Why India and China not happy with each other and how could we settle it?

[kickok1975]

China's reason:
India occupy our territory
India host Dalai exiled government to sabotage China
India works for US to contain China's rise
India's reason:
China occupy our territory
China support our enemy Pakistan to against India
China circle us to contain India's rise
Settlement options

War?: Can't afford and not worth it
Neogotiation?: Deadlock and hard to make concession
What else?

 

[Dovah]

Stop slandering each other over the internet could be a start, seriously, Chinese-Indian animosity does not even come close to Pakistan-Indian one.
The world is is enough for both the countries in a few years everyone would come to their senses.

P.S: No one here hates Chinese "people"( ignore the words exchanged in the heat of the moment, including mine), its the People's Government we are wary of.

India occupy our territory

China occupy our territory

This issue can be solved through talks since there aren't "religious" complexities involved.

India host Dalai exiled government to sabotage China

No anti-China activity is allowed inside India. Hosting refugees is our moral obligation towards the Tibetan people, we did the same with Bangladeshis.

China support our enemy Pakistan

Not "support" but use it as a mercenary, come on, comparing Dalai Lama and Pakistan is a bit biased in my opinion. And its not like India is arming Tibetans, is it?

India works for US to contain China's rise

Nope, in fact both India and China work together against US on international forums, India would never allow US access into the IOR, we may seek their help to build our capability but allowing their forces to be stationed there would be suicidal for us.

China circle us to contain India's rise

Well, what else would you call building ports in all Indian neighboring countries?


But all the points the US and Pakistan ones can be addressed and solved peacefully, for the other two we might have to ignore these things, you know allow the foreign policies to be independent and let's see where it leads us.

Oh...and you forgot to add China damming the Brahmaputra.

 

[hit&run]

Does China care about Tibetans in Exile. Is there any Chinese on this earth who knows how many Tibetans have left the Tibet till today, what is their population not only who are living in India but all over this globe? Is China ready to accept them back if they all want to come back. IF no, then please spare India with your false accusations. Its a non Issue.

 

[huaxia rox]

although i think clearly that india is the foe of china coz india occupied parts of chinas territory namely zangnan and has kept supporting tibetan seperasts and terrorists to cause unstable situations in tibet i cant fully blame all this on indians.

i think as a chinese or even asian i should 1st blame the britishes....the colonizers from the west that created a seria of problems in current asia.....why?

if the brits hadnt come to india and china there wouldnt have been a boderline called McMahon Line....can anyone think deeply.....how fucked up it is for asians to fight a war due to a boder named after a former colonizer who came from a nation that killed millions of asians and stole probably billions of what asians used to have? what a shameful war in asian history!

if brits hadnt come to india and china there would have been no so called indian privileges over tibet which may be the most laughable theory i can ever come across....there would have been no so called tibet as a buffer zoom btw india and china theory as well which is equally insane and uncalled for.

so i can only say indians were brainwashed by brits to some extent and cannot see how distorted and unreasonable the britishes had done to both india and china.

even india doesnt like PRC taking back tibet indians have no rites to interfere.......is there any UN solution?? any nation accepts tibet an independent nation throughout the world? no.........then why india so special? this is like PRC has no rights to interfere events btw india and pakistan over kashmir......so no matter if we like....if indians can take all the kashmir....be my guest.....i dont even care if indians take the whole world as long as chinese lands untouched.

and i dont think 'India works for US to contain China's rise' is a big issue....every country has its own goal.....its not like an invasion or something that others should have to denounce.......there r lots of nations working with the US but anyway china should focus on its own things....if a nation can rise depends on its own people especially when this nation is big enough..... no other 1 can stop the rise besides the nation itself.

 

[huaxia rox]

i fogot to mention....gov in exile in india made a range of military actions on china with maybe all failed....this is why chinese have problems too.....if indians just allow some gov in exile i still can accept.....but military actions.......of coz not...

nepal was also involved since 1960s.......but the mighty US was way too mighty so i can at least understand nepal was under huge pressure....just like i would never blame Isral for not able to finish some military deals with china coz the US stopped them.....and now nepal at least acts very strong against some wrong doings of tibetans in it.

