US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organization?

panduranghari

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Re: US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organizatio

Exercise Cobra Gold takes on a new look
By Saksith Saiyasombut | Posted: 13 February 2013 1648 hrs

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BANGKOK: Exercise Cobra Gold - the United States military's largest exercise in the region - is underway in Thailand.

Cobra Gold, the largest and oldest multilateral military exercise in the Asia-Pacific, began as a US-Thai bilateral exercise more than 30 years ago.

It has now expanded to include regional partners as well and joining in this year are Japan, South Korea, Indonesia, Malaysia and Singapore.

Thitinan Pongsudhirak, political scientist at Chulalongkorn University, said: "Cobra Gold now is not what it used to be. In the Cold War, it was an anti-communist front. After the Cold War in the first two decades or so, it was more a confidence building project designed to promote military cooperation and maintain stability.

"But in the last two, three years, it has taken on a new face. It has become an US vehicle for engaging the region in military terms but also to keep some checks on China's assertiveness."

Since 1982, Cobra Gold has been hosted by Thailand, a key US ally. Over the years, the region has lost the attention of the US because of the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.

But with the US pulling out of both countries, their recently announced and much-discussed pivot towards Asia could see an increased engagement in Southeast Asia in military terms.

The US shift in focus comes at a time of increased tensions in the Asia-Pacific.

Conflicting territorial claims in the South China Sea have become a potential flashpoint, involving China and several ASEAN member states.

And moves towards Democratic reforms in Myanmar could result in a "re-balancing" of American allies in the region.

Kavi Chongkittavorn, senior fellow at Institute of Strategic and International Studies Thailand, said: "Both the United States and Myanmar have readjusted their relations so smooth and so quickly. I would say this is at the expense of Thailand, because Thailand has not yet adjusted and fine-tuned its policy after the US pivot. Many countries have made quick adjustments except Thailand because of its domestic turmoil."

This year, for the first time, Myanmar is participating in Cobra Gold, with two officers invited as observers - an indication of the US' eagerness to engage with the newly open country.

Over the next few days, about 13,000 military personnel will conduct land, air and sea exercises.

They will also be involved in humanitarian projects and disaster response.

Given the current geopolitical and strategic outlook in the Asia-Pacific region, this year's Cobra Gold could be more anticipated than before.
 

roma

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Re: US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organizatio

This is pure fantasy never work on ground.
it might work if it is modified to usa india japan vietnam - keep it that small to avoid spoilers like australia .

and actually that is "small" enough for keeping dragon in check - easily !
 

roma

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Re: US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organizatio

A quick look at any alliance where USA is in charge shows deep failure - eg CENTO where packland was most disappointed with usa . USA didn't help Georgia , now with Ukraine, they did basically nothing and in Vietnam they didn't really help the south

USA is our real friend in education and we hit it big with them on that . Other than that area any interaction with uncle sam has to be strictly on contract basis otherwise they think you are working FOR them . US-aus-india plus any extras will only be for their good i.e usa's good .

We went through the aksai trauma all on our own ( although to be fair usa offered intell and equipment and our wonderful N refused it ), but after aksai we learned and have handled our defence all on our own albeit with purchase of foreign stuff. Lets keep it that way plus of course improve our defence manufacturing .
Any defence group we join , we should be at the helm ...i propose India-Japan-Vietnam ...if that is taken seriously it will more than offset any challenges from china . Any equipment we need and dont have can always be acquired one way or another . WE don't need USA to tell us to do their lower defence jobs for the . Bat the USA is first class in education - that area seems to work . Lets stick to what works and not be too clever and assume success in other areas too ?

addenda :- also compare Mongolia and East Turkestan which broke away from China's domination and was independent in 1939-1949 . Mongolia declared allegiance to soviet and changed their script to Russian Cyrillic . The Russians acknowledged those signs of allegiance and warned china not to push into Mongolia ( which was previously China's ) East Turkestan ( ET ) on the other hand initially allied with soviets and had protection but then became too smart and switched to friendship with usa . Stalin got fed up with them and abandoned protecting them . PRC China swallowed them up, USA did nothing .

The valus of India-Japan-Vietnam group is that Vietnam and japan can keep china occupied in the eastern and S eastern regions while India is freer in the western areas.
 
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EXPERT

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Re: US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organizatio

Well, I don't think this kind of alliance exist or ever could happen. Some points to put in light are
1. Japan and SK are like poles of magnet, they always repel each other.
2.india will always choose to be in limelight. It won't take the leadership part.
3. The navies of Singapore, thiland, Vietnam have very less capability.
4. US will always try to order because it will act supreme what India resist.

And so on.
 

roma

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Re: US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organizatio

Well, I don't think this kind of alliance exist or ever could happen. Some points to put in light are
1. Japan and SK are like poles of magnet, they always repel each other.
2.india will always choose to be in limelight. It won't take the leadership part.
3. The navies of Singapore, thiland, Vietnam have very less capability.
4. US will always try to order because it will act supreme what India resist.

And so on.
agree mostly with what you'd written which is why i would restrict it to india-japan-vietnam . Japan would have more than sufficient naval and other military power while Vietnam has serious army capabilities even if its navy is limited . Bringing others in can as you'd suggested have repercussions within the group plus i would say induce a "spectator effect" with each member expecting the other to do handle the task. Keeping it small and efficient avoids both these problems . Of course the other side is that each member would have to fulfill their obligations, otherwise the value of the group goes to naught ( as in the case of the now defunct CENTO ) .
 
