Stealth Helicopter involved in Osama Bin Laden raid revealed

Discussion in 'China' started by JAYRAM, May 9, 2011.

  1. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Last edited: May 9, 2011
  2.  
  3. utubekhiladi

    utubekhiladi The Preacher Elite Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2010
    Messages:
    3,021
    Likes Received:
    1,423
    Location:
    TX, USA
    so now china can make their own stealth helicopter. :)
     
  4. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Bin Laden raid reveals another elusive target: a stealth helicopter

    By W.J. Hennigan and Ralph Vartabedian, Los Angeles Times

    May 7, 2011



    Military aviation experts have been trying for decades to produce a chopper quiet enough to slip undetected behind enemy lines. Until the crash and destruction of a helicopter during the raid, none thought such a craft existed.

    [​IMG]
    Part of the helicopter that had a malfunction and was destroyed during the raid in which Osama bin Laden was killed is seen near the compound. Aviation experts believe the chopper had stealth capabilities. (Reuters)

    When a U.S. military helicopter was destroyed in the backyard of Osama bin Laden's compound, it left not only a pile of smoldering wreckage but tantalizing evidence of a secret stealth chopper.

    The quest for a helicopter that can slip behind enemy lines without being heard or detected by radar has been the Holy Grail of military aviation for decades and until this week nobody had thought such a craft existed.

    But aviation experts are now convinced that the Pentagon may have developed such an aircraft. They say the U.S. military went to extraordinary lengths to protect its new technology by destroying a helicopter that had been damaged in the raid, either during the initial landing or in the subsequent evacuation.

    A section of the craft also survived intact, and photos of it leave no doubt in analysts' minds that the U.S. had modified a MH-60 Black Hawk into some kind of super-secret stealth helicopter — the likes of which have never been seen before.

    CIA Director Leon E. Panetta has said that the only helicopters used for the operation were Black Hawks, and he acknowledged that one of them had to be destroyed.

    While stealth jets are designed to evade radar, stealth helicopters are built to be quiet. Some experts have concluded that the military and CIA may have succeeded in their decades-old quest to develop a helicopter without the ear-splitting thump-thump-thump that has signaled the presence of rotorcraft from miles away.

    Maj. Wes Ticer, a U.S. Special Operations Command spokesman, declined to comment.

    Aerospace analysts say the surviving tail section appears nothing like that of the standard $30-million Black Hawk chopper made by Sikorsky Aircraft Corp. in Connecticut. Notably, the tail rotor was partially covered by a plate or hub, possibly part of a noise muffling system.

    "What we're seeing here is a very different type of design than what we normally see in rotorcraft," said Loren Thompson, defense policy analyst for the Lexington Institute in Arlington, Va. "It appears that the military went to great lengths to reduce the radar and acoustic signature of the helicopter."

    The tail section hints at what other modifications might have been made to the far more important main rotor.

    Farhan Gandhi, aerospace engineering professor at Pennsylvania State University and deputy director of the Penn State Vertical Lift Research Center of Excellence, said tremendous advances in helicopter noise reduction have been made in recent years.

    "You can never have helicopters make zero noise, but there is a tremendous possibility to make them much quieter than they are now," Gandhi said.

    To reduce noise, rotors can be slowed down. Advanced computation has enabled engineers to refine the shape of rotor tips. And research is being conducted into active controls that can make minute changes to the shape of rotors many times per second as they change position.

    "The technology has been lab tested and flight tested, but it is not on any military aircraft that we know about," Gandhi said.

    Jeff Eldredge, a UCLA aerospace engineering professor and acoustics expert, said helicopter noise is extremely complex and requires many approaches to controlling it.

    "The idea of a stealth helicopter is something of a misnomer," he said. "It is very unlikely this is a helicopter you wouldn't hear coming."

    But any reduction in noise could provide some tactical benefit.

    The idea of quiet choppers is not a new one. During the Vietnam War, the U.S. Army and CIA developed what could be considered a stealth helicopter for the first time. Dubbed "the Quiet One," it was developed by now-defunct Hughes Aircraft Co. in Playa Vista.

    In the 1980s, the Pentagon worked on developing a classified stealth helicopter along with the F-117 Nighthawk stealth aircraft and the B-2 stealth bomber, said John Pike, director of GlobalSecurity.org, a website for military policy research.

    The Army also tried to develop a stealth chopper, dubbed Comanche. But the helicopter program was canceled in 2004 after it incurred huge cost overruns.

    No one knows for sure who worked on the modifications on the special forces' Black Hawks or how many of them exist, but at least one may have been destroyed.

    The Pentagon said the chopper experienced a mechanical "malfunction." A senior military official who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk about the incident said that the helicopter couldn't get lift because of the 18-foot-high walls surrounding the compound.

    The lift problem may have been caused by the modification to the aircraft, Pike said. The aerodynamics of the chopper could have been compromised in the process of making it stealthy.

    The wreckage, some of which was carted away by the Pakistan military, has raised worries that key technology could be revealed to other countries, said Rebecca Grant, president of IRIS Independent Research, a military and aerospace consulting firm.

    This year, China said it had developed and built a stealth fighter jet, dubbed Chengdu J-20. U.S. military officials believe that the Chinese used technology collected from a F-117 stealth aircraft that was shot down over Serbia in 1999 during the Kosovo war.

    Chinese agents were said to have purchased parts of the plane from local farmers. The F-117 fighter uses high-tech coatings that act like a sponge to absorb radar waves as they strike the plane.

    "There will be fears that the technology may get into the wrong hands," Grant said. "But it's not like you can just pick up a piece and reproduce it. This is extremely complicated technology. Most of us never have the chance to ever see it."

    Stealth helicopter: Bin Laden raid reveals another elusive target, the stealth helicopter - latimes.com
     
  5. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Stealth craft in bin Laden raid has Nevada ties

    [​IMG]

    By Keith Rogers
    LAS VEGAS REVIEW-JOURNAL
    Posted: May 7, 2011 | 2:22 a.m.


    Radar-evading technology for the mysterious helicopters that carried out the U.S. special operations raid of Osama bin Laden's walled compound in Pakistan was spawned in the early 1990s at the classified Area 51 installation in Southern Nevada, according to sources close to the black projects facility.