 

[huaxia rox]

Does China care about Tibetans in Exile. Is there any Chinese on this earth who knows how many Tibetans have left the Tibet till today, what is their population not only who are living in India but all over this globe? Is China ready to accept them back if they all want to come back. IF no, then please spare India with your false accusations. Its a non Issue.

1 i dont know the numbers.....maybe no chinese actually cares to know....or maybe RAW can tell us??

2 if they wanna come back they r welcomed. i m sorry some of them were treated unfairly as a result of the govs mistakes like the culture revolution etc but they should accept the fact that tibet is a part of china...nothing can change this.......if they want a separet tibet then stay in india for the dream........

 

[sayareakd]

how about us giving Tibet govt some missile and nukes to defend itself. China has given the same to pakistan.

 

[Godless-Kafir]

although i think clearly that india is the foe of china coz india occupied parts of chinas territory namely zangnan and has kept supporting tibetan seperasts and terrorists to cause unstable situations in tibet i cant fully blame all this on indians.

India is a foe? When you can be friends with Britian who invaded and took parts of your country why is it hard towards India which never invaded you?

i think as a chinese or even asian i should 1st blame the britishes....the colonizers from the west that created a seria of problems in current asia.....why?

We dont blame anyone, leave us alone.

if the brits hadnt come to india and china there wouldnt have been a boderline called McMahon Line....can anyone think deeply.....how fucked up it is for asians to fight a war due to a boder named after a former colonizer who came from a nation that killed millions of asians and stole probably billions of what asians used to have? what a shameful war in asian history!

Our claim of Arunachal is as good as your claim of Tibet. So lets leave it at that? Other wise i will stir up the Tibet issue as well and you wont like to face the facts either.

if brits hadnt come to india and china there would have been no so called indian privileges over tibet which may be the most laughable theory i can ever come across....there would have been no so called tibet as a buffer zoom btw india and china theory as well which is equally insane and uncalled for.

If it is laughable how come the Tibetans don't agree they are part of China till today? Even India ruled Afghanistan once, does this mean we should own Afghanistan now? or Roam ruled Europe so everyone are Italian there? Its what the people think they are and they think they are TIBETANS, however CCP never considers what the people think so why care right?

so i can only say indians were brainwashed by brits to some extent and cannot see how distorted and unreasonable the britishes had done to both india and china.

It cant be the British who brain washed us because is not here any more, but we all know how China controls it media. Why dont you have free press and then tell me who is brain washed?

even india doesnt like PRC taking back tibet indians have no rites to interfere.......is there any UN solution?? any nation accepts tibet an independent nation throughout the world? no.........then why india so special? this is like PRC has no rights to interfere events btw india and pakistan over kashmir......so no matter if we like....if indians can take all the kashmir....be my guest.....i dont even care if indians take the whole world as long as chinese lands untouched.

India is the first country that recognized tibet, however we like Buddhist so we allow Dali Lama to live here, we dont support him with military aid to set up a terrorist organization to fight you. Like Pakistan does in Kashmir and XinJiang or China did to some militant in India.

and i dont think 'India works for US to contain China's rise' is a big issue....every country has its own goal.....its not like an invasion or something that others should have to denounce.......there r lots of nations working with the US but anyway china should focus on its own things....if a nation can rise depends on its own people especially when this nation is big enough..... no other 1 can stop the rise besides the nation itself.

India is not against the Chinese people, all of us in this forum want China to become wealth and powerful, So asia can be powerful once again. Inside even the most ardent and angry sounding Indian members here wants to see China do well, secretly all of us want China be successful. We dont see or neither can we make ourselves feel angry towards China because there is no History of Chinese people hating us or invading us(not CCP). So cultural there is no hate handed over generation over generation.

