Three countries that should firmly be in India's camp

tony4562

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Pakistan is a friend of China, not an ally. There is no no alliance between China and Pakistan. Unlike India, China does not live in never-ending insecurity and does not spend the day pondering what the neighbor is up to. But Pakistan, along with Burma, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Iran and Thailand, basically every major neighbor of India, have better relationship with China than they do with India. And if you look beyond your immediate neighborhood, you will find that top world leaders visit China far more often than they do visit India. China is one of the P5, a permanent member of the security council, sits on a huge pile of foreign reserve, and in additon China is the No.1 trading partner of just about every country on earth including India. It is simply puzzling where you got the impression that India is preferred over China world over?
 

KS

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Japan,Vietnam,Phillipines &Myanmar.

It's not India's camp.

By default there will be implicit or even explicit US backing an =d the most we can be is equal partners.
 

KS

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Pakistan is a friend of China, not an ally. There is no no alliance between China and Pakistan. Unlike India, China does not live in never-ending insecurity and does not spend the day pondering what the neighbor is up to. But Pakistan, along with Burma, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Iran and Thailand, basically every major neighbor of India, have better relationship with China than they do with India. And if you look beyond your immediate neighborhood, you will find that top world leaders visit China far more often than they do visit India. China is one of the P5, a permanent member of the security council, sits on a huge pile of foreign reserve, and in additon China is the No.1 trading partner of just about every country on earth including India. It is simply puzzling where you got the impression that India is preferred over China world over?
I recommend you this.Beginner Geography & Map Activities
 

tony4562

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Japan,Vietnam,Phillipines &Myanmar.

It's not India's camp.

By default there will be implicit or even explicit US backing an =d the most we can be is equal partners.
I give you Vietnam here, even though economic relationship between China and Vietnam is far stronger. Mynamar is certainly not in India's camp any more than they are in China's camp. The other 2 have issues with China, this however does not make them allies of India. Their relationship with India is very very very basic.
 

Blackwater

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I would say if you have
USA
Rusland
Chin- land

in your pocket, u got whole world in your pocket...

the only country which is left is pakisland.i would say " bahrd me jaye"
 
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Zebra

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and who are the neighbours of India in cyberspace? :lol:
From space :
Moon , Mars , Sun ....... :D

from cyberspace :

land of Aliens :D
 
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pmaitra

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All right guys, while it is true India does not share borders with Iran and Thailand, they are indeed relevant to us and it would be nice if they were in our 'camp' or at least had a foreign policy that was friendly towards us.
 

mayfair

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Let us not talk and act like the Americans, the Brits, the Chinese and the erstwhile colonial powers about controlling the region. Yes we must have strong and friendly relations with these countries, so that we can safeguard our interests, but not if we wish to control the region. Sounds too much like colonialism for my taste and we who were plundered and colonised by all and sundry for nearly a millenia should know how it feels to be subservient to someone else.

Rather, soft power projection is the best course- Afghanistan, Iran, Myanmar, Vietnam,countries of the Middle East and Africa, and even Bangladesh to an extent are examples of this. Friends not Masters...
 

Zebra

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If we stick to three countries only , than Afghanistan , Myanmar , Sri Lanka . :yo:
 

ejazr

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Strike out Indonesia. (see their reaction in the 1962 war)
Oh and 1965, they went as far as to supply the Pakis along with Iran and PRC.(US didn't, they recognized the war as Pakistan's fault)
The first thing we need to learn about International diplomacy is that there are NO permanent friends or enemies, only permanent interests. Otherwise, your diplomacy will be a big failure.


Indonesia along with six NAM countries have come up with the Colombo proposals that asked for China to withdraw 20km away from its claimed lines without any reciprocal need from India. Ofcourse, unlike say the United Arab Republic (combined Egypt and Syria union) that openly took the Indian side, they stayed "neutral" i.e. did not take the stand that China had committed aggression against India.
General Nasser who was the President of United Arab Republic (Egypt and Syria) championed India's stand in 1962 and 65 as well later. And this again had dynamics of the Cold war where Egypt, Syria, Malaysia, USSR and the PLO were all siding with India more or less. Infact, Pakistan broke of diplomatic relations with Malaysia because it opposed Pakistan stand and supported India on Kashmir. By the late 60s Indonesia had come under a military dictatorship supported by the US and would be firmly in the US camp against Communism until 1998 when people would overthrow military rule to return to democracy.

