Shanghai free-trade zone will hit Hong Kong quicker than expected,

[Ray]

Shanghai free-trade zone will hit Hong Kong quicker than expected, says Li Ka-shing

Hong Kong needs to develop more quickly or risk being left behind, warns tycoon, as he urges people to unite to improve the city

Shanghai's new free-trade zone will have a bigger and quicker impact on Hong Kong than most people imagine, Asia's richest man, Li Ka-shing, said yesterday.

"[The free-trade zone] will have a big impact on Hong Kong," said Li, who chairs Cheung Kong (Holdings) and Hutchison Whampoa. "It has different aspects, including financial services. When the yuan becomes fully convertible, it will benefit the development of Shanghai."

Hong Kong would lag behind if it did not accelerate the pace of its development, he said.

The landmark project signals Beijing's determination to raise the competitiveness of the mainland economy. It plans to elevate Shanghai's role in economic reform by loosening controls on capital flows and expanding foreign investment in its free-trade zone, to officially open next week.

Asked if Shanghai would surpass Hong Kong in the next five to 10 years, Li replied: "I do not want to predict. But it will be faster than most people expect.

"It is just like you are running a 1,000-kilometre race. When you run one-third of the race, you see [your competitor] still behind you. But you are already surpassed [by your competitor] in the first half of the race. It is all about the speed."

The speed at which the Shanghai project has taken shape has caught market watchers by surprise. It has overshadowed similar plans for Qianhai in Shenzhen, Hengqin island in the Zhuhai special economic zone, and Nansha, in Guangzhou.

Li urged Hongkongers to unite to improve the city, and said his flagship companies would not pull their assets out of Hong Kong. "I will absolutely not move our domiciles from Hong Kong," he said. "After many years Cheung Kong and Hutchison will still be here."

His remarks followed widespread reports that Li was pulling assets out of Hong Kong and the mainland, with plans to offload HK$40 billion of assets, including the possible sale of the ParknShop supermarket chain.

Li said selling ParknShop was a commercial decision.

"If [this move] is interpreted as pulling out from Hong Kong, the amount may be too small," Li said, joking that "to me, if I sell this building [Cheung Kong Center], you should start to worry."

Li said Hong Kong's property market had become unpredictable because it was subject to government policies, but the impact of cooling measures on developers and other sectors would be reflected next year.

Property transactions in Hong Kong dropped to their lowest level in a decade in the first half of the year. There were 39,077 property transactions lodged with the government registry as a series of housing policy measures and the continued tightening of mortgage requirements weighed on the real estate industry. It was the lowest number of transactions since the 35,200 deals recorded in the first half of 2003, when the city was gripped by fears about Sars.

Separately, a member of the Friends of Hong Kong Association quoted Wang Guangya, director of the Hong Kong and Macau Affairs Office, as saying there were several economic hubs that needed support from the central government.

"Wang said the country had more than a son, referring to the several hubs, but it would reserve the best policies for Hong Kong," said Chan Wing-kee.

Commenting on the Occupy Central movement for greater democracy, Li said: "Personally I do not agree with occupying Central. It will adversely affect Hong Kong's image as a financial city and have a negative impact on the city's economy."

There were many ways to express an opinion, he said, and it was not necessary to choose such a method to fight for democracy.

This article appeared in the South China Morning Post print edition as Shanghai free zone will hit HK, says Li

Shanghai free-trade zone will hit Hong Kong quicker than expected, says Li Ka-shing | South China Morning Post

########################

End of Hong Kong?

Is there any way Hong Kong could stave of this challenge?

With the demise of Hong Kong, the 'conscience' of the Chinese people will be dead!

 

[amoy]

is it a karma? quite a lot of HK tycoons of older generations were from Shanghai, in fields like shipping, media and entertainment. many heavyweights even worldwide in some sectors.

can an economy of US size sustain both New York and Los Angelas? Or can a emerging power like India have two powerhouses Bombay and Calcutta?

If yea then China can hv two financial hubs prosperous (competing to a degree though) too!

Yes we can!

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Compersion]

is it a karma? quite a lot of HK tycoons of older generations were from Shanghai, in fields like shipping, media and entertainment. many heavyweights even worldwide in some sectors.

can an economy of US size sustain both New York and Los Angelas? Or can a emerging power like India have two powerhouses Bombay and Calcutta?

If yea then China can hv two financial hubs prosperous (competing to a degree though) too!

Yes we can!

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

New York is totally different compared to Los Angleles. New York is the financial hub of USA. Where the stock market is listed and financial services firms are established. Los Angeles does not compare at all to New York.

Hong Kong compares to New York not Los Angeles. And Shanghai is positioning it self to replace Hong Kong and become a New York not Los Angeles.

How can PRC have two New Yorks (you might want to say three including Taipei). Even India only has one Mumbai (New York : Hong Kong).

The above article is a gem it is basically saying the PRC is making Hong Kong loose importance.

