Buying at home

[ersakthivel]

You have not answered a single point which I have made earlier All you give a mere statements like "Tejas is a good plane" with no reference, I am not talking about future benefits which will surely come... but about the mere combat aspects and capabilities of the Tejas.

A fighter that lacks BVR capability, a fighter which cannot keep climbing without lift from its wings, a fighter that has not even been inducted is simply no match to a fighter made by one of the oldest and most experienced aircraft manufacturers.

The IAF has a limited budget, and will thus only go for the best plane they can get.. sorry but the Tejas is simply playing in a completely different league.

In tejas mk-2 thread in this forum,

and in the comments column on following blogs,

Securitywise-Stop wasteful defence expenditure by Bharath Karnad

and

Undermining national security by-AVM Arjun

both from Indian Express news service it is clearly explained.

Please go through a few pages of the following thread,.

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...arat-karnad-stop-wasteful-military-deals.html

Also

reding a few pages of this thread will help you to understand the argument why buying 126 RAFALEs at 20 billion plus dollars monumental cost will spell the death knell of home grown aviation industry in india.

tejas mk-2 will have a better top speed than RAFALE .

I don't know what you mean by saying a fighter that lacks BVR capacity!!!!!!!!


And the radome dia of tejas mk-2 is almost equal to radome dia of RAFALE meaning same radar tracking range , So both will have same long range missiles for BVR . On record tejas mk-2 is supposed to have interface for METEOR the same long range BVR slated for RAFALE.



The fuel fraction of tejas of tejas will also be close to RAFALE meaning for useful combat missions tejas may have close to 80 percent of RAAFLE range, For those twenty percent shortage having a couple of extra super Su-30 MKI will do.


Induction is a matter of time . All the test pilots of tejas are from IAF. For your info tejas mk-2 and mk-1 will have a lower wing loading than RAFALE ,i.e tejas will generate more lift force from it's wings than RAFALE because Load carried/Wing area (wing loading) is less for tejas.

ANd mk-2 will have more or less same TWR compared TO rafale.

AND BOTH USE VORTICE BASED FLIGHT AT HIGH aoa , ONE WITH THE USE OF CANARDS AND THE OTHER WITH THE USE OF COMPOUND DELTA.

 

[Snuggy321]

In tejas mk-2 thread in this forum,

and in the comments column on following blogs,

Securitywise-Stop wasteful defence expenditure by Bharath Karnad

and

Undermining national security by-AVM Arjun

both from Indian Express news service it is clearly explained.

Please go through a few pages of the following thread,.

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...arat-karnad-stop-wasteful-military-deals.html

Also

reding a few pages of this thread will help you to understand the argument why buying 126 RAFALEs at 20 billion plus dollars monumental cost will spell the death knell of home grown aviation industry in india.

tejas mk-2 will have a better top speed than RAFALE .

I don't know what you mean by saying a fighter that lacks BVR capacity!!!!!!!!


And the radome dia of tejas mk-2 is almost equal to radome dia of RAFALE meaning same radar tracking range , So both will have same long range missiles for BVR . On record tejas mk-2 is supposed to have interface for METEOR the same long range BVR slated for RAFALE.



The fuel fraction of tejas of tejas will also be close to RAFALE meaning for useful combat missions tejas may have close to 80 percent of RAAFLE range, For those twenty percent shortage having a couple of extra super Su-30 MKI will do.


Induction is a matter of time . All the test pilots of tejas are from IAF. For your info tejas mk-2 and mk-1 will have a lower wing loading than RAFALE ,i.e tejas will generate more lift force from it's wings than RAFALE because Load carried/Wing area (wing loading) is less for tejas.

ANd mk-2 will have more or less same TWR compared TO rafale.

AND BOTH USE VORTICE BASED FLIGHT AT HIGH aoa , ONE WITH THE USE OF CANARDS AND THE OTHER WITH THE USE OF COMPOUND DELTA.

1.) Bharath Karnads arguments have been proven as nonsense many times. This guy is everything but an aviation expert.

2.) The mere fact that you are comparing flight characteristics of a PAPERPLANE which simply does not exist with one of the most successful 4.5 gen fighters together with your question what BVR capabilities mean shows enough about your knowledge about military aviation.

