A Paper Dragon: China's armed forces

[CCP]

I don't dispute that the majority of Taiwanese are Han Chinese. So what? The majority of Singaporeans are Han Chinese, too. Does the PRC want to annex Singapore, too. I'm of predominantly English descent and am considered an Anglo-Saxon, does this make a British citizen? No, it does not. Many Americans are of German descent, does this make them German citizens? No, it does not. Why does being of Han Chinese descent mean that they must be PRC nationals? Very racially imperialist attitude to have.

Why Singapore? It is never part of China before.

 

[CCP]

The problem lies somewhere else... These Chinese communist with some new found wealth selling counterfeit / copied products are unable to handle the sudden change they are experiencing and their irrational and aggressive behaviour comes from their inability to move forward in 21st century from the deep rooted humiliations they got repeatedly from Japanese"¦ These Chinese will issue threats to smaller countries on a daily basis...

Well, PRC went to wars with both US and Soviet not far ago.

PS. Did your defence minister friend tell you that?

 

[Redhawk]

The problem lies somewhere else... These Chinese communist with some new found wealth selling counterfeit / copied products are unable to handle the sudden change they are experiencing and their irrational and aggressive behaviour comes from their inability to move forward in 21st century from the deep humiliations they got repeatedly from Japanese"¦ These Chinese will issue threats to smaller countries on a daily basis...

Exactly, but you must remember that the vast majority of Chinese in the PRC are peasants and have the attitudes of peasants, including their leadership. Chinese may be four or five generations out of the paddy fields but still think and act like peasants, albeit in a lot of cases, rich peasants. The Chinese in the PRC are still a pre-Industrial Revolution people with their heads stuck firmly in a time which is comparable to the early Middle Ages or late Antiquity in the West. China might have been a great civilisation 1,500 or 2000 years ago, but that's where Chinese society has stayed.

And the other thing is with the rise of new-found wealth and material consumerism, the peasant culture of China has not had time to absorb it and adjust.

 

[Ray]

I don't dispute that the majority of Taiwanese are Han Chinese. So what? The majority of Singaporeans are Han Chinese, too. Does the PRC want to annex Singapore, too. I'm of predominantly English descent and am considered an Anglo-Saxon, does this make a British citizen? No, it does not. Many Americans are of German descent, does this make them German citizens? No, it does not. Why does being of Han Chinese descent mean that they must be PRC nationals? Very racially imperialist attitude to have.

Taiwanese are not Han Chinese majority.

This will indicate what the Taiwanese are
The True History of Taiwan

By Dr. Sim Kiantek
The True History of Taiwan

As far as China being 92% Han is another bogus myth spun by the overactive spinmeisters amongst the Han, ancient and new.

Han people were classified as 'inner people' (nei ren) and 'outer people' (non Han) whom they called 'barbarians' (wei ren).

After capturing the areas which were Non Han, they roadrolled the people captured to accept Han culture and identity through the process called Sinicisation.

The 'barbarians' who accepted Han culture and became Han erasing their original identity and culture were called by the Han as shufan (cooked barbarians) and those who did not willing become Han as shengfan (raw barbarians)

'Barbarians' were given generic names in the Chinese classics and history: The Yi barbarians to the East, the Man to the South, the Rong to the West and Di to the North.

Until 1930, the names of the outgroups (wai ren were commonly written in characters with an animal radical:
1. the Di, the tribe to the North were linked to the Dog.
2. the Man and the Min were characterised with Reptiles.
3. the Qiang was written with a Sheep radical.
Link

Imagine the humiliation they were subjected to till they accepted being 'cooked barbarians' and eventual Han!

It is time we realised the huge faking that the Mainland China and the Chinese historians have faked on the world that Chinese people are 92% Han. This figure is a fudged mirage perpetuated because of the cultural and social genocide that signatures the idea that China consist of Han people.

 

[CCP]

Exactly, but you must remember that the vast majority of Chinese in the PRC are peasants and have the attitudes of peasants, including their leadership. Chinese may be four or five generations out of the paddy fields but still think and act like peasants, albeit in a lot of cases, rich peasants. The Chinese in the PRC are still a pre-Industrial Revolution people with their heads stuck firmly in a time which is comparable to the early Middle Ages or late Antiquity in the West. China might have been a great civilisation 1,500 or 2000 years ago, but that's where Chinese society has stayed.

And the other thing is with the rise of new-found wealth and material consumerism, the peasant culture of China has not had time to absorb it and adjust.

What do you mean " vast majority"?



Urbanization in the People's Republic of China increased in speed following the initiation of the reform and opening policy. By the end of 2012, the mainland of the People's Republic of China had a total urban population of 712 million or 52.6% of the total population, rising from 26% in 1990.

