Western economies in deep freeze, expats look at India for jobs

[Iamanidiot]

for 12000 you will get matchboxes for rent in delhi.A westerner must get atleast 5000-6000$ to live a decent life in the metro's.for me rs32

 

[Iamanidiot]

a dinner at bukhara will shave off 10-15000 bucks for a dinner of two

 

[Galaxy]

for 12000 you will get matchboxes for rent in delhi.A westerner must get atleast 5000-6000$ to live a decent life in the metro's.for me rs32

5-6K $ is quite high. Around 2.5-3 Lakh and 30-35 Lakh P.A. (60-72 K $)

I think 25k $ P.A. is fair enough to live decent life in Delhi.

There is no upside limit, but 25k is okay for decent life in Delhi. In Mumbai, may be 30k-35k $.

 

[The Messiah]

5-6K $ is quite high. Around 2.5-3 Lakh and 30-35 Lakh P.A. (60-72 K $)

I think 25k $ P.A. is fair enough to live decent life in Delhi.

There is no upside limit, but 25k is okay for decent life in Delhi. In Mumbai, may be 30k-35k $.

Delhi is cheaper to live than mumbai but there is more money in delhi.

leela hotel has pizza priced at 9000

 

[Galaxy]

Delhi is cheaper to live than mumbai but there is more money in delhi.

leela hotel has pizza priced at 9000

Agree with Bold part.

There is difference between decent normal life and luxurious stuff. One can never be happy with whatever money you have.

If someone wants to visit Hotel Taj, Leela regularly, Then even 5-6k $ would be less/monthly.

But 25k/P.A. is fair enough for decent life. [Don't ask me what is decent life] 8)

 

[The Messiah]

Agree with Bold part.

There is difference between decent normal life and luxurious stuff. One can never be happy with whatever money you have.

If someone wants to visit Hotel Taj, Leela regularly, Then even 5-6k $ would be less/monthly.

But 25k/P.A. is fair enough for decent life. [Don't ask me what is decent life] 8)

Me and friend had a full lunch in east of kailash for Rs 80. daal, kadahi paneer, butter naan, pepsi, ras malai.

Ive also shelled out 8000 in zest emporio mall. you get both extremes in delhi.

You eat non-veg ?

 

[Armand2REP]

I wasn't even talking about renting an apartment - I was talking about buying one. Something unimanigable for a young professional in most Western nations.

A Yuppie in most Western nations makes several times more than $1500 a month and they can afford a mortgage and a car note.

And since you're talking of rent, let us look at the math here. A 27 year old youngster who earns $1500 in India after tax deductions - that is the chap we are talking about. So you say $300 for a decent apartment. Actually you'll get quite a good one for $300, so let's accept that. What else do you have? Food and drink will not cost more than $300, even if you really splurge like crazy. Fuel, entertainment, and the rest will cost you around $300 more - and this is the real extreme maximum. No one spends 30000 rupees per month, month after month, on food, entertainment, fuel and "miscellaneous expenses".

$300 for an apartment, $300 for food, $300 on a car note, $285 for income tax... you still haven't covered utilities, internet, satellite TV, phone, insurance, any debts that need to be paid... this guy is already broke.

 

[Yusuf]

A Yuppie in most Western nations makes several times more than $1500 a month and they can afford a mortgage and a car note.



$300 for an apartment, $300 for food, $300 on a car note, $285 for income tax... you still haven't covered utilities, internet, satellite TV, phone, insurance, any debts that need to be paid... this guy is already broke.

Internet 2Mbps (that's standard speed don't ask more) cost less than $20 a month. DTH with all channels $10 a month, india has the cheapest call rate for mobile in the world @1ps per sec that is a very small fraction of a cent. Insurance is cheap as well. Medical insurance about $30 a year for a $3000 dollar cover. Life insurance again cheap starting about $200 a year if not less. All this is the lower limit.
I tell you, a single person can really survive well with $1500 a month. In India, families of 4 survive easy on that money, off course minus a lot of luxury that a single person can afford.