All I can say is that the HK Tycoons and older generations they built up Hong Kong through hard work and brains. Do you see that in Shanghai.

The HK Tycoons are old and the ones that are replacing them are not of the same class.

The important quotes from the article are:

"It has different aspects, including financial services. When the yuan becomes fully convertible, it will benefit the development of Shanghai."

"Wang said the country had more than a son, referring to the several hubs, but it would reserve the best policies for Hong Kong," said Chan Wing-kee.

Wonder who is telling the truth and who is defending Hong Kong.

Interesting times ahead.

 

[t_co]

Every time I think of Shanghai's free trade zone, I envision this:

 

[Compersion]

Shanghai free-trade zone to test financial reforms in China

When Premier Li Keqiang showcased China's plans for more market economic reforms and a reduction in the role of state sector at a recent global forum, he highlighted a proposed free-trade zone in Shanghai.

Li said China plans to prioritise "easier investment access and greater openness in trade in services" in the zone, whose full name, the China (Shanghai) Pilot Free Trade Area, reflects its national and international significance.

It combines four existing free-trade zones and port districts into a new area that the city government said it will use to promote trade in financial services and logistics, and develop trading zones for steel, cars, chemicals and jewellery.

Analysts differ over its expected speed and scope of development, but they all agree that the 29-square-kilometre zone marks a crucial step in China's economic reform.

"It will carry the same expectations as China's first opening up and reforms in the late 1970s and when the country joined the World Trade Organisation in 2001," the official China Daily said on Wednesday.

Speaking in Shanghai this week, World Bank President Jim Yong Kim hailed the zone as a "positive development" that "will allow China to become more competitive." Its most important long-term role will be to test financial policies that can underpin the next phase of China's development.

Free exchange of currency

"The key thing is to see whether the central government will allow the free exchange of the renminbi [currency]," Guo Hongyu, an expert in finance at Beijing's University of International Business and Economics, said.

A plan to build Shanghai into an international financial centre by 2020 would be "meaningless" without liberalisation of the currency exchange mechanism, Guo said.

"Capital must circulate freely if you aim to become an international financial centre," she said.

Ministry of Commerce spokesman Shen Danyang said on Tuesday that the government has approved the suspension of several regulations on foreign investment in the free-trade zone for three years from October 1.

The government will officially launch the zone on September 29, Shen said, but it is not expected to publish detailed plans for several months, leaving debate open about how far and how fast the ruling Communist Party should go.

The party's 205-member Central Committee is expected to discuss the zone at a meeting scheduled for November to approve a new raft of economic reforms.

Concerns over free-trade zone

One reason for the party's caution over liberalising currency exchange in Shanghai is a fear that it could fuel a stampede of speculators keen to profit from different rates inside and outside the zone.

Setting rules for banks and companies operating in the zone, and how they link to those outside it, will be "complicated" for the government, Standard Chartered Global Research said in a recent briefing note.

"On the one hand, if the authorities restrict the companies to conduct all their business only within the zone, the impact will be very small," it said.

"On the other hand, if the freed-up financial services within the zone are accessible to any firm in China that merely sets up a representative office in the zone, China would basically have opened up its capital account." Li promised to adopt a "negative-list approach" in Shanghai, meaning that foreign trade will be allowed in all services, including new industries, unless specifically restricted. China currently uses a "positive list" of sectors that are open to foreign trade.

Yet China Daily quoted two Shanghai-based economists as saying the zone's "negative list" contains more than 10,000 restrictions, rendering it "meaningless" without severe cuts.

Such problems mean the other Chinese cities queuing to develop similar free-trade zones might have a long wait until the party can judge the success of Shanghai's pilot policies.

Over the next decade, the expansion of more open economic policies to new zones, and eventually to the whole country, could prove crucial to the party's efforts to hold on to the political power it has held since 1949.

Standard Chartered said it has "yet to be convinced that such zones will be the driver of reform in China." The party must also persuade foreign businesses and governments, as well as China's 1.3 billion people, that it can improve the rule of law, protect financial interests, expand social freedoms and continue rapid economic growth.

Many analysts and dissidents see loosening the party's stranglehold on legal, judicial and security organs as the key to both economic and political reform.

"Using Shanghai, such a big metropolis and China's financial centre, for the FTZ experiment is actually doing an experiment in judicial independence," said Wu Qiang, a political scientist at Beijing's Tsinghua University.

"It will have long-term strategic significance," Wu said.

(This article was published on September 19, 2013)

Shanghai free-trade zone to test financial reforms in China | Business Line

 

[Ray]

@t_co,

Discuss the issue and not take the usual path of digression of posting 'wonderful' pictures of China Shining!

One sure wants to know the fate of Hong Kong, which was the base that gave spurt to China's economic boost!

 

[amoy]

@Compersion tks for your analysis, which just gives me a feel u may be echoing my points, i..e. nowadays competition doesnt only happen globally but also internally, like rise of Bombay to an extent could hv bn at the cost of decline of Calcutta （？a zero sum game).

