Something's wrong at heart of Islam

Discussion in 'International Politics' started by Yusuf, Sep 22, 2012.

  1. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    'Something's wrong at heart of Islam' - TOI Mobile | The Times of India Mobile Site

    PARIS: Author Salman Rushdie, who lived in hiding for nine years under a death sentence from Iran's supreme leader, told Le Monde in an interview published on Thursday that something had gone wrong at the heart of Islam.

    "Something has gone wrong at the heart of Islam. It is quite recent. I remember when I was young, many cities in the Muslim world were cosmopolitan cities with a lot of culture," he said. "It is a tragedy that this culture has regressed to this point, like a self-inflicted wound. The Islam in which I grew up was open, influenced by Sufism and Hinduism, and not like the one which is spreading rapidly at the moment."

    "There is a limit beyond which you cannot blame the West any more," he said.
     
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  3. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Totally agree with him.
     
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  4. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Nothing is wrong with Islam.

    It is just that the clergy has taken a grip over the Muslims, and this has been whipped up to a tyrannical stranglehold because of the backlash on the War on Terror, which has become a cause célèbre to exploit.

    The violence unleashed thereafter has caught the attention of the world, since that violence is affecting one and all.

    The Muslim clergy have made the situation worse, by giving fatwas on even trifling issues as also indirectly agitating the Muslim people, alienating the community further from the mainstream.

    What is worse, they not only take up cudgels with other religions, but also incite sectarian violence against different sects of Islam itself!

    That is the irony and tragedy of the issue.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2012
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  5. KS

    KS Bye bye DFI Veteran Member

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    Islam does not condone influences of Hinduism in it. So in this case Rushdie is clearly wrong.
     
  6. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    You have misread him.

    He wrote

    In Kashmir, the land from which Rushdie is, Hinduism has indeed influenced Kashmiri Islam which is Sufi Islam.

    I am selectively quoting Muslim poets only to prove the point.


    Shams Faqir: - “Zaanwale kar zaen yaar harmukh vichu deedar, parde zal az darde naar harmukh vichu deedar”.

    Shah Gafoor: - Yyoth yith zanamas kaenh chune larun, darinay darun soham soo; Brahma, Vishnu, Maheshwar gharun, darinay darun soham soo.

    Azad Zargar: - Harmukh bozmay chon keel Kalo, Ha valo baal chas praraeney Ahmed Shah Batwari:- “Vishnas ti Krishnas Raesh Maidanas, Mahaganesh tate kas kare namaskar; Gange-raaz byuthum Gange-bal thanas, jan chum mileth jahaanas seet”,

    Ayub Betab: - “Dyanas manz mas Shankar chunho parvati mozaan, kamdevas van baan chalevaeth yokun karehaes dhyaan”
    .
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2012
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  7. KS

    KS Bye bye DFI Veteran Member

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    ^^ Exactly. That is something what Quran does not condone. it is called shirk if I am not mistaken.
     
  8. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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  9. parijataka

    parijataka Senior Member Senior Member

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    One word - regressive Wahhabi ideology being propagated by Saudi petro dollars since the 1970's.
     
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  10. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Many scholars and jurists may join issue with the above statement. They perceive sufism as an unacceptable distortion of Islamic beliefs and way of life. They find the rituals and practices as well as the beliefs of many sufis repugnant to the teachings of Islam. They argue that sufism has brought about a confusion in the minds of its believers leading them away from the simplicity and purity of the glorious faith.

    Many orientalists, on the other hand, do not accept that sufism has a direct link with Islam and reject the idea that it has evolved from the consciousness inspired by the Quraan or the teachings of Muhammad. They affirm that its origin is firmly embedded in the mysticism of the Jew and Christian hermits and monks of the time and that their traditions not only inspired but also dictated the evolution of sufism.....

    Suffism and Islam





    WHAT IS A SUFI AND WHAT IS SUFISM?