 

[thakur_ritesh]

What kind of apartment, what neighbourhood, what kind of car, what kind of diet, what kind of insurance... there are some levels of low cleanliness and quality Westerners will not settle for. It costs $300 a month for a decent apartment in Dehli, probably more in Bangalore.

apartment - you can buy a good house for around 100,000usd.
RoI - 15% return yoy (or more in metros). depending on the location, some give you huge returns, indian property market is not going anywhere, assured return, best is if you can buy a property, buy it rather than on rent.
locality - rest assured one of the very good localities, but out skirts of the city.
there are new housing societies coming up spread over small areas.
new townships with infrastructure and amenities parallel to any city out there (no exaggeration). these can spread over 1,000-10,000acres. these townships will give you a feel of not being in india (since most have a stereo-typical image of india), just the way the corporate office wont give you a feel of being in india.
car - cars are expensive, higher category you go, higher the taxes. its the same with anything categorised as luxury item.
there are some levels of low cleanliness and quality Westerners will not settle for - if you are in a locality as defined above you wont have to bother about cleanliness.
It costs $300 a month for a decent apartment in Dehli, probably more in Bangalore - dont rent a property, buy one if you can. one of the best investments in india with very good returns.

 

[Known_Unknown]

A new graduate out of university generally makes around $5000-$5500 a month in Canada. Now if I was in such a situation and unable to find work, if I move to India temporarily, I might be able to get a good salary and live comfortably, but I won't be able to save much in $ terms.

I'll save far more even if I was working abroad in customer service, sales or even as a computer repair guy. In addition, if I lose my job, the government will send me employment insurance checks every month for almost a year until I find a new one. Even the EI checks will be 2.5 to 3 times the amount I could make in India working full time.

The only reason I'd want to move temporarily to India would be the fact that Indian companies will generally give preference to graduates with foreign degrees and experience due to their communication, presentation and negotiation skills. So if I was unable to get an entry into the US branch of an MNC, I'd try for the Indian branch, and it would be easier to get in.

 

[Known_Unknown]

I wonder which "yuppie" new grads in India make $1500 or Rs 70,000 per month. My friends in Infosys/Wipro etc all started @ Rs 18,000 and some of the lucky ones after a year or two of experience were getting Rs 30,000.

 

[Bangalorean]

I wonder which "yuppie" new grads in India make $1500 or Rs 70,000 per month. My friends in Infosys/Wipro etc all started @ Rs 18,000 and some of the lucky ones after a year or two of experience were getting Rs 30,000.

The talk was about a person with 6+ years of experience, not a "new grad". And one more piece of information: Infosys and Wipro are pieces of shit in terms of salary. Talk about Accenture, IBM, Oracle, iFlex, and dozens of other lesser known (but awesome) consulting/implementation companies.

Anyway, this discussion is so stupid. I have been enough in Europe to know certain basic stuff. In Europe, a 27-30 year old just cannot hope to own an apartment of his own.

Of course, living in Europe has advantages. It is cleaner, less polluted, less noisy, better roads, things get done easier, limited corruption, etc. But if you talk at an individual level, an Indian young professional can have more conveniences and acquire more assets than his counterpart in Europe.

 

[sandeepdg]

I wonder which "yuppie" new grads in India make $1500 or Rs 70,000 per month. My friends in Infosys/Wipro etc all started @ Rs 18,000 and some of the lucky ones after a year or two of experience were getting Rs 30,000.

As Bangalorean said, they are both shitty in terms of salaries. Do you think that a company that hires 5000 or so people every year, can pay US$ 1000 as salary to each one of them ?? Do the math, please. And yes, all of them are engineers, not for other departments like admin etc.

My friends from my engineering college in North India, got a package of 3.6 lakhs in Cognizant, Birlasoft, Satyam etc. among others, 5 years back. So please, don't compare the economy on individual salaries, since there are wide variations in every category.