    One source familiar with operations at the secret location along Groom Dry Lake, 90 miles north of Las Vegas, said a smaller version stealth helicopter -- an angular, two-seat McDonnell Douglas 500 with sharp edges, riveted body, gull-wing doors and black-brown coating -- would fly "two or three times a day" during 1992 and 1993.

    "The rotors, the entire body and even the canopy system on it was all integrated into that material," said the source, who spoke on the condition he not be identified because of security obligations.

    The source said the craft was difficult to land. " It had to land on a special trailer so it could be maneuvered into the hangar," he said, noting that the landing gear consisted of skids, not wheels.

    His account confirmed a Review-Journal story from 1995 that quoted an unnamed former base employee who said the project was code-named "T.E.-K," which stood for "Test and Evaluation Project K."

    At least two of the prototype stealth helicopters were stored near the southern end of the installation in Hangar 8, according to accounts from both sources.

    The Groom Lake source on Friday said, "This was the test bed, the original one, to see if you could exploit it and turn it into something bigger."

    He said work began on stealth helicopters at the installation in the early 1990s following production of the F-117A Nighthawk attack jet that was tested there and developed under a tightly guarded program.

    And, that's what apparently happened with black project helicopters 16 years after the Review-Journal revealed the existence of Project K, according to John Pike, director of globalsecurity.org, a military information website. The radar-evading helicopters that shuttled Navy SEALs to bin Laden's compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, could have evolved from the Groom Lake test bed in the early 1990s.

    The raid aroused the curiosity of aviation buffs after one of the helicopters made a hard landing. The SEAL team blew up most of the crippled aircraft before they barreled out of the compound, but the tail section with a "hubcap" to hide movement of the rear rotor and reduce noise remained intact.

    "I would have no way of knowing whether it was technology from the test bed applied to the MH-60 or a prototype for an entirely new design," Pike said.

    "I suspect from looking at the wreckage that it's a heavily modified MH-60 (Black Hawk) but that's erring on the side of caution."

    He surmised that the bin Laden raid helicopters were probably tested against foreign radar systems around the high-tech Area 51 installation. While there are other locations to do such testing, Pike said, "Groom Lake is the best place in the world where you're not going to be seen."

    Pike estimated there aren't many of these larger stealth helicopters in existence. "It would not be very many. In the low dozens."

    He said today's black program budgets are "somewhere in the billions and billions of dollars." They are as big as the so-called Star Wars era of the Reagan administration "except under Reagan we knew where it was being spent. Today we don't."

    The beginning of the military's stealth development efforts predated the Reagan administration when Ben Rich, Lockheed Martin's "father of the stealth," started the F-117 design in December 1978 at the Skunk Works plant in Palmdale, Calif. The full-blown combat version followed successful test flights at Area 51 of a prototype, dubbed Have Blue.

    The F-117 fighter-attack jet made its first flight on June 18, 1981, and the first war-fighting Nighthawks were based at the Tonopah Test Range.

    They launched the era of using stealth technology to attack heavily protected, high-value targets.

    After the stealth program was declassified in November 1988, the first warplanes were deployed in combat over Panama during Operation Just Cause in December 1989 to help spur the surrender of military dictator Manuel Noriega.

    In the Persian Gulf War in 1991, 36 F-117As bolstered the allied effort against Iraq by bombing targets in Baghdad.

    The original wing at Tonopah on Nellis Air Force Range was relocated to Holloman Air Force Base, N.M., after the Persian Gulf War, with the first plane arriving at Holloman in May 1992.

    Fifty-nine production models were made, with the last rolling off the line at Lockheed's Palmdale plant on July 12, 1990. Seven were destroyed in crashes, including one lost in combat over Yugoslavia on March 27, 1999, in the Kosovo war effort.

    Two F-117As spearheaded the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq during Operation Iraqi Freedom in March 2003. They flew unescorted over Baghdad and dropped bombs on Dora Farms, where intelligence sources thought Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein was hiding.

    Besides radar-evading helicopters, the F-117A with its oblique, batlike shape and secret black coating blazed the trail for today's stealth jet, the F-22 Raptor, which, with the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, is replacing the Nighthawk.

    On April 22, 2008, the last four Nighthawks arrived at the Tonopah Test Range where the fleet was retired. The black jets are mothballed in hangars in classified storage with their wings unbolted .

    Stealth craft in bin Laden raid has Nevada ties - News - ReviewJournal.com
     
  6. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Stealth Helicopter in Osama Bin Laden Raid Revealed

    05.05.2011 · Posted in World Latest News

    Osama bin Laden’s recent death is riddled with mysteries, the most recent of which is the stealth helicopter used to sneak up on him.

    ABC News reported that aviation analysts said commandos on the bin Laden mission used secret, stealth-modified helicopters.

    According to ABC News, there were two Blackhawk helicopters that brought the SEALs to bin Laden’s compound in Pakistan, and one of them scraped a compound wall, forcing it to make a rough landing. Since the chopper could no longer be used, the SEALs destroyed it.

    However, what survived the destruction was captured by cameras, specifically the tail section of the craft, which had intriguing modifications. CNN reported that this helicopter has previously been unknown to aviation experts.

    The aircraft has a modified tail boom, a noise-reducing covering on rear rotors, hard angles, flat surfaces, and a unique material used in stealth fighters.

    “This is a first,” Dan Goure, former Department of Defense official and vice president of the Lexington Institute, told ABC News. “You wouldn’t know that it was coming right at you. And that’s what’s important, because these are coming in fast and low, and if they aren’t sounding like they’re coming right at you, you might not even react until it’s too late…That was clearly part of the success.”

    Related ArticlesBin Laden Escape Plan: 500 Euros and Two Cell PhonesBin Laden’s neighbors in Abbottabad, Pakistan told the news agency that they were unaware of the helicopters until they flew directly above them. Bill Sweetman, editor and chief of Defense Technology International, commented that the rotor covering and a special rotor design suppressed the choppers’ noise.

    When ABC News asked to comment on the bird, a Pentagon official informed them that the Defense Department would “absolutely not.”