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india twentyone

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Re: US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organizatio

Strengthening relations with Russia into an alliance is of paramount importance.
 

prohumanity

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Re: US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organizatio

I support INDIA-JAPAN-VIETNAM ...trade and defense pact to balance Chinese -Paki threat. But, keep Russia as our dear ,reliable, time tested friend at the same time. US,UK,Aus ...difficult to trust these guys..unpredictable, too self centered and opportunistic
when it comes to India security.
Of course, Indians can learn a lot from the greatest knowledge nation( USA) in field of Science and technology and Education etc. In that way, US can be India's great friend.
 
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Redhawk

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Re: US-Australia-India-Japan-SK: South Asia Pacific Treaty Organizatio

A treaty organisation between South and South-east Asian members, the U.S., Australia, and New Zealand would never work. Our alliance with the U.S. is as strong as ever and it has weathered all sorts of storms and turbulence. The ANZUS alliance is a definite keeper and a tremendous stayer: proven in and out of war. Military ties with India are more pro-forma and window-dressing than anything of substance. When SEATO was tried in the 1950s and into the 60s it was an abysmal failure. Asian treaty organisations involving non-Asian actors are simply not practicable. Bilateral alliances such as between South Korea and the U.S. are another matter. And just as Indians mistrust Australia's reliability we would have deep doubts as to India's reliability as an ally and the reliability of other Asian countries. We would never desert the U.S. alliance for any formal or informal alliance with the PRC (or for any major Asian power for that matter). To think so is simply incredible. The cultural differences are far too different for one thing. And the PRC is far too motivated by self-interest and self-centred to be a reliable ally to anyone let alone to an English-speaking democracy like Australia. If the PRC is prepared to abandon North Korea when it is no longer needed, what chance would Australia have as a PRC ally? A Sino-Australian alliance is pure fantasy and entirely impracticable. Trade is one thing, military alliances are an entirely different matter.
 
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Srinivas_K

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It is more about economies and military posturings to take care of economic and strategic interests.

Economically speaking China and Japan trade hundreds of billions, did Chinese stopped trade with Japan because of what they have to go through in WWII?

It is politics, to take care of India's economic and strategic interests in Asia India has to have military and strategic partnerships with other powers.
 

Nuvneet Kundu

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It is more about economies and military posturings to take care of economic and strategic interests.

Economically speaking China and Japan trade hundreds of billions, did Chinese stopped trade with Japan because of what they have to go through in WWII?

It is politics, to take care of India's economic and strategic interests in Asia India has to have military and strategic partnerships with other powers.
Right.

It is only US which actually WANTS there to be a conflict between these Asian giants so that they could reap the benefits. It hurts the US the most if all Asian nations bury or solve their problems amicably and come together as a single bloc. They are trying hard to promote conflict between these nations so that the US could maintain a dominating posture globally. Imagine the heartburn it will give to the Americans if all Asian economies decide to trash the US dollar and start using a common Asian currency.

As it is, Asia will constitute 2/3 of global trade by 2045 anyway. As long as this trade takes place with separate domestic currencies acknowledging the primacy of the USD as a benchmark, the US will be more than happy, but if the nations get together to build a common currency, the US will do everything it can to engineer a conflict.

WTF has US, Australia and S.Korea have to do in this alliance? they will always remain in the American bloc. We need a Russia, India, China, Iran bloc. The littoral states of ASEAN will follow suit.
 

rockey 71

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This is a WCC (Western Christian Civilization) program to contain, and thereafter, disintegrate China. India is needed to provide cannon fodder. However, India is a nation with diverse views / opinion. To bring India to totally support someone else's hegemonic war or to meddle in historical Sino-Nipponese tussle/hatred, will be difficult indeed.
 

Ankit Kumar

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Till we want our hands tied in case Pakistan sinks our corvette , we should not even think about it. (Hint :- North Korea did so for SK and the best SK was able to do was to double the number of propaganda speakers on border ).
 

roma

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agni -5 can take care of whole Aussie i think.India dont need any alliance.It is alone and it has to fight its battle alone as 26/11 perfidy of usa shown us.What india need is that true ICBM which can hit any corner of the earth from anywhere on earth.unless you threaten these so called western nations they take you for granted.
i have a big doubt on australia ,first of all they are not reliable ,second resist mentality,and 3rd they do not view india a alli
We are NOT usa with huge budget and equal reputation for proven leadership

we are a newly developing nation with , let's face it a poor image even today

Let's keep it small and successful and team with nations that take us seriously and with ourselves as the prime mover NOT the usa

India Vietnam Japan is the core ( Japan is beginning to respect india in certain specific areas ) add Mongolia as we have tracking bases already there and they are mighty wary of ccpchina
 

desicanuk

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Australia can get ripped to pieces for all i care!

We should have alliance with vietnam,indonesia,malaysia,japan etc but not australia.
Why?What have you got against Aussies.I know they used to have racist immigration system that
kept us brown skin people out ( including Pakis who dont like to be brown but whitearab).But that was
yesterday.My encounters with them indicate they pretty descent bunch.India is among the top ten source
of immigrants.
Yes we should be part of this alliance and not that idiotic Beijing inspired Shanghai Cooperation Shit!!!
 

desicanuk

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[QUOTE=" Our military with Russia's and Israel's material and arms support is more than enough to tackle regional threats. We don't need a bunch of racist losers to be a part of our "alliance". They can go and kiss the Dragon's feet all they want. They're the only two countries that have stood by us sincerely.[/QUOTE]
Russia , my foot.Are you still living in Breznev era.??Putin is not reliable or dependable.He has thrown in his lot with Beijing and Islamabad.In the meantime we are being screwed again again with overpriced obsolete Russian military hardware.Our future lies in an alliance with US,Japan,Israel among other countries.Australia
should be welcomed as well.Pragmatism should rule the day not some old wounds.Lastly do not underestimate PRC.They are well ahead of us in many fields.Judging from the current trends we are not keeping pace with PRC.I have doubts about our ability to taken on PRC in future without a strong multinational alliance.
 

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