The Indian Express - Nasser swears by Colombo plan
The Sydney Morning Herald - UAR champions India cause at Colombo



On the other hand, US was fully capable of helping us militarily in 1962 but refused to help us military at our time of need. Which is why Nehru leaned on the USSR to help us out in military supplies.
Jawaharlal Nehru pleaded for US help against China in 1962 - Times Of India
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Admitting that Indians couldn't use air strikes against the rampaging Chinese army for fear of retaliatory action, Nehru went on to specifically ask for 12 squadrons of supersonic all-weather fighters and a modern radar system. He also mentioned that these aircraft would have to be manned by US personnel while the Indians were still being trained.

Apart from it having the potential of embarrassing the Congress party, the disclosure has also been described by foreign policy experts, including former foreign secretary Kapil Sibal and former diplomat G Parthasarathy, as a clear case of US letting India down badly. "What has come out is factually correct. These facts came out after the event too but the important thing is that only after we got nothing from the US did arms supplies from the Soviet Union to India commence," Parthasarathy said.

Sibal described the contents of the letters as Nehru's desperate bid for help against all the principles he had espoused as a leader of the non-aligned movement even though he added that what Nehru did should be judged in the context of history. "Given the Cold War and Communism, it was the only available option for him. Our forces suffered a rout and it was a personal setback for an ailing Nehru given what happened to his Hindi-Chini initiative. The moral of the story is to build up a strong defence against China," Sibal said.

AICC spokesman Manish Tewari, however, justified Nehru's action. "It is part of historical record that India did request the major powers including the US for logistical help to repudiate the Chinese aggression. This is exactly what enlightened national interest means -- that is putting the nation first," he said.
The 1965 war in a way was a direct consequence of the US destablising the sub-continent by forming a military pact CENTO with Pakistan and arming it with the latest military technology and training their pilots and military personnel. This was much much more directly harmful to Indian interests than any other country did regarding diplomatic niceties during war time.

And Pakistan did not get any supplies from outside either from China or Iran during that time. Pakistan had the latest Patton tanks and American F-86s and F-104 which was the fastest jet on the sub-continent at that time. In 1971, it was President Nixon and his NSA Kissinger that supplied Iran with fighter jets so that Iranian jets that were of similar make as the Pakistanis could be transferred to Pakistan in VIOLATION of US laws that had Pakistan sanctioned from US military aid under the previous democratic govt. because of the 1965 war with India.


Now does that mean that we continue to oppose the US blindly and not see the benefit with aligning with the US if its in out international interests because its actions have always been detrimental to Indian interests? Of course not.

So we should realize that the cold war is over and now is the time of building up a new web of alliances and relationships. The old cold war blocks have dismantled and that is why we have seen a spurt of improvement in relationships with such countries. To be hung up on cold war days relationship issues and define the policy today would be a folly.


On topic, other than China and Pakistan, we really don't have a problem with any country. And that is what we have to maintain. Trying to isolate these two countries in different ways. And in real terms it is only China that is a major threat. Take care of China and Pakistan will fall in line automatically. So not just three countries, we should be taking care of as many countries as possible particularly the SAARC countries and our immediate and extended neighbours in central asia, south east asia and west asia.
 
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no smoking

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Im talking about future. If we start now then only we'll achieve something.
You are talking about nonsense!
If you want to get someone into your camp against another one, the only question is if your offer can be good enough for them to take the risk of confrontation with other side.
So far, india is still lagging behind China on almost every economic front. China can simply beat you by spending money. That is exactly what china is doing--being the biggiest customer of every south eastern asian country.
Yes, these countries would love to see india or US coming in and increase their power in talking with China. But standing with india to confront china is another question. Not impossible, but need a much higher price. Remember: what they want is india to fight china for them not they fight for india.
 

charlyondfi

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Jawaharlal Nehru pleaded for US help against China in 1962 - Times Of India
Admitting that Indians couldn't use air strikes against the rampaging Chinese army for fear of retaliatory action, Nehru went on to specifically ask for 12 squadrons of supersonic all-weather fighters and a modern radar system. He also mentioned that these aircraft would have to be manned by US personnel while the Indians were still being trained.
Perhaps apart from topic, yet post of Ejazr here re-confirm one of my question:

I have heard people in DFI kept blaming Nehru it's his "spineless" NOT using Indian Air Force in the 1962 war. Yet, according to ToI posting -- and Maxwell book also clearly said "the limitation of IA at 1962" -- it is 1) even IA won't really help in the war, despite due to equipment restriction or "fear of retaliation", i.e. strategic reason, and 2) Nehru's decision must come from his military advisors, considering his plead to USA even involve a specific number: 12 squadrons.

As far as I know that 1962 war in an area India got insufficient preparation is a mistake, no doubt. My point: is it really Nehru's "guilt" for NOT using IA in it?
 
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