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asianobserve

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Abraham Lincoln was a republican president who freed the slaves.

His action in the Civil War drove the Southern states to the Democratic fold.

Anyway, Democratic Presidents completed his plan for a free and equal Negro slaves/population with the passage of the Civil Rights Act.
 
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His action in the Civil War drove the Southern states to the Democratic fold.

Anyway, Democratic Presidents completed his plan for a free and equal Negro slaves/population with the passage of the Civil Rights Act.
The first official document to free the slaves was Lincoln's Emancipation proclamation.
most southern states are still republican.

 
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asianobserve

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An interesting letter of Linclon to his friend...

In 1855, Lincoln wrote to Joshua Speed, a personal friend and slave owner in Kentucky:

You know I dislike slavery; and you fully admit the abstract wrong of it. ... I also acknowledge your rights and my obligations, under the constitution, in regard to your slaves. I confess I hate to see the poor creatures hunted down, and caught, and carried back to their stripes, and unrewarded toils; but I bite my lip and keep quiet. In 1841 you and I had together a tedious low-water trip, on a Steam Boat from Louisville to St. Louis. You may remember, as I well do, that from Louisville to the mouth of the Ohio, there were, on board, ten or a dozen slaves, shackled together with irons. That sight was a continued torment to me; and I see something like it every time I touch the Ohio, or any other slave-border. It is hardly fair for you to assume, that I have no interest in a thing which has, and continually exercises, the power of making me miserable. You ought rather to appreciate how much the great body of the Northern people do crucify their feelings, in order to maintain their loyalty to the Constitution and the Union. . . .

. . . How can any one who abhors the oppression of negroes, be in favor of degrading classes of white people? Our progress in degeneracy appears to me to be pretty rapid. As a nation, we began by declaring that "all men are created equal." We now practically read it "all men are created equal, except negroes." When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read "all men are created equal, except negroes, and foreigners, and catholics." When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretence of loving liberty— to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be take pure, and without the base alloy of hypocrisy [sic].


Abraham Lincoln and slavery - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

aeroblogger

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Abraham Lincoln was a republican president who freed the slaves.
I know that Abraham Lincoln was a Republican president, and I know that he freed the slavess.

That is 100% irrelevant to my point.

The Republican party today has a vastly different platform and a vastly different vote-base than they did back in the 1960s.
 

W.G.Ewald

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The Republicans stood had a very different platform in the 1960s than they do today. Don't try to justify the neocon agenda by claiming that the same agenda supported liberation. It most certainly did not.
Can you explicate the differences you allege? I don't know what you mean by "neocon." It has been used as a perjorative word for Jews. Is that what you mean?
 
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I know that Abraham Lincoln was a Republican president, and I know that he freed the slavess.

That is 100% irrelevant to my point.

The Republican party today has a vastly different platform and a vastly different vote-base than they did back in the 1960s.
Most southern states are traditionally republican states, the platform from the 1960s may have changed
but it was Republican Bush that gave Condelizza Rice and Colin Powell both African Americans positions
as Secretary of State.
 

asianobserve

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Most southern states are traditionally republican states, the platform from the 1960s may have changed
but it was Republican Bush that gave Condelizza Rice and Colin Powell both African Americans positions
as Secretary of State.
One might ask, "where's Mr. Powell" now?
 

W.G.Ewald

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Most southern states are traditionally republican states, the platform from the 1960s may have changed
but it was Republican Bush that gave Condelizza Rice and Colin Powell both African Americans positions
as Secretary of State.
Southern states were Republican during Reconstruction following the Civil War. The antebellum South was Democratic, and the South of the 1960s was Democratic.
 

aeroblogger

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Most southern states are traditionally republican states, the platform from the 1960s may have changed
but it was Republican Bush that gave Condelizza Rice and Colin Powell both African Americans positions
as Secretary of State.
While the Southern states are traditionally Republican now, were they back then?

The answer is not what you think. Do take a look at some data before coming back please...

And Mr. Ewald, it'll take me a little while to reply to your post with data, but I haven't forgotten about you. Don't worry. ;)
 

W.G.Ewald

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The Republicans stood had a very different platform in the 1960s than they do today. Don't try to justify the neocon agenda by claiming that the same agenda supported liberation. It most certainly did not.
Michael Lind wrote:

"Most neoconservative defense intellectuals have their roots on the left, not the right. They are products of the influential Jewish-American sector of the Trotskyist movement of the 1930s and 1940s, which morphed into anti-communist liberalism between the 1950s and 1970s and finally into a kind of militaristic and imperial right with no precedents in American culture or political history. Their admiration for the Israeli Likud party's tactics, including preventive warfare such as Israel's 1981 raid on Iraq's Osirak nuclear reactor, is mixed with odd bursts of ideological enthusiasm for "democracy." They call their revolutionary ideology "Wilsonianism" (after President Woodrow Wilson), but it is really Trotsky's theory of the permanent revolution mingled with the far-right Likud strain of Zionism. Genuine American Wilsonians believe in self-determination for people such as the Palestinians."

