Aviation minister nudges AI to take a tough stand on strike

Ray

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Aviation minister nudges AI to take a tough stand on strike


MUMBAI: Ajit Singh, the Union civil aviation minister , seems to have taken a tough stance on the on-going Air India pilots' strike. Here is why. With the burden of a government bailout for Air India weighing on him, Singh has managed to nudge the airline into taking a firm stance in dealing with the Air India strike.

This is in complete contrast to what happened last year, when the aviation ministry , under Vayalar Ravi, agreed to most of the demands by ICPA, a union of pilots affiliated to Indian Airlines. The hardening stance of the ministry and Air India - and their threat to sack nearly 340 agitating pilots at the loss-making Air India - has striking pilots of Air India alleging that the Indian Airline faction of Air India are now calling the shots.

Only last year, pilots from the Indian Pilots' Guild (IPG) - a union of pilots affiliated to Air India - alleged that the management treated with kid gloves a faction of pilots belonging to the erstwhile Indian Airlines, who had grounded the carrier for 12 days. In May 2011, the ministry of civil aviation had signed an agreement with the Indian Commercial Pilots Association (ICPA), a union affiliated to the then Indian Airlines.

The 600 pilots affiliated to ICPA had gone on a strike over issues of pay parity with their colleagues in Air India. The ministry, which de-recognised IPG on the first day of May 2012 and sacked nearly 100 pilots in 37 days of agitation (with a threat to terminate services of 340 pilots more), is now in no mood to initiate a dialogue with agitating pilots till the time they rejoin flying.

The changed stance is glaring as the same ministry along with Air India had initially refused to reinstate the sacked pilots in May last year, when the Indian Airlines pilots were on strike. The ministry buckled under pressure by signing an agreement with ICPA, agreeing not only to recognise the agitating union, but also taking back the sacked office bearers of ICPA with immediate effect. The management also referred the terms and conditions of pay parity to the Dharmadhikari Committee that was appointed to blueprint a plan for the merged Air India.

A copy of the minutes of a meeting of the ICPA office bearers, including the then general secretary Rishabh Kapur, with three top-level civil aviation ministry officials , including joint secretary Prashant Shukul in Delhi between May 4 and 6, which brought the strike to an end, was reviewed by ET. The ministry officials agreed that in lieu of withdrawal of agitation the Air India management will revoke orders regarding suspension/termination of employees immediately and will also recognise the union with immediate effect once the strike is withdrawn. It also agreed to refer terms of pay and other allowances to the Dharamadhikari Committee.

Though the minutes state that the demand for a monthly grant of $1,600 per month will be referred to the same committee, the Air India management went ahead and gave a pay hike of as much as $1,200 to ICPA pilots in November 2011. The employees of Air India questioned the ministry's involvement in the whole matter and argued as to why the ministry couldn't intervene now when IPG is striking, the same way it intervened and brought the warring management and pilots on the same page. "The nodal ministry does not enter into agreements with striking unions. Only the labour ministry can do so.

Aviation minister nudges AI to take a tough stand on strike - The Economic Times
The strike is well over the 48[SUP]th[/SUP] day.

It has put a whole lot of passengers to great inconvenience and allowed other airlines to manipulate fares to make a killing.

It has tarnished the image of India, it being a national carrier.

Are the pilots justified in their demands?

Are the pilots justified for going on strike?

Is the Govt and the Minister correct in taking the stand the Govt and the Minister has taken?

If the Govt blinks, is there any guarantee that the pilots will not go another strike another day as they have been doing over the years and the Govt blinking first every time?

I heard the Minister on TV that the Air India pilots are the highest paid pilots in the world and this could not be refuted by the representative of the Indian Pilots Guild on that show.
 

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I wonder why people are still buying AI tickets. There bookings should have dried up after 15 days of strike!!

Common people, if GoI does not want to close AI, then you should send it down the drain by choosing others.
 

Mad Indian

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I wonder why people are still buying AI tickets. There bookings should have dried up after 15 days of strike!!

Common people, if GoI does not want to close AI, then you should send it down the drain by choosing others.
Personally, I would not use AI if unless there is no other choice. What about those cases, where only AI tickets are available?
 

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If there is no option, then its just the AI way. But you should hedge well against the risk of cancellation!
 

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It is true that closing down would be a good answer.

However, it is also time to teach these chaps you cannot hold the country to ransom.

Ajit Singh said that the pilots should return to work and the AI management would then look into their grievances and take them on re-negotiated terms.