Meantime another prospect is highlighted if the economy is wholesome and robust enough it can prop up several hubs (financially or whatever) though with different priorities or emphasis (like u enlightened on LA and NYC).

The key is the pie is getting bigger n bigger.

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Ray]

@Compersion tks for your analysis, which just gives me a feel u may be echoing my points, i..e. nowadays competition doesnt only happen globally but also internally, like rise of Bombay to an extent could hv bn at the cost of decline of Calcutta （？a zero sum game).

Meantime another prospect is highlighted if the economy is wholesome and robust enough it can prop up several hubs (financially or whatever) though with different priorities or emphasis (like u enlightened on LA and NYC).

The key is the pie is getting bigger n bigger.

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

The decline of Calcutta was not because of competition, but because the Communists wanted all forms of economy to be thrown out by organising strikes and gheraos wherein the industries left. Poverty ensured votes since demanding ridiculous pay rise appealed to the masses, but it kept them staved and hungry and all the blame was on the industrialists and the Centre.

Then Bombay flourished.

 

[Compersion]

@Compersion tks for your analysis, which just gives me a feel u may be echoing my points, i..e. nowadays competition doesnt only happen globally but also internally, like rise of Bombay to an extent could hv bn at the cost of decline of Calcutta （？a zero sum game).

Meantime another prospect is highlighted if the economy is wholesome and robust enough it can prop up several hubs (financially or whatever) though with different priorities or emphasis (like u enlightened on LA and NYC).

The key is the pie is getting bigger n bigger.

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

You are welcome also its good to know what you think. Would love to hear more what you think (and from others) about the fate of hong kong and also the development of shanghai free trade zone.

The fate of hong kong is an imperative topic and is pertinent to a lot of people. In game theory you have to pick the right players and comparisons. And you might be right there is a zero sum game possible here.

My interpretation of the article is that PRC will make hong kong decrease in value and status to develop shanghai (first through shanghai free trade zone). the contemporary resurgence in hong kong is fueled by the nucleus of PRC financial investments and establishment being there (in hong kong). Basically Hong Kong is the condom used by PRC to screw the world (at this moment).

From my understanding if one looks at the proposed body of shanghai free trade zone and hong kong it is the same (one country two systems).

the above chap Mr. Li (a very smart chap indeed and rarely opens his mouth without thinking carefully) is saying a few things one can apply using game theory. (a). The upcoming protests (occupy central) for universal suffrage in Hong Kong are coming. (b). Hong Kong is facing threat from Shanghai. (c). Shanghai will develop when yaun currency is fully convertible. (d). He loves the country (assuming he means PRC). (e ). He loves Hong Kong. The PRC ambassador / representative / middle man is throwing it in the mix by saying that PRC will "reserve the best policies for Hong Kong" (f).

(a) and (b) are known. But (C),(D), (E) and (F) are significant and why are they being said and why now. This smart chap (mr. li) has had to throw in (d) to protect himself. (f) is there to minimise the impact of (a) and Mr. Li's thoughts. And if it was only about (a) why talk about (c) and (e ). Why would (b) and (c) and (e) be said.

Mr Li is close to the PRC inner circle (the same one that Bo Xilai belong(ed) to before the westerner spoiled his merrymaking) and knows PRC is allowing Hong Kong to suffer and create the picture that they will realign the nucleus of PRC financial investments and establishment away from Hong Kong to Shanghai. He has voiced this out loud suddenly because of (a). I assume he has been told by PRC they will move the condom close to where it can be controlled without any subversive activities (to shanghai). These planned protests in Hong Kong are considered subversive by PRC leadership (a). More about that here:

Occupy Central (2014) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(Wonder where they got that idea from – non-violent protest and civil disobedience - Also Hong Kong is not Tibet and India is 2600 KM away.)

PRC has told Mr Li that they will lessen the importance of Hong Kong and thrust Shanghai. I refer to the article above "Shanghai free-trade zone to test financial reforms in China" on its implementation and issues. I personally think it will not be difficult to implement. But I think the will power of PRC wont be there. Hong Kong reaction will be colossal and also the full conversion of yuan currency wont happen (no matter how much Mr Li tries to get PRC to do it). Also Mr. Li has said (e ).

Unless of course PRC has undertaken and assured someone that they will fully convert the currency by a certain time frame (hint).

I personally think Hong Kong is too important to PRC and they would be stupid to diminish Hong Kong value but like I said why did Mr Li say "When the yuan becomes fully convertible, it will benefit the development of Shanghai." Hong Kong is the condom used by PRC to screw the world. But with fully convertible yuan "¦

one must recongise that at this moment Hong Kong compares to New York not Los Angeles (and not Calcutta). And Shanghai wants to position itself to replace Hong Kong and become a New York not Los Angeles. Shanghai ultimately wants to be the only New York in the region and take away importance and significance from Hong Kong and eventually its long term focus is reduce the value of Tokyo.