Urbanization in China - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Redhawk]

What do you mean " vast majority"?



Urbanization in the People's Republic of China increased in speed following the initiation of the reform and opening policy. By the end of 2012, the mainland of the People's Republic of China had a total urban population of 712 million or 52.6% of the total population, rising from 26% in 1990.

Urbanization in China - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Exactly what I said. Even if they have moved from rural hinterland to the cities, they are still peasants. As I said, many Chinese, and not just in the PRC, think and act like peasants even though they may be four or five generations out of the paddy fields. Chinese culture is a peasant culture.

All Chinese are products of that culture. The overwhelming majority of Chinese are a pre-Industrial Revolution people, with some notable exceptions. Singaporeans, for example, overcame their peasant origins and developed into a modern society. But they are an exception and they had the good luck to be under British rule for 145 years, with the Brits showing them a better way to develop.

 

[CCP]

Taiwanese are not Han Chinese majority.

This will indicate what the Taiwanese are
The True History of Taiwan

By Dr. Sim Kiantek
The True History of Taiwan

As far as China being 92% Han is another bogus myth spun by the overactive spinmeisters amongst the Han, ancient and new.

Han people were classified as 'inner people' (nei ren) and 'outer people' (non Han) whom they called 'barbarians' (wei ren).

After capturing the areas which were Non Han, they roadrolled the people captured to accept Han culture and identity through the process called Sinicisation.

The 'barbarians' who accepted Han culture and became Han erasing their original identity and culture were called by the Han as shufan (cooked barbarians) and those who did not willing become Han as shengfan (raw barbarians)

'Barbarians' were given generic names in the Chinese classics and history: The Yi barbarians to the East, the Man to the South, the Rong to the West and Di to the North.

Until 1930, the names of the outgroups (wai ren were commonly written in characters with an animal radical:
1. the Di, the tribe to the North were linked to the Dog.
2. the Man and the Min were characterised with Reptiles.
3. the Qiang was written with a Sheep radical.
Link

Imagine the humiliation they were subjected to till they accepted being 'cooked barbarians' and eventual Han!

It is time we realised the huge faking that the Mainland China and the Chinese historians have faked on the world that Chinese people are 92% Han. This figure is a fudged mirage perpetuated because of the cultural and social genocide that signatures the idea that China consist of Han people.

Well, how can " Chinese historians have faked on the world" if people identified themselves as Han ? Both mainland China ,Taiwan( and Singapore )?

 

[CCP]

Exactly what I said. Even if they have moved from rural hinterland to the cities, they are still peasants. As I said, many Chinese, and not just in the PRC, think and act like peasants even though they may be four or five generations out of the paddy fields. Chinese culture is a peasant culture.

You are out of your mind..

PS , Are you a peasant by your own definition?

 

[Ray]

Ok, you tell me.

Take a glimpse of the above posts of mine.

Just the trailer.

You must do your own homework too.

 

[Ray]

Well, how can " Chinese historians have faked on the world" if people identified themselves as Han ? Both mainland China ,Taiwan and Singapore ?

When one is bamboozled into accepting that they are Han and when the State does everything to wipe out their roots, what options do the people who are Sinicised have but call themselves as Han?

 

[CCP]

When one is bamboozled into accepting that they are Han and when the State does everything to wipe out their roots, what options do the people who are Sinicised have but call themselves as Han?

CCP did that in Taiwan and Singapore too?

 

[Redhawk]

You are out of your mind..

PS , Are you a peasant by your definition?

Peasants still retain their attitudes and practices even if their work location changes. Peasants are peasants. Chinese culture is clearly a peasant culture. And no, I'm not at all a peasant. No, I'm an Anglo-Saxon from a post-Industrial Revolution society, a developed, first-world country, and a modern culture.

 

[Ray]

@CCP

In 1950s, China incorporated Tibet into its territory and since then, it has began a major reform of all aspects of Tibetan life - social, religious, political and economic. The Tibetans had organised an armed resistance but it could not challenge the Chinese army. As a result of this, thousands of Tibetans fled from Tibet and seek asylum in nearby countries like India, Nepal and Bhutan where they have created refugee or exile communities. But other forms of resistance had been continued and is still continued by Tibetans in Tibet and in exile.

