Chanakya's Arthashastra

Discussion in 'Military History' started by civfanatic, Feb 6, 2011.

  1. KS

    KS Bye bye DFI Veteran Member

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    Brahaspati is not Shukracharya according to the Puranas...

    While Brahaspati was the counsellor of the Devas, Shuracharya was supposed to the counsellor of the Asuras.

    Was that a typo ?
     
  2. kabutar

    kabutar New Member

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    Thank you.
     
  3. kabutar

    kabutar New Member

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    Can we have the same now?
     
  4. civfanatic

    civfanatic Retired Moderator

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    By "School of Brhaspati", I think the book refers to the early Charvak school.

    The Brhaspatya sutras, the foundation of Charvak philosophy, are believed to have been composed during Mauryan times.
     
  5. Ankit Purohit

    Ankit Purohit Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Books I-V

    Dear civfanatic,

    attachment is not opening,showing below message

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    Why, help me
    regards
    ankit
     
  6. civfanatic

    civfanatic Retired Moderator

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    Re: Books I-V

    Hmm, it seems the old bug is back.
    @LurkerBaba can you look into this?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
  7. Ankit Purohit

    Ankit Purohit Senior Member Senior Member

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    Re: Books I-V

    Not a problem,i have found this chapter in google.

    thanks for posting .....useful chapter

    Jai maa Bharti
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
  8. LurkerBaba

    LurkerBaba Staff Administrator

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    Re: Books I-V

    It's fixed now
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 10, 2015
  9. punjab47

    punjab47 महाबलामहावीर्यामहासत्यपराक्रमासर्वाग्रेक्षत्रियाजट Banned

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    Title should be

    Acharya Chankya Ji Arthashastra

    Rajnitishastra says you should worship a man who teaches you even one letter of the dharam else you are a chandal (or worse actually)

    Respect is first aspect of worship

    So..
     
  10. I_PLAY_BAD

    I_PLAY_BAD Regular Member

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    I have read arthasastra.
    Personally I feel many ideas and practices written in it are simply barbaric and business minded.
    When you read it you would feel as if Chanakya has cleverly written everything but after some time when you feed those ideas to your rationale you would start hating Chanakya. Arthasastra may well suit for formulating Foreign, trade and Defence policies but it will never allow you to be a human being when followed in your personal life. Some advices given in it are simply unacceptable and cruel. Also a Government cannot function as it is mentioned in Arthasatra, people will surely riot.
    Typical Brahmin thinking and dangerous to the society.
     
  11. DingDong

    DingDong Senior Member Senior Member

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    Commoners comply with laws, Rulers bend and create laws. Morality is subjective, people with high emotional quotient are unfit to rule.
     
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  12. Yumdoot

    Yumdoot Regular Member

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    Kautilya does pay respects to both Brihaspati and Shukracharya even though both acharyas are enimical to each other.

    So does Krishna in Gita where he mentions in different shloks of chapter 10 that #24-'Among Purohits I am Brihaspati' and #37-'among kavis I am Ushana' where Ushana=Shukracharya.

    The Indian astrology also considers both Brihaspati and Shukracharya as important for lifetime of a jataka.

    So I guess no need to feel conflicted.
     
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  13. vram

    vram Regular Member

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    No ancient treatise should be taken as the gospel of truth and followed exactly .That leads to a decay of civilization. Only new ideas and acceptance of the strange can take the land forward . Ideas and the desire to progress are greatest gift of humankind. That is why I do not subscribe much to any ancient books of religion .I only accept what is morally correct to me from even the Bhagavad Gita.
    The cosmic nature has given us the capacity to reason and understand. What is religion but a construct of the human mind. Human have existed for only about a few thousand decades. Can we even imagine this with the context of the sun which is already 5 billion years old??? We are a mere eyeblink and we dare to imagine the supernatural in our image ??
     
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  14. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Have you read Gita? From the little I have read, there is no dos or donts in it. Only questions to which we are supposed to come to a conclusion on our own
     
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  15. asingh10

    asingh10 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Arthashastra is a book on statecraft, not a book on morality. You can call it barbaric but western strategists have been studying it along side Sun Tzu's Art of War, Ibn Khaldun's Muqaddimah, The Book Of Lord Shang Yang & Machiaveli's Prince.
     
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  16. asingh10

    asingh10 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Many things that happen in PRC have roots in classical Chinese legalism as well. Mao was himself inspired by Shang Yang as is the current president. Of course the Chinese normalize & make the necessary changes to keep legalism relevant. This is the core of the Chinese civilization, everything else like Communism , Buddhism, Confucianism is a facade to fool the world.

    MAO TSE-TUNG ON LEGALISM AND LORD SHANG

    HOW CHINA'S ANCIENT PAST INFLUENCED ITS FUTURE

    http://www.worldfuturefund.org/wffmaster/Reading/China/Mao on Shang Yang.htm

    It's no wonder some one like Nehru was outsmarted by Mao. If Hindu sensibilities are so easily offended by Arthashastra then what future do we really have against our ruthless, predatory civilizational foes ?
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2015
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  17. Yumdoot

    Yumdoot Regular Member

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    Arthashastra is about statecraft but it would be wrong to say it is not about morality. It is very much about Indian concept of Morality. Kautilya wrote Arthashastra as a distilled product of all the extant understanding of his times. So say for example, the lay population would enjoy the tales from Pauranic-granth but for the bureaucrats, administrators, ministers, King and his family and his employees this was the highly distilled product.

    As an aside, it would not be very fruitful for foreigners to try to read Arthashastra. In fact without the benefit of vernacular/sanskrit versions and simultaneous benefit of cultural upbringing even Indians will have a hard time understanding it properly. I have read in bits and pieces out of only one english version ie. by R. Shamasastry and its dull and dry with little practical use. Reminded me of what I felt when I first read the Bible.

    I would like to read Sun Tzu in Chinese directly but then that is in the future.

    What is Muqaddimah about. Book's name sounds very bollywood - muakil ka mukadhma etc.

    And who is Shang Yang?
    Wiki suggests Shang Yang died around competing dynasties. Not a good way to die if you are a teacher. But I guess the Chinese are not averse to mixing up teachers and rulers into a singular role, like the rest of the world. Probably also the reason Chinese convert easily.
     
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  18. vram

    vram Regular Member

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    I was an avid reader of some of the chapters in the Gita during my college days.It is a very difficult book to pigeon hole into a category. But it does have some definitive standards on the morality of a Human being and the the path of Karma and Dharma.
    The Rig Veda is actually the book that questions a lot on the nature of Dharma and also on the very nature of human existence. One of the most commonly quoted (and mis-understood part :) ) is the Nasadiya Suktam. But there are many other stanzas like this which question a lot and confuse you . They also leave things very vague.
     
  19. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    But that's what I love about it . A good book should work to make you work and come to your conclusions and should actively confuse you and rethink your positions several times.


    For example, have you heard of the train problem on morality?let's say there is a train coming and 5 people are tied to the track and are going to be killed. But you control a switch which will divert the train to another track which has only one person stuck on it. Now , will you divert the train to kill one person(with your action) to save 5? Or will you cause the death of 5 people due to your inaction? What if the one person on the other track is an innocent 1yr old child? Which of these actions is morally right?


    This is why Gita is more suited to 21 century and beyond than Koran or Bible. It gives no absolutes and provokes our morality
     
  20. Abhijat

    Abhijat Regular Member

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    Going by Moral values , I will not divert the train , because it will create an action by which I became part of death of one person.

    But by ethics , I will divert the train , as 5>1 , so save more no. of people.

    :confused1:
     

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