    Stealth Helicopter in Osama Bin Laden Raid Revealed | Manoshevitz
     
  7. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Stealth Helicopter in Osama Bin Laden Raid Revealed

    05.05.2011 · Posted in World Latest News

    Osama bin Laden’s recent death is riddled with mysteries, the most recent of which is the stealth helicopter used to sneak up on him.

    ABC News reported that aviation analysts said commandos on the bin Laden mission used secret, stealth-modified helicopters.

    According to ABC News, there were two Blackhawk helicopters that brought the SEALs to bin Laden’s compound in Pakistan, and one of them scraped a compound wall, forcing it to make a rough landing. Since the chopper could no longer be used, the SEALs destroyed it.

    However, what survived the destruction was captured by cameras, specifically the tail section of the craft, which had intriguing modifications. CNN reported that this helicopter has previously been unknown to aviation experts.

    The aircraft has a modified tail boom, a noise-reducing covering on rear rotors, hard angles, flat surfaces, and a unique material used in stealth fighters.

    “This is a first,” Dan Goure, former Department of Defense official and vice president of the Lexington Institute, told ABC News. “You wouldn’t know that it was coming right at you. And that’s what’s important, because these are coming in fast and low, and if they aren’t sounding like they’re coming right at you, you might not even react until it’s too late…That was clearly part of the success.”

    Related ArticlesBin Laden Escape Plan: 500 Euros and Two Cell PhonesBin Laden’s neighbors in Abbottabad, Pakistan told the news agency that they were unaware of the helicopters until they flew directly above them. Bill Sweetman, editor and chief of Defense Technology International, commented that the rotor covering and a special rotor design suppressed the choppers’ noise.

    When ABC News asked to comment on the bird, a Pentagon official informed them that the Defense Department would “absolutely not.”

    Stealth Helicopter in Osama Bin Laden Raid Revealed | Manoshevitz
     
  8. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Photos Of The Secret Stealth Helicopter Used In The Osama Raid

    Politics Buzz It appears the Seal team used two secret stealth choppers. One of the choppers crash landed after sustaining some damage. “We had to blow the helicopter,” CIA Director Leon Panetta said, “and that probably woke up a lot of people, including the Pakistanis.”

    jonsteinberg

    posted about 3 days ago


    [​IMG]
    (With reporting by The Associated Press) A Pakistani youngster shows metal pieces collected from the wheat field outside a house, where al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden was caught and killed in Abbottabad, Pakistan, on Tuesday, May 3, 2011. Local residents showed off small parts of what appeared to be a U.S. helicopter that Washington said malfunctioned and was disabled by the American commando strike team as they retreated, while Pakistan's leader on Tuesday denied suggestions that his country's security forces had sheltered Osama bin Laden. (AP Caption and Photo/Anjum Naveed)

    [​IMG]
    A Pakistani security official carries metal piece collected from the wheat field outside a house, where al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden was caught. (AP Caption and Photo/Anjum Naveed)

    [​IMG]
    A boy collects trophy pieces of metal from the wheat field outside the compound and house where al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden was caught and killed late Monday, in Abbottabad, Pakistan. (AP Caption and Photo/Anjum Naveed)

    [​IMG]
    A Pakistani youngster shows metal pieces collected from wheat field outside a house, seen background, where al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden lived in Abbottabad, Pakistan. (AP Caption and Photo/Anjum Naveed)

    [​IMG]
    Vehicles carry the wreckage of a helicopter that crashed next to the wall of a compound. (AP Caption and Photo/Aqeel Ahmed)

    [​IMG]
    A tractor trolley carries the wreckage of a helicopter that crashed next to the wall of a compound. (AP Caption and Photo/Aqeel Ahmed)

    Photos Of The Secret Stealth Helicopter Used In The Osama Raid: Pics, Videos, Links, News
     
  9. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Stealth Helos Used In Osama Raid

    Posted by Bill Sweetman at 5/3/2011 11:14 AM CDT


    Well, now we know why all of us had trouble ID'ing the helicopter that crashed, or was brought down, in the Osama raid.

    [​IMG]

    It was a secretly developed stealth helicopter, probably a highly modified version of an H-60 Blackhawk. Photos published in the Daily Mail and on the Secret Projects board show that the helicopter's tail features stealth-configured shapes on the boom and tip fairings, swept stabilizers and a "dishpan" cover over a non-standard five-or-six-blade tail rotor. It has a silver-loaded infra-red suppression finish similar to that seen on some V-22s.

    No wonder the team tried to destroy it. The photos show that they did a thorough job - except for the end of the tailboom, which ended up outside the compound wall. (It almost looks as if the helo's tail hit the wall on landing.)

    Stealth helicopter technology in itself is not new and was applied extensively to the RAH-66 Comanche. Priorities are usually different versus fixed-wing aircraft. Reducing noise and making it less conspicuous is the first job (more main and tail blades reduce the classic whop-whop signature). Listen here.

    Noise can also be reduced by aerodynamic modifications and flight control changes that make it possible to slow the rotor down, particularly in forward flight below maximum speed. Infra-red reduction measures are crucial -- the Comanche had an elaborate system of exhaust ducts and fresh-air mixers in its tailboom.

    [​IMG]

    Radar cross-section reduction is also possible - you can't make a helo as radar-stealthy as a fixed-wing airplane, because of all its moving parts, but on the other hand it is generally operating at low altitude in ground clutter, and is not an easy target. Reducing RCS also makes jamming more effective, whether from the aircraft itself or from a standoff jammer.

    The willingness to compromise this technology shows the importance of the mission in the eyes of US commanders -- and what we're seeing here also explains why Pakistani defenses didn't see the first wave (at least) coming in.

    Update: Quellish at Secret Projects mentions an ancestor system(Air America's Black Helicopter | Military Aviation | Air & Space Magazine)




    Stealth Helos Used In Osama Raid

     
  10. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Bin Laden Raid May Have Exposed Stealth Helo

    May 5, 2011

    By Bill Sweetman [email protected]


    [​IMG]

    A previously undisclosed, classified stealth helicopter apparently was part of the U.S. task force that killed Osama bin Laden in Pakistan on May 1.