Singapore is also in the mix as it will take away the shine from Hong Kong and has already done that.

Shanghai will not focus in the fields like shipping, media and entertainment but will focus on making itself like New York, Hong Kong (like it is now), Tokyo.

The game theory question that decides who wins and share of the pie is "When the yuan becomes fully convertible".

With what Mr. Li has said and also the Occupy Central Protests and the Elections – there are interesting times ahead for Hong Kong. That's why Mr. Li has said everyone will know what will happen by "next year". I really wonder who is telling the truth and who is defending Hong Kong.

In India it is not possible because the antiquity and configuration of Mumbai as the Financial Hub of India. Also we don't have Hong Kong (one country two systems) and Taipei (one china principle) to take into account. Also the indian rupee currency is fully convertible. You know India plays by the rules. In PRC there is confusion to be honest.

It is also not about competition because Shanghai is not competing with Hong Kong (it cannot - Without fully convertible currency) and Taipei (it cannot – because it's a different area).

It is not about the Pie getting bigger (emergence of two financial hubs). The pie has grown already and PRC needs to decide how to decorate the pie.

I do understand what you are trying to say and you want Hong Kong to lessen in value (karma like you say). But it is taking two sides of the coin.

Interesting times ahead. Hong Kong and PRC confrontation some people are saying.

 

[cloud_9]

LOL! Read people are buying into companies with Shanghai in their name without going into the specifics

 

[amoy]

LOL! Read people are buying into companies with Shanghai in their name without going into the specifics

LOL like HSBC - The Hongkong and Shanghai Banking Corporation Limited? This bank issues HK Dollar.

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

 

[cloud_9]

LOL like HSBC - The Hongkong and Shanghai Banking Corporation Limited? This bank issues HK Dollar.

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

Are these people stupid.HSBC is a flipping British bank

Want a big bump in your stock price? Try tacking "Shanghai" onto your company's name

What do a Chinese underwear maker, a port operator and a taxi logistics firm—which have all seen their shares surge on the Shanghai stock exchange over the past month—have in common? They all include "Shanghai" in their company name. According to Bloomberg, since late August publicly-traded firms that include the city in their company name have added a total market value of about $45 billion (more than the value of Vietnam's stock market) and outpaced the Shanghai composite index by nearly five times.
+

Betting on a new free trade zone recently approved for Shanghai, investors have piled into stocks of companies even nominally related to the zone. The free-trade zone will encompass a 29-square kilometer area on the eastern part of Shanghai's Pudong district. It's meant to be a testing ground for broader economic reforms, which could include increasing the flow of foreign investment to companies in the zone. It will combine three existing Shanghai free trade areas for shipping, advanced manufacturing, and air freight into one. What benefits companies derive from being in the existing free trade zones is unclear. And yet, shares of companies already in one of these zones have soared, including Shanghai Waigaoqiao Free Trade Zone Development Co, which says it will develop and manage new properties for the combined zone. But companies that aren't clearly tied to the zone have rallied, too.

According to Bloomberg, shares in companies like Shanghai Dragon Corp, an underwear maker and a taxi logistics firm, Shanghai Haibo—both of which will be outside the free trade zone—have surged 30% and 55% respectively since Aug. 22, when Chinese officials approved the free-trade zone. Shanghai International Port, a port operator that will be in the zone, has jumped 140% and Shanghai Material Trading, a metals trader, has risen about 25%.

 

[amoy]

@cloud_9 nope not stupid HSBC was founded in Hongkong and its Shanghai branch was set up in the same year. Its Hqtrs were relocated to London only in 1993 before HK's handover.

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

 

[amoy]

@cloud_9 nope not stupid HSBC was founded in Hongkong and its Shanghai branch was set up in the same year. Its Hqtrs were relocated to London only in 1993 before HK's handover.

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

 

[no smoking]

@t_co,

Discuss the issue and not take the usual path of digression of posting 'wonderful' pictures of China Shining!

One sure wants to know the fate of Hong Kong, which was the base that gave spurt to China's economic boost!

Then you need to discuss the economic issue in economic way. Please leave your politic nonsense "'conscience' out of it!

Sure, Hong Kong helped China's economic boost in last 80s and they earned huge profit from these "helps". That was how they become one of "four dregons" during its peak time. They can't asked mainlanders to keep paying it for ever!

If today, Hong kong's prosperity is still depending on limiting other areas develpment, then there must be something wrong in Hong kong's economy.

 

[no smoking]

My interpretation of the article is that PRC will make hong kong decrease in value and status to develop shanghai (first through shanghai free trade zone). the contemporary resurgence in hong kong is fueled by the nucleus of PRC financial investments and establishment being there (in hong kong). Basically Hong Kong is the condom used by PRC to screw the world (at this moment).

How could PRC make Hongkong decrease in value when Hongkong has its own independent economic policy?

