RUSSIAN fighters will top in the next decade.

ahmedsid

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How will the Su-35 be the Typhoon slayer? By and large it has an inferior airframe and inferior avionics.

When have the MKI and the EF met properly in exercises anyway? They have only had a few mock 1-on-1 dogfights, and the results were never publicly released. Basically they just slapped each other on the back. (I heard that they broke pretty much even in these mock WVR battles but who knows for sure).

We wont see any Russian 5th Gen type in service until around 2015 at the earliest anyway, who knows what the PAK-FA will turn out like.

How are the Russians not behind anyone? A lack of resources after the break up meant that the already significant tech gap was expanded massively. No fault to the engineers themselves, actually on that matter haven't a lot of the old engineers started to retire anyway?
I thought the airframes of the Su 35 were new and improved, could you shed some light on this Shiny???
 

Shiny Capstar

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I thought the airframes of the Su 35 were new and improved, could you shed some light on this Shiny???
The airframe is improved yes, it certainly isn't the same as the earlier Su-XX's, it is however a development of a much older design than the EF. Updated to give moderate RCS reduction (as much as is feasibly possible with the basic Flanker template) and use new materials/methods where possible, the base EF design is somewhat more advanced in a lot of areas (even though the Flanker design exceeds it in some). The Flanker design can't really be easily improved much more than what they are doing with the Su-35, it will probably be the last real change they do to the airframe before moving onto pastures new.
 

Zmey Smirnoff

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How will the Su-35 be the Typhoon slayer? By and large it has an inferior airframe and inferior avionics.

Do you care to provide some evidence to back up that claim, or brand new Su-35 is inferior to 15 year old Eurofighter just because its Russian? From what I see, its just misguided national pride talking.

So lets hear it, fogbreather. Whats your proof?
 

Soham

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Do you care to provide some evidence to back up that claim, or brand new Su-35 is inferior to 15 year old Eurofighter just because its Russian? From what I see, its just misguided national pride talking.

So lets hear it, fogbreather. Whats your proof?
Now now.... a military professional deserves more respect than that. Don't you think ?
Arguments can always be carried out in a more polite manner.
 

ahmedsid

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Shiny, The SU Family were never known for stealthiness, and yes this might be the last of improvements. But I am sure with top of the line AESA and other stuff, it can give the EF a Fight and win too.

The Su30 MKI met the EFs on an exercise I believe, and it was head to head I have read. Please let us know what you think with some more details, but I personally think the SU 35 will do good against the EF.
 

Shiny Capstar

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Do you care to provide some evidence to back up that claim, or brand new Su-35 is inferior to 15 year old Eurofighter just because its Russian? From what I see, its just misguided national pride talking.

So lets hear it, fogbreather. Whats your proof?
Which Su-35? The current one in service with the RuAF (awaiting upgrading) or the one they always go on about (the 'intermediate fighter program' one with the Irbis-E and all that) that is not in service, you know the one which has only 3 prototypes. Which nobody even knows if they actually have the systems installed for pre-production integration.

Please clarify which Su-35 you are talking about, the older one in service with the RuAF or the one still in testing and a few years away from production (from Sukhoi's estimates). After that I will be happy to answer you.
 

A.V.

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shiny sir ,zmey is speaking about the new SU-35 BM model the one which made its recent 100th test flight a few days back.
 

Shiny Capstar

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Shiny, The SU Family were never known for stealthiness, and yes this might be the last of improvements. But I am sure with top of the line AESA and other stuff, it can give the EF a Fight and win too.
I thought the Su-35 was getting a PESA?
Any plane has a chance against any other plane, and the gap between the two in this case is not so much as to make it just luck in a one on one fight. We will have to wait and see.

The Su30 MKI met the EFs on an exercise I believe, and it was head to head I have read. Please let us know what you think with some more details, but I personally think the SU 35 will do good against the EF.
From what I have been able to find out the Eurofighter and MKI (Exercise Indra Dhanush) were pretty much even in the WVR mocks, (as much detail as I was able to squeeze out of him), I don't think there was any BVR (I have never found out anything to the contrary). The Harriers and Tornado's apparently got walloped by them both, as you would expect.
 

Shiny Capstar

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shiny sir ,zmey is speaking about the new SU-35 BM model the one which made its recent 100th test flight a few days back.
The one a few years away from production then.
When I see it in its final configuration I shall say, it is currently a paper plane (in terms of not the airframe but what it shall carry). All we have right now is the estimated range of the Irbis-E, (which I assume it will have when it is put into production, currently it doesn't), and (probably estimated) raw performance figures.
 

A.V.