A very long time ago we where close friends and good neighbors culturally, spiritually and economically, However i guess the Communist government saw the closeness in culture, philosophy like Buddhism or other ideologies etc., as a threat during the cultural revolution and wanted to destroy it and along with it destroy the relation with India. So we dont like the Communist government at all, i like the Chinese people and i wish one days things will get back to normal from this madness.

 

[huaxia rox]

how about us giving Tibet govt some missile and nukes to defend itself. China has given the same to pakistan.

then we would give the same to people in assam nagaland and evry1 of ur 7 sister state the same...plus khalistan and kashimir or naxal insurgency maybe??? to defend themselves.......

 

[Godless-Kafir]

how about us giving Tibet govt some missile and nukes to defend itself. China has given the same to pakistan.

Lets not further this into more bashing, lets see where this goes if we hold our egos back. Lets give it a chance Saya.

 

[Godless-Kafir]

then we would give the same to people in assam nagaland and evry1 of ur 7 sister state the same...plus khalistan and kashimir or naxal insurgency maybe??? to defend themselves.......

Naxals are called MAOISTS, anyway i will hold that part. Lets not get into blame.

 

[Godless-Kafir]

i fogot to mention....gov in exile in india made a range of military actions on china with maybe all failed....this is why chinese have problems too.....if indians just allow some gov in exile i still can accept.....but military actions.......of coz not...

nepal was also involved since 1960s.......but the mighty US was way too mighty so i can at least understand nepal was under huge pressure....just like i would never blame Isral for not able to finish some military deals with china coz the US stopped them.....and now nepal at least acts very strong against some wrong doings of tibetans in it.

Military actions aided by India? Do you have any source to this, so that i can educate myself to?

 

[huaxia rox]

Godless-Kafir

i will put something more maybe tomorrow or a bit after regarding what u said coz i ve run out my time here.....but what i wanna make clear right now is if 'china india enemy' depends on different views.......maybe many indians and chinese dont think so

i think if 2 nations have major territory disputes and negotiations r just alway s symbolic then they have to be foes. how ever like in cold war the US and the soviet union can cooperated well in some ways......i think india and china can do much more than that especially in the era of globalization........and if the boder dispute etc can really be solved....we should be friends.

 

[civfanatic]

Oh dear, this thread has become a troll thread after just one post

Anyway, it's my turn now:
1) Tibet was never ruled directly by any Chinese government in history. This is a fact whether you like it or not. The closest it ever came to being under Chinese control was in the 18th century when it was a vassal under the Qing. If you know what a 'vassal' is, you would know that Chinese claims over Tibet are shaky at best.

2) The Qing themselves were foreigners, not Han Chinese. Some guy on this thread said that India's control over Arunachal is the result of being ruled by a foreign power (British Raj). You're absolutely correct. But your claims on Tibet are also the result of being ruled by a foreign power, so your point is null.

3) Concerning Arunachal itself, this area was not directly ruled by the Tibetan lamas. Rather, the Monpa people living in the north of the state paid tribute to Lhasa in exchange for their autonomy (there is still some animosity today among the Monpa towards Tibet for this exploitative relationship). In other words, the northern part of Arunachal Pradesh was a vassal of Tibet, and Chinese claims on Arunachal are based on it being a vassal of your vassal

 

[kickok1975]

My suggestion (may sound too good to be true but is achievable):
India and China declare that they will restrain from what they control right now without further aggression
India and China declare they will remain neutral should a conflict break between either country with a 3rd country
India and China declare they will withdraw missiles aiming at each other
India and China declare they will establish senior level military, political, culture exchange structure, set up 24hr hot line between Chinese leader and Indian leader
India and China declare they will seek more common grounds, teaming together in UN, developing country and world economic stages
India and China declare they will assist each other should a natural disaster, financial crisis happen
India and China declare to send more students, citizens to each other's country for study.

