Bit by Bit lets dismantle them

Param

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Possible



The same happens now, with tacit approval of the 'anglosphere'
It can get worse.

For eg, China ,SU_ Sudan, Pol Pot's Cambodia, N.Korea

West _ Authoritarian regimes in Latin America, SE Asia , Pakistan. etc

The former is worse compared to the later.
 

mayfair

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Off topic, but I do wonder if the TATAs transferred some of the British Steel/Corus technology and metallurgy knowledge to their Indian operations? We come across oft expressed sentiment that Indian firms do not have the requisite expertise in metallurgy and engineering to design components that go into advanced innovations- such as special steel for aircraft, ships, high speed rails etc.

I am sure Corus would have such knowledge and if the technology is transferred to India, it would mitigate many of those issues.
 

trackwhack

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Off topic, but I do wonder if the TATAs transferred some of the British Steel/Corus technology and metallurgy knowledge to their Indian operations? We come across oft expressed sentiment that Indian firms do not have the requisite expertise in metallurgy and engineering to design components that go into advanced innovations- such as special steel for aircraft, ships, high speed rails etc.

I am sure Corus would have such knowledge and if the technology is transferred to India, it would mitigate many of those issues.
Corus is Tata. Of course there would have been tech transfer and a heck of a lot of it already.
 

LurkerBaba

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It can get worse.

For eg, China ,SU_ Sudan, Pol Pot's Cambodia, N.Korea

West _ Authoritarian regimes in Latin America, SE Asia , Pakistan. etc

The former is worse compared to the later.
The regime in Pakistan killed off 3million Bangladeshis. I don't think the Western regimes/actions are somehow better, they just get better PR
 

SADAKHUSH

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To all those who seem to have lost the sight of topic and started on a road to take revenge of the past have to look at the revenue of Tata Group and Birla. Both the enterprises drive their sixty and forty percent respectively from overseas subsidaries, what that does that tell you? What will India gain by bringing the UK industry to its knees? Perhaps a retaliation by British consumers! They are not going to come and give you hugs for busting their economy as some of you are dreaming about.

I have never heard of misplaced logic about the economic prosperity of UK because they stole resources from Indian subcontinent 300 years ago. By gosh that is the resource I want to get my hands on so that I can live a life of leisure. What Europe and UK in particular will have to do is bring the social welfare care programme expenses under control and they will just like PM Thatcher in her time busted the unions and to this day they have not dared to go on strike as they used to prior to her rule. If push comes to shove general public will rise to the occasion to protect the jobs as they have done in USA and Canada by throwing a life line to auto sector. They achieved it by winning concessions from unions, which is off the topic.

Now let us look at the USA economic situation. Is USA in dire state due to the auto plants set up by its companies overseas? The answer is no. So how can one auto manufacturer relocation to India from UK will bring down their economy? Can someone crunch the numbers to make sense of your angry dreams?

Indian industrial giants are not going to benefit in any way by killing the goose that will lay golden eggs for them.

At the end, I would ask those of you who are still angry at the British occupation of the past to go and buy a Jaguar and listen to some peaceful pleasant bollywood tunes. Zindagi ik safar hai suhana.
 

trackwhack

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No one wants to bring UK industries to their knees. We just have to own the country in due course. That's all. We must become their paymasters. :)
 

parijataka

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Mr Tata speaks of doing business. Anglophobes on DFI gloat about the downfall of the business partner because of 300 year old grudges. Bizarre. Really, really bizarre.
Ewald, Empire might have been a good thing for the British, not for us natives! Besides the British were responsible for many bad things such as the Bengal famine when grains were diverted for British troops during WWII. History is not easy to forget.

Having said that that is no reason to gloat over the apparent misery of the British. The British are people of great grit and character, proof of which was their empire! Lot of their problems mentioned by other posts stem from the policies of successive Labour governments that have increased the social spending by govt and made the benefits system very liberal.
 
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civfanatic

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I'm sure none of you find it bizarre that Jews hate Nazis, so why do some find it bizarre that educated Indians despise the British and everything they stand for?

