China says to USA: 'Pakistan is our Israel'

Ray

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When a US delegate once confronted a Chinese diplomat about Beijing's uncompromising support for Pakistan, the Chinese reportedly responded with a heavily-loaded sarcastic remark: "Pakistan is our Israel".
It is time that Tibet and East Turkmenistan should become India's Israel!
 

LurkerBaba

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The main problem will be when the cleft between the average anti-US Pakistan says enough is enough and just gets rid of the top elite something like the French revolution.
How about the Chinese drop in a few of Mao's red books and kick-start Pak's cultural revolution ? ;)
 
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Mustang

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@badguy,

if that is the case then your commies should forget about sending PLA to india, as if at all they do capture some territory, you will have supply a lot more tissues .

Take a pole position in olympic medal tally, and your commie government thinks that china has finally arrived on world stage.
 

Agantrope

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If america, EU, Japan, Australia etc etc put pressure on pakistan, then they will go against china also, just like the way they did it against taliban.
See this will never happens. The difference between US and China is that, Us is giving the freebies and the China is giving it as softloan, anyhow both are ir-ireversible process such that the money is not given back to the owner. Pakistan will remain as mercenary army for ever and a marketing agent for Chinese weapons into the poor countries.
 
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Look at all the losers China supports a classic example of a second rate power.
 
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amoy

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When a US delegate once confronted a Chinese diplomat about Beijing's uncompromising support for Pakistan, the Chinese reportedly responded with a heavily-loaded sarcastic remark: "Pakistan is our Israel".
IMO, such a new generation of diplomats are more lovely and lively in furthering interest of the country he stands for than their predecessors.

What would have a poke-faced mandarin responded to the US delegate?

Probably Madarin would have stiffly chanted "all nations are equal" or "sovereignty" blah blah

Which American once said "yes he is a bastard, but he is OUR bastard!"?
 
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Chinese aid is not even 10% of USA's aid,to make a statement like this is idiotic.
 

ZOOM

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It is true that What chinese diplomat has labelled their close ally. This remarks are especially directed towards India more rather then towards US. Such comments were long overdue and the time has been appropriate to make such remarks as US doing everything to scuttle Nucler deal between China and Pak.
 
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It is true that What chinese diplomat has labelled their close ally. This remarks are especially directed towards India more rather then towards US. Such comments were long overdue and the time has been appropriate to make such remarks as US doing everything to scuttle Nucler deal between China and Pak.
US can stop uranium supplies to China for violating NPT.
 

thakur_ritesh

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Well not so long back on this forum I once said, super-powers per se do not confront directly but do it through proxies and this is precisely what is at display here. China has no real love for anyone just the way the Americans have no real love for anyone out there, these proxy states are just a way through which they are to further their interests and so is being displayed.

For china a Pakistan, a DPRK, a sudan, a Zimbabwe is no more important than a RoK, a japan, a Canada, a Britain for the US!

Anyways good to hear Pakistan is equated with Israel, speaks a lot about Pakistan. Both are a pariah state!

Let the Americans and the Chinese play the "bigger game", earlier it was the US and the USSR and now its china which has jumped in to take the place of former ideological colleagues and once china was to surpass the US economically this game is only going to get a little more wilder and murkier but I doubt it will reach the highs of cold war era since these two countries are way too integrated economically and there is too much at stake to lose for both of them.

We in india just need to keep shut, play the monkey as the two cats fight it out, as much extract the benefits from the emerging crisis that will show up from time to time since one of the two will want our support and in the meantime keep working our way to the top 3 slots economically and make sure we reach there unhindered, without wasting our resources on these pointless "global issues" and to achieve that it gets very important we root-out all our internal strife and make sure we have a sustainable economic model which doesn't trip.

With that I wish both the US and the PRC all the very best, may you two bash the hell out of each other's proxies and if you two get a chance then out of each other as well!
 
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Vikramaditya

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.....................................self delete ...............................................
 

Vikramaditya

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If america, EU, Japan, Australia etc etc put pressure on pakistan, then they will go against china also, just like the way they did it against taliban.
No need for any pressure just show them some dollar ,Pakistan automatically turn against anyone or give them some weapon..
 

amoy

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Chinese aid is not even 10% of USA's aid,to make a statement like this is idiotic.
We in india just need to keep shut, play the monkey as the two cats fight it out,
Actually it's rightful to say "PAK is the US's Israel in S. Asia"

Look around who's in the neighborhood of PAK?
1) Afghanistan
2) Iran
3) India

Doesn't Uncle know PAK is China's best friend? Yes.

Hasn't Uncle seen through India's disguised ambition and strategy? Of course yes.

So no surprise Pak will play as a cat's paw for Uncle in S. Asia :happy_2:
 

Ray

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Actually it's rightful to say "PAK is the US's Israel in S. Asia"

Look around who's in the neighborhood of PAK?
1) Afghanistan
2) Iran
3) India

Doesn't Uncle know PAK is China's best friend? Yes.

Hasn't Uncle seen through India's disguised ambition and strategy? Of course yes.

