Vladimir Putin's visit to India - 2014

[Kharavela]

Must feel good for Vladimir to visit a country where he is treated with admiration after the terrible visit to G20. RT & co are thrilled to get some authentic footage of cheering crowds and hysteric Indian women all falling for Vladimir's charm.

How dare you to insult Indian women in this forum ? Apologize OR be prepared for the consequence. You should not forget the "Second Strike" capability of India.

cc @Ray; @Kunal Biswas; @ersakthivel; @sgarg;

 

[debasree]

We want to hear from Putin strong commitment for tot transfer of tot of new weapon systwms

 

[roma]

@roma, you denounce racism in Russians. I have seen racism everywhere I went in USA. In fact I found Canada better than USA on this count. And to shock you, racism and casteism is present in Indians too.

A large proportion of Russians have a favourable view of India. We need to further improve it. We need to inculcate good relations with people. We have to make an effort to improve our image in foreign lands.

Americans see India and China just as factory. They get very jealous when a cutting edge scientific development happens in India. Americans have developed an imperialistic view of the world which is unhealthy.

im not denying anything you have written above, except for not totally understanding your first sentence

Anyway immaterial - let me clarify my stand - what i am basically saying is that racism, is a perception

show them that the perception is wrong and they will change their view in a split second - that has
been my experience anyway

I do accept that other people have different experiences - so im not being dogmatic about it , merely
relating what ive seen

of course if youre talking about people who are not educated , then forget it - they wont change their opinions
and we'd do well to keep distance

 

[roma]

Your model does not work.

India has ALWAYS been sucking up to foreign powers in one form or another.

You need to talk to people who have been in IFS or other diplomatic positions. You are living in a dreamworld.

Russia has its unique problems. We cannot dictate to them how to solve these problems as we do not know the solution.

not taking sides here - just a simple observation that has already been made by others in including chicoms
on this forum ( no smoking ? -that india is not fawning dependence on others as it seemed to in the past )

INdia has not suckered up to Putin , in fact the media coverage is nowhere near front page - we have not hailed
putin as india's saviour as packland does with china - nevertheless 7 MOU's were signed - solid action , no fuss
that 's the way india should keep going and i think Namo has scored another substantial plus to his repertoire.

 

[dastan]

Anything on fgfa?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Free country this is ..

hysteric Indian women all falling for Vladimir's charm.

 

[roma]

I think I have not dehumanized Indians. I think it is the other way round, I am being constantly accused of "evil west", NATO, EU colonialistic etc. I am constantly blamed for being nazi symphatizer, US puppet, NATO vassal, Russo phobic, Finns are called drunks, women beating is common, Finland is called "insignificant", I am supposed to support Russian aggression of Ukraine, or I am called propagandist.
Now I give credit to Putin for being so popular in India and even that is bad?

i didnt follow the series of posts that led to your lamentation above

but i can think of one reason why some on this forum are labeling you
could it be that sometimes you make statements that hardly have any sense of reality or evidence eg
your post quoted below :-

Must feel good for Vladimir to visit a country where he is treated with admiration after the terrible visit to G20. RT & co are thrilled to get some authentic footage of cheering crowds and hysteric Indian women all falling for Vladimir's charm.

(ref @Kharavela )
now isnt that an exercise in pure imagination or what ? because there is not the least indication in reality
of any of what you had written - neither of the admiration, nor the so-called "feel good" nor footage nor hysteria
alluded to, which annoys some in what is still a conservative society - and rightly so

so how do you expect folks on this forum to view yourself or some of your posts ?

merely offering an explanation to your dlemma - not a party to the altercation(s).

 

[LETHALFORCE]

No new developments with pakfa ? Disappointing hoping for a breakthrough . But Putin is
Smart he will not give the whole pie only one slice at a time.

 

[Zebra]

No new developments with pakfa ? Disappointing hoping for a breakthrough . But Putin is
Smart he will not give the whole pie only one slice at a time.

Much better.

Obama ji is coming next and getting whole pumpkin....!

 

[sgarg]

Anything on fgfa?

There is nothing wrong with FGFA. India wants to increase its design share and industrial share in the project. The negotiations are on. It will be signed. It is a big project so things take time.

 

[sgarg]

Much better.

Obama ji is coming next and getting whole pumpkin....!

Obama comes with no offers in defence field. A big pointer for you - GE has not made any move to start a production facility for GE-414.

India is not a destination for military cooperation as far as USA is concerned. They may give you something if you are ready to transfer your military budget to USA. But then you will find you are the loser.

 

[Zebra]

Obama comes with no offers in defence field. A big pointer for you - GE has not made any move to start a production facility for GE-414.

India is not a destination for military cooperation as far as USA is concerned. They may give you something if you are ready to transfer your military budget to USA. But then you will find you are the loser.

Already getting many things from US.

Anyway, as per your logic UPA's decision was wrong, when they preferred P-8I, C-130, Chinook, Apache...!

 

[asianobserve]

Obama comes with no offers in defence field. A big pointer for you - GE has not made any move to start a production facility for GE-414.