According to you, Hongkong is living on the benefit provided by mainland, then as a city which enjoys 6 times GDP per capita than the whole China, how could anyone expect the kind of Hongkong-favor policy will continue forever?

Can you specify how Hongkong is the condom used by PRC?

From my understanding if one looks at the proposed body of shanghai free trade zone and hong kong it is the same (one country two systems).

the above chap Mr. Li (a very smart chap indeed and rarely opens his mouth without thinking carefully) is saying a few things one can apply using game theory. (a). The upcoming protests (occupy central) for universal suffrage in Hong Kong are coming. (b). Hong Kong is facing threat from Shanghai. (c). Shanghai will develop when yaun currency is fully convertible. (d). He loves the country (assuming he means PRC). (e ). He loves Hong Kong. The PRC ambassador / representative / middle man is throwing it in the mix by saying that PRC will "reserve the best policies for Hong Kong" (f).

(a) and (b) are known. But (C),(D), (E) and (F) are significant and why are they being said and why now. This smart chap (mr. li) has had to throw in (d) to protect himself. (f) is there to minimise the impact of (a) and Mr. Li's thoughts. And if it was only about (a) why talk about (c) and (e ). Why would (b) and (c) and (e) be said.

Mr Li is close to the PRC inner circle (the same one that Bo Xilai belong(ed) to before the westerner spoiled his merrymaking) and knows PRC is allowing Hong Kong to suffer and create the picture that they will realign the nucleus of PRC financial investments and establishment away from Hong Kong to Shanghai. He has voiced this out loud suddenly because of (a). I assume he has been told by PRC they will move the condom close to where it can be controlled without any subversive activities (to shanghai). These planned protests in Hong Kong are considered subversive by PRC leadership (a). More about that here:

NO! PRC is using his mouth to tell Hongkongness:"you need to live on your own! We got a lot of other children to look after, who is far poorer than you!"

 

[Ray]

Then you need to discuss the economic issue in economic way. Please leave your politic nonsense "'conscience' out of it!

Sure, Hong Kong helped China's economic boost in last 80s and they earned huge profit from these "helps". That was how they become one of "four dregons" during its peak time. They can't asked mainlanders to keep paying it for ever!

If today, Hong kong's prosperity is still depending on limiting other areas develpment, then there must be something wrong in Hong kong's economy.

Economics cannot be sterile.

It has to have politics that drives it.

Communism has a different economic path, capitalism has a totally different political ethos driving it.

I thought that much you all know!

Only zombies and robots are impervious to the 'human face' to life construct.

 

[Compersion]

NO! PRC is using his mouth to tell Hongkongness:"you need to live on your own! We got a lot of other children to look after, who is far poorer than you!"

How could PRC make Hongkong decrease in value when Hongkong has its own independent economic policy?

It is the intent of the PRC government that is of attention and concentration. The purposeful nature that PRC is doing that needs to be questioned (but please also refer to the quote I mention later). That is the real analysis one needs to discuss what is PRC really doing. My interpretation of the article is that PRC will make hong kong decrease in value and status to develop shanghai (first through shanghai free trade zone). Will it happen my personal belief is no because PRC aint got the mojo and would be stupid to diminish Hong Kong value. The planned protests in Hong Kong are considered subversive by PRC leadership. Perhaps the PRC leadership thinks that Shanghai trade zone (one country two systems) can be controlled without any subversive activities. Is that smart - is that stupid (with Hong Kong in mind).

According to you, Hong kong is living on the benefit provided by mainland, then as a city which enjoys 6 times GDP per capita than the whole China, how could anyone expect the kind of Hong kong-favor policy will continue forever?

Please refer to the above answer. If the intent of PRC is to do harm to Hong Kong will that allow for growth in Hong Kong. Thats why the above article is fascinating. Because what Mr Li and Mr Wing-Kee says needs to be understood.

Also the role of Hong Kong in the PRC growth story and GDP growth is prominent and pivotal and central. Without Hong Kong the PRC would not be where it is.

Can you specify how Hongkong is the condom used by PRC?

The yuan (is not fully convertible) and role of Hong Kong, FDI from Hong Kong (recycled), hot money from Hong Kong, hong kong dollar USD peg, the role exports and imports of goods from Hong Kong, PRC companies listed on the Hong Kong stock exchange with loose and slack requirements , PRC individual's use of Hong Kong for security (and hedging), the offering of sophistication. All these and more has allowed the Hong Kong condom to be used by PRC to screw the world. Without this condom the PRC would not be where it is now.

That question of the condom use depends now on PRC yuan full convertibility. Will it burst, will it have a new layer, what will happen. I dont think yuan full convertibility will happen because its a Pandora box and no one really knows what is happening inside PRC at this moment economically.

Unless of course PRC has undertaken and assured someone that they will fully convert the currency by a certain time frame (hint).

Mr Li say "When the yuan becomes fully convertible, it will benefit the development of Shanghai." Why is he saying that.