 

[sandeepdg]

for 12000 you will get matchboxes for rent in delhi.A westerner must get atleast 5000-6000$ to live a decent life in the metro's.for me rs32

That depends on where you live ! My friends stay in Karol Bagh in a 1 BHK accommodation and pay a rent of Rs. 8000. Only the southern, central and some areas in West Delhi are very expensive for accommodation.

But in Mumbai, you will definitely get a matchbox for rent in Rs. 12k !

 

[Known_Unknown]

The talk was about a person with 6+ years of experience, not a "new grad". And one more piece of information: Infosys and Wipro are pieces of shit in terms of salary. Talk about Accenture, IBM, Oracle, iFlex, and dozens of other lesser known (but awesome) consulting/implementation companies.

Anyway, this discussion is so stupid. I have been enough in Europe to know certain basic stuff. In Europe, a 27-30 year old just cannot hope to own an apartment of his own.

Of course, living in Europe has advantages. It is cleaner, less polluted, less noisy, better roads, things get done easier, limited corruption, etc. But if you talk at an individual level, an Indian young professional can have more conveniences and acquire more assets than his counterpart in Europe.

I can't speak for Europe, but in North America, a 27 year old can easily own an apartment, townhouse or even a bungalow. Bank loans are relatively easy to get, and interest rates on mortgage are currently around 3-4%. Cars are also much cheaper than in India.

If you're comparing the salary of an Indian engineer with 6+ years of experience, then a comparable salary level in North America would be $80k-$90k p.a. If a foreign citizen comes to India to work, he'll never save enough money to be of any use to him when he returns back home. That's the reason why foreign expats won't work in India. Of course, some of them may have other reasons, as being closer to their families or wanting to "experience" India (for the goras) etc.

 

[JayATL]

I'd come back in heartbeat. Just that the cultural shock holds me back. Once you get used to discipline of daily life in the US. The ability to be corruption free (we don't have bribe to get a phone line, cops, city permits) and then of course there is the traffic. I'm telling you it's difficult to slip back into the " chalte hai bhai" attitude in India after you have been integrated into the US lifestyle. yeah-I'd love too and really have given a long hard thought-- but man-- to go from a disciplined, quiet surrounding to Bombay estyle..

 

[The Messiah]

I'd come back in heartbeat. Just that the cultural shock holds me back. Once you get used to discipline of daily life in the US. The ability to be corruption free (we don't have bribe to get a phone line, cops, city permits) and then of course there is the traffic. I'm telling you it's difficult to slip back into the " chalte hai bhai" attitude in India after you have been integrated into the US lifestyle. yeah-I'd love too and really have given a long hard thought-- but man-- to go from a disciplined, quiet surrounding to Bombay estyle..

I thought you were a person who thinks for himself rather than being fed information ?

I didn't have to pay for a telephone line or my internet...infact they installed it within 1 day and activated it a day later. Yes there is corruption but not how it is portrayed like that every single person round the corner needs to be bribed.

 

[sandeepdg]

I thought you were a person who thinks for himself rather than being fed information ?

I didn't have to pay for a telephone line or my internet...infact they installed it within 1 day and activated it a day later. Yes there is corruption but not how it is portrayed like that every single person round the corner needs to be bribed.

As usual, some people are really great in blowing things out of proportion, mate !

 

[Bangalorean]

Most NRIs think of India as it was when they were growing up. Those days we didn't have any choice other than BSNL for telephones, and the lineman had to be "cultivated" with bribes etc. Today, we have enough choice in the form of Airtel, Tata, Reliance, etc. Moreover, even BSNL guys don't take bribe nowadays to come and install the phone.

Traffic cops need not be bribed if you don't want to. Just pay the fine for whatever offense you commit, if you are pulled over. No one will force you to pay a bribe to them.

Corruption will be encountered only if you are unfortunate enough to interact with government officials while building your house, setting up a business, real legal issues, and so on. Most yuppies in the middle class don't even have to interact with any babus, and lead a completely "corruption free" life.

 

[Iamanidiot]

Corruption the best and worst of it is tasted by businessmen