 

[Godless-Kafir]

Godless-Kafir

i will put something more maybe tomorrow or a bit after regarding what u said coz i ve run out my time here.....but what i wanna make clear right now is if 'china india enemy' depends on different views.......maybe many indians and chinese dont think so

i think if 2 nations have major territory disputes and negotiations r just alway s symbolic then they have to be foes. how ever like in cold war the US and the soviet union can cooperated well in some ways......i think india and china can do much more than that especially in the era of globalization........and if the boder dispute etc can really be solved....we should be friends.

There are disputes every where and in all walks of our life. Even among family like between brothers or parents we have major disputes, so do we say that they are not our family or try to kill them? No, if every time a kid fights his brother for toys it does not mean he should hate him or kill him, right? We try to compromise or give and take a few things and thats how we live in everyday life. Why is this any different when it comes to nations? The world is a limited place so all of us share the same air, water and land, we cant fight over those because no one really owns that. No one owns the air or the waters, offcourse if you see Discovery channel you see animals piss on tress to marks on land and think it belongs to them, we humans do the same on maps but generally everything belongs to all life in this planet. Offcourse that is not an diplomatic answer but that is the truth.

I will leave it to you to decide.

 

[Godless-Kafir]

Oh dear, this thread has become a troll thread after just one post

Anyway, it's my turn now:
1) Tibet was never ruled directly by any Chinese government in history. This is a fact whether you like it or not. The closest it ever came to being under Chinese control was in the 18th century when it was a vassal under the Qing. If you know what a 'vassal' is, you would know that Chinese claims over Tibet are shaky at best.

2) The Qing themselves were foreigners, not Han Chinese. Some guy on this thread said that India's control over Arunachal is the result of being ruled by a foreign power (British Raj). You're absolutely correct. But your claims on Tibet are also the result of being ruled by a foreign power, so your point is null.

3) Concerning Arunachal itself, this area was not directly ruled by the Tibetan lamas. Rather, the Monpa people living in the north of the state paid tribute to Lhasa in exchange for their autonomy (there is still some animosity today among the Monpa towards Tibet for this exploitative relationship). In other words, the northern part of Arunachal Pradesh was a vassal of Tibet, and Chinese claims on Arunachal are based on it being a vassal of your vassal

Civ, read my earlier post. Lets not accuse and fight each other, lets give it a decent try to put things behind us. Please delete the post or make it less confrontational and diplomatic.

 

[civfanatic]

Civ, read my earlier post. Lets not accuse and fight each other, lets give it a decent try to put things behind us. Please delete the post or make it less confrontational and diplomatic.

No, I will not delete the post. I didn't state my opinion, I stated facts. If some people can't handle facts that is their problem, I will not malign or revise history for their sake.

Ever since I joined this forum I have been a vocal supporter of closer Sino-Indian cooperation. I am willing to put history behind us. I am more than willing to recognize PRC's control over Tibet, and I am even willing to give up India's claim over Aksai Chin. How many self-proclaimed Indian nationalists would go that far? I would, for the sake of greater Sino-Indian friendship.

But one thing I absolutely will not tolerate is historical revisionism.

 

[kickok1975]

In addition:
India and China should embrace Russia, Brazil and other major developing countries to set up an organization to speak louder for their interest. Right now the world is still controlled by a few ailing developed countries:
IMF is controlled by Europeans
World bank is controlled by Americans
Military is controlled by NATO
G7 is a joke but still wants to dictate world economy (China, India, Brazil's economy are already larger than some, if not all G7 countries)

 

[Tshering22]

China's reason:
India occupy our territory
India host Dalai exiled government to sabotage China
India works for US to contain China's rise
India's reason:
China occupy our territory
China support our enemy Pakistan to against India
China circle us to contain India's rise
Settlement options

War?: Can't afford and not worth it
Neogotiation?: Deadlock and hard to make concession
What else?

We declare this border as our official border with you, Stop supporting Pakistanis and supplying them weapons that are harming only us and not any anti-Pakistani terrorists.

That will clear all the doubts.