Do you think the yuan will be fully convertible?

I have heard people say step-by-step approach. But when I read the article it gives a different impression.

NO! PRC is using his mouth to tell Hongkongness:"you need to live on your own! We got a lot of other children to look after, who is far poorer than you!"

The beauty of what you say ignores what Mr Li and Mr Wang-Kee is saying.

"Wang said the country had more than a son, referring to the several hubs, but it would reserve the best policies for Hong Kong," said Chan Wing-kee.

Not sure why the person did not say:

"Hong Kong has good policies for PRC. Hong Kong has done a lot for PRC and it better treat Hong Kong well".

I would like to hear what you think about Hong Kong more.

1. Why and what do you think Mr Li is saying

2. Why and what do you think will happen with Occupy Central Protests

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupy_Central_(2014)

3. With reference to the current leader of Hong Kong does it mean there is independent policies from PRC.

4. Hong Kong Elections are coming up do you think the Hong Kong people will get universal suffrage.

5. Are you proud that Hong Kong has more democracy compared to PRC. It must make you proud Chinese to see a region have such policies (and also Taiwan to some extent).

6. I am also getting a feeling from reading posts that PRC people dont like Hong Kong too much. I have read Hong Kong people not liking PRC people but am coming across more PRC people saying this.

If we refer to the article I really wonder who is defending Hong Kong and who is telling the truth. Interesting times ahead. Hong Kong and PRC confrontation people are saying.

 

[no smoking]

It is the intent of the PRC government that is of attention and concentration. The purposeful nature that PRC is doing that needs to be questioned (but please also refer to the quote I mention later). That is the real analysis one needs to discuss what is PRC really doing. My interpretation of the article is that PRC will make hong kong decrease in value and status to develop shanghai (first through shanghai free trade zone). Will it happen my personal belief is no because PRC aint got the mojo and would be stupid to diminish Hong Kong value. The planned protests in Hong Kong are considered subversive by PRC leadership. Perhaps the PRC leadership thinks that Shanghai trade zone (one country two systems) can be controlled without any subversive activities. Is that smart - is that stupid (with Hong Kong in mind).

Please refer to the above answer. If the intent of PRC is to do harm to Hong Kong will that allow for growth in Hong Kong. Thats why the above article is fascinating. Because what Mr Li and Mr Wing-Kee says needs to be understood.

Your perosnal belief is baseless! Shanghia trade zone is not "one country two systems", it is a test farm to check the planned financial reform. If it succeds, the policy will be applied to whole country which means a tolal openned financial market. So, please go back and read some books instead using your imagination first!

Also the role of Hong Kong in the PRC growth story and GDP growth is prominent and pivotal and central. Without Hong Kong the PRC would not be where it is.

Hongkong used to be the mentor of Chinese economic development
But after 30 years development, mainland doesn't need Hongkong to play this role any more!

The yuan (is not fully convertible) and role of Hong Kong, FDI from Hong Kong (recycled), hot money from Hong Kong, hong kong dollar USD peg, the role exports and imports of goods from Hong Kong, PRC companies listed on the Hong Kong stock exchange with loose and slack requirements , PRC individual's use of Hong Kong for security (and hedging), the offering of sophistication. All these and more has allowed the Hong Kong condom to be used by PRC to screw the world. Without this condom the PRC would not be where it is now.

Based on your explaination, every country's stock market is their or others condom to screw the world!

That question of the condom use depends now on PRC yuan full convertibility. Will it burst, will it have a new layer, what will happen. I dont think yuan full convertibility will happen because its a Pandora box and no one really knows what is happening inside PRC at this moment economically.

Your thinking is worthless since you are just talking. Thousands of multinational corpeartions believe they know what is happening inside PRC and they bet billions of dollars on it!

Unless of course PRC has undertaken and assured someone that they will fully convert the currency by a certain time frame (hint).

Kid, go back to school and try to learn something real! Where have you been? PRC has been telling EVERYONE that they will do that for 10 years!

Mr Li say "When the yuan becomes fully convertible, it will benefit the development of Shanghai." Why is he saying that.

Do you think the yuan will be fully convertible?

On that case, I do because it is the natural result if Chinese economy continues to develop!

I have heard people say step-by-step approach. But when I read the article it gives a different impression.

As I said, you have to learn some basic knowledge about Chinese economy!

Not sure why the person did not say:

"Hong Kong has good policies for PRC. Hong Kong has done a lot for PRC and it better treat Hong Kong well".

Because you can't say that to your boss if you don't have any significant leverage!

I would like to hear what you think about Hong Kong more.

1. Why and what do you think Mr Li is saying

Because Hongkong is losing its value to Mainland and what Hongkongness is doing is speeding up this process! And he is lossing money or profit because of it!

2. Why and what do you think will happen with Occupy Central Protests

What happened with occupy wall street?

3. With reference to the current leader of Hong Kong does it mean there is independent policies from PRC.

I don't know! But, if Hongkong's prosperity is depending on PRC, how much independence can they have.

