Tajikistan gives land to China

[Bangalorean]

Houde:

First of all, stop prattling about Chinese projects here. The thing is, India does not build white elephants which will never be used, and which are good only for **** measuring contests. India's aviation sector is among the fastest growing in the world, and a high speed rail will come up naturally when it should. And maybe you don't know about the changes in Indian defence industry and the emphasis on domestic production, and the impending entry of private players like Tata and Mahindra into the defence market. India will have a very different military by 2020, I guarantee you. And by the way, even if there is a war immediately, tomorrow - China is not going to walk over like in 1962. We control the straits of Malacca and the Indian ocean still, remember that. And that is not going to change, because we have realized the true nature of the aggression and warmongering of the communist regime in China, we are going to be prepared.

And for your information, we have no interest in taking Tibet or Xinjiang or any other part of China. Neither are we the world's policeman. It is Chinese who keep crowing about taking Arunachal, and even about dismemberment of India. Actually this dismemberment talk shows the crazy nature of the communist brainwashing that Chinese citizens are subjected to. If you people honestly feel that you can "dismember" a country around as large as yourself, which is around as old as your own, and which is among the most powerful armies worldwide, I can only laugh and shake my head at the extent of brainwashing that the Chinese might be undergoing!

 

[Abir]

All my engagement with Chinese people in net ended in ad nauseam. They will keep repeating same non sequitur until you literally bang your head on the wall. And I never seen a chinese living in mainland opposing their state policy, even for a change!

 

[kickok1975]

Stop arguing and restrain yourself! You guys are living in fantasy and fortunately both India and China's leaders don't have your way of thinking. How could a Tajikistan topics end up into Indo-China war? It just shows how provocative some members here.

But your debate will lead to nowhere except more hate and mistrust between each other. That's not good to both countries regardless how powerful China is and how peaceful India is.

 

[amoy]

I never seen a chinese living in mainland opposing their state policy, even for a change!

not 'state policies' at all. simply Chinese across the whole spectrum cannot buy in some of your (Indian) views. Be the change u wish to see in the world - why don't Indians change first?

 

[Shaitan]

 

[Abir]

not 'state policies' at all. simply Chinese across the whole spectrum cannot buy in some of your (Indian) views. Be the change u wish to see in the world - why don't Indians change first?

Yeah they may or may not buy our views but atleast they should buy logic, that is the normal behaviour one expect from fellow human beings.

I don't mean to generalise though, I've come across some very good Chinese debaters but the drones take most of the space.

 

[civfanatic]

Mr.houde, why aren't you replying to my points? Why are you running away from the debate that you started?

@ohimalaya

Which Indian views are unacceptable to China? You want us to give up our motherland to satisfy CCP's ego? What country in the world (besides Pakistan, who shamelessly gave up land to China) would do that?

 

[KS]

All my engagement with Chinese people in net ended in ad nauseam. They will keep repeating same non sequitur until you literally bang your head on the wall. And I never seen a chinese living in mainland opposing their state policy, even for a change!

Big Daddy is watching you...Beware.

 

[pmaitra]

LOL, did you ask Turkey when they knew how to write? They were barbarian in chinese history, this is nothing about racism, it is just like Aryan was barbarian in Roman history. Should I read rigorous history written by chinese historian in 8th century, or listen to barbarian's legend, of course, not read, they don't know how to write.

Let's forget about history and come to current times. Look at these pictures below and tell me who is the barbarian today? Looking forward to your response.

Pardon me if this breaks the house rules, but you are indeed a perfect example of the pot calling the kettle black!

 

[pmaitra]

And I never seen a chinese living in mainland opposing their state policy, even for a change!

A Chinese that opposes PRC state policies is a dead Chinese, hence, you have never seen a "chinese living in mainland opposing their state policy" [sic]. Refer to examples below:

References:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiananmen_Square_protests_of_1989
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/june/4/newsid_2496000/2496277.stm

 

[pmaitra]

One small clarification to those who think Uighurs and Tajik are related ;

NO THEY ARE NOT.