You guys need to come out of your narrowminded and blind nationalism and see the reality. Do you think that future planes will have the predicted characteristics just because someone wrote it on the blueprints?

Aviation industry is the most sophisticated industry a country can possess and it takes decades of long, expensive and painful experience to develop it to world class standard. I am not against the development of our own fighters which is obviously necessary to develop out own aviation industry, but saying that our very first combat aircraft will somehow and magically be a top notch 4.5 gen fighter which can compete with any other aircraft made by companies which are designing combat aircraft since the beginning of aviation is mere BS.

This process will take much time, and there are simply much more capable fighters around.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

The fighter is design to drop LGB, Rockets so does ARM and BVR, The tests are just matter of time ( Within Next Years end )

The fighter use extensive stealth material and has internal ECM capabilities like most other MRCA contenders ..

Its a 4.5gen fighter with all its capabilities, And yes its a light fighter ..

====================

Regardless how modern fighter we import, We cannot keep up with the loses in War with Imports for that one need to be self reliant ..

but about the mere combat aspects and capabilities of the Tejas.

A fighter that lacks BVR capability, a fighter which cannot keep climbing without lift from its wings, a fighter that has not even been inducted is simply no match to a fighter made by one of the oldest and most experienced aircraft manufacturers.

The IAF has a limited budget, and will thus only go for the best plane they can get..

This process will take much time, and there are simply much more capable fighters around.

 

[ninja85]

buying 126 RAFALEs at 20 billion plus dollars monumental cost will spell the death knell of home grown aviation industry in india.

yes correct,but unfortunately no other good option left in such short time,

still having said that i say your point is correct,india should have brought dassault aviation instead of buying rafale (just a thought)because if this deal hasn't happened dassault aviation would have been out of defense business any way.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

SCAMS and over SCAMs, That is the truth of our defense procurements ..

This Gov since 48 doing this to Army and will keep it corrupt tradition alive ..

yes correct,but unfortunately no other good option left in such short time,:

 

[ninja85]

SCAMS and over SCAMs, That is the truth of our defense procurements ..

This Gov since 48 doing this to Army and will keep it corrupt tradition alive ..

i have the same opinion.

 

[SilentKiller]

You have not answered a single point which I have made earlier All you give a mere statements like "Tejas is a good plane" with no reference, I am not talking about future benefits which will surely come... but about the mere combat aspects and capabilities of the Tejas.

A fighter that lacks BVR capability, a fighter which cannot keep climbing without lift from its wings, a fighter that has not even been inducted is simply no match to a fighter made by one of the oldest and most experienced aircraft manufacturers.

The IAF has a limited budget, and will thus only go for the best plane they can get.. sorry but the Tejas is simply playing in a completely different league.

Am not Fighter Plane Expert to let u know merits of LCA over Rafale what i gave a point why indigenous military items are better than foreign.
as far as BVR capability is concerned please watch video of missile launch by LCA it can fire R-73 and R-77 missiles and R-77 is BVR missile.

come out of mindset that beautiful is good, foreign made goods r better, LCA is Mig-21 replacement as be needs numbers there which is >250 and rafale in such huge numbers is not possible in current economics as we need to maintain numerical strength to counter 2 threats.

e.g. (sorry for little bit of history lesson)
ok in case of war we will suffer losses no one can deny that but how quickly u replenish them is more important, even if u have F-22 but u cannot manufacture them yourself there is no use of them in long war. check history how a superior german tech was defeated by more numerical allies, learn from history never repeat the mistakes. tiger tanks were better than T-34 but when u r facing 5 vs 20 scenario u r bound to lose but as germany was not able to replenish its losses fast, it lost war.
even for Su-30's we r dependent on russian, what if russians don't support us in case f war with china like soviets did in 62 war?

 

[SilentKiller]

SCAMS and over SCAMs, That is the truth of our defense procurements ..

This Gov since 48 doing this to Army and will keep it corrupt tradition alive ..

True but we have 1 silver line in case of navy...
army and airforce can learn from them, i know its not long term solution.
army/airforce is to be blamed for this for some extent, if we had better govt it should have just made army to accept arjun tanks in army or lCA in airforce.

sometimes a product is launched half good its used by customer, company works on reviews and introduce next version better and so on and in years a great product is with customer!!. but company needs encouragement in some cases.

but corruption is not only becoz of politicians or govt but because of us too as we support it in some way or another.