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friends why i posted this report is because of the folllowing 3 planes, the russian su-35BM which is a 4++ generation plane and is a very good transition type the russians have managed to get the aesa radar, the supercruise and even reduced the rcs considerably.
after that news is already out about the PAKFA with india also heavily involved it will a 5th gen heavy class fighter with internal weapons bay,considerable stealth and a good avionics package. pakfa when its complete will have all the qualities to match the f-22a on paper.

now the most important part pakfa is a very heavy plane and it will be twin engine plane it is virtually impossible to replace the old single engine mig 4th gen variants with pakfa completely both for the russian airforce and indian or the vast number of countries that fly the mig. russia is looking to produce the LMFI the light weight single engine 5th gen fighter once the pakfa is done with by 2015 both the pakfa and LFMI cannot be done together because of funds and its very logical the LMFI will be based on the MIG 1.42 and the yak models several russian sources have claimed the planning of such an aircraft this will be highly needed for export versions as this will be single engine light single seater plane which will need less maintenence than the pakfa.

i posted the news about the origin of the LMFI days back but here is a more recent link

http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/the-dewline/2009/04/russian-industry-looks-beyond.html

alex fedrov here claims the need for the light weight fighter and why it was not developed earlier.



now lets do an accessment of the future russian generation fighters,in the next 15 years

mig will have upgraded mig-35 and new LMFI
sukhoi will have SU-35BM and PAKFA.
yak will have the PAKDA

now compare for your self where russia stands in respect to the other fighter producing countries.
 

Yusuf

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The need for a single engine light weight 5th gen fighter will definitely arise just as the west found the need for one with the JSF.
Not everyone will be interested or will be able to afford F22s and PAKFAs. But everyone will require a 5th gen fighter once they become common and standard. Thats why the need for a single engine light fighter.
 

A.V.

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MOSCOW, August 5 (RIA Novosti) - New and modernized aircraft will comprise 70% of the Russian Air Force by 2020, the Air Force commander said on Wednesday.

"We expect 70% of the Air Force strength to be new and modernized aircraft by 2020," Col. Gen. Alexander Zelin told reporters.

"The development of the Russian Air Force will be carried out through extensive acquisition of new advanced aircraft and continuing modernization of the existing fleet," he added.

STRATEGIC AVIATION AND RECONAISSANCE AIRCRAFT

According to Zelin, Tu-95MC Bear and Tu-160 Blackjack bombers, Tu-22M3 Backfire long-range bombers and Il-78 Midas aerial tankers will form the backbone of the Russian strategic aviation in the next decade following extensive modernization.

The bombers, in particular, will be equipped with new targeting and navigation systems, which will enable them, in particular, to use conventional unguided bombs with a very high degree of accuracy - effectively engaging any target within 20 meters.

They will also have their operational range increased and their onboard defense systems significantly upgraded, the general said.

In addition, Zelin said Russia had been developing a fifth-generation strategic bomber which could be used effectively in both conventional and nuclear conflicts.

"The new plane will use a wide selection of high-precision weapons, and will have a whole range of new combat capabilities, allowing it to apply new methods to carrying out deterrence tasks," he said.

Russia will also develop in the near future a number of advanced reconnaissance aircraft including a stratospheric plane capable of avoiding enemy air defenses.

"Ultra-high altitude reconnaissance planes will play a key role in future wars because they will be capable of staying in the air for a long time and conduct reconnaissance operations deep into enemy territory while avoiding hostile air defenses," the Air Force commander said.

FRONTLINE AVIATION
The frontline aviation is the core of the Russian Air Force and currently comprises MiG-31B Foxhound interceptors, Su-27 Flanker and MiG-29 Fulcrum fighters, Su-24M Fencer fighter-bombers, Su-25 Frogfoot ground attack aircraft, and MiG-25R Foxbat and Su-24MR Fencer-E tactical reconnaissance aircraft.

Zelin said the Air Force will receive in the next decade not only modernized Su-27SM and MiG-29SMT fighters, but also generation 4++ Su-35S Flanker-E and MiG-35C Fulcrum-F fighters.

"The Russian Defense Ministry will start purchasing large numbers of these aircraft at the beginning of the next decade," the general said.

Meanwhile, Russia's fifth-generation multirole fighter is being developed by the Sukhoi aircraft maker, part of the United Aircraft Corporation (UAC), along with India's Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL), under a preliminary intergovernmental agreement signed in October 2007.

"Flight tests of the [fifth-generation] aircraft are scheduled to start in the second half of 2009, and the aircraft is expected be put into service in the next few years," the commander said.

He also said Su-24 fighter-bombers will soon be replaced by advanced Su-34 Fullback aircraft.

The general reiterated that Russia will start in 2009 the production of the Su-25UBM, a two-seat version of the Su-25SM.

MILITARY TRANSPORT AVIATION
There are up to 300 transport aircraft in service with the Russian Air Force, including An-12 Cub, An-72 Coaler, An-22 Cock, An-124 Condor and Il-76 Candid planes.

The An-12, An-22, and An-26 planes will be decommissioned in the near future, Zelin said.

