With TMC exit, Chidambaram to increase AC rail fares by 3%

[Ray]

Touch wood, highways that i travel on are beauties..

I am aware of those highways since I too travelled those.

Thank Khanduri - the Army General!

 

[Bangalorean]

This is the classic discussion about LPG vs. pre-LPG, no matter what one calls it. Anyway, I'm off to bed now - but ponder upon the fact that we have had enough of the same old "we need to monitor", "we need to do things better, we can do it" stuff. Enough waiting, the system does not work. The experiences of the last 20 years should have taught Indians this by now, I am surprised that some people still advocate more of the same old... Very sad indeed.

 

[Yusuf]

I am aware of those highways since I too travelled those.

Thank Khanduri - the Army General!

Let the generals take over Lutyens Delhi.

 

[Ray]

sir you are mixing up increase in fares with taxes and corruption.

No.

As a citizen I can understand a rise of fares.

But when it does not mean improvement in service because of corruption, inefficiency or total disdain for the public at large, is when I feel my taxes are being cast before swines!

 

[Ray]

Let the generals take over Lutyens Delhi.

This is India and NOT Pakistan.

The psyche is totally different!

 

[Yusuf]

No.

As a citizen I can understand a rise of fares.

But when it does not mean improvement in service because of corruption, inefficiency or total disdain for the public at large, is when I feel my taxes are being cast before swines!

Sir, keeping it just confined to the railways, the services are not good because there is not enough money. There are accidents because there is no money to spend on advanced signalling system. Reason, the railways always runs on losses. Laloo lied big time about the massive profits that he showed while he was the Railway min. But there were also some things that he did right as the Rail min.

 

[Ray]

This is the classic discussion about LPG vs. pre-LPG, no matter what one calls it. Anyway, I'm off to bed now - but ponder upon the fact that we have had enough of the same old "we need to monitor", "we need to do things better, we can do it" stuff. Enough waiting, the system does not work. The experiences of the last 20 years should have taught Indians this by now, I am surprised that some people still advocate more of the same old... Very sad indeed.

You must be in the Rs one lakh bracket.

Sleep tight, you will not have to worry for the next few years.

They will not be able to bring you to the situation where you have to worry!

No one advocates a stupor. All they want is their money's worth.

Give it and no one complains.

But treat the tax payer as a mere cash cow, then one does complain, except those who live in the lap of luxury even after paying their taxes!

 

[Ray]

Sir, keeping it just confined to the railways, the services are not good because there is not enough money. There are accidents because there is no money to spend on advanced signalling system. Reason, the railways always runs on losses. Laloo lied big time about the massive profits that he showed while he was the Railway min. But there were also some things that he did right as the Rail min.

I totally agree with you.

The Railways is in the pits.

Too much of populism.

Let the Govt give out a White Paper. Place the facts on the table to include the plans.

Then raise the fares to what would make the Railways viable.

Give the service expected for the raise.

Arbitrary small hikes is irritating and one feels that it is all an eyewash.

Raise the fares. Do it over years, Give the reason to the people.

No one will complain.

Take the fares of the Duronto. It is way higher. Who complains?

The bathrooms are clean and the food is palatable.

The service is good.

 

[sob]

Everybody is missing the point. The Finance minister has introduced Service Tax in the Railways, this had been opposed by many.

This is not a fare hike by the IR. This is a cess being mopped by the Finance Ministry to meet the Fiscal Targets. Not a single penny of this will go to the IR, I repeat not a single penny will go to IR.

 

[Ray]

Everybody is missing the point. The Finance minister has introduced Service Tax in the Railways, this had been opposed by many.

This is not a fare hike by the IR. This is a cess being mopped by the Finance Ministry to meet the Fiscal Targets. Not a single penny of this will go to the IR, I repeat not a single penny will go to IR.

Tell that too the Govt adovcates Bangalorean and Yusuf, who I have tried to inform without being able to be as candid and clear as you.

 

[Ray]

This is not a fare hike by the IR. This is a cess being mopped by the Finance Ministry to meet the Fiscal Targets. Not a single penny of this will go to the IR, I repeat not a single penny will go to IR.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

train charges should be increased, not only AC class but all.Indian railways can no longer afford the charity. Even mamata's rail minister said this.


if it's just service charges then later fare should also be increased.


I travel from Bangalore to kerala

by ordinary bus but it takes nearly 300 rupees to reach kerala.

but by train local class it's just 140 rupees.


same difference of charges exists between air bus and reserved train tickets in other classes.

 

[Ray]

train charges should be increased, not only AC class but all.Indian railways can no longer afford the charity. Even mamata's rail minister said this.

NO contest.

But it should be cess that is of no use to the railway users but to salvage the Govt over other harebrained populist scheme riddled like sieves to pocket the linings of the politicians and their surrogates!