 

[ersakthivel]

1.) Bharath Karnads arguments have been proven as nonsense many times. This guy is everything but an aviation expert.

2.) The mere fact that you are comparing flight characteristics of a PAPERPLANE which simply does not exist with one of the most successful 4.5 gen fighters together with your question what BVR capabilities mean shows enough about your knowledge about military aviation.

You guys need to come out of your narrowminded and blind nationalism and see the reality. Do you think that future planes will have the predicted characteristics just because someone wrote it on the blueprints?

Aviation industry is the most sophisticated industry a country can possess and it takes decades of long, expensive and painful experience to develop it to world class standard. I am not against the development of our own fighters which is obviously necessary to develop out own aviation industry, but saying that our very first combat aircraft will somehow and magically be a top notch 4.5 gen fighter which can compete with any other aircraft made by companies which are designing combat aircraft since the beginning of aviation is mere BS.

This process will take much time, and there are simply much more capable fighters around.

I always know that guys who don't know anything about aerodynamic are the ones who use the term paper plane when it comes to tejas,

Why?

They don't know what is the reason for lower wing loading of Tejas mk-2 than RAFALE ,

They don't know what is the reason behind comparable TWR of Tejas mk-2 with RAfALE,

They don't even know that when RADOME dia is the same tracking range and long range BVR will also be the same,

they don't know for the price of one RAFALE we can put three Tejas mk-2 in air which means we will be putting three RAFALE sized radars, three ew suits and three IRST devices along with 21 pylons ready to carry any kind of loadout of air to air or air to ground munition.

They just keep on arguing that Tejas mk-2 is a paper plane and RAFALE is the most successful 4.5th gen plane,

Ask any one RAFALE pilot how he is going to counter three tejas mk-2 with each one having the same radome dia as RAFALE and with a combination of three EW suits and three IRST devices spread over the air space,

Our very first combat fighter's close combat specs are culled from the even very best Mig-29s and Mirage-2000 that is for tejas Mk-1.

tejas mk-2 will match RAFALE in close combat specs since it has lower wing loading than RAFALE and comparable TWR.

And the IAF wanted 124 Mirage-2000s after the kargil war. There never was a place for 17 ton MMRCA in their order of battle and now classifying fighters as light , heavy and middle weight class like olympic boxing championship is to pull the wool over hapless political leadership.

SOURCE: IDRW NEWS NETWORK ( INN )

http://idrw.org/?p=29990

It was in 1999 after end of Kargil war with Pakistan, when Indian air force decided to procure 126 more French build Mirage 2000s after the aircraft performed exceptionally well in the mountainous terrain of Kargil . It's been 14 years now after Kargil war but Indian air force is still waiting for a deal for purchase of new fighter.

Idrw.org Recently spoke to Retired IAF Official who didn't wanted to be named, who said that "Due to Political reasons whole deal dragged on for years "he also told that "It was Political decision to make it multi-vendor competition, IAF knew exactly what it wanted and it was Upgraded Mirage-2000s then but later allowing American companies for bidding was also a mistake since IAF always knew their aircrafts (F-16 and F-18SH) will never fit out requirements.

According to retired official ' opening up and inviting American companies for bidding lead to further delays since multi-vendor proposals had to be gone through in details and aircraft's testing of additional aircraft's had to been carried out , it was lengthy process which could have been avoided but just sake for transparency from political masters , IAF had to go through whole ordeal which has seriously effected its current fleet strength which has been going south due to retirements of older Migs .

Throwing some light into current negotiation with French for Purchase of 126 Rafale jets, Official said that it was due to French stubbornness we are still Negotiating the deal and it will take few more months before the deal is signed between the two parties, French for better part of last year have been trying hard to tell us how due to our inability to absorb Transfer of technology shouldn't seek transfer of core technology of Rafale aircraft , literally backing off from submitted proposal by them , He also mentioned that he is not aware of current status of the deal but he strongly believes that there might be deviation in Transfer of Technology between two parties .