I am not too sure, but to me it appeared during the TV debate that these chaps have been sacked since they have disregarded the Court orders too!
 

lcatejas

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Don't take though action from mouth its time to action .... .. strike to mazak ho gaya hai india me ...
 
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aeroblogger

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Aha! My topic :)
(I'm an aviation journalist)

The strike is well over the 48[SUP]th[/SUP] day.

It has put a whole lot of passengers to great inconvenience and allowed other airlines to manipulate fares to make a killing.

It has tarnished the image of India, it being a national carrier.
The effect of the strike has been minimal to anybody outside AI and its immediate extranet.
Are the pilots justified in their demands?

Are the pilots justified for going on strike?
Somewhat. The pilots had some legitimate grievances (and some not-so-legitimate ones). They went on strike assuming it would be the same as the past - management would talk tough for a few days, then talks would occur, and everybody would end up happy (except for the taxpayer I suppose). This time, that didn't happen. They didn't have their act together until they realized that this wasn't going to happen, and by then it was too late. They lost the PR game. The aam aadmi doesn't support the IPG at all, because they don't understand why the IPG is on strike. And they don't want to understand why the IPG is on strike.

Is the Govt and the Minister correct in taking the stand the Govt and the Minister has taken?
Not really. It is the Minister's job to get this dispute settled. It is the management's job to act tough and keep costs down. Whether the minister is doing the "right thing" or not is a topic for a very long discussion - it's not very clear cut. But I think everybody is "right" to some extent (pilots, management, minister, etc), but everyone is also "wrong" to some extent as well.
If the Govt blinks, is there any guarantee that the pilots will not go another strike another day as they have been doing over the years and the Govt blinking first every time?
No. But if the government doesn't blink, there is still no guarantee. Until the management inspires confidence of the employees, strikes will continue happening.
I heard the Minister on TV that the Air India pilots are the highest paid pilots in the world and this could not be refuted by the representative of the Indian Pilots Guild on that show.
It is not completely accurate. The highest seniority pilots are indeed some of the highest paid pilots in the world. The younger, lower seniority captains and first officers are paid slightly less than average for an IATA longhaul operator.

I wonder why people are still buying AI tickets. There bookings should have dried up after 15 days of strike!!
Nobody is booking AI for international routes (which this strike affects). This is because AI has itself closed all booking.

Personally, I would not use AI if unless there is no other choice. What about those cases, where only AI tickets are available?
I personally love AI as a passenger (although I hate it as a taxpayer). No matter how incompetent, corrupt, *insert negative quality*, etc. management is, the airline is great for the passenger. The product is really good, it is reasonably reliable compared to its domestic competitors, and prices are fair.

On domestic legs, AI is always my first choice. Internationally, there is more competition (so more choice), and I fly AI much less often.

If there is no option, then its just the AI way. But you should hedge well against the risk of cancellation!
AI's cancellation rate pre-strike was just fine. Now that operations have stabilized after the strike, the cancellation rate has fallen again.
It is true that closing down would be a good answer.
Not really. It would be devastating in the short run to our country's aviation system, which would have far reaching effects in the economy. And politicians all run for the short term, not the long term good of the country.

Regardless, AI is currently in the midst of a (well designed) restructuring package. Once that is over, AI will operationally be the best carrier in India, assuming the competition don't pull off miracles. Industrial relations are another story, but those will be dealt with eventually too. The current state of the airline simply isn't sustainable.
However, it is also time to teach these chaps you cannot hold the country to ransom.
I wouldn't be so quick to condemn them. The strike was their last resort - they tried to get their grievances sorted out in a variety of different ways earlier.
Ajit Singh said that the pilots should return to work and the AI management would then look into their grievances and take them on re-negotiated terms.
That is not going to happen. No self-respecting union member would cross a picket line without their fellow staff reinstated. It is idiotic to expect this.

AI pilots' stand isn't any more reasonable though. There needs to be compromise somewhere.
I am not too sure, but to me it appeared during the TV debate that these chaps have been sacked since they have disregarded the Court orders too!
AI pilots have disregarded the court order to return to work. AI management have disregarded the court order to conduct talks and sort out grievances before sacking more pilots.

Neither side is "innocent."
 

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I personally love AI as a passenger (although I hate it as a taxpayer). No matter how incompetent, corrupt, *insert negative quality*, etc. management is, the airline is great for the passenger. The product is really good, it is reasonably reliable compared to its domestic competitors, and prices are fair.

On domestic legs, AI is always my first choice. Internationally, there is more competition (so more choice), and I fly AI much less often.
I have first hand experience with AI.

