Why feminism is toxic and bad for our society

Discussion in 'Politics & Society' started by Mad Indian, Mar 10, 2015.

  1. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    This is a video by a MGTOW(Men going their own way), .ie men not bothered about the societal roles thrust on them like being a husband or a father and just says FU to marriage and child births
    @pmaitra and @Razor

    I was watching the internet for the breakdown of western family values, divorce rates and men not marrying etc . I came across MGTOW , MRAs and anti feminists. Is the Western society as degraded as these videos suggest they are?
    @Bangalorean This is what unrestricted feminism will take our society to(.ie the point where western society has taken them to). Do you really want us to go there?

    Do we want to rig our legal system so badly in favor of women in the name of women's empowerment such that we also become a society where men are just tired of getting caught in the society and go their own way? Do we want our daughter or grand daughters to not find someone they want to settle down and raise kids , because boys of their time are not going to be bothered by such entanglements because the system is so rigged against them?

    I dont know if this discussion will even be given due merit in India considering how brainwashed people here are regarding "women empowerment" and thats why I am hesitant of making a new thread on it. I honestly dont know how many of DFIans actually think about these issues . They take things like Patriarchy at their face value and believe it completely. Women empowerment without the accompanying women "responsibilities" will be disastrous for the society. Eight decades of feminism has degraded the family values in western society beyond repairs(I am not talking about drugs, sex or morality nonsense, I am talking about the breakdown of marriage and the rising no. of people who dont want kids and such)?

    I dont know, if we are not going to reverse or check feminism in India, it will become the same rot as the west.
     
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  3. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    @Mad Indian, I think this calls for a thread of its own.
     
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  4. Razor

    Razor CIDs from Tamilnadu Senior Member

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    @Mad Indian :

    I have 4 Nepali friends, same age group as us early-mid twenties, they are ALL married, two of them have kids :shocked:
    So Nepali women don't seem to care about feminism and neither are nepali men too worried I guess.

    Is feminism something that inevitably comes to "developing nations"/ "developed nations"
    Or is it something that is actively thrust upon some nations.

    I think it is the latter.

    For example, (okay not an extensive example but still): You will China, Japan, korea are more developed than India, and Russia is a bit more developed than China, but one will see these feminist clamours mostly from russia, India.
    Note: These are observations and not air-tight.
     
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  5. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    I dint think it will generate enough discussion, but if you think so, move it.
     
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  6. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    I dont think it comes with development. I think it comes with natural female tendency to crave for power and control. I am not sure if China is free of such feminism. If China opens up, then there too you will see feminist movements
     
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  7. Razor

    Razor CIDs from Tamilnadu Senior Member

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    Yes, that was my line of thinking too for both statements.
    And If china opens up, it will also see more feminst movements.

    Also

    I agree with the above.

    It makes sense. Note that not all "hindus" gave property rights to males.
    For eg: Nairs women had property rights. And therefore (among other reasons), there was NO dowry.

    Some people mistake nair system as matriarchy, but it not exactly matriarchy.
    Nairs: Women empowerment and freedom to women among Nairs in Kerala
     
  8. ezsasa

    ezsasa Senior Member Senior Member

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    As far as i know, True Gender equality happened only in one civilisation. That is the kingdom of sparta.

    Makes sense because of the practical reasons, Given that their mortality rate of men is high, they would have needed the other gender to maintain the occupancy levels of jobs.

    But fact that they did not last for more than 900 years, makes me believe that there is a fundamental problem with concept of Gender equality in the truest sense.
     
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  9. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    Yeah, dowry was only a natural part of son=inheritance then daughter=dowry arrangement. If there was no discrepency in son/daughter inheritance, then there should logically no dowry

    Also, If you look at the video, the MGTOW is arguing that the only way to keep the traditional society is to enforce misogyny like the sharia . But if you want to give freedom to women, then you must assign all the duties assigned to men to them as well. For ex., you want women's right to work , then you should assign the same responibility a man has to the family , .ie supporting the family on divorce and not force the husband into paying the alimony. If you want women to behave and not engage in domestic abuse of their Husbands, then you should punish them for abusing their husbands, as severely as you punish the husbands if they abuse their wives, etc




    @pmaitra The title is misleading. The discussion I want to have is why feminism is toxic and bad for our society. MRA in a sense is not even in movement of any support in India, because we are yet to see the full brunt of the feminism. Nagaland lynching is just one example of this issue
     
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  10. Razor

    Razor CIDs from Tamilnadu Senior Member

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    If I'm not mistaken Spartans had a holiday when they were obliged to kill their slaves (keeping numbers in check.)

