The Future Indian Navy !

SPIEZ

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Should the IN look at Battle Cruisers (BC)

Battlecruiser - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Large Bc's have the advantage of being Blue water navy vessels which can stay away from the coast for extended periods of time. This will give the IN blue water capability.

Also nuclear powered BC's will not require refueling for a long period of time, for eg~30 years.

They would be able to beef up our attack capabilities with long range missiles like Nirbhay (Nirbhay - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) and the K15( missiles.
 

p2prada

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PDV/PAD and AAD ship with Navy version of LRTR.......
I guess you are talking about an AAW Destroyer like the Aegis equipped ABs.

Battlecruisers are expensive and difficult to maintain. Two destroyers are a better option instead of one battlecruiser. More flexibility.
 

SPIEZ

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I guess you are talking about an AAW Destroyer like the Aegis equipped ABs.

Battlecruisers are expensive and difficult to maintain. Two destroyers are a better option instead of one battlecruiser. More flexibility.
When the ship is bigger isn't it harder to drown ?

Also refueling, won't it be a burden ?
 
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p2prada

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When the ship is bigger isn't it harder to drown ?

Also refueling, won't it be a burden ?
Smaller American ships have survived big hits, like USS Cole. You need to do major damage in order to sink the ship, big or small.

Smaller ships are more stealthy and pack excellent firepower.

USS Stark and HMS Sheffield were attacked using Exocets. Both suffered major damages, but did not sink.

Tactics can always overcome size. The only ships that deserve to be big are carriers, tankers and LPDs.
 

ace009

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"Battlecruisers" or "cruisers" or pocket battleships were a class of warships being built between 1850 till the early parts of 2nd world war. They had thick armor to protect them against gunfire and were considerably slow. They were considered to be the "queens" of a fleet and were frequently considered the flagships of a navy.

However, 2nd WW showed the limitations of these design due to the development of advanced torpedoes (launched from submarines and aircraft) that could penetrate the armor of the battle ships. In addition there were dive bombers that could destroy a battleship (a la Pearl Harbor). Battleships became less and less effective and useful as WW2 went on and were eventually replaced by Destroyers (to counter submarines) and Aircraft Carriers (to counter other surface ships and land attack).

Since WW-2, the shift has been towards speed, stealth and missile firing capabilities (both for defense and offense) for naval vessels (Destroyers, Submarines and Frigates). Russian Navy is the only major navy that still maintains some "Cruisers" which carry ballistic missiles. They are also mainly nuclear powered to give them the extra leg. As Ewald pointed out, the USN planned and then cancelled it's own Dreadnought battleship project.

We have discussed about the use of a nuke powered cruiser for IN - I personally think it might not be a bad idea - as a "patrol vessel" that can carry balistic missiles, have Aegis type ABM defense and can launch large drones for strike (like the MQ-9 Reaper). But most people on this forum do not like the concept of large Cruisers ...
 

Armand2REP

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I know we have already had this discussion before. It was agreed more cheaper ships are better than a few large ones.
 

SPIEZ

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Amur class submarine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

SPECS :
Displacement:
950 long tons (970 t) surfaced
Length:
58.8 m (192 ft 11 in)
Beam:
5.65 m (18 ft 6 in)
Height:
6.4 m (21 ft 0 in)
Speed:
20 knots (23 mph; 37 km/h)
Range:
350 nmi (650 km) AIP
3,000 nmi (5,600 km) Snorkelhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine_snorkel
Endurance:
45 days
Test depth:250 m (820 ft)
Complement:18
Armament:"¢ 4 × 533 mm (21 in) Torpedo tubeshttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torpedo_tube
"¢ 16 torpedoes
"¢ 10 VLS cells
 

Payeng

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Should the IN look at Battle Cruisers (BC)

Battlecruiser - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Large Bc's have the advantage of being Blue water navy vessels which can stay away from the coast for extended periods of time. This will give the IN blue water capability.

Also nuclear powered BC's will not require refueling for a long period of time, for eg~30 years.

They would be able to beef up our attack capabilities with long range missiles like Nirbhay (Nirbhay - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) and the K15( missiles.
Good thought, for a ship of that class India will need a heavy air defence, both long range and point defence,
battle cruisers like the Kirov class employees massive air defence some 100 long range SAM, 250+ point defense SAM with CIWS plus anti submarine and Anti ship capabilities with a speculation of more then 500 missiles in the single ship. Now that's some huge armament for probability for IN to maintain a ship of that class.

To the max I have seen 32 Barak point defense SAM plus other armaments fitted on Mysore Class Destroyers, India still have a gap in Long range SAM capabilities for Naval Ship defense.