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

NO contest.

But it should be cess that is of no use to the railway users but to salvage the Govt over other harebrained populist scheme riddled like sieves to pocket the linings of the politicians and their surrogates!

what purpose does it serve if this money is only used for popularity freebees ? I mean govt is making a large number of people angry with this charge hike.

corruption is a different issue it is there, and ill will be there in different degrees. But for that we can't say no to reasonable decisions.

 

[Ray]

But for that we can't say no to reasonable decisions.

No contest. I agree with you.

But you are missing the point.

The cess on railway fares is NOT going to be used to improve the Railways.

It is going to be used for populist schemes including the subsidies which you are advocating against.

That is the issue.

Chidambaram is a Baniya.

He is merely like a cheap grocer who is selling you grain but adding stones to make up the weight that you want.

You think it is for the Railways, but it is for other issues where he is badly required to balance the books!

 

[Ray]

Cess

Alternative term for a tax. The term is still frequently used in a few countries including Britain, Ireland, to indicate a local tax, Scotland, to indicate a land tax, and India, applied as a suffix to a indicate a category of tax such as 'property-cess'.

While a precise definition of cess is somewhat elusive, Jas Bains says that ''in modern terms, cess is used to describe a tax on a tax. This meaning has been derived from Irish farmers, as those who have the most successful yield pay the most tax on their crop to the Government (cess for assess)''. In the Indian context, however, the Supreme Court, in a ruling in Shinde Brothers versus Commissioner, Raichur reported in 1967, said that ''the word cess means a tax and is generally used when the levy is for some special administrative expense'' citing various examples suggesting the name of the cess explains the object.

The cess on petrol and diesel which finances the
National Highway Development Programme as well as rural roads is understandable and is directly earmarked for its end use. In fact, its proceeds go to a corpus which enables market borrowing based on securitisation of the anticipated revenue stream. Similarly, the education cess recently imposed is designed to augment resources for enabling us to meet the necessary but somewhat daunting targets for human resource development. While the cess for NHAI and education are recent and their use understandable, there are multiple small cesses being collected through a number of legislations which we have all forgotten.

Here is a list of small cesses being collected by a multitude of laws in 2003-04:

"¢ Cess on bidis: The Bidis Workers' Welfare Act, 1976; Amount collected: Rs. 94.05 crores.

"¢ Cess on iron ore: Iron Ore Mines, Manganese Ore Mines and Chrome; the Mines Labour Welfare Cess Act, 1976; Amount collected: Rs 7.72 crores.

"¢ Cess on limestone and dolomite: The Limestone and Mines Labour Welfare Fund Act, 1972; Amount collected: Rs 16.49 crores.

"¢ Cess on feature films: The Cine Workers Welfare Cess Act, 1981; Amount collected: Rs 90,36,000.

Objective: The above four welfare funds are to be administered by the Ministry of Labour to provide housing, medical care, educational and recreational facilities to workers employed in bidi industry, certain non-coal mines and cine workers.

"¢ Cess on coal and coke: Coal Mines (Conservation and Development) Act, 1974. Objective: Provision for conservation and safety measures in the coal mines and the development of road and rail transport infrastructure in the coal-mine areas. Amount Collected: Rs 230 crores.

"¢ Cess on Copra: Copra Cess Act, 1979. Objective: An Act to provide the imposition of cess on Copra for the development of the coconut industry and for matters connected therewith. Amount collected: Rs 9,000.

"¢ Cess on coffee: Coffee Act, 1942. Objective: Coffee board implements various plan schemes for development of coffee under which various types of financial/ technical assistance is provided to coffee growers. Amount collected: Rs 50,000.

"¢ Cess on oil and oil seeds: Produce Cess Act, 1966. Amount collected: Rs 46,87,000.

"¢ Cess on vegetable oil: Ministry of Agriculture (Department of Agriculture) Notification No. G.S.R. 882 (E), dated 8-12-1983. Amount collected: Rs 17,80,000.

"¢ Cess on jute: Jute Manufactures Cess Act, 1983. Objective: For the purpose of carrying out measures for the development of jute manufactures and for matters connected therewith. Amount collected: Rs 40.37 crores.

"¢ Cess on rubber: Rubber Act, 1947. Objective: To give the minimum price to the rubber growers for stabilising rubber price. Amount collected: Rs 84.16 crores.

"¢ Cess on salt: Salt Cess Act, 1953. Objective: For the purpose of raising funds to meet the expenses incurred on the salt organisation maintained by government and on the measures taken by government in connection with the manufacture, supply and distribution of salt. Amount collected: Rs 2.77 crores.

"¢ Cess on sugar: Sugar Cess Act, 1982. Objective: The imposition of a cess on sugar for the development of sugar industry and the matters connected therewith. Amount collected: Rs 341.57 crores.

