Silent sub: Russian noiseless Borei class

Discussion in 'Naval Warfare' started by W.G.Ewald, Dec 31, 2012.

  1. W.G.Ewald

    W.G.Ewald Defence Professionals/ DFI member of 2 Defence Professionals

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    Silent sub: Russian noiseless Borei class nuclear submarine immersed — RT

    Borei class nuclear submarine Vladimir Monomah at the “Sevmash” shipyard before its launch in Severodvinsk. (RIA Novosti/A. Petrov)
     
  2. hello_10

    hello_10 Tihar Jail Banned

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    how do we compare it with the nuclear submarine Akula -2 leased to India? in terms of capabilities/performance?????

    also, how would it be compared with 'Amur Class' offered for Project 75I too, in terms of capabilities/performance?
     
  3. The Fox

    The Fox Regular Member

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    i was about to ask this question hello_10 thanks anyway also compare it with Arihanth......
     
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  4. SATISH

    SATISH DFI Technocrat Stars and Ambassadors

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    Well you want to compare the arihant with Borei?...its futile. Bigger is always better when it comes to SSBN...more firepower and capability. If the Bulava is as good as the Russians say it is this sub is a world beater. The arihant is comparable with the older generation of nuclear subs not the latest ones.

    THe Nerpa is more or less comparable to the Yasen class which is facing problems just like the Astute class since 2000.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2012
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  5. average american

    average american Senior Member Senior Member

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    Borei Boomers Delayed Yet Again
    Next Article → MORALE: Russia Seeks Closure In Afghanistan
    October 26, 2012: The new Russian Borei class SSBNs (ballistic missile nuclear subs or "boomers") was supposed to enter service at the end this year. Then problems were discovered in the software that runs the missile launching and other systems on the boat. Because of that the first Borei won’t enter service until next year. This boat, the Yuri Dolgoruky, was launched five years ago, after being under construction since 1996. Money shortages and technical issues slowed progress. Yuri Dolgoruky was further delayed after launch because of power plant and other equipment problems. Yuri Dolgoruky was the first new Russian SSBN since 1990 and there seemed to be no end of problems. Part of this is because the new Borei class boats makes extensive use of modern electronics. It’s all digital and flat screens inside. Lots of microprocessors and modern sonar, which the navy insisted would make these boats more aware of their underwater surroundings than previous designs. The possible complications from debugging all this new tech were never mentioned.
    Externally, the Boreis are closer in design to the older Delta IVs than to the more recent, and much larger, Typhoon boats. The Boreis are 170 meters (558 feet) long and 13 meters (42 feet) wide. Surface displacement is 15,000 tons, and 16 Bulava SLBMs (Sea Launched Ballistic Missile) are carried. Work on the first Borei, the Yuri Dolgoruky, was delayed for several years because the first missile being designed for it did not work out. As a replacement, the successful land based missile, the Topol-M, was quickly modified for submarine use. This Bulava was a larger missile, cutting the Boreis capacity from twenty to 16 missiles. The boat also has four torpedo tubes and twelve torpedoes or torpedo tube launched missiles. The Borei also sports a huge sonar dome in the bow.

    The Boreis have a crew of 107, with half of them being officers (a common Russian practice when it comes to high tech ships like nuclear subs). Each of these boats cost at least two billion dollars. This high cost, by Russian standards, is partly because many factories that supplied parts for Russian subs were in parts of the Soviet Union that are not now within the borders of present day Russia, so new factories had to be built. All components of the Boreis, and their missiles, will be built in Russia. A dozen Boreis were originally planned, but for now only eight are being built. All are supposed to be in service by the end of the decade. The last five are referred to as Borei-A and will carry 20 missiles and contain a number of other improvements.

    The Boreis will replace the aging Cold War era Delta class SSBNs that are being retired because of safety and reliability issues. Nuclear submarines are one area of military spending that did not get cut back sharply after the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, but there are still limits to the navy budgets and the Boreis are being built, in part, to be cheaper to operate. Two Borei boats are now completed and waiting for all these glitches to be fixed before entering service. The more recent, but massive, Typhoon SSBNs will be retired in two years, mainly because they are so expensive to operate.
     