So tejas mk-2 is many times superior to the 124 mirage-2000s the IAF was asking,And tejas mk-2 can more than fulfill the original need which was behind the MMRCA deal.Everyone in IAF Knows this.

it is absurd to spend 20 billion dollar on a 4.5 th gen plane when we are about to introduce 5th gen FGFA.that too when the original need behind the MMRCA deal can more than easily be fulfilled by tejas mk-2,

If the money we pay for RAFALE is diverted to Tejas mk-2 we will have close to 350 tejas mk-2 making IAF one of the most formidable air forces of the airforce along with Su-30 MKIs and FGFA and AMCA fighters,

Rafale is not going to add anything significant over the above combination for the money spent on it.

RAFALE is going to be introduced side by side with FGFA and Super sukhoi.

What does RAFALE do that can not be done by these two planes , so that we are spending 20 billion dollars on RAFALE?

Also read the article by manohar joshi about tejas mk-2 in India Today.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/indian-light-combat-aircraft/1/164326.html

SO try to learn a few basic facts about fighter close combat specs and how those specs are affected in hot and arid climatic condition of india before posting useless stuff like-------"but saying that our very first combat aircraft will somehow and magically be a top notch 4.5 gen fighter which can compete with any other aircraft made by companies which are designing combat aircraft since the beginning of aviation is mere BS."

tejas mk-1 was built with the aim to counter PAF F-16s and Mk-2 is an upgrade over that.So it is naturally in RAfALE class.

Also the mk-2 has all the improvements suggested by CEMILAC to improve the mk-1. And it is no paper plane as it is slated to fly with in an year or two using the latest Ge-414-In S6 engine which is one of the most modern and reliable engine as well,

 

[Snuggy321]

Again you come up with things like: Tejas MKII WILL do this and that and blah blah blah.... Dont brag around until this plane actually lifts off. If you know anything about aviation history you would know how much actual flight performances differ from predicted ones. People can talk much about future projects, but the results are often lightyears apart from what was predicted.

 

[Snuggy321]

They don't know what is the reason behind comparable TWR of Tejas mk-2 with RAfALE,

They don't even know that when RADOME dia is the same tracking range and long range BVR will also be the same,

Our very first combat fighter's close combat specs are culled from the even very best Mig-29s and Mirage-2000 that is for tejas Mk-1.

tejas mk-2 will match RAFALE in close combat specs since it has lower wing loading than RAFALE and comparable TWR.

tejas mk-1 was built with the aim to counter PAF F-16s and Mk-2 is an upgrade over that.So it is naturally in RAfALE class. :shocked:

Do you actually have ANY proofs for all these laughable claims?

Post this on an aviation forum just for fun and see the replies.

 

[ersakthivel]

Do you actually have ANY proofs for all these laughable claims?

Post this on an aviation forum just for fun and see the replies.

O.K

Explain the various aerodynamic parameter that juseify the smoking 20 billion dollar investment in RAFALE when Russian 5th gen PAKFA is about to enter service in Russian airforce,

IAF instead of fooling people by going in for "advanced out of the world FGFA" can simply follow the Su-30 MKI route and by ordering 40 PAKFAs off the shelf and go in for 200 Tejas mk-2

It has been already explained to you that this so called MMRCA circus is the prime example of defrauding poor indian tax payer, because the original 124 Mirage-2000 proposal by IAF if accepted by the govt of the day would have seen no place for RAFALE for IAF.

But with IAF getting PAKFA with in a couple of years which fool will put 20 plus billion dollar in a fighter that is a generation below PAKFA?

In aviation forums there are many super genius guys like you who will write that Since tejas can not generate any lift force from it's wings it is a paper plane, without even knowing what the crucial spec wing loading means for fighter performance.

So there is no advantage in spending 20 billion dollar in 126 RAFALERs when 200 Tejas mk-2s + 50 PAKFA or Super Sukhoi will do a much better job than 124 for the same cost.

The price being asked by french for the fighter is so much that it is yet to win a single oversea contract with it's line of production about to be shut down. If it is such a world class fighter why it could not win the tenders at 150 million dollar plus a piece price?

ON its own tejas mk-2 will do more than 80 percent of the RAFALE missions when you combine them with a couple of squadron of Super Sukhois or Su-30 MKI or FGFA it is more than a match for RAFALE

 

[ersakthivel]

Again you come up with things like: Tejas MKII WILL do this and that and blah blah blah.... Dont brag around until this plane actually lifts off. If you know anything about aviation history you would know how much actual flight performances differ from predicted ones. People can talk much about future projects, but the results are often lightyears apart from what was predicted.