So no surprise Pak will play as a cat's paw for Uncle in S. Asia :happy_2:
The US has seen 'India's disguised ambition and strategy' so well, that President Bush went out of the way to overturn everything and ensure India gets the nuclear deal that neither the US Congress nor the Indian Parliament was comfortable about.

On top of all that, there is this 'strategic partnership' wherein China feels India is 'encircling China'. Actually, China is worried about the expanded strategic partnership of India - Japan - Taiwan - Vietnam - Australia - Indonesia under the guidance of the US and its effect on the imperialistic designs of China i.e. leaving China's plan in the cold!

As far as Pakistan is concerned, it is good that China is her best friend. She requires friends and she has none, thanks to her exporting terrorism to even the Muslim countries. That is why the Middle East countries joined the ISAF in Afghanistan.

Afghanistan is also Russia's backyard and notwithstanding what you may say, China would not be too happy with Afghanistan becoming a Taliban and AQ hunting ground once the US and ISAF withdraws. The AQ and Taliban would have tasted blood when the US withdraws and there is a good chance that they will turn against their sponsors and instead promote radical Islam to include terrorists. If that happens, then Uighurs will achieve their independence and even if they don't immediately, they will keep the Han Army on the hop and once that happens, there will be the domino effect and the Tibetans will rise!!

So, please be friends of Pakistan and don't whimper when it bites the hand that feeds. Remember, the elected govt has no control over Pakistan and the Army cannot forever keep the Pakistanis (non Punjabis) under check!!
 

Ray

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Oh yes, as one Canadian Colonel of Chinese origin had said - China will fight India to the last Pakistani! :)
 

Ray

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For our Most Respected Chinese posters:

I am cross posting a news report from 'US, Russia join Asia club in a blow to China ' appended by LethalForce:

HANOI, Vietnam — China's military expansion and assertive trade policies have set off jitters across Asia, prompting many of its neighbors to rekindle old alliances and cultivate new ones to better defend their interests against the rising superpower.A whirl of deal-making and diplomacy, from Tokyo to New Delhi, is giving the United States an opportunity to reassert itself in a region where its eclipse by China has been viewed as inevitable.President Obama's trip to the region this week, his most extensive as president, will take him to the area's big democracies, India, Indonesia, South Korea and Japan, skirting authoritarian China. Those countries and other neighbors, though with varying degrees of candor, have taken steps to blunt China's assertiveness in the region.


Mr. Obama and Prime Minister Manmohan Singh of India are expected to sign a landmark deal for American military transport aircraft and are discussing the possible sale of jet fighters, which would make the Pentagon a major defense partner of India for the first time. Japan and India are courting Southeast Asian nations with trade agreements and talk of a "circle of democracy." Vietnam has a rapidly warming rapport with its old foe, the United States, in large part because its old friend, China, makes broad territorial claims in the South China Sea.The deals and alliances are not intended to contain China. But they suggest a palpable shift in the diplomatic landscape, on vivid display as leaders from 18 countries gathered this weekend in Hanoi's sleek glass-and-steel convention center, not far from Ho Chi Minh's mausoleum, for a meeting suffused by tensions between China and its neighbors.


Most Asian countries, even as they argue that China will inevitably replace the United States as the top regional power, have grown concerned at how quickly that shift is occurring, and what China the superpower may look like.China's big trading partners are complaining more loudly that it intervenes too aggressively to keep its currency undervalued. Its recent restrictions on exports of crucial rare earths minerals, first to Japan and then to the United States and Europe, raised the prospect that it may use its dominant positions in some industries as a diplomatic and political weapon.And its rapid naval expansion, combined with a more strident defense of its claims to disputed territories far off its shores, has persuaded Japan, South Korea, Vietnam and Singapore to reaffirm their enthusiasm for the American security umbrella.


"The most common thing that Asian leaders have said to me in my travels over this last 20 months is, 'Thank you, we're so glad that you're playing an active role in Asia again,' " Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said in Hawaii, opening a seven-country tour of Asia that includes a last-minute stop in China.Few of China's neighbors voice their concerns about the country publicly, but analysts and diplomats say they express wariness about the pace of China's military expansion and the stridency of its trade policies in private.


"Most of these countries have come to us and said, 'We're really worried about China,' " said Kenneth G. Lieberthal, a China adviser in the administration of President Bill Clinton who is now at the Brookings Institution.The Obama administration has been quick to capitalize on China's missteps. Where officials used to speak of China as the Asian economic giant, they now speak of India and China as twin giants. And they make clear which one they believe has a closer affinity to the United States."India and the United States have never mattered more to each other," Mrs. Clinton said. "As the world's two largest democracies, we are united by common interests and common values."


As Mr. Obama prepares to visits India in his first stop on his tour of Asian democracies, Mr. Singh, India's prime minister, will have just returned from his own grand tour — with both of them somewhat conspicuously, if at least partly coincidentally, circling China.None of this seems likely to lead to a cold war-style standoff. China is fully integrated into the global economy, and all of its neighbors are eager to deepen their ties with it. China has fought no wars since a border skirmish with Vietnam three decades ago, and it often emphasizes that it has no intention of projecting power through the use of force.