Uighurs are a Turkic lot while the Tajiks are Persian. Or in other words - Tajiks are not a Turkic clan/tribe.

I'd recommend you read more about history before posting nonsense. I have some excerpts for your kind perusal.

Early history

Modern Tajiks regard the Samanid Empire as the first Tajik state. This monument in Dushanbe honors Amir Ismail Samani.

The territory of what is now Tajikistan has been inhabited continuously since 4000 BC.[citation needed] It has been under the rule of various empires throughout history, for the longest period being part of the Persian Empire.

Acharya Yaska's Nirukta[8] (7th century BC) attests that the verb Åšavati in the sense "to go" was used by only the Kambojas. It has been shown that the modern Ghalcha dialects, Valkhi, Shigali, Sriqoli, Jebaka (also called Sanglichi or Ishkashim), Munjani, Yidga and Yaghnobi, mainly spoken in Pamirs and countries on the headwaters of the Oxus, still use terms derived from ancient Kamboja Åšavati in the sense "to go".[9] The Yaghnobi language, spoken by the Yaghnobis in the Sughd Province around the headwaters of Zeravshan valley, also still contains a relic "Åšu" from ancient Kamboja Åšavati in the sense "to go".[10]

Further, Sir George Abraham Grierson says that the speech of Badakshan was a Ghalcha until about three centuries ago when it was supplanted by a form of Persian.[11] Thus, the ancient Kamboja, probably included the Badakshan, Pamirs and northern territories including the Yaghnobi region in the doab of the Oxus and Jaxartes.[12] On the east it was bounded roughly by Yarkand and/or Kashgar, on the west by Bahlika (Uttaramadra), on the northwest by Sogdiana, on the north by Uttarakuru, on the southeast by Darada, and on the south by Gandhara.

Numerous Indologists locate original Kamboja in Pamirs and Badakshan and the Parama Kamboja further north, in the Trans-Pamirian territories comprising Zeravshan valley, north up parts of Sogdhiana/Fargana — in the Sakadvipa or Scythia of the classical writers.[13]

Thus, in the pre-Buddhist times (7th–6th century BCE), the parts of modern Tajikistan including territories as far as Zeravshan valley in Sogdiana formed parts of ancient Kamboja and the Parama Kamboja kingdoms when it was ruled by the Kambojas till it became part of Persian Achaemenid Empire. After the Persian Empire was defeated by Alexander the Great, the region became the northern part of Hellenistic Greco-Bactrian Kingdom.

From the last quarter of fourth century BCE until the first quarter of the second century BCE, it was part of the Bactrian Empire, from whom it was passed on to Scythian Tukharas and hence became part of Tukharistan. Contact with the Chinese Han Dynasty was made in the second century BCE, when envoys were sent to the area of Bactria to explore regions west of China.

For source and references, go to: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tajikistan

Turkic khaganates at their height, c. 600 CE:

Turkic peoples in Central Asia:

Turkic Migration:

References:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Göktürk_Khaganate
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_people

 

[Oracle]

Time that we start discussing on the topic and leave rants!

 

[niceguy2011]

Time that we start discussing on the topic and leave rants!

Agree!
History means nothing but more hate and conflict!

 

[houde10000]

man, i can not stay online 24 hour to reply you

Mr.houde, why aren't you replying to my points? Why are you running away from the debate that you started?

@ohimalaya

Which Indian views are unacceptable to China? You want us to give up our motherland to satisfy CCP's ego? What country in the world (besides Pakistan, who shamelessly gave up land to China) would do that?

1) man, i can not stay online 24 hour to reply you.

2) South Tibet is Indian land, when you have Arunachal state? 1986, right? why it is not 1947? I didn't say you gave you mother land to China, I said give the south tibet back to China, that is not your land. If you want peace and want your mother to be one piece, then return the chinese land you seized.

3) India won't be the only country has to return land to China, Japan also has to return Ryukyu island, Vietnam, philipine, Malaysia, Indonisia have to return return south chinese sea islands.