The An-26 plane will be replaced by Il-112B light transport aircraft with higher payload capacity and better fuel efficiency.

"The first Il-112 is expected to make its maiden flight in 2011. The Air Force will order over 70 planes of this type," the general said.

The An-12 will be most likely replaced by a medium-haul transport plane jointly-developed by Russia and India, Zelin said.

The plane, with a 20-ton cargo capacity, is expected to go in service with the Russian and Indian air forces in about eight years.

The An-124 and its modernized version, the An-124-100, will remain in service as a strategic heavy airlift transport aircraft. In addition, 12 Il-76 aircraft will be modernized to Il-76MD-90A starting in 2011.

HELICOPTERS

The existing fleet of Mi-24 Hind attack helicopters will be fully replaced with new-generation Mi-28N Night Hunter and Ka-52 Alligator attack helicopters by 2015.

"We have started deliveries of Mi-28N helicopters to combat units [in the North Caucasus military district] and plan to re-equip at least one squadron with these aircraft by the yearend," Zelin said.

"We are also expecting to complete the tests of the Ka-52 helicopter this year," he added.

The Ka-52 is a twin-seat derivative of the Ka-50 Hokum-A attack helicopter, and is designed primarily for reconnaissance and target designation purposes. It is similar to the U.S. AH-64 Apache attack helicopter.

UAV

The unmanned aerial vehicles (UAV) will start playing an increasingly important role in future combat. Given their much lower manufacturing and maintenance costs they could form as much as 40% of the Air Force fleet by 2025, Zelin said.

The Air Force will start receiving domestically-developed attack UAVs in 2011.

"Unmanned and manned aircraft will complement one another, and must be able to accomplish a full range of combat missions in regional or local conflicts," the general said.
here is the complete russian plan for 2020 and it comes from a very dependable source
 

IBM

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Russia got tech better than western world, but they face problem on money and corruption. But if u seee cold war era there fighter and bombers clearly outclassed western ones...
 

RAM

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Nizhny Novgorod region prosecutors opened a criminal investigations into the sale of four MiG-31 supersonic long-range fighter jets to a shell company for $5 apiece, the Prosecutor General’s Office said Thursday in a statement on its web site.

The MiGs — which had been stored at the Nizhny Novgorod’s Sokol aviation plant that produces them — were sold without engines and weapon systems, but even in such a condition they’re each worth at least 116 million rubles ($3.7 million), the statement said.

Investigators from the regional prosecutor’s office and the Federal Security Service established that between October 2006 and July 2007, unidentified officials from the Volga Federal District branch of the Federal Reserves Agency abused their authority and illegally included the fighters in a list of assets that the agency was selling.

An appraisal valued the MiGs at 153 rubles each, and they were sold in a tender to a shell company, Metalsnab, that had no right to trade in arms or military equipment, the statement said. As a result, the federal budget suffered damages of more than $15 million.

Detectives also said they could not establish the identities of the officials involved in the scheme. Investigators were not able to determine the whereabouts of the MiGs, prosecutors said.

Meanwhile, Sokol’s deputy director for communications, Igor Chernichenko, told The Moscow Times on Thursday that the airframes in question were still safe and sound at the plant.

“They’ve been here for almost 20 years,” he said.

Chernichenko denied that Sokol officials were involved in the fraud scheme described by prosecutors.

Nizhny Novgorod prosecutors had opened a criminal case into massive fraud, the Prosecutor General’s Office said. The charge carries a punishment of up to 10 years in prison.

Sokol is part of the state-owned United Aircraft Corporation.
 

IBRIS

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Competition in the fighter jet market is taking flight. PAK FA, Su-34, Su-30mk, Mig-35, F/A-18, Rafale and Eurofighter Typhoon, along with the JSF, are all due to enter service in the next decade. Existing models, such as the F-16 and MiG-29, are already saturating the lower end of the market.


But my favorite:


 

Sabir

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If Su-30MKI with a AESA is a match to Eurofighter Typhoon...why not future generation PAK-FA?( Anyway, India has the option to alter some components with israeli or western ones)
Before cliaming Russians are inferior in avionics some one should remember no country has exported more aircrafts than the Russians. Top Guns of all these Air-Forces are stupids?

Please tell me one thing-our LCA Tejas will be fitted with Israeli Elta EL/M 2052 AESA?
 

Soham

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Russia got tech better than western world, but they face problem on money and corruption. But if u seee cold war era there fighter and bombers clearly outclassed western ones...
Could I have an example along with an incident where it proved its superiority ?
 

IBM

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Could I have an example along with an incident where it proved its superiority ?
Soham you can check youtube along with several defence site .They r full of articles about russian superiority over west. In korean war MIG- 19 were superor than U.S sabre. In vieatnam war,mig 21 were better than phantom..
 

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