"The major link between the conservative think tanks and the Israel lobby is the Washington-based and Likud-supporting Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs (Jinsa), which co-opts many non-Jewish defense experts by sending them on trips to Israel."
Neoconservatism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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While the Southern states are traditionally Republican now, were they back then?

The answer is not what you think. Do take a look at some data before coming back please...
If your point is to give credit to the democrats for the civil rights movement then i will not argue this it
was mostly democrats than supported it and pushed it thru. Democrats today still use the same base of
minority and female votes to win.
 
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aeroblogger

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Can you explicate the differences you allege? I don't know what you mean by "neocon." It has been used as a perjorative word for Jews. Is that what you mean?
Wikipedia says:
Neoconservatism is a variant of the political ideology of conservatism which combines features of traditional (paleo) conservatism, military interventionism, social conservatism, nationalism, and a qualified endorsement of free markets.

This is the political philosophy which most closely describes the Republican platform today.
 

aeroblogger

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If your point is to give credit to the democrats for the civil rights movement then i will not argue this it
was mostly democrats than supported it and pushed it thru.
My point is certainly not to give credit to the Democrats. I'm not a fan of them either.

I just wanted to point out that the Republicans of yesteryear are not the Republicans of today, and therefore praising the Republicans of today for the achievements of the Republicans of yesteryear is ridiculous.
 
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My point is certainly not to give credit to the Democrats. I'm not a fan of them either.

I just wanted to point out that the Republicans of yesteryear are not the Republicans of today, and therefore praising the Republicans of today for the achievements of the Republicans of yesteryear is ridiculous.
I am biased towards the Republican party since i was a kid and I saw Reagan
bring down the Soviet Union. My father was a Democrat and never understood
why i was Republican.
 

aeroblogger

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I am biased towards the Republican party since i was a kid and I saw Reagan bring down the Soviet Union. My father was a Democrat and never understood why i was Republican.
I must admit, I don't understand your reasoning either. Bringing down the SU was certainly not a favor Reagan did for India.

On the topic of political views, I am a fiscal moderate, extremely libertarian... I generally support the Democrats though, simply because they are more tolerant of immigration. But I can't stand either party.
 
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I must admit, I don't understand your reasoning either. Bringing down the SU was certainly not a favor Reagan did for India.

On the topic of political views, I am a fiscal moderate, extremely libertarian... I generally support the Democrats though, simply because they are more tolerant of immigration. But I can't stand either party.
When I was a kid 7 years old it was a short time after the moon landing and Mccarthyism was still alive
in my small town we use to watch films in school regularly about the dangers of communists and occasionally
military personnel would come and give lectures to the children and hand out buttons and stickers etc...
This made a very big impression on me I viewed communists as a plague, This impression
always stuck with me and only when i got older did i realize things are not always what you are
taught.
 
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W.G.Ewald

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If your point is to give credit to the democrats for the civil rights movement then i will not argue this it
was mostly democrats than supported it and pushed it thru. Democrats today still use the same base of
minority and female votes to win.
The actual history is exactly the opposite. Read about President Johnson and the Voting Rights and Civil Rights Acts.
 
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niharjhatn

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When I was a kid 7 years old it was a short time after the moon landing and Mccarthyism was still alive
in my small town we use to watch films in school regularly about the dangers of communists and occasionally
military personnel would come and give lectures to the children and hand out buttons and stickers etc...
This made a very big impression on me I viewed communists as a plague, This impression
always stuck with me and only when i got older did i realize things are not always what you are
taught.
The most interesting thing to look at is the media/propaganda directed at the younger kids. Reading some of these books (I remember reading one about an American kid talking about a Russian migrant who came to escape communism and some of the bashing of communism as he integrates into US society by joining the local baseball team) as well as cartoons is incredible.

Bashing a totalitarian government and getting the kids to play the "star spangled banner" every morning! Incredible!
 

average american

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I spent some time in the USSR, it was a pretty horrible place.....the average person had given up hope of things getting better and was afraid all the time of getting in trouble.
 

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