    The exact type of helicopter is unknown but it appears to be a highly modified version of an H-60 Blackhawk. Photos disseminated via the European PressPhoto agency and attributed to an anonymous stringer show that the helicopter’s tail features stealth-configured shapes on the boom and the tail rotor hub fairings, swept stabilizers and a “dishpan” cover over a five-or-six-blade tail rotor. It has a silver-loaded infrared suppression finish similar to that seen on V-22s.

    See AviationWeek.com/ares for some photographs.

    The aircraft was damaged during the mission and abandoned. The mission team destroyed most of the airframe but its tail section landed outside the wall of the target compound and escaped demolition.

    Stealth helicopter technology is not new and was applied extensively to the Boeing/Sikorsky RAH-66 Comanche, cancelled in 2004. Compared with fixed-wing stealth, more emphasis is usually placed on noise and infrared signatures.

    Noise can be reduced and made less conspicuous by adding blades to the main and tail rotors. It can also be reduced by aerodynamic modifications and flight control changes that make it possible to reduce rotor rpm, particularly in forward flight below maximum speed. Infrared reduction measures are crucial - the Comanche had an elaborate system of exhaust ducts and fresh-air ejectors in its tailboom.

    Radar cross-section (RCS) reduction measures include flattened and canted body sides, making landing gear and other features retractable, and adding fairings over the rotor hubs. It usually is not possible to achieve the same - you can’t make a helo as radar-stealthy as a fixed-wing airplane, but helicopters generally operate at low altitude in ground clutter. Reducing RCS also makes jamming more effective, whether from the aircraft itself or from a standoff jammer.

    UH-60M File Photo: Sikorsky


    Bin Laden Raid May Have Exposed Stealth Helo | AVIATION WEEK
     
  11. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Top Secret Stealth Helicopter Program Revealed in Osama Bin Laden Raid

    Posted by China Military 10:06:00 AM,

    [​IMG]

    A U.S. defense official is concerned that the tail of a military helicopter left at Usama bin Laden's Abbottabad compound and widely considered to be a "stealth" model could be technologically exploited if it falls into Chinese or enemy hands.

    bin laden raid helicopter,bin laden raid photos,photos of bin laden raid helicopter

    A series of photos that a Pakistani security official sold to Reuters reportedly shows three of the men killed in the siege, as well as wreckage of the helicopter that the U.S. had to abandon due to engine failure after Navy SEALs killed the Al Qaeda leader and took his body away in another helicopter.

    The tail design of the helicopter seen in the new photos shows an unusual assembly, possibly hinting at a type of previously-unknown stealth capability, experts say.

    "It was a secretly developed stealth helicopter, probably a highly modified version of an H-60 Blackhawk," reported Bill Sweetman on Aviation Week's Ares blog. "The helicopter's tail features stealth-configured shapes on the boom and tip fairings, swept stabilizers and a "dishpan" cover over a non-standard five-or-six-blade tail rotor. It has a silver-loaded infra-red suppression finish similar to that seen on some V-22s."

    An unamed retired special operations aviator told the Army Times a similar story, that the helicopters that flew the Navy SEALs on their mission were a radar-evading variant of the special operations MH-60 Black Hawk.

    The helicopter's low-observable technology is similar to that of the F-117 Stealth Fighter he said. "It really didn't look like a traditional Black Hawk," he said. It had "hard edges, sort of like an … F-117, you know how they have those distinctive edges and angles — that's what they had on this one."

    The U.S. expects Pakistan to transfer the wreckage back, the Defense official told Fox News, with discussions likely taking place at the highest levels.

    Hours before Reuters released the photos, the White House announced President Obama had decided not to release a photo taken of bin Laden after he was killed by Navy SEALs. Bin Laden's body was taken from the compound and later buried at sea.

    "It is not in our national security interest to allow those images ... to become icons to rally opinion against the United States," White House Press Secretary Jay Carney said Wednesday. "There is no question at all that Usama bin Laden is dead. He will not walk this earth again."

    But the photos obtained by Reuters show three other men lying in pools of blood at bin Laden's compound, allegedly unarmed.

    Two men photographed were dressed in traditional Pakistani clothing, while another was in a T-shirt. The photos showed the men with blood streaming from their mouths, noses and ears, Reuters reports.

    Their hands and arms were often cropped out of the pictures as they were taken from a close-up distance. No weapons were seen on their bodies, but one of the photos showed what appeared to be a child's plastic green and orange water pistol lying near a man's shoulder.

    The photos were said to have been taken starting an hour after the U.S. raid on the facility. Reuters believes the metadata of the photos -- and their similarity to independent photos taken at the compound -- validate their authenticity.


    Top Secret Stealth Helicopter Program Revealed in Osama Bin Laden Raid ~ China Military Report
     
  12. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    More photos from location:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  13. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
  14. JAYRAM

    JAYRAM 2 STRIKE CORPS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,274
    Likes Received:
    313
    Location:
    North Frontier, The Mighty Himalaya's
    Mission helo was secret stealth Black Hawk

    By Sean D. Naylor - Staff writer
    Posted : Wednesday May 4, 2011 18:08:39 EDT


    [​IMG]

    The helicopters that flew the Navy SEALs on the mission to kill Osama bin Laden were a radar-evading variant of the special operations MH-60 Black Hawk, according to a retired special operations aviator.

    The helicopter’s low-observable technology is similar to that of the F-117 Stealth Fighter the retired special operations aviator said. “It really didn’t look like a traditional Black Hawk,” he said. It had “hard edges, sort of like an … F-117, you know how they have those distinctive edges and angles — that’s what they had on this one.”

    In addition, “in order to keep the radar cross-section down, you have to do something to treat the windshield,” he said. If a special coating was applied to the windshield it is “very plausible” that would make the helicopter more difficult to fly for pilots wearing night-vision goggles, he said. The helicopters carrying the SEALs arrived over the bin Laden compound at about 1 a.m. Monday local time. One crash-landed in the courtyard and was so badly damaged it was unable to take off again.

    That crash landing might have been caused by a phenomenon known as “settling with power,” which occurs when a helicopter descends too quickly because its rotors cannot get the lift required from the turbulent air of their own downwash. “It’s hard to settle with power in a Black Hawk, but then again, if they were using one of these [low-observable helicopters], working at max gross weight, it’s certainly plausible that they could have because they would have been flying so heavy,” the retired special operations aviator said, noting that low-observable modifications added “several hundred pounds” to the weight of the MH-60, which already weighs about 500 to 1000 pounds more than a regular UH-60 Black Hawk.

