Turkey's miltary exercise with China

Discussion in 'China' started by amoy, Oct 6, 2010.

  1. amoy

    amoy Senior Member Senior Member

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    U.S. Questions Turkey's miltary exercise with China

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    Nato source | Atlantic Council

    From Zaman: Turkish and Chinese militaries recently conducted a joint aerial exercise in central Anatolia, the first such exercise involving the air forces of NATO member Turkey and China.

    The joint exercise was part of Turkey’s Anatolian Eagle maneuvers, which have so far been carried out jointly with US, other NATO countries and Israel. They took place sometime this month in the central Anatolian province of Konya, where Anatolian Eagle maneuvers traditionally take place, Today’s Zaman has learned. Turkish F-16s and Chinese SU-27s and Russian-made MIG-29s took part in the joint exercise, staging a mock dogfight in central Anatolian airspace. The exercise comes ahead of a planned visit by Chinese Prime Minister Wen Jiabao to Turkey next month, which officials say will boost relations to a new level.

    From Hurriyet: The Turkish and Chinese air forces secretly participated in a military drill in Konya as part of the “Anatolian Eagle” war games, prompting a reaction from Washington, daily Taraf reported Thursday. ...

    The U.S. administration reportedly contacted the Turkish foreign and defense ministries and asked why the drill was conducted and what kind of maneuvers were practiced. (photo: Rupeenews)

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    Chinese Su-27s Fly Mock Combat in Turkey
    Posted by David A. Fulghum at 9/30/2010 10:29 AM CDT

    Chinese Su-27s Fly Mock Combat in Turkey


    An unexpected military cooperative exercise between China and Turkey has caught the eye of Washington-based analysts.

    The two air forces were involved in a joint air exercise in the central Anatolian province of Konya, the first such exercise involving the air forces of China (People’s Liberation Army Air Force – PLAAF) and NATO member Turkey.

    Part of the significance is that the PLAAF recently demonstrated major advances in long-range strike during their own “Peace Mission 2010.”

    The latest joint exercise, “Anatolian Eagle,” in the past has been conducted jointly with the U.S. Air Force, other NATO air forces and the Israeli Air Force.

    Ankara’s Zama newspaper reported that Turkish F-16s and Chinese Su-27s staged a mock dogfight. Chinese Prime Minister Wen Jiabao plans a visit to Turkey next month where several agreements on economic and cultural cooperation are expected to be signed. Chinese aircraft, including the JF-17 export fighter, stopped in Turkey to refuel on the way to last summer’s Farnborough air show.

    Turkey flies 200 F-16s, 150 RF/F-4s and 75 F-5s.

    Another sign that Turkey is changing its international stance is modification of its security policy to remove some of its neighboring countries from a list of those considered as national security threats and the exclusion of the IAF from its exercises.
     
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  3. Tshering22

    Tshering22 Sikkimese Saber Senior Member

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    I am kind of surprised why this thread hasn't attracted a lot of attention from members here. A Turkish exercise with Chine is something that should be raising a lot of eyebrows from Israel to Greece to NATO members and USA. If Turkey continues its aggressive independent stand destroying all its commitments and promises to NATO like this, I think they will be kicked out soon enough. It is good to assert individual identity but they're pushing beyond what NATO as a union can tolerate.

    If Su-27s have exchanged maneuvers with Turkish F-16s, then certainly its a high level secretive agreement. Also considering the bonhomie ties of Pakistan with both China and Turkey, I believe that Pakistanis might have had a part on bringing this from paper to reality. Remember in 2008, our ACM FH Major had offered a join air force exercise with PLAAF and the PLAAF generals refused to accept the terms and conditions and the plan was cancelled. Turkey and China have not been friends all this long considering Turkish soft corner for the Uyighur rebels. But this exercise changes all the current political scenario.
     
  4. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    Turkey does not seem to care about their NATO membership, there relations with Russia are good it does not serve the same purpose as it did during the cold war. Looks like Obama has a big problem.
     
  5. tony4562

    tony4562 Tihar Jail Banned

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    China there days has so much money and imports so much natural resources from around the world, this makes China a popular country everywhere except for the G7 and their rich friends. But there is precious little they can do about it. Western countries outside the US have long given up the idea of containing China, now it is 'Can't Beat Them, Join Them'.