For your kind info The F3 standard proposed for RAFALE is also to be attained after it entered the MMRCA competition . So in theory the RAFALE F-3 config accepted by IAF for MMRCA too is a paper plane only paper plane for the huge cost.

When it entered the competition it did not have any other air to air missile than MICA (meteor was proved only later by EADS) and also without the ASEA radar, which too is proved only very in the after most of the evaluation is finished .

IAF is yet to see what kind of ASEA is there on RAFALE

Even Grippen NG is just one development model with no fixed IOC and FOC shedul;e if it did not win MMRCA contract.
The TYPHOON which contested was also not tuned to the ground bombing.

In fact if you want to buy only a proven plane you can buy either F-16 of Hornet in the MMRCA. They were the only ones that actually flew in service with the stated config of ASEA radar and all the advanced air to air missiles and avionics.

. Also without the ASEA in F-16 aviation forum it was reported that it's radar tracking range was just 100 Km. Even less than the tejas mk-1 , if the claim on the forum is true.

Even tejas mk-2 can fire any long range BVR missile that is presently there for Su-30 MKI and in future that can come in for FGFA or PAKFA. CAn RAFALE do that?

No. If rafale has to do that we have to pay russians and french for it over the tender amount.

The radome dia of TEJAS mk-1 is 650 mm and tracking range is 120 Km for 2 sq meter target with max power out put at 10 Kw at 10 percent cycle and normal power out put of 5 kw.


In tejas mk-2 the fuselage dia is expectede to be increased by 120 mm to house the larger dia GE-414 IN S6. SO in mk-2 it will have a close to 800 mm dia radar antenna.

In deciding BVR range the radar antenna dia and and the power output for radar is the determining factor in deciding the longer radar tracking range.

Also if you are such an aviation expert why don't you post the radome dia or the diameter of the radar antenna along with power out put for RAFALE? Rather than writing blah blah,,,,,,

Also can you post what is the R-73 or Python equivalent harder to evade WVR missile of RAFALE? MICA is a medium range BVR, so don't post that as answer, Tejas's MICA equivalent is derby[ And besides that Tejas can also fire any ASTRA mk-1 and MK-2 in future./B],

 

[ersakthivel]

You have not answered a single point which I have made earlier All you give a mere statements like "Tejas is a good plane" with no reference, I am not talking about future benefits which will surely come... but about the mere combat aspects and capabilities of the Tejas.

A fighter that lacks BVR capability, a fighter which cannot keep climbing without lift from its wings, a fighter that has not even been inducted is simply no match to a fighter made by one of the oldest and most experienced aircraft manufacturers.

The IAF has a limited budget, and will thus only go for the best plane they can get.. sorry but the Tejas is simply playing in a completely different league.

17 deg sustained turn rate is the initial ASR set for LCA mk-1 just 1 degree less than F-16 block C/D.

1.Even with 6G and 20 deg AOA limitation the LCA has already completed a horizontal loop in Aeroindia demo within 23 seconds. That comes to a STR of close to 16 deg with the limitations of partially opened flight envelope.We don't know whether the plane was stretched even to this partial limit of 6Gs and 20 Deg AOA in that demo.

Also with the same 6G 20 deg AOA restriction it completed a vertical loop within 20 seconds in AeroIndia 2013 ,meaning it had a STR of close to 18 deg in vertical loop. In a recent fly past the Su-35 too completed the powered vertical loop within 18 seconds. Once again We don't know whether the plane was stretched even to this partial limit of 6Gs and 20 Deg AOA in that demo.

Recent reports in a blog indicate that LCA mk-1 has achieved a Sustained Turn Rate to the IAf's satisfaction even with 1 ton extra empty weight than the original target of 5470 kg. SO it must have improved over the aeroindia2013 demo in a substantial manner.

So in no way can say it is fighter which cannot keep climbing without lift from its wings,

Also the TWR ratio of LCA with 50 percent fuel is 1.07. Same for F-16 is 1.25. So with even lower thrust to weight ratio than F-16 C/D , LCA has managed to pull closer to the F-16 C/D .

this simple fact proves your allegation-" fighter which cannot keep climbing without lift from its wings," as completely wrong.