    The special operations troops on the bin Laden mission destroyed the stricken aircraft — most likely using thermite grenades — but the resultant fire left the helicopter’s tail boom, tail rotor assembly and horizontal stabilizers intact in the compound’s courtyard.

    Photographs of the wreckage taken the next day raced around the Internet, creating a firestorm of speculation among military aviation enthusiasts because the tail of the helicopter did not resemble any officially acknowledged U.S. military airframe.

    This was to be expected, the retired special operations aviator said. “Certain parts of the fuselage, the nose and the tail had these various almost like snap-on parts to them that gave it the very unique appearance,” he said. He and another source referred to the disc-shaped device that is seen covering the tail rotor in the photographs as a “hubcap.”

    If the radar-evading technology worked, it “would be a true statement” to say that the use of the low-observable Black Hawks was evidence that the United States gave Pakistani authorities no advance warning of the mission, the retired special operations aviator added.

    The low-observable program started with AH-6 Little Bird special operations attack helicopters in the 1980s, said the aviator. During the 1990s U.S. Special Operations Command worked with the Lockheed-Martin Skunk Works division, which also designed the F-117, to refine the radar-evading technology and apply it to the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment’s MH-60s, he said. USSOCOM awarded a contract to Boeing to modify several MH-60s to the low-observable design “in the ’99 to 2000 timeframe,” he said.

    Initial plans called for the low-observable Black Hawks to be formed into a new unit commanded by a lieutenant colonel and located at a military facility in Nevada, the retired special operations aviator said. “The intent was always to move it out west where it could be kept in a covered capability,” he said.

    USSOCOM planned to assign about 35 to 50 personnel to the unit, the retired special operations aviator said. “There were going to be four [low-observable] aircraft, they were going to have a couple of ‘slick’ unmodified Black Hawks, and that was going to be their job was to fly the low-observables.”

    SOCOM canceled those plans “within the last two years,” but not before at least some of the low-observable helicopters had been delivered to the Nevada facility, the retired aviator said. “I don’t know if it was for money or if it was because the technology was not achieving the reduction in the radar cross-section that they were hoping for,” he said. In the meantime, MH-60 Black Hawk crews from the 160th’s 1st Battalion, headquartered at Fort Campbell, Ky., would rotate to Nevada to train on the stealthy aircraft, he said.

    The low-observable MH-60s were armed with the same sort of door mini-guns as standard MH-60s, he said. “There was not a DAP conversion,” he added, referring to the MH-60 variant known as the Direct Action Penetrator, which is equipped with stub wings upon which can be fitted a variety of armaments.

    The early versions of the low-observable Black Hawks were not fitted with air-to-air refueling probes, the retired special operations aviator said. “The probe would disrupt the ability to reduce the radar cross-section,” he added. “There was no way to put some kind of a hub or cowling over the probe that would make it stealthy.” However, he said he did not know whether the models that flew the bin Laden mission had been equipped with such probes.

    USSOCOM spokesman Army Col. Tim Nye said his command had no comment for this story.

    Marcus Weisgerber contributed to this story.

    Mission helo was secret stealth Black Hawk - Army News | News from Afghanistan & Iraq - Army Times
     
  15. ganesh177

    ganesh177 Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2009
    Messages:
    863
    Likes Received:
    295
    Location:
    Pune, Incredible India
    If it was really that high profile helo then why dint US put behind its weight to collect the wreckage from the crash site, instead of risking them ending up in chinese hand ?
     
  16. nimo_cn

    nimo_cn Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2009
    Messages:
    3,491
    Likes Received:
    592
    Americans are very good at keeping their state-of-the-art weapons as top secret. Ironically, US had always been pointing its fingers at other countries, lecturing about transparency. If not this crash accident, how long is it gonna take for them to disclose this stealth helicopter?
     
  17. chex3009

    chex3009 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    915
    Likes Received:
    161
    Location:
    IL
    The Chinese by now would surely have got their hands on the tail of this stealth Helo...
     
  18. Patriot

    Patriot Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,760
    Likes Received:
    538
    Location:
    Ahmedabad, Gujarat, India

    Rare Earth Woes Could Mean Trouble for U.S. Stealth Fleet


    [​IMG]

    Ever since Osama bin Laden’s demise, aviation sleuths have been trying to figure out what was the mystery copter that delivered Seal Team Six. I’ve been pondering a much geekier question: what was in the mystery copter?

    Odds are, rare earth elements played important roles in producing the elusive aircraft. After all, these elements have been essential to everything from stealth technologies to targeting mechanisms to temperature-resistant magnets for aerospace components. Many missile designs have used samarium-cobalt permanent magnet motors. Joint Direct Attack Munitions (JDAMs) have used neodymium-iron-boron magnets, which have a unique ability to withstand extreme temperatures without losing magnetism. Radar, phosphors for fluorescent lighting, and night vision goggles require rare earths too. Think your basic ground vehicles are safe? Rare earths are used in automotive catalytic converters and for refining petroleum products. These minerals are used to make smart phones, so you can bet we need them for Darpa’s universal translators.

    So what are these rare earths that are so critical to defense tech? Rare earths are a class of minerals with similarly unique physical and chemical properties, including yttrium, lanthanum, neodymium, samarium, europium, and others. If you look at a periodic table, they comprise the separated two rows at the bottom (with a few others sometimes classified as rare earths).

    The minerals aren’t actually rare in nature — they’re just not found in heavy concentration, as I describe in my report, Elements of Security: Mitigating the Risks of U.S. Dependence on Critical Minerals, which comes out Thursday. But the rare earths are increasingly part of Washington lexicon these days. Most of the fuss involves the fact that China, supplier of some 95% of global consumption, continues to limit exports and played its near-monopoly card in a 2010 dispute with Japan. The market has grown so tight that the price of neodymium last week jumped to $283 per kilogram from $42 a year ago, and samarium rose from $18.50 a year ago to $146 per kilogram.