    Sufi: a follower of Sufism

    Sufism: a sect that has introduced many innovated practices and beliefs into the religion of Islam while claiming to be mystical

    Sufism was not known in the time of the Prophet (may Allah raise his rank and grant him peace) or his Companions, nor was it well known in the first three generations after them. It first appeared in Basrah in Iraq, where some people went to extremes in worship and in avoiding the worldly life, something which is admonished in the Quran:

    "The Monasticism which they invented for themselves; We did not prescribe it for them." Qur'an 57:27

    Sufis belong to the Illumist school of philosophy which holds that knowledge and awareness is brought about in the soul by spiritual exercises. Orthodox Islam holds that one can achieve true knowledge and awareness through the acts of worship that exist in the Quran and Sunnah.

    Sufism is often, willfully or otherwise, referred to by Sufis themselves, or by orientalists, as "Islamic mysticism", in order to give the impression that Islam is either wholly or partly an esoteric religion, with a set of dogmatic rituals to be understood by the elite alone-in this class, the Sufis! Unfortunately, the lack of any sound critical analysis of the subject in the English language allows these orientalists to flood the English and North American book market with literature that stands unchallenged, and dupes naive Muslims into believing that true salvation can only be attained by pursuing a mystical order. Their vain goal strips Islam of its Universality. The Sufis have introduced many innovations into Islam in the name of Tasawwuf and have justified such practises by fabricated statements and unsound arguments

    Although many sects have appeared throughout the ages, none have outlasted as long and spread their effects into the homes of so many as Sufism has. The emotional attachment that a countless number of Muslims have towards this sect is so powerful that any analysis should be purely from an objective perspective; Its conclusions however leave no doubt as to the alien nature of Sufi teachings that have infiltrated into the religion that our beloved Prophet (s.a.w.s) left us upon.

    True Muslims should be content with the name "Muslims given to them by Almighty Allah as he says: which means,

    "He has chosen you (to conform to His religion) and has imposed no difficulty upon you in religion, the religion of your father Ibrahim. He named you 'Muslims' both before (in the preceding Divine Scriptures) and in this Book." (22.78)

    Ibn Kathir elaborated on this verse, saying: "Allah has chosen the Muslims, honoured them, and distinguished them exclusively of other nations by the most honourable Messenger and the most perfect religion, and He has not overburdened them with more than they can bear.

    Sufis believe that their teachers are also a source for legislation in worship, as they will order them to carry out acts of worship that have no basis in either the Quran or the Sunnah. The extremists from amongst them often claim that Allah dwells within His creation (i.e. in people's hearts, internal organs etc.). Consequently, they ascribe to their Sufi teachers attributes and powers which only belong to Allah, such as the knowledge of the unseen.

    They often claim that the texts of the Quran and the Sunnah have an outer, apparent meaning, and as well, an inner, hidden meaning. They hold that the outer, apparent meaning is known to those who practice orthodox Islam, while the inner and hidden meanings of the Quran and Sunnah are known only to their teacher and order. These teachers will often claim that since they have advanced to the inner and hidden meaning of Islam, they no longer need to pray or fast, something that not even the Prophets were excused from.

    Like many other Sufi doctrines, pantheism is adopted from man-made religions and philosophies, as confirmed by S. R. Sharda in his book, Sufi Thought

    "Sufi literature of the post-Timur period shows a significant change in thought content. It is pantheistic. After the fall of Muslim orthodoxy from power at the centre of India for about a century, due to the invasion of Timur, the Sufi became free from the control of the Muslim orthodoxy and consorted with Hindu saints, who influenced them to an amazing extent. The Sufi adopted Monism and wifely devotion from the Vaishnava Vedantic school and Bhakti and Yogic practices from the Vaishnava Vedantic school. By that time, the popularity of the Vedantic pantheism among the Sufis had reached its zenith."