In 1951, the Chinese Government had pressurised the Tibetan Government to sign the "Agreement of the Central People's Government and the Local Government of Tibet on Measures for the Peaceful Liberation of Tibet". Amongst the 17 points of the "Agreement" were clauses authorizing the entry of Chinese forces into Tibet and empowering the Chinese Government to control Tibet's external affairs. It guaranteed that China would not alter the existing political system in Tibet and not interfere with the cultural and religious beliefs and would grand regional autonomy to Tibet. After the formal acceptance by the Tibetan Government, soon, the whole of Tibet was virtually under the PLA's sway and from this position China refused to reopen negotiations and Tibetans and the Dalai Lama had effectively lost the ability to either accept or reject any Tibet-China "Agreement".

Gradually, even the autonomy offered to the Tibetans to preserve their traditional belief and lifestyle in the agreement was flouted. Their traditional political system, economy and religious beliefs have been suppressed.

Chinese rule has forced the traditional living as nomads to lead a sedentary commune life and forbidden from roaming with their herds in search of seasonal pastures. One of the important ways to undermine and suppress the Tibetans has been the large influx of Chinese migrants in Tibet. The migrants are offered higher salaries than their counterparts in China. They have taken almost all the jobs of the artisans, market stalls, restaurants and repair units. This has led to food shortages and unemployment among the Tibetans. The police also favors the Chinese. It expels the illegal Tibetans immigrants from the hinterlands to the city but pays no attention to the illegal Chinese migrants.

Similarly, the religious and cultural life of Tibetans has suffered. There is a dominance of Chinese language in the education system. As for religion, Tibet's social and religious systems are considered to be "alien to China's atheistic taste". The Chinese had vandalized monasteries, nunneries, temples, and other cultural institutes. All articles of value and precious stones were looted and sold. Religious texts were burnt and mixed with field manure. The sacred mani stones were used for making toilets and pavements. Monks and nuns were forced to copulate in public and taunted to perform "miracles". Ruined monasteries and temples were turned into pigsties; starving monks and nuns in Chinese prisons were told to "get food from the Buddha"(DIIR 2001: 37-8). It is also to be noted that even when Chinese have been forced to restrict their control over Tibetans through violence, the strategy to undermine and degrade cultural beliefs have been continued. It is, infact, intensified.

The PLA or the People's Liberation Army has also committed atrocities on the civilians. They are accused of torture, rape and killing of the civilians. The document by the Department of Information and International Relations(DIIR) of Central Tibetan Administration states,

An internal Chinese military document states that from 1952 to 1958, the PLA crushed 996 rebellions and killed over 10,000 Tibetans in the northeastern region of Kanlho. Golog, another Amdo area, saw its population halved from an estimated 140,000 in 1956 to about 70,000 in 1964. Referring to this area, the late Panchen Lama told Beijing's leaders: "If there was a film made on all the atrocities perpetrated in Qinghai Province, it would shock the viewers. In Golog area, many people were killed and their dead bodies rolled down the hill into a big ditch. The soldiers told the family members and relatives of the dead people that they should celebrate since the rebels had been wiped out. They were even forced to dance on the dead bodies. Soon after, they were also massacred with machine guns.

All forms of protests and resistance movements have faced similar consequences. By the end of 1994, the authorities had adopted a new series of measures to eliminate the roots of protest movements. These were the "anti-Dalai" or the "anti-splittist" campaigns. The Third Forum of Tibet had advocated this "struggle" was not a " a matter of religious belief, nor a matter of the question of autonomy, it is a matter of securing the unity of our country and opposing splittism...No one should be careless about it. This is a life-and-death struggle".

Thus, new security measures were adopted to tighten control over the tibetans. People were forced to provide information about colleagues and neighbours on the fear of losing housing, employment, education, a place in the monastery, etc. Telephone hotlines were set up. During religious festivals, special security cameras were installed on pilgrim routes and at key sites. In 1995, the authorities had introduced a new strategy for the suspects wherein they would be detained for short periods, for two days every week. They would be tortured with sophisticated torture techniques that would leave no visible marks. These would include exposure to extreme temperatures or making detainees stand in icy water in winter or sit in crippling positions for long periods. From the year 2000, the suspects would also be taken to PSB (Police Security Bureau) guesthouses where they were interrogated and tortured, often for four to 24 weeks. This technique was used typically against people suspected of communicating information on the situation inside Tibet to the outside world. When the victims were released, they were warned against telling anyone about their detention.

The report of DIIR submitted to the United Nations committee against torture in 2000 had also stated that since 1996, there has been an increasing rise in the death of tibetan prisoners due to torture in jails. Torture in prisons include hard labor, the forced extraction of blood, inadequate and unhygienic food and water, psychological torture to humiliate and degrade them on the basis of their religious beliefs. The report mentioned that some people were forced to carry human feces on the thanka (a sacred religious painting). There have also been reports of nuns being raped.