Also this simple fact proves that a fighter with a larger wing are will do well in comparison with a fighter with lower wing area even if it has a way lower TWR than the lower wing area fighter .Which is what called the significance of having a low wing loading which makes the fighter more agile,

In mk-2 it will only further improve, with weight reduction due to more composite percentage and a 20 percent higher thrust engine in GE F414 IN S 6. Since the length of fuselage is going to be expanded by 0.5 meter only it won't add to much empty weight either.

Also with an empty weight of 8.5 ton F-16 C/D carries 3.1 ton fuel.

LCA mk-1 with it's empty weight of 6.4 tons carries 2.5 ton fuel.SO LCA mk-1 has a close to 10 percent better fuel fraction ratio than the F-16 C/ D. Indicating it won't suffer much in range in an air to air configuration of 2 ton air to air missile load which is it's primary role.

But by having a significantly lower wing loading than the F-16 C/D Tejas mk-1 will have a much better Instantaneous turn Rate than the 26 degree given for F-16 C/ D.

Even the initial ASR given for LCA by MSD Woollen indicates a requirement of 30 deg maximum attainable in the ADA website.

So in the all important high off bore sight WVR missile launching capacity based on Instantaneous Turn Rate , it will be better than the F-16 C/D, just going by the low wing loading factor alone.. But needs citation ofcourse

@pmaitra please give your opinion on this.

 

[AVERAGE INDIAN]

Economic Slowdown : Indigenisation is now imperative

Addressing the Combined Commanders' Conference recently, Prime Minister Manmohan Singh bluntly warned the Indian military that the growth slowdown would lead to curbs on new purchases.

Addressing the Combined Commanders' Conference recently, Prime Minister Manmohan Singh bluntly warned the Indian military that the growth slowdown would lead to curbs on new purchases. He said, "While we must take into account the capabilities of our adversaries, we have to plan our long-term acquisition on the assumption of limited resource availability." This is an important and timely warning. It is certainly clear that the military's insistence on foreign purchases has led to expectations that are unaffordable.

Consider just the Indian Air Force (IAF): it is understrength at the moment, with only 36 out of 39.5 fighter squadrons ready. Further depletions to the number of squadrons are likely when various ageing MiG-21s and MiG-27s are removed from service in the next few years. But the IAF, in order to make up the deficit, has a shopping list that might total $100 billion (approximately Rs 6 lakh crore) in the next 10 to 15 years. This is clearly unaffordable. The army is in a similar position.

However, the unfortunate fact is that the civilians at the defence ministry have not controlled the free-spending instincts of the military and warned them against the idea of expensive foreign purchases. The prime minister urged "the defence ministry and the armed forces, as also the DRDO [Defence Research and Development Organisation], to build on this experience and urgently review the different Task Force reports that our government has initiated with a view to achieving a higher index of indigenous capability in military inventory production". This admonition is overdue.

Indigenisation is the only way out. It is worth noting that this dovetails with a time when the rupee is weakening, which means that imports have become more expensive; and when the government has woken up to the crisis in Indian manufacturing and is pushing various incentives for investment in the sector, particularly in high-tech enterprises. Military development has historically, across countries and decades, created clusters of excellence in manufacturing and research that are exactly the kind of thing that New Delhi's policies are supposed to make happen. Thus, working with the private sector to increase defence production in India satisfies not just defence but also economic imperatives.

While the current government in recent years corrected its poor record in terms of spending on defence, the spigot of funding is about to be turned off thanks to the slowdown. Meanwhile, some at the defence ministry are unhappy at the thought of the defence public sector enterprises being pushed aside by increasing private sector participation; and the military does not believe in anything but foreign purchases. Put together, this momentum means that nothing will change without a serious push towards the private sector. Over the past year, the defence ministry released a sanitised version of its long-term integrated perspective plan in order to give private companies a sense of the military's requirement. But too few actionable items were on the list.

To get the private sector moving, the ministry must realise that funding support for risky and expensive research and assured orders for the weaponry so produced will be essential. This will cause defence public sector undertakings and the military to scream blue murder, and will require the defence ministry, in turn, to take a few risks and deal with the inevitable accusations of favouritism. But that is the cost of indigenisation - and of defence readiness in an economic downturn.