 

[houde10000]

A Chinese that opposes PRC state policies is a dead Chinese, hence, you have never seen a "chinese living in mainland opposing their state policy" [sic]. Refer to examples below:

References:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiananmen_Square_protests_of_1989
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/june/4/newsid_2496000/2496277.stm

Mr. Pmaitra,

I am sure you made those in your mind, you know nothing about today's China, when I was in China last year, I talked to over 100 different chinese, including teacher, professor, doctor, engineer, artist, cashier, taxi driver, barber, ......, a lot of them maybe not know outside of world very much, but they are not scare to talk about any topic I asked, they criticized chinese government vehemently more than I could image, from everything, I didn't see anyone was arrested or disappeared.

Of course you are not allow to do something in China, such as showing a slogan in Tian_an_men_square, I am sure you will be arrested, practicing FaLunGong (cult) is also forbidden. I really don't feel there is any difference with Canadian, American, Japan civilian life.

 

[maomao]

1) man, i can not stay online 24 hour to reply you.

2) South Tibet is Indian land, when you have Arunachal state? 1986, right? why it is not 1947? I didn't say you gave you mother land to China, I said give the south tibet back to China, that is not your land. If you want peace and want your mother to be one piece, then return the chinese land you seized.

3) India won't be the only country has to return land to China, Japan also has to return Ryukyu island, Vietnam, philipine, Malaysia, Indonisia have to return return south chinese sea islands.

Now you are giving threats!!

LOL take the land by force because we will give you none, rather take back what is our!! Tibet was free country even before China claimed to be a republic and CCP wrote your history books.....Tibet, Xinjiang and Inner Mangolia will be free soon Inshallah!

If you want your country in one piece, then give up the above mentioned places and return to east coast of China!

 

[houde10000]

Mr. Pmaitra,

1) I did search, this is real picture taken before 1990, about 20 years ago, the Armed Police wear the 1980s style uniform.

2) Do you know why those women were executed? They are drug traffickers, even today, no matter who you are, carry over 400 gram drug, will be sentenced to death in China. China is not foolish British and French, human right doesn't including freedom to sale drug in China!!!

3) The pictures are very bloody, I also feel very sick, but I understand, chinese law, police, government just did their job to protect innocent people.

4) There are many different way to execute people, shot is one of options. I don't think there is big different between hanging, shot, lethal injection, electric chair. The most importance is justice.

5) Burn brides because their family not offer large dowry? That's really barbarian, right? I read that from Indian news.

Let's forget about history and come to current times. Look at these pictures below and tell me who is the barbarian today? Looking forward to your response.

Pardon me if this breaks the house rules, but you are indeed a perfect example of the pot calling the kettle black!

 

[roma]

Let's try to be "objective".

During Czarist Russia era there was a border treaty btwn Russia Empire and Qing Dynasty by which 1/3 of today's Tajik was China's. But later Russia expanded eastward and annexed more. What happens now is a compromise - China gave up most of the claim based on Czar-Qing Treaty.

Both may say they suffer a "loss". But the upside of such a settlement ALL central Asian STANs and China can move ahead with no more "historical baggage" from now on.

ALL central Asian STANs and China can move ahead with no more "historical baggage" from now on ??

not quite - silent prc policy is that hte actual western borderof china goes all the way to the caspian sea - one of the older dynasties had that reach and that's what theyre aiming for longer term.

 

[maomao]

^^^^@ Haute There is a difference between state sponsored executions, genocides, repressions and domestic/house feuds between families, don't display your distorted Chinese logic to compare the incomparable!

 

[LurkerBaba]

South Tibet is Indian land, when you have Arunachal state? 1986, right? why it is not 1947?

Tibet is Chinese land, when you have Tibet? 1950, right? Why it is not in 1949? (btw AP was always part of India, the states were reorganized later)

This is just ridiculous, now they'll lay a claim on Mongolia too just because it was part of some Chinese Empire

If we had this crazy imperialist mindset, all of South Asia would be India. Why? It's our land, we have proof

Mughal Empire

Mauryan empire

All these countries must give up their sovereignty ! Akhand Bharat !!