In Tibet, militarisation has meant a deterioration of their traditional political, economic and cultural life. The militarisation attempts to eliminate the Tibetan identity. The military forces also commits inhuman atrocities on the civilians. This is because militarism or militarisation is, as Walter Benjamin argued, the compulsory, universal use of violence as a means to the ends of the state. Violence has been used to preserve the state. In both the regions, the militarisation is embarked on "protecting" the interests of imagined communities called nations, even though they violate human rights. It is, as if, a situation of citizen rights v/s human rights.

It is another tragic reality of the world. The modern nation-states were crafted by dividing territories. Since their formation, there has been a persistent struggle for controlling as well as extending territory. In order to survive, they also instilled strong and blinding emotions of patriotism. And in all this struggle for "territory", they forgot the inhabitants of the territory. China claims Tibet, not Tibetans.

References:

Anderson, Benedict 1983 Imagined Communities. London Verso.

Benjamin, Walter. 1968. Critique of Violence. In Reflections. New York: Schoken Books.

DIIR. 2001. Tibet under Communist China. Publication Information missing.

DIIR. 2000. Torture in Tibet. http://www.tibetjustice.org/reports/un/torture.pdf (Last accessed on 24th May 2013).

Harris, Nigel. 1993. "Tibet and Empire", Economic and Political Weekly, Vol. 28, No. 39: 2069-2070.

McGranahan, Carole. 2005. "Truth, Fear, and Lies: Exile Politics and Arrested Histories of the Tibetan Resistance", Cultural Anthropology, Vol. 20, No. 4: 570-600.
The Sinicization Of Tibet By Devika Mittal

An example of Sinisization that is historical and even been done today.

Soon, they will get 'assimilated' and will call themselves as 'Han'/

 

[CCP]

Not at all. Chinese culture is a peasant culture. No, I'm an Anglo-Saxon and is from a post-Industrial Revolution society and a modern culture.

"peasant culture".... you are innovative.:cool2:

 

[Redhawk]

"peasant culture".... you are innovative.:cool2:

It is a peasant culture. Honest and educated Chinese say this themselves. And they are right. It is not just my opinion, it is also said by many ethnic Chinese that live in Western countries and who have relatives in the PRC and the ROC on Taiwan, whom they visit. This is one thing the PRC and ROC have in common: they are both peasant cultures and peasant societies, though the PRC is much the worse in this respect than the ROC as the ROC has been a more open and Western-oriented society and didn't have to go through the stultifying turmoil of such monumental and grotesque events as the Great Leap Forward, and its ensuing famine, or the Cultural Revolution.

I know one Australian girl of Chinese descent who went to Canton to visit her grandparents and said that going into Canton was like going into hell and she couldn't wait to leave. She hated being in China. She swore she would never go back.

 

[Ray]

CCP did that in Taiwan and Singapore too?

Taiwan and Singapore are a part of China or were a part of China?

What are you talking about?

This will indicate when the Han came and why.
The True History of Taiwan
The True History of Taiwan

and Singapore?

Do grow up. Don't expect me to encourage your fantasies and drivel.

I would not try to convince even an illiterate that Moon gives light and does not reflect light.

Chinese coolies
http://eresources.nlb.gov.sg/infopedia/articles/SIP_87_2004-12-15.html

 

[bose]

Well, PRC went to wars with both US and Soviet not far ago.

PS. Did your defence minister friend tell you that?

We Indians have also seen the Chinese bluff in 1971 ... unable to come to its own friend's rescue ... what a shame...

 

[CCP]

Taiwan and Singapore are a part of China or were a part of China?

What are you talking about?

This will indicate when the Han came and why.
The True History of Taiwan
The True History of Taiwan

and Singapore?

Do grow up. Don't expect me to encourage your fantasies and drivel.

Taiwan and Singapore is not under control of PRC , but they do recognize they are Hans.

 

[CCP]

We Indians have also seen the Chinese bluff in 1971 ... unable to come to its own friend's rescue ... what a shame...

There are no permanent friends or enemies, but permanent interests in international relations.

 

[CCP]

It is a peasant culture. Honest and educated Chinese say this themselves. And they are right. It is not just my opinion, it is also said by many ethnic Chinese that live in Western countries and who have relatives in the PRC and the ROC on Taiwan, whom they visit. This one thing the PRC and ROC have in common: they are both peasant cultures and peasant societies.

I know one Australian girl of Chinese descent who went to Canton to visit her grandparents and said that going into Canton was like going into hell and she couldn't wait to leave. She hated being in China. She swore she would never go back.

Ok, what do you mean peasant cultures and peasant societies?