And trust me, It was not good. NO no no no no. Not good at all.:denied:

The Service inside was the worst I ever had. The Air Hostess(who was atleast 50 BTW) looked as if she was going to kill me whenever I asked for water or snacks:tsk:

Personally, I want keep AI in a museum:fyeah:
 

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I have first hand experience with AI.

And trust me, It was not good. NO no no no no. Not good at all.:denied:

The Service inside was the worst I ever had. The Air Hostess(who was atleast 50 BTW) looked as if she was going to kill me whenever I asked for water or snacks:tsk:

Personally, I want keep AI in a museum:fyeah:
Well, then we've had very different experiences. I've flown AI 38 times in the last 6 months (mostly domestic), including once this morning. In those 38 times, I have had a grand total of 3 poor experiences directly caused by the airline (all 3 times, the problem was rude/uncommunicative staff).

I was counting this morning for an article I'm working on - compared to the 38 AI segments (3 bad experiences), I have had 8 Spicejet flights (2 bad experiences), 3 IndiGo flights (1 bad experience), 2 Jet Airways flights (1 bad experience), 2 JetLite flights (2 bad experiences), and 1 Kingfisher flight (bad experience). AI's product blows all of these airlines out of the air anyway. Mind you, my personal experience is hardly a drop in the bucket for the total airline system, so my experience might very well be fluke. However, a clear pattern has emerged over the years of my flying AI - they are as good as it gets in Indian aviation.

I also fail to see what is wrong with having older flight attendants. They are on board for your safety, not to be gawked at :rolleyes:
 
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lcatejas

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The best way is ... govt should totally shut down the headache (AI) ...:cool2:
 

Mad Indian

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Well, then we've had very different experiences. I've flown AI 38 times in the last 6 months (mostly domestic), including once this morning. In those 38 times, I have had a grand total of 3 poor experiences directly caused by the airline (all 3 times, the problem was rude/uncommunicative staff).

I was counting this morning for an article I'm working on - compared to the 38 AI segments (3 bad experiences), I have had 8 Spicejet flights (2 bad experiences), 3 IndiGo flights (1 bad experience), 2 Jet Airways flights (1 bad experience), 2 JetLite flights (2 bad experience), and 1 Kingfisher flight (bad experience). AI's product blows all of these airlines out of the air anyway.
Yeah well the difference is, I can express my views on their management via a feedback to these Private companies in case if I found these rude behaviors.

is that so with AI. No one will give two hoots about what some customer complains. True or not?

I also fail to see what is wrong with having older flight attendants. They are on board for your safety, not to be gawked at :rolleyes:
Yeah well there is a reason Air hostesses are Hot:flame:. But, the thing is even at the age of 50+ they lacked the empathy they are supposed to show. That was my point, not their attractiveness. Though I wont complain if they had younger Air Hostesses:heh:
 

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Yeah well the difference is, I can express my views on their management via a feedback to these Private companies in case if I found these rude behaviors.

is that so with AI. No one will give two hoots about what some customer complains. True or not?
Not quite true. Whenever I send a complaint, I get a reply within a week or 2 from customer service department...

Maybe it is because I have elite status though - if I wasn't a Golden Edge member, maybe they wouldn't give a shit.

Then again, the private airlines aren't much better - I sent complaint to Jet Airways about my poor experience. Let me quote the reply:
Dear Mr. Rao,

Thank you for your email about the issues you have faced on flight 9W XXXX. We have checked with the crew of this flight, and come to the conclusion that this flight had no irregularities, and we were able to deliver our fantastic Jet Airways service.

We hope you enjoyed your flight, and we hope to see you back on board soon.

Regards,
XXXXX
Jet Airways Customer Care
Does that look like they care about my complaint?

Yeah well there is a reason Air hostesses are Hot:flame:. But, the thing is even at the age of 50+ they lacked the empathy they are supposed to show. That was my point, not their attractiveness. Though I wont complain if they had younger Air Hostesses:heh:
Trying to explain seems to be futile, so I'll just let you know about the good news: AI recently hired about 80 ex-Kingfisher Airlines Flight Attendants to replace retirees. You'll have some better luck finding hot ones now. :rolleyes:
 

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The best way is ... govt should totally shut down the headache (AI) ...:cool2:
That is an idiotic idea. If AI stopped operating tomorrow, the economic shockwave would be horrible.

A phased shutdown over a long period of time is an idea, but restructuring and privatization would be far better.
 

Ray

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Give it back to Tata.
 

pmaitra

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I have first hand experience with AI.