    If Sufis insist that they are Muslims, then what is the sense of identifying themselves with Sufism rather than with Islam. The word "Sufism" was not familiar to those who lived in the first and the best three generations of as-Salaf as-Salih (the pious predecessors) who were commanded by Allah the Exalted and His Messenger Muhammad (s.a.w.s)

    Ibn Taymiyyah makes this clear in his 'Majmu al-Fatawa: 'Some people accept everything of sufism, what is right as well as what is wrong; others reject it totally, both what is wrong and what is right, as some scholars of kalam and fiqh do. The right attitude towards sufism, or any other thing, is to accept what is in agreement with the Quran and the Sunnah, and reject what does not agree'" [Majmu Fatawa Shaykh al-Islam, Vol. 10, p. 82]

    http://www.allaahuakbar.net/sufism/what_is_a_sufi_and_what_is_sufis.htm
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2012
  11. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Martin Lings, himself a practicing Sufi, in his work What is Sufism?, states that “Prince Dara Shikoh (d.1619), the Sufi son of the Mogul Emperor Shah Jahan, was able to affirm that Sufism and Advaita Vedantism [Hinduism] are essentially the same, with a surface difference of terminology.”34 Prince Dara Shikoh was also responsible for the translation of the Bhagavad-Gita, the Yoga Vasishtha, and the Upanishads into Persian.35 Seyyed Hossein Nasr acknowledges that “many Sufis in India called Hinduism the religion of Adam,” and, “[the] orthodox Naqshbandi saint Mirza Mazhar Jan Janan considered the Vedas as divinely inspired.”36

    While Sufi teachings have been influenced by various religions, their practices also bear close similarities to those of Hinduism and other mystical religions of the East. The Sufi orders are led by shaikhs, who play the same role as Hindu gurus. Some of the shaikhs were described as having “pronounced psychic powers.”37 The master-disciple relationship was seen as an essential facet of Sufism by the reformer al-Ghazali who stated,

    the murid [disciple] must of necessity have recourse to a shaikh [master] to guide him aright. For the way of faith is obscure, but the Devil’s ways are many and patent, and he who has no shaikh to guide him will be led by the Devil into his ways. Wherefore the murid must cling to his shaikh as a blind man on the edge of a river clings to his leader, confiding himself to him entirely, opposing him in no matter whatsoever, and binding himself to follow him absolutely. Let him know that the advantage he gains from the error of his shaikh, if he should err, is greater than the advantage of his own rightness, if he should be right.38

    Most Sufi orders still consider the five pillars of Islam to be essential, and practice them piously. However, under the leadership of the shaikh they go far beyond this, aiming “to break the conditioned patterns of behaviour which inhibit the desired spiritual awakening.”39

    The mystical quest is pursued through a number of mental and physical exercises. These include whirling dances “intended above all to plunge the dancer into a state of concentration upon Allah.”40 Martin Lings states that “the body stands for the Axis of the Universe which is none other than the Tree of Life. The dance is thus a rite of centralization, a foretaste of the lost Centre...”41 A Morrocan Sufi order reduces the dance to a rigorous “rhythmic up and down movement of the body,” combined with “a rhythmic rise and fall of the breast as the lungs are filled and emptied.”42 As a result the Sufi may “see visions, hear the voices of angels and prophets, and gain from them guidance... it is a condition of joy and longing, and when the condition seizes the seeker he falls into ecstasy.”43 Breathing exercises are also combined with meditation in order to induce altered states of consciousness.44

    Central to all of these practices are ritual “invocations of the Divine Name,” also known as dhikr, which can be done either silently or in a chant.45 Here similarities with Hindu mantras are unmistakable. One author declares, “the Sufi doctrine of the dhikr coincides with that taught by the nineteenth-century Hindu saint Rama-krishna, who succinctly summed it up in the phrase: ‘God and His Name are one.’”46

    The Rifa‘iyya, a major Sufi order which spawned numerous sub-groups and associated branches, was named after Ahmad b. ‘Ali al-Rifa‘i (d. 1182). The practices of this order reveal the extremes to which some Sufi rituals went as the Rifa‘i dervishes “became famous for their extreme practices like eating live snakes and performing various feats with fire.”47 This preoccupation with snakes and fire is clearly paralleled in the practices and rituals of Hinduism.