    [​IMG]

    At the Pentagon, the concern today is that rare earths supplies to the United States happen to exhibit a perfect storm of vulnerabilities: rising global demand; a dearth of producers; out-dated stockpiling policies; an inability to ability to substitute more readily-available minerals; skyrocketing prices.

    Perhaps worse, there is a looming problem that the Defense Department doesn’t always understand its supply chains down to the raw material level now that the defense industrial base is thoroughly globalized and dual-use with civilian applications. Ask a Pentagon supplier which rare earths it needs to produce a drone or a reconnaissance satellite, for example, and the odds a good you’ll get a shoulder-shrug in return. Those kind of micro details are up to some sub-sub-sub-sub-contractor.

    The Department of Defense has been trying to dig out the information it needs to address rare earths concerns. But it’s not enough for some members of Congress, who wrote a letter to Secretary Gates last January complaining that the military wasn’t giving the issue. Meanwhile, a common refrain from some defense analysts and active Pentagon officials over the past few years has been that the market will sort out any problems. Never mind the extreme market manipulation that already governs minerals production, from environmental regulations to allowing access to public lands, or that international trade disputes often lead private companies to call on the U.S. government to get involved when things get too heated.

    This year’s rare earths tussling between the Hill and the Pentagon is not too shocking; the causes and solutions to America’s mineral troubles are hard to get straight. U.S. companies and federal agencies can’t simply buy their way out of a shortage if the only sellers aren’t selling. It takes years to get rare earths production up and running. The timeline extends up to and beyond a decade for mines that have never produced rare earths given the massive technological investments needed to process individual minerals. (Each element is found in trace amounts in any given chunk of mined rare earths, and each must be physically or chemically separated and processed in often-elaborate, multi-stage processes.) Even then, many rare earth mines are raising capital by selling their future products, preventing others from accessing the added production capacity.

    To boot, many myths circulate weekly in the mainstream media. Is Afghanistan going to bring in trillions from minerals? Not any time soon. Is China unreasonable in restricting rare earth exports? Not if you consider its domestic high-tech manufacturing needs and concerns over the environmental impacts of its rare earth mining methods.

    Still, it doesn’t have to be this way. In contrast to the Pentagon’s reactive stance, the Department of Energy is identifying now what minerals are must-haves for tomorrow’s energy innovation — and what minerals are most likely to cause rare earth-style problems down the road. In other words, it is proactively managing the problem.

    The Defense Department can do the same. Additionally, it can provide incentives or require suppliers to share raw material information.The Pentagon is in the process of updating its stockpiling policies (though we have yet to see whether this update will go far enough). The Department of Defense can also invest more heavily in developing substitutes for some of the functions rare earths play. Even thinking creatively to better understand how minerals can combine with emerging geopolitical trends – say, incorporating enduring supply disruptions into Asia- or Latin America-focused war games – could go a long way toward preventing future problems. There’s a good chance that preventing minerals problems from grabbing major headlines would be more cost-effective than reacting to problems after they surface.

    This story – and the ability to reduce future risks to U.S. interests – doesn’t end with rare earths. The new stealth Joint Strike Fighters can’t be made without rhenium, a particularly heat-resistant mineral used in alloying metals that today we import almost entirely from just two countries, Chile and Kazakhstan. Gallium, tantalum, niobium and other minerals exhibit the same risks of supply disruptions, suppliers leveraging exports for political gain, and cost overruns that make rare earths so problematic today.

    Unless America gets ahead of this problem, the United States will be unnecessarily ceding strategic advantage to commodity suppliers — all over pretty modest quantities of rocks and metals. Minerals should not command foreign policy or derail defense procurement. Even when they go into things as cool as stealth copters.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2011
  19. Patriot

    Patriot Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,760
    Likes Received:
    538
    Location:
    Ahmedabad, Gujarat, India

    A Black Hawk View on bin Laden


    Cynthia Iris speaks with US Army Black Hawk pilot Col. Paul Bricker about his take on the special forces mission against Osama bin Laden and why it was successful.

    The US Army’s Task Force 160 (Special Operations Aviation Regiment/the ‘Night Stalkers’) came into being as a result of the problems and failure of Desert One in 1980 in Iran as the United States tried to rescue the American hostages. What do you think the military has learned since that operation that helped the helicopter assault succeed with the bin Laden raid in Pakistan last week?


    [​IMG]

    I’ve never served in the 160th, but I’m relatively familiar with the organization. The senior leadership of the military determined that we needed some special capabilities, some niche capabilities, and one of those capabilities we need is with rotary link aircraft, helicopters. We needed to invest in a small organization, because it’s going to be expensive; helicopters are expensive. We were going to specially recruit and select warrant officers, commissioned officers, and sergeants that are in Army aviation, put them into operational units and, for the most part, not take them out. We developed a bench of incredibly skilled aviators, especially, that can operate at night. That’s why they’re called the ‘Night Stalkers.’ All the forces operate at night.

    They come out (of those units) occasionally, but to a large degree, because we’re investing in them, because we want them to have the kind of skills that you saw the other night in that operation, you have to keep those folks in an organization like the 160th so that they can maintain those skill sets.

    One of the other things the Army has done is that they’ve invested in special helicopters that have special equipment on them—and I’m not talking about the ‘low observable’ aircraft. Since I came into Army aviation in 1985, they’ve always had the leading-edge technologies, whether it be in the cockpit, in the airframe, with regard to capabilities. That has benefited the rest of the Army as well, because some of those technologies then cascade into the rest of the army. But their aircraft have always been a little flashier with regard to the capabilities that they bring. They had GPS before anybody had GPS. They had specially mounted weapons systems. They had rescue hoists. They had special armour on the inside of the aircraft. They had forward-looking infrared radar, avoidance radar, air-to-air refuelling probes.

    This all gave us this great capability that has been called upon on various occasions to put special folks into special places and pull them out. But you can always trace that back to Desert One, where we had, if I’m not mistaken, Marine Corps pilots flying Army helicopters operating off of Navy ships, rallying in the desert with an Air Force aircraft. So when you peel the onion back, we needed these capabilities resident, we needed a certain select unit. So there are Navy units. There are Army units and there are Air Force units. And to a large degree, they all have their own training and selection programme.