And trust me, It was not good. NO no no no no. Not good at all.:denied:

The Service inside was the worst I ever had. The Air Hostess(who was atleast 50 BTW) looked as if she was going to kill me whenever I asked for water or snacks:tsk:

Personally, I want keep AI in a museum:fyeah:
You are not the only one though.

I have flown on IA, then government owned, and also on Alliance Air, and I must say, the service I received does not warrant any negative attribute. Of course, my choosing IA or AA wasn't motivated by my desire to ogle at hot lasses; it was motivated by my desire for quick transport and the lack of reservation availability with the Indian Railways.

Oh, BTW, when will domestic carriers, who have tied up with international carriers and code share with international flights start accepting US dollars for in-flight meals? Travelling and waiting for more than 10 hours, with dollar bills in your pocket, and dumping cup after cup of water into your stomach because you cannot buy any food, isn't exactly a great experience.

Maddy, do please keep AI in the museum, and while you are at it, do tag along a few of these inept private carriers as well.
 

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I guess there should be some electoral reforms, both for AI and IR, whereby, any increase in prices, or layoff by the employer , does not automatically lead to the people voting against the government. How does one achieve this? Why should the government be held at ransom for doing what is necessary?
 

aeroblogger

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Give it back to Tata.
:rolleyes:

I have flown on IA, then government owned, and also on Alliance Air, and I must say, the service I received does not warrant any negative attribute. Of course, my choosing IA or AA wasn't motivated by my desire to ogle at hot lasses; it was motivated by my desire for quick transport and the lack of reservation availability with the Indian Railways.
And it has only gotten better - since the merger, PTVs have been introduced, catering has been revamped, and service is the best its been in over a decade.

Since the merger, losses have also spiraled. But that's a different discussion, and doesn't take away the enjoyment from the passenger point of view ;)

Oh, BTW, when will domestic carriers, who have tied up with international carriers and code share with international flights start accepting US dollars for in-flight meals? Travelling and waiting for more than 10 hours, with dollar bills in your pocket, and dumping cup after cup of water into your stomach because you cannot buy any food, isn't exactly a great experience.
That's another advantage of flying with AI - no fees for anything :)

I guess there should be some electoral reforms, both for AI and IR, whereby, any increase in prices, or layoff by the employer , does not automatically lead to the people voting against the government. How does one achieve this? Why should the government be held at ransom for doing what is necessary?
This is a very serious problem at most PSUs, which definitely needs to be addressed. The aviation minister is not the person who should be dealing with it
 

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Crippled Kingfisher sees flight of engineers

Mumbai, Jun 26 (PTI): About 80 engineers have quit beleaguered Kingfisher Airlines during the past four months due to non-payment of salaries by the near-bankrupt carrier, sources said.

"Some 60-80 engineers have already quit the carrier in the last 4-5 months, as they could not sustain non-payment of salaries. And more are planning to do so," airline sources told PTI here.

Some more engineers are in the process of bidding good-bye to the carrier, they said, adding, "if the trend continues, the airline may face severe shortage of engineers."

Also, around 200 engineers reported sick in April this year protesting delay in salaries.

Crippled Kingfisher sees flight of engineers
 

Ray

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The aviation minister is not the person who should be dealing with it
Then who?

The political appointees on the board who are bureaucrats?
 

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Well, then we've had very different experiences. I've flown AI 38 times in the last 6 months (mostly domestic), including once this morning. In those 38 times, I have had a grand total of 3 poor experiences directly caused by the airline (all 3 times, the problem was rude/uncommunicative staff).

I was counting this morning for an article I'm working on - compared to the 38 AI segments (3 bad experiences), I have had 8 Spicejet flights (2 bad experiences), 3 IndiGo flights (1 bad experience), 2 Jet Airways flights (1 bad experience), 2 JetLite flights (2 bad experiences), and 1 Kingfisher flight (bad experience). AI's product blows all of these airlines out of the air anyway. Mind you, my personal experience is hardly a drop in the bucket for the total airline system, so my experience might very well be fluke. However, a clear pattern has emerged over the years of my flying AI - they are as good as it gets in Indian aviation.

I also fail to see what is wrong with having older flight attendants. They are on board for your safety, not to be gawked at :rolleyes:
Absolutely, and I have always wondered how is it that people tend to talk so highly about a lot of these private airlines when they are indeed crappy in many ways than one when compared to AI. I have been rather amazed with the way the staff has improved in their interactions right from ground to on-board, some of these people, much older and are outright courteous, its been some transformation.

Anyways, when one is doing a low cost/no-frill airline one doesn't really bother what's on offer, at least I don't.

I would for one definitely say, AI is one of the better airlines in the domestic circuit.
 

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