    In response to Sufi rituals, John Alden Williams states that “the observer may encounter things which seem to belong in a case book of abnormal psychology; or witness what looks remarkably like demonic possession.”48 Elliot Miller says, “the natural (and, from the Christian perspective, God-given) mental barriers to psychic intrusion are broken down, and a link is established to the spirit world.”49

    The evidence of Sufi borrowings from other religions such as Hinduism and Zoroastrianism is certain. The similarities in teachings and ritual are overwhelming. It is no surprise then that the goals of Sufism reflect the pantheism and monism of Hinduism and other Eastern religions.

    Idries Shah, a famed twentieth-century Sufi thinker, states that Sufi practice in the mystic quest culminates when “by divine illumination man sees the world to be illusion.”50 Numerous other Sufi saints also clearly reflect monistic and pantheistic beliefs in their sayings:

    Mansur al-Hallaj (d.922): “I saw my Lord with the eye of the heart. I said: Who art Thou? He answered: Thou.”

    Abu Maydan (d. 1197): “Everything outside of God is unreal, everything taken individually or collectively, when you truly know it... Whatever does not have root in his Being, can in no wise be real.”

    Muhammad al-Harraq (d. 1845): “Seekest thou Laila [Divine Reality], when she is manifest within thee? Thou deemest her to be other, but she is not other than thou.”51

    Jalal al-Din Rumi (d.1273): “Though the many ways [diverse religions] are various, the goal is one. Do you not see there are many roads to the Kaaba?”52

    In some Sufi orders the goal of the mystical quest is “personified as a woman, usually named Laila which means ‘night’... this is the holiest and most secret inwardness of Allah... in this symbolism Laila and haqiqa (Divine Reality) are one.”53 This, and the above statements appear to be distinctly contrary to Muslim orthodoxy in their blatant echoes of Eastern mystic religions. Yet, for Sufis this is not a problem. As Ibn ‘Arabi stated,

    My heart has become capable of every form: it is a pasture for gazelles and a convent for Christians, and a temple for idols and the pilgrims Ka‘ba and the tables of the Torah, and the book of the Koran. I follow the religion of Love: whatever way Love’s camels take, that is my religion and faith..54

    Another Sufi saint, Mahmud Shabistari, in his work Gulshan-i Raz (The Mystic Rose Garden) concurs, declaring, “..what is mosque, what is synagogue, what is fire temple? ... ‘I’ and ‘You’ are the Hades veil between them.. When this veil is lifted up from before you, there remains not the bond of sects and creeds.”55

    Thus, not only has Sufism been influenced by other religions, but its mystic quest for spirituality has led it to embrace all sorts of religion, as abundantly shown in the writings of the great Sufi saints. To try to deny this as a scholar is incomprehensible. Yet, those scholars who are sympathetic towards Islam, as previously shown, have a marked tendency to minimize or altogether ignore these facts.
    How then, in conclusion, does the evidence presented, reflect not only on the nature of Sufism, but on the very nature of Islam itself?

    Sufism is clearly a reaction or response to what was lacking in early Islam. The argument for Muslim materialism lends support to the concept of a spiritual void in Islam - keenly felt by many Muslims as their civilization began to expand and come into contact with other religions. There was a hunger for more spirituality, along with the realization that despite all of the shari‘a Islam did not effectively deal with the problems of materialism.
    The very strength of Islam, in its reliance on a simple creed and the five pillars of practice, proved to be the very weakness of Islam. While the Islamic system had allowed for rapid expansion, and the five practices were a uniting force, it soon became evident that one could accept this framework and step right through it into whatever they pleased. In the early days this meant earthly success, as Islam spread rapidly through the desire for wealth and gain. Yet, just as those caught up in materialism had accepted and stepped through the framework of the shari‘a, all the while continuing in their materialistic lives, so also the Sufis in reaction to the materialism of the Islamic civilization, stepped through the framework of legality into a world of mysticism. However, in their reaction, the Sufis created a more serious problem for Islam, as due to their religiosity, they introduced new teachings, reinterpreting the Quran and sunna.