At the same time, fears that China has become more assertive as it has become richer are having real consequences around the region. India is promoting itself throughout the region as a counterweight to China; Japan is settling a dispute with the United States over a Marine air base; the Vietnamese are negotiating a deal to obtain civilian nuclear technology from the United States; and the Americans, who had largely ignored Asia as they waged wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, see an opportunity to come back in a big way.In July, for example, Mrs. Clinton reassured Vietnam, Indonesia, the Philippines and other countries by announcing that the United States would be willing to help resolve disputes between China and its neighbors over a string of strategically-important islands in the South China Sea.

China's foreign minister, Yang Jiechi, reacted furiously, accusing the United States of plotting against it, according to people briefed on the meeting. Mr. Yang went on to note that China was a big country, while staring pointedly at the foreign minister of tiny Singapore.Undaunted, Mrs. Clinton repeated the American pledge on the South China Sea in Hanoi on Saturday.China's rise as an authoritarian power has also revived a sense that democracies should stick together. K. Subrahmanyam, an influential strategic analyst in India, noted that half the world's people now live in democracies and that of the world's six biggest powers, only China has not accepted democracy.


"Today the problem is a rising China that is not democratic and is challenging for the No. 1 position in the world," he said.Indeed, how to deal with China seems to be an abiding preoccupation of Asia's leaders these days. In Japan, Prime Minister Naoto Kan and Mr. Singh discussed China's booming economy, military expansion and increased assertiveness on territorial disputes.


"Prime Minister Kan was keen to understand how India engages China," India's foreign secretary, Nirupama Rao, told the traveling press pool. "Our prime minister said it requires developing trust, close engagement and a lot of patience."Japan has just weathered a fierce war of words with China over its detention of a Chinese captain whose vessel collided with two Japanese patrol boats near disputed islands. India has watched nervously as China has started building ports in Sri Lanka and Pakistan, extending rail lines toward the border of Nepal, and otherwise seeking to expand its footprint in South Asia.


Mr. Singh's trip was part of his "Look East" policy, intended to broaden trade between India and the rest of Asia. He has repeatedly said it is not related to any frictions with China, but China is concerned. On Thursday, People's Daily, the Communist Party newspaper, ran an opinion article asking, "Does India's 'Look East' Policy Mean 'Look to Encircle China'?"
India's Defense Ministry has sought military contacts with a host of Asian nations while steadily expanding contacts and weapons procurements from the United States. The United States, American officials said, has conducted more exercises in recent years with India than with any other nation.
Inside China, some analysts say that the strengthening of American alliances around the Pacific rim need not come at the cost of its relationship with the United States. But they add that it will depend on how the Obama administration presents the strategy to China.


"What we have seen did raise the concern of many Chinese," said Da Wei, deputy director of the Institute of American Studies at the China Institutes of Contemporary International Relations. "When people believe the Obama administration is going to make efforts to contain China, to act against China, this change of perspective could have a negative effect."Other analysts say that China has reason to question American motives, given the intense surveillance of China conducted by the United States and the vast American military presence in Asia. On Friday, Mrs. Clinton stopped at an Air Force base in Guam, where she praised the troops.


"To a lot of Chinese, to P.L.A. people, it's very hard to understand why the United States moved half its military forces to the Asia-Pacific region," said Sun Zhe, director of the Center for U.S.-China Relations at Tsinghua University, using the acronym for the Chinese People's Liberation Army. "It's a serious threat and a potential threat."
Some Chinese analysts say the Western view of Beijing's aggression has been exaggerated by the news media in the United States, Japan and South Korea. China's policies toward its neighbors are basically unchanged, they say. To the extent that China's behavior is seen as more menacing, it reflects the insecurity and uncertainty of these smaller countries, they say.

"The Chinese perceived the Hanoi meeting as a gang attack on them," said Charles Freeman, director of China policy at the Center for Strategic and International Studies. "There's no question that they have miscalculated their own standing in the region."



http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/31/wo...nted=2&_r=1&hp


So, now what?

Any comments?
 
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sayareakd

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May be china is pakistan's best friend, same cannot be said vice versa, if the history has to believe IMHO Pakistan's (its military) best friend is anyone who will help them against India to get Kashmir. Pakistan has earlier gone to US and now to China.
 

ajtr

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May be china is pakistan's best friend, same cannot be said vice versa, if the history has to believe IMHO Pakistan's (its military) best friend is anyone who will help them against India to get Kashmir. Pakistan has earlier gone to US and now to China.
Or is it other way round?????Pakistan's masters have always gone against it even if all the three 've joined their forces against india.The reason is both cant deliver what pakistan wants and hence pakistan which sees master-slave relation as allied relation feels hurt in the end by the debauchery of its masters and turns against them only when it gets in sight of new master meanwhile milking the old one.
 

Ray

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Now why is China upsetting their best friend Pakistan?

Why is Wen coming to India?

To ensure that India is weaned away from the strategic partnership that the US is building in the Asia Pacific region?

When is Wen coming and what is his agenda?

China sure is highly disturbed and very high strung with the current developments at Hanoi!
 

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