    India too bad still has not realized this。 Instead of trying to make friends with China like everyone else does India is foolishly trying to provoke and antagonize China at every turn. Too bad, in the end western arms dealers win big and laugh all the way to the bank. 4.5 $Billion for 6 Scorpene, 5.8 $Billion for 10 C-17, 9 $Billion for 126 MRCA, ..., just keep'm coming!
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  6. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    USA has given up on the idea of containing China, what world are you living in?? India, Japan, Australia,Mongolia,S. Korea,Vietnam, Pakistan,Afghanistan CAS,Russia as well as naval bases in Guam, Samoa,Phillipines are all being setup to contian China
     
  7. tony4562

    tony4562 Tihar Jail Banned

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    Australia is earning big from exports to China, that's why they have not been hit hard by the economic downturn. Mongolia, haha, check map, mongolia's economy is almost entirely dependent on China now. Vietnam is busy exporting wifes to China and chinese investments are a life-line in Vietnam. Yes these countries are little bit apprehensive of China, but they are not acting antagonistically like India. With NATO increasing knocking on Russia's doorstep, Russia is siding with China on almost every issue, just last week these two countries have finalized a gas pipeline deal which India can only dream about. Even US, it's just a small bunch of China haters who are calling for containment of China, check which country did Obama visit first, china or india?
     
  8. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    All these nations have military pacts with USA against China, Japan is starting to militarize, which country Obama visited first what relevance does it have??
     
  9. tony4562

    tony4562 Tihar Jail Banned

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    Mongolia,Vietnam, and funniest of them all Pakistan??? Wake up and face the reality, chinese are kings these days, its money that talks!
     
  10. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    just a reminder USA has 10 times bigger military budget than China, so right now you maybe the court jester but not the king.
     
  11. Tshering22

    Tshering22 Sikkimese Saber Senior Member

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    We're antagonizing you? For the last 2 years, you've been entering our territory, feeding our enemy latest weapons since last 3 decades, entering our claimed province with your military, claiming our entire state, writing provocative messages with red paint on our rocks, threatening our shepherds, violating our airspace with transport helicopters AND you say we're antagonizing you?!

    We're just making sure that you don't get to walk in and take whatever you want suddenly someday and that to remind your out of control army that meddling in Indian affairs is not a walk in the park no matter how big your economy is. Simple as that. You've been building infrastructure especially military grade roads, airstrips and bases all over Tibet and therefore there's no reason why we shouldn't move combat troops, light tanks and fighters to our side of the border especially with your PLA walking into our side at their fancy.

    First keep your army under control and then blame us for being aggressive.
     
  12. Tshering22

    Tshering22 Sikkimese Saber Senior Member

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    Russia siding with China? I guess reading too much People's Daily is not good. Russia simply finds your money lucrative and conducts energy trade with you just as it conducts with another 2 dozen countries. Russia sees you as a cash machine which all countries do in trade, unless you plan to be aggressive with them. Vietnam exporting brides to you? First of all, your country is hit with acute shortage of women due to obsession with male child and this is supposed to be a shameful fact with nothing to brag about. It is a problem in India as well but nowhere as serious and alarming as your case where you've to import women from another country. Mail order brides are a trend all over the world especially for those who are interested in foreign taste when it comes to female companionship. There's nothing derogatory about inter-racial marriages. Wonder where does that make Vietnamese lower than you. Vietnam has a trade with a host of countries and you're one of them. The simple reason why China has the upper hand in most countries as presumed by some people is simply because you trade in surplus and therefore play the role of suppliers to every country you trade with. Southeast has been your backyard only till others didn't set their eyes upon the region's potential. That is changing as you increase your differences with all Southeastern countries by claiming off their islands and provinces as yours.

    Australia is your puppet and I won't deny that and this trend of its subservience to CCP has been rising ever since your economy has quadrupled and for taming a bunch of wild racists, I congratulate your government.

    We don't need to 'dream' about gas pipelines as we're signing similar multiple deals with Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and even Russia via Iran and undersea routes. Also the India-Iran-Russia transport corridor is on the cards which would bring in lots of revenue to the participating countries by slashing the Pacific-Europe trade and transport routes by half through port transfer to India and to Iran straight into Europe using Russia's territory. Apart from this, the extent of our nuclear trade is something you will have to acquaint yourself with. We're not entirely dependent on gas for energy requirements as thanks to friends of India in US government, we've all the leverage to trade in nuclear energy and you could simply google the list of countries we've so far made agreements with which span almost every continent. Even the arrogant Aussie opposition has pitched in nuclear trade with us, defying their own laws as a political pitch to come to power.Please do update yourself with Indian news if you're so interested in jeering at us.