4. Hong Kong Elections are coming up do you think the Hong Kong people will get universal suffrage.

Does it matter if your pocket is controlled by others?

5. Are you proud that Hong Kong has more democracy compared to PRC. It must make you proud Chinese to see a region have such policies (and also Taiwan to some extent).

Why? There are almost 100m chineses are still struggling around poverty line and 200m-400m are just a little better than them. Comparing to our political freedom, I am more concerned about their living standard. As I know, if we don't look after their lives, they will come to us one day just as we did 60 years ago.

6. I am also getting a feeling from reading posts that PRC people dont like Hong Kong too much. I have read Hong Kong people not liking PRC people but am coming across more PRC people saying this.

It is just 2 brothers grew up in different families, after they come back to live together, they find a lot of differences between them. Do you think who is right or wrong?

If we refer to the article I really wonder who is defending Hong Kong and who is telling the truth. Interesting times ahead. Hong Kong and PRC confrontation people are saying.

Does it matter? In the past 100 years, Hongkong's economic basis is being the window of the mainland market. It can't live without China, but as the only window for China, China can't afford closing it. But now, the whole China is opened, Hongkong is no longer that important to China while mainland is even more important to Hongkong. It is not who is telling the truth, it is about who is replying on who!

 

[Compersion]

Does it matter? In the past 100 years, Hongkong's economic basis is being the window of the mainland market. It can't live without China, but as the only window for China, China can't afford closing it. But now, the whole China is opened, Hongkong is no longer that important to China while mainland is even more important to Hongkong. It is not who is telling the truth, it is about who is replying on who!

Its good to have you agree on many of the points I said. Looking at the small bits of information you have shared:

Your perosnal belief is baseless! Shanghia trade zone is not "one country two systems", it is a test farm to check the planned financial reform. If it succeds, the policy will be applied to whole country which means a tolal openned financial market. So, please go back and read some books instead using your imagination first!

What will this supposed test farm be like. Will it be like "Hong Kong". How to manage the entry and exit of this zone (people and financial instruments).
What don't you share the books if not articles one can read to get a better understanding. Here are some I found:

"China Censors Eye Internet Freedom In Shanghai Trade Zone, Says SCMP"

China Censors Eye Internet Freedom In Shanghai Trade Zone, Says SCMP - Forbes

Quotes:

What exactly will investors be permitted to do inside the FTZ? Will China's currency be fully convertible? Who adjudicates commercial disputes?... Will I be allowed to update my status on Facebook?

How wonderful. It's more cost-effective than providing to Zone residents a VPN account to get around the blocking, which is what most free thinkers use now to read unimpeded what the rest of the English-speaking world is reading. I got a taste of this geo-unblocking in June at the Fortune Global Forum in Chengdu. Inside the aptly-named Shangri-La Hotel, where the CEOs gathered, the wi-fi was magically uncensored. See, isn't China just like any other capitalist country? Did you see my status update? No need to break their illusion. Leave the hotel, though, and the old rules applied in Chengdu, as elsewhere in China. No Facebook, New York Times, or Bloomberg (banned last year after reporting on Xi Jinping's wealthy relatives). So this is what life in Shanghai's FTZ could be like.


"Will Shanghai be free to trade?"
Will Shanghai be free to trade? - Craig Stephen's This Week in China - MarketWatch

"looking like a global financial center has been easier than behaving like one."

It would not be unreasonable to say Shanghai has been going backwards in terms of being a functioning domestic financial center, never mind a global one.It looks as if Hong Kong can relax for a few more years before worrying that its place will be usurped by Shanghai

"China to lift ban on Facebook, Twitter in Shanghai Free Trade Zone"
China to lift ban on Facebook, Twitter in Shanghai Free Trade Zone

Government sources who were knowledgeable about the decision told the Post that the authority in charge of the Hong Kong-like FTZ in Shanghai, the first such zone on the mainland, would also welcome bids from foreign telecommunications companies for licences to provide internet services within the new special economic zone.

Hongkong used to be the mentor of Chinese economic development
But after 30 years development, mainland doesn't need Hongkong to play this role any more!

My personal belief is that Hong Kong will still be the condom used by PRC. There is more chance of PRC loosing its edge compared to Hong Kong loosing its edge. Yes if PRC fails Hong Kong will suffer temporarily.

Based on your explaination, every country's stock market is their or others condom to screw the world!

What you say makes no sense. The stock market is one aspect of the condom (its funny you dont doubt whats in the condom). I repeat PRC companies were listed on the Hong Kong stock exchange with loose and slack requirements. People also include lax accounting standards. Tell me where else has this happened and in vast figures to PRC (you can include Shanghai).

Your thinking is worthless since you are just talking. Thousands of multinational corpeartions believe they know what is happening inside PRC and they bet billions of dollars on it!