    As an aviation commander, I had 155 helicopters in Southern Afghanistan last year, and about 3,200 folks. Some of my warrant officer aviators and NCOs were assessed and were selected to go fly in the 160th, and they’re flying in the 160th today. It doesn’t surprise me that they (the Night Stalkers) were able to do what they did in the raid. They do a lot of things every single night in Afghanistan and Iraq that people never hear about.

    Are you worried that we’re here hearing too much too often about what should be, or used to be, secret operations? The bin Laden operation opened up a lot of press coverage and speculation, especially with the tail rotor of a helicopter left behind.


    This is kind of the trade-off when you live in a society where you have freedom of speech, freedom of the press, and you’ve got so many people that want to share in good news. I think it would have been much more convenient had that component of the aircraft not been left there because that makes it really complicated. We invest a lot of money in technology. It’s one of the game-changing aspects of the United States military. It’s because of our investment in research and development, and those things aren’t cheap. Unfortunately, there others who want to exploit what we’ve invested in. We have the greatest scientists in the world that are teaming with smart folks in our military to help develop technologies that give our troops the advantage.

    The helicopters used in the raid weren’t the first US military helicopters with stealth capability. Didn’t the Comanche helicopter have it?


    It was a desirable aspect of the Comanche. Of course, there was so much we expected of Comanche. It was an aircraft ahead of its time, and technology couldn’t keep up. But there were some spinoffs with regard to technology that we’ve gone ahead and, I think, added into current day Army aircraft and other aircraft. The Blackhawk, for example—the Blackhawk is in the Navy, it’s in the Air Force, it’s in the Army. And it’s in other nations around the world. It’s a tremendously capable aircraft.

    Do you think the fact that the rotor section got left behind and Pakistan now has it – is there a realistic possibility they’re going to share technology with China?


    I hope not. But I think anything’s possible when you’re dealing in this environment. I would hope that that the component would be turned back to the United States so that we could safeguard it.

    When you first heard about the bin Laden raid, what were the biggest things that you thought could go wrong from a pilot’s point of view?


    Well, when I looked at the distances. I’m somewhat familiar with that portion of Afghanistan, having spent quite a bit of time there. I figure they probably had to refuel and launch from one of these bases that’s right on the border. When you look at the distance to Islamabad, and then based on the reporting, it was about 30 miles north of that. Well, that’s about 150 to 170 nautical miles. If we just do a planning factor of 120 knots or 110 knots, it’s going to tell you, ‘wow, that was like a five-hour operation.’ So when you start thinking about a five-hour operation, in somebody else’s backyard, you don’t want anything to go wrong, because if anything goes wrong, it’s above the fold stuff in the Washington Post. So you’ve got to have second and third order of contingencies addressed, and we’re not even talking about taking enemy fire and getting shot down—we’re talking about penetrating the airspace, flying the mission profile, an airplane that runs into problems. So the contingency, if you have an aircraft go down, then you’ve always got to think back to Somalia. What happens when an aircraft goes down? It’s like a magnet for jihadists. And how quickly can I get a Quick Reaction Force (QRF) in there to secure it and get the folks out? And then what happens if somebody gets hurt?

    Is there a higher rate of helicopter failure in the military than you would expect at this point? It seems that more helicopters go down than you might think.


    When you look at the literally millions of hours we fly, it’s a miracle we don’t have more accidents or more aircraft go down. So we’re flying in an incredibly hazardous environment. We’re flying a lot at night. We’re flying with people shooting at you, and we’re doing pretty well. These crews, we’ve got the best-trained crews that I’ve ever seen in my entire career, I think since Vietnam.

    Why?

    They are flying their trails off. Most of these warrant officer aviators and commissioned officers have three times the amount of flight time I did when I was their age. It’s because they’ve got repetitive, two, three, four tours down range where they’re getting hundreds and hundreds of hours. I had some guys who came back last year with 1,000 hours in one year, which is almost unheard of. When I was growing up, there were some officers would go their whole career and get 1,000 hours. Now we’ve got majors and captains that are at 1,500, 2,000 hours because of all the flying that they’ve done down range.

    When you get that kind of flight time, the quality of your force goes up. I think accidents have gone down relatively speaking from the beginning of the war to where we are now. We’ve incorporated our lessons learned, our tactics, techniques and procedures. We’ve put modifications on the aircraft to help deal with the environment. For example, with the new Chinooks that we’re putting in now, we’ve got the capability to shoot an approach into a complete ‘zero-zero’—basically you can’t see in front of your aircraft, but you’ve got a capability now where you can do an approach to a hover and then mechanically bring it down to the ground because we’ve got sensors that are helping the crew by providing information. When we first started the war, we didn’t have that in our aircraft.

    We’ve lost a lot of aircraft in dust landing conditions. So, the Army has invested heavily in this ‘reset programme.’ Reset is when we bring aircraft back from the theatre. We rip them down to the frame, and we replace components. We clean out all the dirt, and we do a comprehensive ‘depot level’ evaluation of all our aircraft. That’s helping extend not only the life, but it’s also identifying problems before they happen. In addition, the crews are more experienced—that helps, but it’s still dangerous.

    I don’t know what caused that aircraft to go down in bin Laden’s compound. There’s a lot of speculation over what caused that aircraft to go down. It could have been enemy fire. Of course, nobody wants to believe that.

    What do you think ensured it was successful getting out of Pakistani airspace undetected?


    When you look at the terrain over there, it’s very challenging to be able to see ‘electronically’ the border between Afghanistan and Pakistan. So if you pick some valleys, you can probably beat it. We go through pre-mission planning, and if we’re trying to evade something, you can put up receivers, and you understand at what altitude that radar is going to be effective. So if you fly below that radar, then that would be a way in which you could conceal your ingress and egress. Also, we would have airborne command and control aircraft in Afghanistan on big operations.

    The US got bin Laden in what has to be considered a phenomenally successful counterterrorism operation. You’ve had years of experience in Afghanistan. What do you think of continuing a counterinsurgency operation with the big success of counterterrorism at this point?