Defence News - Economic Slowdown : Indigenisation is now imperative

 

[ersakthivel]

Tata group | Media room | Interview with Hemant Achaya | Leading with mettle

ISRO now considers TAML a strategic partner and we expect much more business from them. Our first order from HAL came in 2005 for supplying around 165 components for the Advanced Light Helicopter (ALH). Thereafter, HAL has given us more orders, and this year we will be supplying more than 500 of the 800 parts per helicopter that HAL needs. HAL has also entrusted us with supplying sophisticated carbon fibre tools for their new helicopter programme.

We recently signed an MoU with the advanced composites division of National Aerospace Laboratories, by which we will be the manufacturing centre for the products designed by them. This MoU also gives us the responsibility to market their capabilities globally.

 

[ersakthivel]

Re: Economic Slowdown : Indigenisation is now imperative

HAL developing light choppers for high-altitude operations

New Delhi: Indian aerospace major HAL is developing an indigenous light utility helicopter to ferry troops and supplies in high altitude areas such as Siachen Glacier as a programme to procure 197 such choppers from foreign sellers is delayed in view of a CBI probe.

The programme for developing the three-tonne helicopter is in the 'design freeze' stage after consultations with the armed forces headquarters, including the Army and Air Force. The machine is expected to be ready by 2015.

"The LUH programme is progressing well and the project has achieved 'design freeze' following the concurrence from armed forces headquarters. The first ground test vehicle is being readied for factory tests," Hindustan Aeronautics Limited officials said here.

The single-engine chopper would be powered by a French engine, which has been chosen by the country's only aerospace company through a tendering process.

But, at the moment, the plan to procure 197 choppers from abroad is stuck due to various reasons. The first tender to procure the choppers was scrapped by Defence Minister AK Antony after some wrongdoing was detected in them.

The second tender has been stuck for over a year now after the government ordered a CBI probe into allegations that a Brigadier had sought a bribe of around Rs 25 crore for helping a particular vendor in the case.

These choppers are mainly deployed in high-altitude areas in Ladakh to provide supplies to Indian troops deployed there at heights of between 10,000-23,000 feet.

 

[ersakthivel]

Seven Private Aerospace companies Bid to overhaul IAF jets | idrw.org

 

[ersakthivel]

The article below reveals the double speak of the MMS -UPA regime, if we shrink the budget of DRDO, how are we going to buy at home?

Shrinking budget worries DRDO head - Times Of India
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HYDERABAD: In its first major step towards export of indigenous defence products and systems developed by Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), India will be showcasing more than a dozen of its products before more than 30 countries at the International Aerospace and Defence Exhibition 'ADEX-2013' at Seoul, South Korea, from October 29 to November 3. And a significant chunk of these products are from the Hyderabad-based labs of DRDO including Research Centre Imarat (RCI), Defence Research and Development Laboratory and other facilities at the Missile Complex.

Amongst the defence systems and products up for export are Pragati (surface-to-surface tactical missile system) developed by RCI and DRDL, babies like Akash (surface-to-air missile system) and Astra (beyond visual range air-to-air missile). Impressive list includes Abhyas, a high-speed expendable aerial target designed for autonomous flying with the help of an autopilot, Airborne Early Warning and Control system, IFF Interrogator (Identification Friend or Foe System), weapon locating radar and other surveillance and battlefield radars. D



DRDO's Explosive Detection Kit has already been grabbed by a US-based company.

Disclosing this at the Missile Complex in Kanchanbagh, scientific advisor to raksha mantri and director general DRDO, Avinash Chander expressed concern over the shrinking budget for DRDO. "It has come down to 5.5% from the previous 6. 2%, and given the current dynamics regarding depreciation of rupee against dollar, the percentage is actually even lesser. With the current policy of indigenous production, discouraging import of technology and products, the government must increase the allocation for R&D as it would fetch huge returns tomorrow", said Chander, adding that the budget allocation for DRDO should go up to 9% of the total allocated sum for the defence sector.

He further said that world over, the time taken from R&D to defence capabilities is about 15 years and another 20-25 years are taken for economic returns. "So far, India is the biggest importer of defence systems but the trend can be reversed completely if more budget is allocated to R&D in addition to industrial participation for the same", he said, adding that the Indian industry, especially Andhra Pradesh which has contributed immensely to major projects like Agni V, would reap huge benefits by taking a leap into defence production. The scientific advisor to defence minister maintained that investment in R&D would be a game changer in indigenous defence production bringing down the costs phenomenally

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