India is not a destination for military cooperation as far as USA is concerned. They may give you something if you are ready to transfer your military budget to USA. But then you will find you are the loser.

South Korea is a US weapons buyer but I don;t think you can consider it a "loser." It is fast developing its own domestic weapons industry in cooperation with American companies. They have exported their F-50 LIFT to coutries like Iraq and the Philippines. They are exporting now small arms, military vehicles, naval vessels and is on track to build a new stealth fighter with Indonesia as a major partner/buyer. All these military projects are done with some form of cooperation with US companies.

 

[sgarg]

Already getting many things from US.

Anyway, as per your logic UPA's decision was wrong, when they preferred P-8I, C-130, Chinook, Apache...!

These are military buys, not cooperation. Such buys gives a temporary boost in military power BUT NO LONG TERM CAPABILITY.

Let me give you an example. If India suffers from a shortage of warplanes in a war, which ones will it pull out of storage?? The answer is Mig-21 and Mig-27? Why? Because India made these planes, even engines, and has absorbed the knowhow.

The P-8i and C-130 will go out of service the day USA stops spares supplies.

India's buys from USA are NON-strategic. India has to buy something from USA as trade is heavily in India's favour. There is not much that USA exports. The only viable option is military buys.

Your conclusion that American equipment buys is strategic is a faulty conclusion. USA does not consider India as part of its security structure.

I have said it many times on this discussion board - India's neighbours and Asian powers must be prime in India's security calculus.

 

[Zebra]

These are military buys, not cooperation. Such buys gives a temporary boost in military power BUT NO LONG TERM CAPABILITY.

Let me give you an example. If India suffers from a shortage of warplanes in a war, which ones will it pull out of storage?? The answer is Mig-21 and Mig-27? Why? Because India made these planes, even engines, and has absorbed the knowhow.

The P-8i and C-130 will go out of service the day USA stops spares supplies.

India's buys from USA are NON-strategic. India has to buy something from USA as trade is heavily in India's favour. There is not much that USA exports. The only viable option is military buys.

Your conclusion that American equipment buys is strategic is a faulty conclusion. USA does not consider India as part of its security structure.

I have said it many times on this discussion board - India's neighbours and Asian powers must be prime in India's security calculus.

For god sake give some better example than vintage Mig-21 and 27.

BTW, any news about FGFA, when we are getting and absorbing full know-how of FGFA.....!

 

[pmaitra]

Already getting many things from US.

Anyway, as per your logic UPA's decision was wrong, when they preferred P-8I, C-130, Chinook, Apache...!

"Getting," as in buying off the shelf, with strings attached?

Our deals with Russia are far better. We make Sukhoi-30s in India to a large percentage. Let me know, anytime in the next decade, when we begin to make that much of a US fighter jet in India.

UPA's decision was correct that is chose not to buy US made fighters and restricted itself to transporters.

Agreed, Apache is probably better than Mil-28N, but picking Chinook over Mil-26T2 was the stupidest decision made by UPA. The Chinook does not even meet the minimum weight carrying requirements. It is unfortunate that India's national interests are sacrificed to please the US.

South Korea is a US weapons buyer but I don;t think you can consider it a "loser." It is fast developing its own domestic weapons industry in cooperation with American companies. They have exported their F-50 LIFT to coutries like Iraq and the Philippines. They are exporting now small arms, military vehicles, naval vessels and is on track to build a new stealth fighter with Indonesia as a major partner/buyer. All these military projects are done with some form of cooperation with US companies.

South Korea poses no long term threat to the US. The US will never extend this type of cooperation with any country like PRC, India, Brazil, etc.. If India has to export, it has to build things on its own.

 

[asianobserve]

South Korea poses no long term threat to the US. The US will never extend this type of cooperation with any country like PRC, India, Brazil, etc.. If India has to export, it has to build things on its own.

Interesting. So you are saying that India is a long term threat to the US?

 

[Ray]

How dare you to insult Indian women in this forum ? Apologize OR be prepared for the consequence. You should not forget the "Second Strike" capability of India.

cc @Ray; @Kunal Biswas; @ersakthivel; @sgarg;

Don't get inflamed.

You must be patient with him. He comes from a country where the words they speak freezes. Therefore, they have so frozen that they cannot open their mouths in a smile.

Hence, if he finds people happy and smiling, he finds that to be 'hysterical'.

That is why his country loved the grim, sour faced, goose stepping German and Nazis.

So, don't take umbrage. Understand the psyche of the people and you will remain happy.

Must feel good for Vladimir to visit a country where he is treated with admiration after the terrible visit to G20. RT & co are thrilled to get some authentic footage of cheering crowds and hysteric Indian women all falling for Vladimir's charm.

Our tradition teaches us to honour and respect our guests.
athithi devo bhava ( 'The guest is equivalent to God' )

It is taken from a Sanskrit verse, taken from an ancient Hindu scripture which became part of the "code of conduct" for society.
Its from the Taittiriya Upanishad, Shikshavalli I.20 that says: matrudevo bhava, pitrudevo bhava, acharyadevo bhava, atithidevo bhava. It literally means "be one for whom the Mother is God, be one for whom the Father is God, be one for whom the Teacher is God, be one for whom the guest is God."


