and engines usually make up about one-quarter of the total price of a fighter," Vasilyev said.

In fact, he said, it looks as if the Chinese government is offering the fighter for less than its production cost — "dumping" them on the world's arms market.

Russia and China have already clashed in the international market over air defense missile system exports. The Russian S-300 anti-aircraft system is competing with the Chinese HQ-9 system for a three-year-old Turkish tender.

Pakistan is watching the engine dispute with concern. One observer gave even odds that Pogosyan would succeed in his efforts to block the engines.

"Russian military-industrial oligarchies are powerful and have immense say in the Russian governmental structures," said retired Pakistan Air Force Air Commodore Kaiser Tufail.

That would hurt Pakistan's domestic fighter program, Tufail said. Waiting for the Chinese WS-13 engine would require a whole range of test trials in different configurations and could lead to a two-year delay.

It does not help, Tufail said, that "China is not going whole hog with the JF-17 for reasons of their own."

China is not building the fighter for its own air service; that role will be filled by the more capable J-10 aircraft.

Wendell Minnick contributed to this report from Taipei, Usman Ansari from Islamabad and Nabi Abdullaev from Moscow.


http://tavivootuniverse.wordpress.com/2010/07/17/defense-news-russia-fears-competition-from-chinese-fighter-jets/
 

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
Russian, Chinese Weapons Compete in Africa
China is increasingly challenging Russia in the African arms trade, offering lower prices on weapons that, ironically, are often made in China with Russian technologies. Chinese products are less expensive than Russian and Western systems, similar to the Russian systems that many African countries are familiar with, easy to maintain and easy to use in training.
Many countries are therefore switching allegiance to China for their weapons purchases. A typical example is Sudan. At a 2007 military parade, the Khartoum regime showcased its China-made T96 main battle tanks and T92 wheeled armoured vehicles.

The T92 is fitted with Russian 2A72 30-mm machine guns. Russia's KBP Design Bureau transferred the machine-gun technology to China in 1996, along with fire-control technology for the BMP-3 infantry fighting vehicle.

Sudan has also acquired K-8 trainer aircraft, Q-5 attackers and FN-6 portable ground-to-air missiles from China. Traditionally, Sudan has been a client of Russia, from whom it has purchased BMP-1 and BMP-2 infantry fighting vehicles, BTR-50 wheeled IFVs and T54/55 main battle tanks.
http://chinadigitaltimes.net/2008/12/russian-chinese-weapons-compete-in-africa/
 

SHASH2K2

New Member
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
5,711
Likes
730
Russia China in weapons competition





Russian aircraft makers MiG and Sukhoi have spoken against the sale of RD-93 jet engines to China citing the threat of strong competition from cheaper Chinese models of fighter aircraft.

Russia's state arms exporter Rosoboronexport planned to sign a contract with China on the delivery of 100 RD-93 engines for FC-1 fighters, which are direct competitors of the famed MiG-29 Fulcrum aircraft.

Mikhail Pogosyan, the head of the MiG and Sukhoi corporations, said the re-export of technologies must be approved by the original manufacturers to avoid unfair competition.

The FC-1 Xiaolong (Fierce Dragon) is a single-engine multi-role fighter aircraft developed jointly by China and Pakistan. It is designated as JF-17 Thunder by Pakistan.

A Russian aircraft industry source said the FC-1 is inferior to MiG-29 in performance, but sells for about $10 million, while the price of a MiG-29 is about $35 mln.

MiG-29s are currently competing with FC-1s in an Egyptian tender on the delivery of 32 fighters. In addition, Egypt has launched negotiations with Pakistan on the licensed production of FC-1 aircraft.

Russian Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation (FSMTC) approved the re-export of RD-93 engines to Egypt as part of the FC-1 fighter package in November 2007.

Rosoboronexport has said a decision to allow the re-export of technology could be made only by the government, and the manufacturers have never been consulted on the issue.

Russian weapons manufacturers are also facing increasing competition from China on other arms markets.

Russian S-300 and Chinese HQ-9 air defense systems have been competing in a Turkish tender since 2007.

Russian and Chinese armored personnel carriers competed in an Indonesian tender in 2007.

In 2009, Myanmar chose Russian Mig-29s over Chinese J-10s and FC-1s.

Russia has also accused China of producing its own copycat versions of some Russian-made weaponry, including the Su-27SK fighter jet, in violation of intellectual property agreements.
 

Latest Replies

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top