    Pipelines and reactors are a dream for your servants in Pakistan who cannot digest their food without blowing up half their country at the drop of a hat-- not for us. We don't care as to who Obama visits first or second but we're interested in the deal which Obama has to offer to us--something that every sensible government looks forward to rather than counting which number in order was their country visited in by the US president. Geographically a whole host of tiny countries come before us if US president has to arrive to India and that includes a failed state right before us from West to East direction, does it mean that our position is any lower than theirs? I am surprised that you as a Chinese take such small gestures so seriously. I thought you lot were high thinking people.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2010
  13. Tshering22

    Tshering22 Sikkimese Saber Senior Member

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    Guess you're right. With German and French opposition to Turkey joining the EU, I doubt that Turkey could care any more about EU membership. However about NATO you are wrong. Through NATO's relevance in post Soviet era has lost significance, Turkey still gets a lot of goodies for being committed to NATO, the biggest of them all being a chance to participate in the JSF programme for their future air force replacements of old F-16 A/Bs and F-4 Phantoms. Turkey can take individual actions but within limited engagement as long as it doesn't annoy Uncle Sam and his European sidekicks.

    As you can see from the article, US was not pleased with these secret exercises and demanded an explanation from Turkish government. Besides, according to Turkish members on other forums, Turkish people are not very pleased with the radical U-turn policies of AKP party that rules Ankara and the ruling party is having some serious issues with their national army. AKP has been accused of silencing opposition, aggressively clamping down dissent and being un-constitutionally aggressive by Turkish opposition as well as their military itself. Therefore, once the elections are over in Ankara, we'd be seeing a government that doesn't try to become an Arab wannabe-independent country.
     
  14. badguy2000

    badguy2000 Respected Member Senior Member

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    yes, 10 times more military budget borrowed from CHina.
     
  15. tony4562

    tony4562 Tihar Jail Banned

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    That's why US is bleeding to death in both Iraq and Afghanistan. If china wanted to do, she could comfortably spend 3 times as much as she does now, but China chooses not to. You need to know that military spending, unlike spending on infra-structur doesn't contribute to the economy. That's why I think your country's plan of importing more than 100 $Billion worth of weapons in the next few years, is stupid and irresponsible. One day when those weapons are rusting away you will realize that you've been just taken for a ride by the weapon dealers.
     
  16. tony4562

    tony4562 Tihar Jail Banned

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    China has virtually no military presence in the tibeten autonomous region, in other words, no military presence within 500 km of indian border (None of PLA's 18 corps is stationed even remotely near India). It is India who has amassed more than 300000 troops along the border. Also, pakistan is a sovereign country, recognized by virtually all lands, including your own government. And china is far from being the only Country to supply weapons to Pakistan. France, your master Britain, US, and your so-called most reliable friend Russia all sell weapons en mass to Pakistan. You know what the most likely nuklear weapon delivery vehicle Pakistan has, is not its missiles, but its F-16 fleet.
     
  17. nimo_cn

    nimo_cn Senior Member Senior Member

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    I have a feeling this is gonna be a endless troll.

    Stay on topic, guys. Let us have some constructive discussion.

    How much credibility does this report has? I haven't read any Chinese report with regard to this, this is huge if it is true.

    How will Chinese fighters reach Turkey? Turkey is 4500 kms away from China.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2010
  18. Minghegy

    Minghegy Regular Member

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    Iran media said Iran opened air space for Chinese fighters, so it may be China-Pakistan-Iran-Turkey.
     
  19. shotgunner

    shotgunner Regular Member

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    Why sent Su-27? That's outgoing model.
    Should send J-10, JH-7, etc.
    I thought they sent J-10 to Kazakhstan recently for SCO exercise?
     
  20. redragon

    redragon Regular Member

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    Because this is the first time, so it's only reasonable to be conservative, Turkey is sending F-4, Why should China show case the best it has?
     
  21. Tshering22

    Tshering22 Sikkimese Saber Senior Member

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    The official report stated that it was a joint maneuvering of F-16s and Su-27s (J-11s in your case). That's certainly not a conservative first time style exercise. Guess Turkey is eager to get off the NATO bandwagon and shift allegiances to you.
     

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