Maybe that is not your custom, but what can we do about your and your compatriots' surliness?

 

[Ray]

Interesting. So you are saying that India is a long term threat to the US?

The threat to the US is not India centric.

It is any country centric that can challenge the US and its sole supremacy in any form or the other.

 

[pmaitra]

Putin and India's Modi Will Hit it Off

• Say their aides.
• They're alike personally and politically.

Jason Burke (The Guardian) | Shaun Walker (The Guardian) [SOURCE]

This article originally appeared in The Guardian.

Vladimir Putin, the Russian president, who will arrive in Delhi on Tuesday night, has much in common with Narendra Modi, India's prime minister, according to aides and diplomats from the leaders' two countries.

The two men, both in their early sixties, have met twice – at the July Brics summit in Brazil and at the G20 in Australia last month, where Putin received a chilly reception from western nations angered by Moscow's intervention in Ukraine.

His welcome in a smoggy but unseasonably temperate Delhi for his first summit with Modi will be much warmer. Russia and India have long had a close relationship, even if the two Asian powers have grown distant in recent decades.

Officials hope the leaders of each power, one a former spy, the other a former organiser for a hardline rightwing organisation, will be able to develop a close personal bond that will bring the two states back together.

"They've had two short meetings but they went very well. They understand each other," said one Delhi-based Indian diplomat present on both occasions.​

Delhi tilted towards Moscow during the cold war as hostile neighbour Pakistan grew close to the US. The era has left deep traces.

In the Hindustan Times, a local newspaper, analyst Sushil Aaron described both states as "instinctively uncomfortable with the west's dominance of global institutions and its alleged propensity to use narratives of a rules-based international system to suit its interests".

If the Communist party of India is a shadow of its former self, the influence of decades of leftwing activism and centrally planned socialist economic policies remains deep.

One result is that although successive US administrations have sought to improve relations with India – President Obama has accepted an invitation to be chief guest at the nation's Republic Day parade in January – Moscow can still rely on goodwill in Delhi that Washington can only envy.

"Ask any child in India who is India's best friend internationally and they will tell you that it is Russia," said one Ministry of External Affairs (MEA) official, echoing a comment made by Modi this year.​

India has strongly opposed EU and US sanctions on Russia over events in Ukraine while Russia has historically backed India's position on the disputed Himalayan former kingdom of Kashmir.

But it's on the personal level that many believe the coming summit, an annual occasion, will work best.

"Modi and Putin get on very well together. Both ... are self-assured and charismatic leaders with a strong nationalist bent, who have a clear vision for their country and keep its best interests at heart," said Ajai Malhotra, who was Indian ambassador to Russia until last year.​

Less diplomatic commentators point out that support for both men is rooted in a populist promise to restore the former power and wealth of their respective nations.

Both have explicitly said they hope to force their immediate neighbours to respect their local dominance, while domestically both are suspicious of "liberals" and distrust the mainstream media.

Modi's attitude to the west is ambivalent, with reservations on the cultural front but enthusiasm for technology and governance; Putin's is increasingly hostile all round.

The geopolitical context also throws India and Russia together. Senior Russian officials have said they expect sanctions against the country to be in place for years or decades to come, and have reiterated that Moscow will look elsewhere for new allies.

"Our goal is to find as many equal partners as possible," Putin said during his annual state of the nation address last week.​

He said focus would be put on countries that did not mix economics and politics, with China and India the two most obvious targets.

Tatiana Shaumian of the India Studies Centre in Moscow noted defence cooperation, the diamond industry and energy as particular areas of focus for the summit. India, despite recent flagging growth, has a huge need for oil, gas and coal. Russia has done cut-price deals with China and Turkey on crucial energy resources in recent months. Moscow is also involved with India's civilian nuclear power programme, building reactors in the south.

Some analysts are less convinced about the extent of the warmth between the two leaders.

C Raja Mohan, a leading Delhi-based foreign policy analyst, said that, though there was a "lot of sentiment", there were some "big structural issues".

"Both men are nationalists and realists, strong leaders who want to do as much as they can. They need to salvage what they can from this relationship," he said.​

Sameer Patil, associate national security fellow at Gateway House thinktank in Mumbai, said trade between the two nations was particularly disappointing – about $10bn annually – and the defence relationship had been troubled by unreliability, defective spare parts and disagreements over the pricing of equipment.

Neither have signs that Russia is working to build a closer relationship with Pakistan pleased observers in Delhi, though analysts say there is a recognition that to expect Moscow to ignore Islamabad would be unrealistic.

At least on the cultural front, there are signs that the two countries have things in common. While huge quantities of ideological literature were once printed in the USSR and distributed almost free in India, different cultural exchanges have taken their place, the MEA official said.

"Now the [Russians] are into Bollywood and yoga, and we welcome them here in Goa."​