And don't give me some crap about how Britain "developed" India. The Germans built railroads in Poland too; they used them to transport prisoners to concentration camps.
 
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trackwhack

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Originally Posted by W.G.Ewald

Mr Tata speaks of doing business. Anglophobes on DFI gloat about the downfall of the business partner because of 300 year old grudges. Bizarre. Really, really bizarre.

Ewald, with all due respect, and I know you have only the best of intentions and well wishes for India, you don't know what most peoples families have had to go through to rebuild this nation. I can talk from personal experience. My grandparents (both sides) lived in absolute poverty. Struggled really hard and afforded my dad a diploma after his 10th grade. My dad worked like a dog to get his three kids through college. I remember the bad days when me and my siblings shared food from one plate and my parents went through the day with one meal. But that's nothing. We still have millions who go through a day with just one meal. I know similar stories are shared by many others on this forum.

Yes, its our fault to have let the Brits in. But they plundered us for three centuries and built their empire and luxuries and funded their science and infrastructure by sucking the life out out this nation. And when they left, they left us with Pakistan.

You expect us to have sympathy for the Brits. The day is not far when their society will descend into anarchy. If I did have a chance then I would piss into their dead skulls.
 

pmaitra

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To all those who seem to have lost the sight of topic and started on a road to take revenge of the past have to look at the revenue of Tata Group and Birla. Both the enterprises drive their sixty and forty percent respectively from overseas subsidaries, what that does that tell you? What will India gain by bringing the UK industry to its knees? Perhaps a retaliation by British consumers! They are not going to come and give you hugs for busting their economy as some of you are dreaming about.

I have never heard of misplaced logic about the economic prosperity of UK because they stole resources from Indian subcontinent 300 years ago. By gosh that is the resource I want to get my hands on so that I can live a life of leisure. What Europe and UK in particular will have to do is bring the social welfare care programme expenses under control and they will just like PM Thatcher in her time busted the unions and to this day they have not dared to go on strike as they used to prior to her rule. If push comes to shove general public will rise to the occasion to protect the jobs as they have done in USA and Canada by throwing a life line to auto sector. They achieved it by winning concessions from unions, which is off the topic.

Now let us look at the USA economic situation. Is USA in dire state due to the auto plants set up by its companies overseas? The answer is no. So how can one auto manufacturer relocation to India from UK will bring down their economy? Can someone crunch the numbers to make sense of your angry dreams?

Indian industrial giants are not going to benefit in any way by killing the goose that will lay golden eggs for them.

At the end, I would ask those of you who are still angry at the British occupation of the past to go and buy a Jaguar and listen to some peaceful pleasant bollywood tunes. Zindagi ik safar hai suhana.
Very mature post. I second that!

Mr Tata speaks of doing business. Anglophobes on DFI gloat about the downfall of the business partner because of 300 year old grudges. Bizarre. Really, really bizarre.
Ewald, Empire might have been a good thing for the British, not for us natives! Besides the British were responsible for many bad things such as the Bengal famine when grains were diverted for British troops during WWII. History is not easy to forget.
W.G.Ewald, whatever parijataka said is correct. If someone holds a grudge against the British, I will defend his right to do so, because it is indeed a genuine grievance. I am sure you have not and will not see such feelings against the Germans or the Russians. The reason is history. As bizarre as it may sound, I want to point out that this is not xenophobia. Notice his comment "History is not easy to forget." I will go on to add that it is easier to forget 1776 than it is to forget 1947.
 
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niharjhatn

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Mr Tata speaks of doing business. Anglophobes on DFI gloat about the downfall of the business partner because of 300 year old grudges. Bizarre. Really, really bizarre.
Tell that to the british. Whilst I agree that irrationality has no place in business, they too have been unwilling to move on over 300 year history - look at their national museum; and their insistence of holding on to their "righteous" possessions with an unwillingness bordering on hostility.

Literally - holding on to the past.
 