  6. Armand2REP

    Armand2REP CHINI EXPERT Veteran Member

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    Considering unfinished Akula IIs were cannabalised to build Boreis, they are quite similar . Amur has failed to meet its design goals so that isn't worth comparing.
     
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  7. hello_10

    hello_10 Tihar Jail Banned

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    in fact we already have the news that Akula-2, the biggest threat to US, generally visits US without being detected, and remains there for weeks, as below: :thumb:
    we also discussed about this news and it was quite clear that the Submarines offered for Project-75I would have the best techs of Russia, to beat its European rivals, while its already the lowest bidder for this tender too. and hopefully the whole project may then be extended to 12 with the upgraded versions in future too, as per the news as below :thumb:

    India’s Multi-billion Dollar Scorpene Sub Contract

    and we also have an American view of the recent Russian nuclear submarine as below, and here its good to know that it already superior to its US's competitors in many terms while its obvious that if production lines of Project-75I will start from 2017/18 then it will have the latest techs of Russia that time too :thumb:
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2013
  8. SATISH

    SATISH DFI Technocrat Stars and Ambassadors

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    THe Russian Akulas are typhoons right....and the Shchuka is the akula....darn confusing...so which one is being caniballized?
     
  9. sayareakd

    sayareakd Moderator Moderator

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    Arihant is our first attempt and present Russian sub is state of the art sub. Wait for our other subs and they will be more silent and lethal.
     
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  10. hello_10

    hello_10 Tihar Jail Banned

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    Also as per the links of post#7, US's analysts find Akula-2 quite capable against US too, naming it the biggest threat to US. while Russia is going to have more advanced submarines in future too, and we expect the same for Project-75I :thumb:
     
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  11. average american

    average american Senior Member Senior Member

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    Total Submarine Strength by Country expect it will be some time befor we know how the new Russian subs do, so far Russian track record on subs leaves a lot to be desired.
     
  12. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Post Soviet a hot went wrong. The Akulas were dreaded by the Americans.
     
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  13. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    What have the Russians done to make the submarines 'almost noiseless'?

    Noise signature is the worst enemy of a submarine, no matter what it carries or can do.
     
  14. Armand2REP

    Armand2REP CHINI EXPERT Veteran Member

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    Project 971U/M unfinished subs were cannablised to build Project 955 Borei. We call 971 Akula because it is the lead ship of class.
     
  15. Armand2REP

    Armand2REP CHINI EXPERT Veteran Member

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    There has been little progress made over the Akula II standard. After the USSR broke up, the navy and its R&D was left to rot.
     
  16. Damian

    Damian Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    I would be carefull with media statements about something being the best, noiseless etc. There are no such things.

    If a sub crew want's the sub to be quiet, it needs to reduce it's speed so the internal components would work quieter, and this of course reduce mobility, and even then there is no guarantee that someone will not hear you on passive or detect you by active sonar.

    It is far more complex than most people think, and all that hype is nothing more than a media BS to please general population and fanboys among them.
     
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  17. Daredevil

    Daredevil On Vacation! Administrator

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    I think they are talking in relative terms compared to other advanced & existing subs. And of course, there are no noiseless subs.
     
  18. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Any submarine that can dive very deep will always have a clear edge. The Akula Class submarines, due to their deep diving capability, are virtually invisible and inaudible to the enemy. The Borei Class probably borrows a lot from the Akula Class. In my opinion, the hydrodynamic shape of the Akula is superior to Borei Class "Alexander Nevsky." When it comes to thermal signatures, modern seekers can detect subs at great lengths. However, if a submarine can dive under the thermocline, they are virtually invisible.
     
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  19. spikey360

    spikey360 Crusader Senior Member

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    This is an excellent development. In terms of Submarine tech and warfare, the only department where Russia is lagging behind is numbers. If Russia plays its numbers correctly, nothing can stop the Russian Navy from having the best submarine fleet. The US for it's part keeps building bigger and bigger subs, but they are yet to match Russia in dive capabilities, automation and some other key areas.
    And what about Graney class? Any news when we can expect subs in that class, apart from experimental ones?
     
  20. W.G.Ewald

    W.G.Ewald Defence Professionals/ DFI member of 2 Defence Professionals

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    John Anthony Walker - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
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