    Another area of weakness in Islam, which helped lead to the problem of Sufism, is found in the teachings of Muhammad. Here the vagueness of character caused by the doctrine of the indescribability of Allah allowed for the influence and development of pantheistic and monistic ideas, in essence creating a contradictory belief system. The orthodox ulama developed their theology in line with what they viewed as their ‘Judeo-Christian’ roots, while the Sufis were largely influenced by Eastern mystics. Consequently, the influences of Hinduism, and other forms of mystical religions on the development of Sufism, can be seen, in part, as a result of the doctrine of the indescribability of Allah.

    Sufism does contribute a lacking spirituality to the religion of Islam. Growing out of the weakness of the Islamic system of belief and practice, it, however, added a dimension which has diversified and further weakened the structure of Islamic belief and practice.

    Reflecting on the evidence presented, and conclusions given, we see that to assume Sufism, with its radical concepts, is a legitimate part of Islam introduces definite problems for anyone who then attempts to try to defend Islam as a logically coherent set of beliefs. For Sufism not only points to a lack of spirituality in Islam, but also contradicts orthodox Muslim teachings - in the process clearly opening the door to all the world’s religions.

    Sufism
     
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  12. hit&run

    hit&run Elite Member Elite Member

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    Islam is infected by Wahhabi bug.

    They want it to be practised in their absolute term and the world should be conquered by Muslims. Islam through out its history has been striving to spread in many forms in order to assimilate other religions into them. At times that strive to assimilate was brutal and fast and at times it took time was slow (Sufism), the purpose was/is always impending for its absolutism which is totally repulsive to any other way of life.

    When ever Muslims have got some power they have expedited that impending goal always. Before industrial age through sword et al. Then through alliances with western world and oil money and now power of information age and oil money both. An empowered Muslim will always direct that power for Islamic absolutism, its good for them but deleterious for others.
     
  13. W.G.Ewald

    W.G.Ewald Defence Professionals/ DFI member of 2 Defence Professionals

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  14. The Messiah

    The Messiah Bow Before Me! Elite Member

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    And heart is saudia arabia and the wahabis who rule it. Every wahabi should be captured and killed imo.
     
  15. Virendra

    Virendra Moderator Moderator

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    Rushdie's latest - "India is no longer an open society." "rolleyes:
     
  16. LurkerBaba

    LurkerBaba Staff Administrator

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    Disagree with this Wahabbi angle. It's a convenient straw man.

    There were no Wahhabis during partition

    Khomeini ain't a Wahhabi either
     
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  17. blank_quest

    blank_quest Senior Member Senior Member

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    The problem is in interpretation-Muslim Clerics are no less crooked than Brahmins , They have twisted interpretation of holy book to suit their own agenda. No one is allowed to reform or think the otherwise- ! the rest is History, as the saying goes....
     
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  18. SPIEZ

    SPIEZ Senior Member Senior Member

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    Now this is interesting Brahmins find their way to Moslim problems, striking similar what do you say causes.
    I m also sure the Brahmins are the problem for the 2008 recession
     
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  19. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    One requires a whipping boy as an all cure panacea! ;) :pound:
     
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  20. blank_quest

    blank_quest Senior Member Senior Member

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    sorry I should have used Intelligent .. :troll:
     
  21. Blackwater

    Blackwater Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    There is nothing wrong with Islam. Islam is ,was and ever will be religion of peace.Its the mullah who manipulates Islam for their owns convenience.
     
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