LurkerBaba

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I have never heard of misplaced logic about the economic prosperity of UK because they stole resources from Indian subcontinent 300 years ago. By gosh that is the resource I want to get my hands on so that I can live a life of leisure. What Europe and UK in particular will have to do is bring the social welfare care programme expenses under control and they will just like PM Thatcher in her time busted the unions and to this day they have not dared to go on strike as they used to prior to her rule. If push comes to shove general public will rise to the occasion to protect the jobs as they have done in USA and Canada by throwing a life line to auto sector. They achieved it by winning concessions from unions, which is off the topic.
Their Empire ended just 65 years back, so the looting was over gradual period of 200 years

Atleast someone is honest about it:

For 300 years Britain has outsourced mayhem. Finally it's coming home


Colonial plunder permitted the British state to balance its resource deficits as well. For some 200 years a river of food flowed into this country from such places as Ireland, India and the Caribbean. In The Blood Never Dried, John Newsinger reveals that in 1748 Jamaica alone sent 17,400 tons of sugar to Britain; by 1815 this had risen to 73,800. It was all produced by stolen labour.
Just as grain was sucked out of Ireland at the height of its great famine, so Britain continued to drain India of food during its catastrophic hungers. In Late Victorian Holocausts, Mike Davis shows that between 1876 and 1877 wheat exports to the UK from India doubled as subsistence there collapsed, and several million died of starvation. In the North-Western provinces famine was wholly engineered by British policy, as good harvests were exported to offset poor English production in 1876 and 1877.
Britain, in other words, outsourced famine as well as social unrest. There was terrible poverty in this country in the second half of the 19th century, but not mass starvation. The bad harvest of 1788 helped precipitate the French revolution, but the British state avoided such hazards. Others died on our behalf.


In the late 19th century, Davis shows, Britain's vast deficits with the United States, Germany and its white dominions were balanced by huge annual surpluses with India and (as a result of the opium trade) China. For a generation "the starving Indian and Chinese peasantries "¦ braced the entire system of international settlements, allowing England's continued financial supremacy to temporarily co-exist with its relative industrial decline". Britain's trade surpluses with India allowed the City to become the world's financial capital.


Its role in British colonisation was not a passive one. The bankruptcy, and subsequent British takeover, of Egypt in 1882 was hastened by a loan from Rothscensoredchild's bank whose execution, Newsinger records, amounted to "fraud on a massive scale". censoredJardine Matheson, once the biggest narco-trafficking outfit in history (it dominated the Chinese opium trade), later formed a major investment bank, Jardine Fleming. It was taken over by JP Morgan Chase in 2000.


We lost our colonies, but the plunder has continued by other means. As Joseph Stiglitz shows in Globalisation and its Discontents, the capital liberalisation forced on Asian economies by the IMF permitted northern traders to loot hundreds of billions of dollars, precipitating the Asian financial crisis of 1997-98. Poorer nations have also been strong-armed into a series of amazingly one-sided treaties and commitments, such as trade-related investment measures, bilateral investment agreements and the EU's economic partnership agreements. If you have ever wondered how a small, densely populated country which produces very little supports itself, I would urge you to study these asymmetric arrangements.
full article: For 300 years Britain has outsourced mayhem. Finally it's coming home | George Monbiot | Comment is free | The Guardian
 

civfanatic

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"The Geat British Empire, the greatest empire the world has ever seen, spread its technology and goods to the furthest corners of the globe. Britain civilised the world and introduced primitive people to science, medicine, law and religion. The last 300 years has seen the most amazing technological advances, and its all because of Britian. James Watt the Scotsman that developed the first proper engine and kickstarted the industrial revolution is someone that we should all be proud of. His genius has allowed the poulation of the world to grow exponentially.
We are the only country properly qualified to lead the world. We should all be proud of what our ancestors achieved and remind ourselves that we still have that potential under the correct spiritual and ethical guidance."