Whats the reason for Shanghai Trade Zone. Why is there trade flowing through Hong Kong to PRC. Why are all of the multinational corporations in PRC located in Hong Kong. Have you read the contracts of these multinational corporations. I wonder what is the law applied and if there has been any disputes.

Kid, go back to school and try to learn something real! Where have you been? PRC has been telling EVERYONE that they will do that for 10 years!

Are you trying to teach me a lesson. Why don't you tell me what will happen in the next 10 years (will it be timed to the [x] amount of years when PRC has been promised full democracy). In fact why don't you tell me what will happen in next 1 (one) year. To make it easy for you why don't you tell me what will happen in Shanghai Trade Zone.

For the Shanghai Trade Zone (test farm) the person writing the book must be a big adult and knows what they are doing am i right ...

After that ask yourself will PRC's currency be fully convertible?

And ask yourself why was it not done in the past 10 years. Why is there ambiguity on when it will be done. Why is there hesitation. What has PRC told to everyone. Why this sudden attention on Shanghai Free trade zone (and not Shenzhen Trade Zone). I guess I am a kid asking children questions.

On that case, I do because it is the natural result if Chinese economy continues to develop!

What is the character of PRC economy to allow it for fully convertible yuan. I ask again why do you think that Mr Li said what he said. He is saying that fully convertible yuan will happen. But when and how.

As I said, you have to learn some basic knowledge about Chinese economy!

The credibility on reading about PRC economy is low and untrustworthy. If you dress up in a smart suit doesn't mean you are rich. Perhaps you can share in a simple one sentence what and when the fully convertible yaun currency will appear. You know when will PRC play by the rules.

Because you can't say that to your boss if you don't have any significant leverage!

That means there is no danger for the protests and universal suffrage to Hong Kong. The boss thinks it has no significant leverage.

Because Hongkong is losing its value to Mainland and what Hongkongness is doing is speeding up this process! And he is lossing money or profit because of it!

I wonder where Mr Li is investing these days. I wonder if he was asked by the PRC leadership why dont you invest more in PRC (hint).

What happened with occupy wall street?

Occupy wall street was held in USA that some say has the aptitude to hold such protests. How about Hong Kong and PRC. Also what is the goal of central hong kong (is it the same to occupy wall street):

Protest to take over Central in July 2014 if promises made by the Central People's Government for universal suffrage were not realized in the 2017 Chief Executive Election and 2020 Legislative Council Elections.

The principles of the movements would be deliberative democracy, self-sacrifice, and civil disobedience modelled after Mahatma Gandhi and Martin Luther King.


You must be proud and influenced by these and also to see such noble actions in PRC region.

Occupy Central (2014) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I don't know! But, if Hongkong's prosperity is depending on PRC, how much independence can they have.

If PRC intent is to loosen the importance of Hong Kong "¦ will the people of Hong Kong demand less independence. Like I said PRC will not loosen the importance of Hong Kong they would be stupid. But can PRC prevent something from happening in Hong Kong that is a bigger question.

This also relates to the question what is the Shanghai Free Trade zone. That's why the above article is fascinating and what Mr Li says is important. If it is a simple test farm why did Mr. Li say what he did.

Does it matter if your pocket is controlled by others?

That means there is no danger for the protests and universal suffrage to Hong Kong. And Hong Kong is not important to PRC.

Why does PRC hate Hong Kong suddenly.

When do you think Hong Kong people will start saying "Hong Kong has good policies for PRC. Hong Kong has done a lot for PRC and it better treat Hong Kong well".

Why? There are almost 100m chineses are still struggling around poverty line and 200m-400m are just a little better than them. Comparing to our political freedom, I am more concerned about their living standard. As I know, if we don't look after their lives, they will come to us one day just as we did 60 years ago.

You must be proud (secretly) that Hong Kong has more democracy compared to PRC. It must make you proud Chinese to see a region have such policies (and also Taiwan to some extent). Unless of course you are not allowed to participate in it. In that case it must make you wonder why Hong Kong people are in a "Special Administrative Region".

Also what happened 60 years ago. You mean the Communist Party defeated KMT in a civil war. And what figures are you using [X] million out of how many.

It is just 2 brothers grew up in different families, after they come back to live together, they find a lot of differences between them. Do you think who is right or wrong?

A fight between two brothers. What will the legacy be from these two brothers. What is Taiwan. What is Shanghai. What is Shanghai Free Trade Zone. Does land border and sea border make a difference.

Does it matter? In the past 100 years, Hongkong's economic basis is being the window of the mainland market. It can't live without China, but as the only window for China, China can't afford closing it. But now, the whole China is opened, Hongkong is no longer that important to China while mainland is even more important to Hongkong. It is not who is telling the truth, it is about who is replying on who!

I will be shocked if you think Hong Kong is no longer important to PRC. It will be stupid thinking.

"Wang said the country had more than a son, referring to the several hubs, but it would reserve the best policies for Hong Kong," said Chan Wing-kee.