"¢ Cess on tea: Tea Act, 1953. Objective: Cess levied on tea goes to Tea Board. Amount collected: Rs 26.86 crores.

"¢ Cess on cotton: Produce Cess Act, 1966. Objective: The proceeds of the cess are utilised to meet the expenditure incurred in connection with measures to promote the improvement, development and marketing of produce under the Act, which includes cotton. Amount collected: Rs 4,22,000.

"¢ Cess on textiles: Objective: To promote development of textiles, woollen fabrics, artsilk fabrics and manmade fabric. Amount collected: Rs 41.61 crores.

"¢ Handloom cess on rayon and artistic fabric: Textile Committee Act, 1963. Amount collected: Rs 3,000.

"¢ Handloom cess on woolen fabrics: Amount collected: Rs 22,000.

"¢ Handloom cess on cotton fabrics: Amount collected: Rs 9,12,99,000

"¢ Handloom cess on Manmade fabrics: Amount collected: Rs 54,000

"¢ Cess on tobacco: Tobacco Cess Act, 1975. Objective: Cess collected under this Act goes to Tobacco Board. Amount collected: Rs 13,94,000.

"¢ Cess on paper: Industries (Development and Regulation) Act, 1951. Amount collected: Rs 18.39 crores.

"¢ Cess on straw board: Amount collected: Rs 13,87,000. Objective: To promote straw board industry.

"¢ Cess on automobiles: Objective: To promote the automobile sector. Amount collected: Rs 77.19 crores

"¢ Cess on matches: Amount collected: Rs 37,000.

"¢ Cess on other commodities: Amount collected: Rs 2,77,000.

The above 26 cesses administered under 27 Acts yields a princely sum of Rs 993 crores. In fact, the cess on copra yields Rs 9,000 while handloom cess on rayon and artsilk fabric yields Rs 3,000. The cost in keeping records, both of their realisation and their expenditure, would in many cases exceed the amount collected from the cess. Clearly, their continuation and the enabling legislations have ceased to be relevant. Their repeal will clear up the books with little revenue consequence. The Finance Ministry should coordinate with administrative ministries for getting them repealed in the Budget session. Continuing with the cesspool of cesses whose collection and use we have forgotten does not contribute to public good.

Meaning of cess? - Yahoo! Answers India

You would not believe it, but in West Bengal we still pay a cess for recovering the cost for the Howrah Bridge which was constructed in the British times!

It is time to wake up and smell the coffee and not be like good old rustics and be happy!

Like the citizens are being told that there is nothing like a Free Lunch by the Govt, it is time to tell the Govt that there is also not a Free Lunch that the people pay in the form of various taxes and cess!

Never forget that even if you are in the highest income group, you have earned it with your sweat.

However, if you have not earned it with your sweat and toil, then sit back and just enjoy.

 

[aeroblogger]

Everybody is missing the point. The Finance minister has introduced Service Tax in the Railways, this had been opposed by many.

This is not a fare hike by the IR. This is a cess being mopped by the Finance Ministry to meet the Fiscal Targets. Not a single penny of this will go to the IR, I repeat not a single penny will go to IR.

I will admit, I did not realize this until after I read your post. I thought that this was, as the title suggested, an "increase [of] AC rail fares," not an additional tax. I suspect the same about Yusuf and Bangalorean.

 

[Phenom]

The fiscal deficit is ballooning, there is even talk of further ratings downgrade so the govt is desperately trying to fix the mess that they themselves created during the past 5 + years. These are difficult but necessary measures that are needed to bring the country back on track.

 

[pmaitra]

Everybody is missing the point. The Finance minister has introduced Service Tax in the Railways, this had been opposed by many.

This is not a fare hike by the IR. This is a cess being mopped by the Finance Ministry to meet the Fiscal Targets. Not a single penny of this will go to the IR, I repeat not a single penny will go to IR.

This is not a fare hike by the IR. This is a cess being mopped by the Finance Ministry to meet the Fiscal Targets. Not a single penny of this will go to the IR, I repeat not a single penny will go to IR.

I believe that.

Therefore, we need to increase the rail fares by at least 25%. If one were to match bus fares for same distance, the hike should be by 50%.

 

[sob]

It was for the first time in the history of any organisation that the Unions rose in a single voice to demand that the Railways increase the passenger fares across all the segments. Previous Railway Ministers, had refused to raise the fares for the fear of facing the backlash of the aam aadmi, leaving IR without the resources to even operate independently.

Today IR is dependent on the grant from the Finance Ministry to run on day to day business as more than 90% of their revenue goes towards meeting their fixed costs, leaving no money for safety and track expansion.

A small hike is the need of the hour, but the money raised, should go 100% for improving the safety and the basic amenities of the passengers. If people see the results of the fare hikes then the vast majority will have no problem in shelling out the extra money.