    Now as for their women, they were baby making factories, helped to increase number of healthy babies, it was essential because of the way their society was arranged.

    And "fundamental problem with concept of Gender Equality" as you say: You are trying to make equal, things that are different, things that have been designed for different purposes.
     
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  11. Razor

    Razor CIDs from Tamilnadu Senior Member

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    Okay, let me go through the video, that will have to be a while later. But I'll make a comment after.



    Yes, that is what I thought too.
    Men's Right Movement? There is such a thing?
     
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  12. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Exactly. So trying to achieve equality of outcome, no matter how much there is difference to person involved will be disasterous. If you rig the system so against men, like they have in the west, in the name of feminism, then men will just say ---- this and will start going their own way. The losers will be society as a whole

    Do you know that there is a theory that the Roman civilisation's decadence came from its own verison of the modern day feminism?

    Here, read about it if you have time : http://www.the-spearhead.com/2013/02/24/when-the-romans-tried-to-save-marriage/
     
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  13. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    Yes, there is Men's Right Movement, (MRM) . They even have members from India(people who are cheated by our justice system, which is rigged with female centric laws) .

    There is also radical Men Going Their Own Way movement, also abbreviated as MGTOWs. They are sick of playing into soceital expectations like marrying, working and paying off for women and children , he is not part of. It was the only obivious conclusion to the feminist movement and where it was headed.

    And I think MGTOWs is a serious issue. You see, men are "rational" beings and like any rational being, they respond to "rewards" and "incentives". Before, men used to work their ass off and were providing for their wives and children, because the society considered children to the the most important wealth in the world and wives were the means to it. At that time, both men and women had to put off their differences because the society was "children" centric. So there was incentive to work his ass off to provide for men and women because it gave him sex and it maintained his old age insurance in the form of kids.

    Then came the feminist movement and it shifted to attention of the "family" from children to wife and women. It then became more about women having freedom to do what they want and less about children. And now, their society has rotten to the part where children are just a liability. It used to be that in the olden days, your children would be the ones who would be providing you with care and support when you are old. Now it is the state which is giving old age pensions. SO there is no benefit in having a child for a man any more.

    So , when you rig a system like that in favor of whining and bitching women, men are naturally going to weigh the benefit of having a family with the problems of it and if they find that the benefits are not worth the risk then going to say that - ---- it, I am out of here.

    Seriously, read a MGTOW website home page on why they exist and you will get an insight on what caused such a huge mess there.

    And yes, you are right in that perceptions of Western superiority of things are just that -perceptions.
     
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  14. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    Topic changed as per the wishes of your highness, or should I say, your madness? :)
     
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  15. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    Lamentations of a very successful, and attractive female lawyer, who is growing old, alone: Do Guys Actually Reject Girls Because They're Intimidated by Them?

    And a nice comment:
     
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  16. Mad Indian

    Mad Indian Proud Bigot Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Re: Chit Chat thread

    Thanks man. The reason title is important is because I want this site and discussion to show up if ever some Indian wants to know the dangers of allowing feminism without debate or scrutiny on its effects.
     
  17. ezsasa

    ezsasa Senior Member Senior Member

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    Latest entrant into this experiment is the Kurd group "YPG". we will have to wait and see how successful their experimentation will be. We will have to wait to see till the war propaganda dies down and reality sets in. I will give End of war + 5 years for reality to set in. Considering the region they are located in i think they might become like turkey or at best Israel in terms of women's rights. Beyond that would truly be a miracle.
     
  18. Otm Shank2

    Otm Shank2 Regular Member

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    y can't see the video but from the post

    Feminism and women's rights are very different things. I'm all for women's rights legally and civicly but they don't deserve preferential treatment in family court and divorce laws as they get now. It is highly discouraging to get married in the west or even live together cause of common law. I can't think of a single person my age that aspires to get married. most have planned their life to avoid it.