Zumwalt Class Destroyers looks impressive as an alternative



The US have currently scrapped such an concept of massive firepower known as Arsenal ship




Arsenal ship - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

India needs Long range SAM for destroyers to escort her CV before such a concept. I hope Shaurya be tested as ABM defence as it might result to in Indian's Long range SAM work horse :)>

Shaurya uses cold launch similar to that of S-300 which Kirov Class Battle cruisers uses, and with a surface to surface range of 750 KM, I believe it can reach atleast 300 km minimum as LR-SAM role

500 kg warhead payload altered for a kill vehicle gimbal controlled third stage, this technology is already available as it had been tested in PADM.

Shaurya is even known as capable of maneuvering at mid course.

What you folks think about it?
 
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SPIEZ

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@ Payeng
Displacement:24,300 tons Standard, 28,000 (Full Load)
Length:252 m (827 ft)
230 m (750 ft) (Waterline)
Beam:28.5 m (94 ft)
Draft:9.1 m (30 ft)
Propulsion:2-shaft CONAS, Nuclear propulsion with steam turbine boost
140,000 shp
Speed:32 knots (59 km/h)
Range:1,000 nautical miles (2,000 km) at 30 knots (56 km/h) (combined propulsion),
Essentially unlimited with nuclear power at 20 knots (37 km/h)
Complement:727
Aircrew: 18
Flag staff: 15
Sensors and
processing systems:
·Voskhod MR-800 (Top Pair) 3D search radar on foremast
·Fregat MR-710 (Top Steer) 3D search radar on main mast
·2 × Palm Frond navigation radar on foremast
·2 × Top Dome for SA-N-6 fire control
·4 × Bass Tilt for AK-360 CIWS System fire control
·2 × Eye Bowl for SA-N-4 fire control
·Horse Jaw LF hull sonar
·Horse Tail VDS (Variable Depth Sonar)
Armament:20 P 700 Granit
14 SS-N-14 SILEX ASW missile
12x8 (96) S-300PMU Favorit SA-N-6 Grumble surface to air missiles
44 OSA-MA (SA-N-4 Gecko) PD SAM
2x RBU-1000 305 mm ASW rocket launchers
2x RBU-12000 (Udav-1) 254 mm ASW rocket launchers
2x AK-100 100 mm/L60 DP guns
10 533 mm ASW/ASuW torpedo tubes, Type 53 torpedo or SS-N-15 ASW missile
8x AK-630 hex gatling 30 mm/L60 PD guns
Armour:76 mm plating around reactor compartment, light splinter protection
Aircraft carried:3 Kamokov Ka 27http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamov_Ka-27 or Ka 25http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamov_Ka-25
Aviation facilities:Below-deck hangar
General characteristics
 

sandeepdg

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I would love to see ships like this with such lethal firepower, although somewhat tweaked in configurations, to carry a heavy load of Brahmos, Nirbhay cruise missiles in good numbers by decreasing the number of SAMs in IN.

Kirov class battlecruiser - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


428 SAM payload on a single ship !! Including, short, medium and LR-SAMs. Mind blowing firepower ! A single ship like this can scare away an entire country's AF !!
 

SPIEZ

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From an educational point of view I would like to know the pro's and con's of nuclear powered Blue-water ships!

And 458 missiles are impossible !
 

sandeepdg

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And 458 missiles are impossible !
Its not impossible, its a fact as stated above. And, its 428 SAMs. Obviously, I am not saying that we have ship with a payload of 400 cruise missiles, I want to see ships with a payload of around 100 SAMs of different ranges and around 50-100 cruise missiles. That is very possible when compared to a Kirov class cruiser.

Pyotr Velikiy is in active service. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_battlecruiser_Pyotr_Velikiy
 
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Payeng

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I would love to see ships like this with such lethal firepower, although somewhat tweaked in configurations, to carry a heavy load of Brahmos, Nirbhay cruise missiles in good numbers by decreasing the number of SAMs in IN.

Kirov class battlecruiser - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


428 SAM payload on a single ship !! Including, short, medium and LR-SAMs. Mind blowing firepower ! A single ship like this can scare away an entire country's AF !!
From an educational point of view I would like to know the pro's and con's of nuclear powered Blue-water ships!

And 458 missiles are impossible !
sandeepdg I think you miscalculated the numbers S-300PMU and S-300FM are different versions expected to be installed in different versions of Kirov Class still Peter the Great is believed to have a massive amount of fire power with a speculated total amount of missile exceeding 500 different types of missiles.

SPIEZ I think you misunderstood my point, as per the thread title 'Future Indian Navy' it is most necessary to produce or procure a LRSAM before any plans for Battle cruisers, Chinese air defence destroyers will carry LRSAM. BTW US cancelled one of its project upon a version of a concept of modern battleships. More or less it is seen as a lesser feasible option.
 

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