:shocked:
 

Galaxy

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I agree with many of the points that members mentioned about British. (Specially Famine in Bengal in 1773 & 1943 and Famine in Rajputna in 1869, Orissa in 1866 and Agra in 1837). More than 20 millions died at that time and it was mainly because of British. They were indulged in looting the India for over 200 years & making U.K. more rich and Hatred against them is justified. But that is one side of the coin.

When British entered India, There was noting called India. India was divided between 100's to 500's of princley states. I know the concept of Chakravarti in old days and there were many Chakravarti like Ashoka, Ikshvaku, Bindusara, etc. But one should remember they were before Islamic invasion and not after that neither it was possible.

If there would be no British, Then most likely India would not be same. Assam, whole J&K be Islamic state. Even South India would be divided between Nizams, Mysore and may be Modern version of Cholas. Gujarat won't be leading state due to radical Sindh, Punjab would be different under Talibani majority and Marathas and 100 princley states of Rajput and Central India would also be different. Few would be fighting against each other. Even Arunchal Pradesh, Sikkim could be part of China due to division of India and lack of legimate border (Macmohan line). There could be some reunification, But then it would be highly unlikely that there would be anything like India. It would be many Indias within India.

I know reunification of India by British was done on own selfish motive but eventually It helped India. Isn't it ? As far as, Pak-BD is considered. I think it's good that both were seperated from India otherwise There would be civil war and terroirsm would have spread in every state/districts. Nehru declined PM post to Jinnah and it was not British fault. But even if that is the case, It was good for us.
 

KS

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All those wishing the death of the Anglosphere have absolutely no idea how important the Anglosphere is in containing the more dangerous chinese imperialism. And unmistakably they are also the ones who still think Anglosphere is of greater danger to India (I frankly dont know how) and need to be dismantled because of a previous grudge and close their eyes to the more dangerous,imminent threat of the chinese hegemony and the role the Anglosphere can play in mitigating it. It's in absolute Indian interest that the Anglosphere should NOT lose its influence in the world affairs.... for India's sake. They are but relics stuck in the past who just want to show off how big their d!ck is without pragmatism.


The day the Anglosphere collapses, China and its allies will F**k the rest of the world.

New totalitarian, undemocratic,imperialist, evils will be born or go unchecked.
People are against the west imperialism..but given a chance these chinis will engage in imperialism that will make these Anglospheres look like milk suckling babies.
 
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Galaxy

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One more point i would like to add.

If U.K./West will fall, China will become super power. SL, BD would be become proxy against India. Pakistan would be big danger for us and Russia will sell weapons at high price too. Even Middle-east including Iran would become more closer to China.

May be once India become big power, Then it's fine but not as of now. Fall of west means rise of China on global platform.
 

W.G.Ewald

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Actually 190 years.

1757–1858 East India Company
1858–1947 British Indian Empire
This is what I based the 300 years on:
In 1610, the British chased away a Portuguese naval squadron, and the East India Company created its own outpost at Surat. This small outpost marked the beginning of a remarkable presence that would last over 300 years and eventually dominate the entire subcontinent.
Indian History - British Period - Arrival of Europeans in India
 

W.G.Ewald

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The day that the Anglosphere collapses is the day that the rest of the world will breathe a sigh of relief.

Indian tycoon Ratan Tata and his business interests outweigh millions of bitter idealists, thank God. Good for him and capitalism. When idealists run governments there is always be the danger
of the extinction of the human race.
 

SADAKHUSH

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Be careful what you wish for others can come to haunt you. That is called "KARMA" according to Indian philosophy. On one hand we blame the foreign rule for the state affairs that India is in and also blame them for spreading the culture of corruption in the sub continent. My question is why India and its citizenry has not taken the steps to root out the cancer of corruption? It is a fact and witnessed by me that when citizens the Indian sub-continent migrate to foreign land they take the same mind set to cheat its adopted country of taxes. This practise is also exercised by many other nationalities who have settled in the North American and European countries. In other words these very people are looting these nations left and right from with in.

It is about time for Indians to keep the history of the past in memories and make something positive out of that horrible experience to move forward.
 

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