    Bin Laden was the head of al-Qaeda. Our counterinsurgency campaign in Afghanistan is really focused on winning the people. So they’re separate and distinct. Now, if I was a mid- or a high- level insurgent, I would be aware that they just nailed bin Laden. Most of those folks who are operating in Afghanistan are already running tired and scared because similar forces have been hunting those guys down for the last few years. If you can separate the head from the body, it enables the conventional as well as the other forces that are operating on the ground to really protect the people.

    As for the counterinsurgency campaign—this summer is going to be a critical period. I was in Afghanistan (in 2009 and 2010) in Kandahar and this is where we’re going to understand the success we’ve had with providing the security for the Afghan people.

    Do you think there is a wedge now between the Taliban and al-Qaeda out of this?


    I would think that this would perhaps create an opportunity for the Karzai government to be a little bit more appealing to the Taliban. So some reconciliation or reintegration. I think it was Secretary of State Hillary Clinton who stated in February that it was US policy now to support the reconciliation process with Afghan President Hamid Karzai. These are venues, opportunities for the Taliban to reintegrate into Afghan society. I believe that as long as they are willing to operate peacefully and within the boundaries of Afghan civil society, that they would be welcome at the table.

    For a soldier, that is somewhat frustrating, because we’ve lost a lot of men and women in Afghanistan fighting the Taliban. But at the end of the day, it’s their country. This counterinsurgency campaign is created to win the people. If the people elect Karzai, and they have a political process that’s peaceful, and it includes this party called the Taliban, maybe it will be the Taliban in name only. I don’t think that they’re going to tolerate the kind of violence that the Taliban have inflicted on their people as the ‘new normal.’ The Afghans we ran into, they hated the Taliban; they feared the Taliban. And that repressive justice does nothing for their children. Just like we do, they want what’s best for their kids. They want for the next generation better than what they had.

    You’ve had a long career in the military. From your experience and viewpoint, does it make sense for the head of the CIA to now be a military general, and for the new head of the Defence Department to come from heading up the civilian CIA?


    I think both their records are incredible, and Gen. David Petraeus is, I think, the closest thing that our generation has seen of a ‘George Marshall’ type leader. Gen. Petraeus has given so much to this nation. He understands Afghanistan, he understands Iraq. He can continue to serve our nation at a time when there aren’t a lot of folks that have the kind of background that he has. He’s a statesman.

    How do you think he’ll fit in with the mission and culture of the CIA, where it’s an intelligence-gathering, civilian, secretive agency, not a military organization?


    He’s going to do great. He’s the kind of leader who wants you to kind of check your rank at the door when he has his sessions. He expects his people to speak the truth to him. He has the ability to get the best out of his people. When you have a session with him, you think he’s really interested in how you think, what you think. I was sitting next to him in a meeting in Afghanistan in 2009. He was genuinely interested in the way in which we were working with the Canadians in an area west of Kandahar City. Petraeus probably knew the answers to the questions before he asked them. But this gives him an opportunity to confirm or deny what he thinks. He asked very probing questions and was constantly taking notes.

    We’ve been much closer involved with the intelligence agencies in the battlefield today because tactical intelligence is critical to our soldiers. And so we get information when we’re deployed. Sometimes we don’t know where it comes from, but I’ve got to believe that there’s a much greater consensus and much better ability for folks who work at certain levels to ensure that the folks who need the information are getting it. He understands what the war fighters need, and I think he’ll just increase that focus as the director of Central Intelligence.

    Col. Paul Bricker has just completed a year at Harvard University’s Weatherhead Center as Harvard's Senior US Army Fellow. Prior to this posting, he commanded the 82nd Airborne Division's Combat Aviation Brigade, and recently completed a 12-month deployment in Kandahar Afghanistan in support of the International Security and Assistance Force. Col. Bricker has served in a variety of command and staff positions in the US, South Korea, Afghanistan twice, and Iraq.This interview was conducted by US-based reporter Cynthia Iris.
     
  20. sandeepdg

    sandeepdg Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2009
    Messages:
    2,333
    Likes Received:
    216
    Location:
    Gurgaon/Noida
    China may have examined US stealth chopper: Report

    WASHINGTON: Pakistan's intelligence service probably let Chinese military engineers examine the wreckage of a supersecret US stealth helicopter that crashed during the May raid on Osama bin Laden's compound in Abbottabad, The New York Times reported late on Sunday.

    Citing unnamed officials familiar with the matter, the newspaper said that US intelligence agencies had concluded that it was likely that Chinese engineers -- at the invitation of Pakistani intelligence operatives -- had taken detailed photographs of the severed tail of the Black Hawk helicopter equipped with classified technology designed to elude radar.

    Relations between the United States and Pakistan have been under strain following the raid that killed bin Laden, who was found living near Pakistan's main military academy.

    President Barack Obama's administration recently suspended about one-third of its $2.7 billion annual defense aid to Pakistan, but assured Islamabad it was committed to a $7.5 billion civilian assistance package approved in 2009.

    US Navy Seals that conducted the raid tried to destroy the helicopter after it crashed at bin Laden's compound, but the tail section of the aircraft remained largely intact, the report said.

    The US officials cautioned that they did not have definitive proof that the Chinese visited Abbottabad, and they said that Pakistani officials denied showing the advanced helicopter technology to any other foreign government.

    The US case is based mostly on intercepted conversations, in which Pakistani officials discussed inviting the Chinese to the crash site, The Times noted.

    One official told the newspaper that intelligence officials were "certain" that Chinese engineers had been able to photograph the helicopter and even walk away with samples of the wreckage.

    Reaction from China was skeptical. "We express deep doubts about this. Such a thing would never happen," a Chinese defence ministry spokesman, who did not give his name, told AFP Monday.

    Foreign ministry spokeswoman Jiang Yu in May dismissed the notion that China had asked to see the wreckage of the US helicopter as "ridiculous."

    China may have examined US stealth chopper: Report - The Times of India
     
  21. agentperry

    agentperry Senior Member Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2010
    Messages:
    3,022
    Likes Received:
    678
    Location:
    delhi
    guys dont you think we are over-estimating china's capability of reverse engineering.. earlier we used to think that china reverse engineered Su-27, F-16/Lavi but later on it came out to be wrong and it was the developer who had sold the knowledge and tech of these planes. i think though china might learn one or two thing but making a rip-off of stealth black hawk will be very difficult if not impossible
     

Share This Page