    That being said the wests birthrate has gone down because its so developed . there's so many options for you to pursue in life like education and work that few people make parenthood or marriage a priority in life.Even if you have no ambition in life there's a million different ways more interesting than the hard worrying work of raising a family. from permissive attitudes to drinking, drugs, sex, clubbing, partying to superficial consumerism of cars, clothes, buying lifestyles you see in media to mindless entertainment like pleasure cruises and casinos and hollywood. it's thelack of moral grounding and expanding of the latter group thats making the west weak.

    If going you're own way alone was a problem then people like Modi, past great sages and the RSS would not have so greatly contributed to our people's well being. It's lack of moral grounding that pull communities and people down..


    also the point that women take exception to traditional roles is understandable. Traditional female roles were and are subjugated to males and they had no control of their lives. They had to be wives and mothers and preform tasks like cleaning and cooking that are lowest and least appreciated in society. men got to be fathers and spouses but also got to pursue education and careers that gave them fufillment.
     
  19. jus

    jus Senior Member Senior Member

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    lol there is nothing Feminism or Patriarchy.There is only need&necessary

    Stage1.
    Where humans are monkeys any1 fu**s any 1

    Stage 2
    Society or cult formation subsequently marriage&family.Cult/grp is MALE dominated 'coz men are athletic/aggressor.

    Stage3 India/3rd world in this stage
    Then comes the govt or state(L&O Police) where weaker sex protected from bad ones.So there is no need for Protection or Male (from another male).

    Stage4 West/1st world problem
    Marriage is not necessary ,kids are boring.Govt takes care kids&security (pension etc)

    Stage 5
    Then men/women are free birds directly goes to stage 1
    every men/women fu**s any1 :lol:.


    But here the problem is Men can happy in grp (men r social&dogs).So the ratio is grp Men 10+ : 1 Women.Wt abt 90 drama queens,God save them from each other Amen :lol:.
     
  20. MANT!

    MANT! Regular Member

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    Interesting,
    In the United States child support/ custody has always favored the female due to the fact (until the last 30 years or so) that females had much less capability to support a household and the male would often ignore his children in favor of work..hence the female-centric family laws..however, this no longer being true, these laws are slowly being changed for a more equal footing.

    There's a holdover to dowries in American society..the bride's family pays for the wedding, the groom's for the rings/honeymoon. but that's usually as far as it goes, though the more wealthy American parents will pay for the newlyweds 1st home. (I wasn't that lucky).

    As to feminism, I don't see increased choices for women as a bad thing (at least in the West) our declined birthrate has almost forced companies to hire women, but as long as male roles are not subjugated to the female (that they are considered equally).

    It's even worse in Japan, where they are feverishly working on automation to maintain the traditional Japanese society (and failing ,with companies asking for more and more female employees).




    My wife is an immigrant here, she maintains her own business (which she started in order to survive here) and I help her when I'm done at my job for the day or on weekends..She would never give up her independence for simply staying at home, watching TV and eating bon-bons (housework is easy here with all the machines available), We keep the house clean together, she cooks, does the laundry, I do the dishes and I maintain the cars (they are only a few years old and paid for)..We work together as a partnership and this allows us to afford a good retirement and international travel. But this works for us..I don't presume that this works for everyone.

    But in India, it may be a bit early with larger birthrates than the US and a larger population to work with. (I really don't know, these are only guesses so forgive my ignorance) About 100 years ago the US had a large birthrate as well, with traditional family roles rigidly enforced by society..it only started it's decline after the Great Depression, when the middle class grew exponentially.
     
  21. ezsasa

    ezsasa Senior Member Senior Member

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    Funny thought:

    Going by the udwin episode it is abundantly clear that feminists do allow their cause to be hijacked for other nefarious purposes, makes me doubt the seriousness of the cause.

    Couple of decades down the line we might even find out that the whole hungama was planned by some guys club to keep the womenfolk busy thinking they have a shot at gender equality, while utilising their nagging ability to get some other things done.
     
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