Russian-Chinese Su-33 fighter deal collapses

Discussion in 'China' started by Singh, Mar 11, 2009.

  1. Singh

    Singh Phat Cat Administrator

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2009
    Messages:
    20,305
    Likes Received:
    8,270
    Location:
    011
    Russian-Chinese Su-33 fighter deal collapses

    MOSCOW, March 10 (RIA Novosti) - Russia has refused to sell its Su-33 carrier-based fighters to China over fears that Beijing could produce cheaper export versions of the aircraft, a Russian daily said on Tuesday.

    The Moskovsky Komsomolets newspaper said that China and Russia had been in negotiations on the sale of 50 of the Su-33 Flanker-D fighters, to be used on future Chinese aircraft carriers, since 2006, but that the talks collapsed recently over China's request for an initial delivery of two aircraft for a "trial."

    Russian Defense Ministry sources confirmed that the refusal was due to findings that China had produced its own copycat version of the Su-27SK fighter jet in violation of intellectual property agreements.

    In 1995, China secured a $2.5-billion production license from Russia to build 200 Su-27SKs, dubbed J-11A, at the Shenyang Aircraft Corp.

    The deal required the aircraft to be outfitted with Russian avionics, radars and engines. Russia cancelled the arrangement in 2006 after it discovered that China was developing an indigenous version, J-11B, with Chinese avionics and systems. The decision came after China had already produced 95 aircraft.

    This time, Russia refused the Chinese offer even after Beijing had offered to buy 14 Su-33 aircraft, saying that at least 24 jets should be sold to recoup production costs.

    However, the Moskovsky Komsomolets said that the Su-33 deal may be reviewed later because China desperately needs carrier-based aircraft to equip its first indigenous 48,000-ton aircraft carrier, due to be built by 2011. Beijing has also announced plans to build a nuclear-powered aircraft-carrier by 2020.

    Chinese media recently quoted China fleet commander Adm. Xu Hongmeng as saying: "China will very soon have its own aircraft carrier."

    The Su-33 is a carrier-based multi-role fighter, which can perform a variety of air superiority, fleet defense, air support and reconnaissance missions. The aircraft entered service with the Russian Navy in 1995 and are currently deployed on board the Nikolai Kuznetsov aircraft carrier.

    Russian Su-33 naval fighters are significantly cheaper than any similar foreign models, such as the French Rafale-M, or the U.S F-35C or the F/A-22N Sea Raptor.

    http://en.rian.ru/russia/20090310/120493194.html
     
  2.  
  3. Triton

    Triton Founding Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Messages:
    342
    Likes Received:
    6
    Hope the Russians will be more serious about the issue when they later review the deal for consideration as Su-33 is one of their best technology available at this moment.
     
  4. EnlightenedMonk

    EnlightenedMonk Member of The Month JULY 2009 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    3,831
    Likes Received:
    23
    How does it matter whether it's cheaper compared to what else??? The fact is that neither the French nor the Americans are going to sell China those jets and face having black market copies peddled around on street corners!!!

    So, Russia is his only option as far as carrier based jets are concerned. Either that, or he builds them himself...
     
  5. A.V.

    A.V. New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Messages:
    6,503
    Likes Received:
    1,106
    Location:
    Moscow, russia
    atleast the russians have come to know finally that for short term gains they are losing out on a big weapons market due to the inferior chinese copies.

    just an info:-
    the next russian aircraft-carrier will not be having the su-33 it will have mig-29k<the same ones that india bought recently> and the pakfa naval version later on.
     
  6. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Messages:
    20,550
    Likes Received:
    6,553
    are they playing Gorshokov games now with the Chinese?
     
  7. yang

    yang Regular Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2009
    Messages:
    358
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    China
    isn't surprise

    Nobody will want lose his strengh by exchanging a little money,and nobody can help someone all the way.The advantage in high technique fields is due to the accumulations attributed to several generations' efforts.We should depend on ourselves.
     
  8. Payeng

    Payeng Daku Mongol Singh

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    2,521
    Likes Received:
    767
    Location:
    Neistan
    Initially it is a bad news for the Chinese aircraft carrier ambition.
     
  9. Payeng

    Payeng Daku Mongol Singh

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    2,521
    Likes Received:
    767
    Location:
    Neistan
    I remember some where I have read that news but can you throw a light why the Russian are moving from the Sukhoi to Migs, what is the reason, any technical issue?
     
  10. yang

    yang Regular Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2009
    Messages:
    358
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    China
    Maybe

    look at the oil & gas transportation pipeline talk among China,Russian,Japan, and the incident between India and Russia about the added fee.Russia seemed to be a businessman but a little too smart.Each investment has systematic risks and unsystematic risks,bet is bet,although it has many economics and financial reasons.
     
  11. A.V.

    A.V. New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Messages:
    6,503
    Likes Received:
    1,106
    Location:
    Moscow, russia
    there is no technical issue with the su-33 its one of the best tech but the mig29k is the most modern russian carrier aircraft also another reason is that russia wants to divide the planes between mig and sukhoi,the mig will get the 29ks while the sukhoi will have the pakfa.

    note:-russian rac mig was in a big financial trouble<following algerias order cancellation > few months back following its integration into united aircraft corporation it has got a new life,to support it further the goverment has decided to buy a set of new mig planes may be this has to do something with this decision.
     
  12. A.V.

    A.V. New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Messages:
    6,503
    Likes Received:
    1,106
    Location:
    Moscow, russia
    russia is acting tough on china

    The reason behind this refusal is Russia's recent admission, that China is producing unlicensed copies of the Su-27 fighter. Russia has known about this theft for some time. It all began in 1995, when China paid $2.5 billion for the right to build 200 Su-27s. Russia would supply engines and electronics. But after 95 of the Chinese built aircraft were built, Russia cancelled the agreement. They claimed that China was using the knowledge acquired with the Su-27 program, to build their own copy of the Su-27, the J-11. Russia kept the piracy issue quiet, and warned the Chinese that simply copying Russian technology would produce an inferior aircraft. Apparently the Chinese do not agree, and are continuing their work on the J-11, using only, what they claim is, Chinese technology. China also recently announced that it was offering for export their HQ-9 anti-aircraft missile system. This system is believed to contain technology from similar Russian (S-300) and U.S. (Patriot) systems.


    http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htmurph/articles/20090312.aspx
     
  13. shiv

    shiv Regular Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2009
    Messages:
    326
    Likes Received:
    5
    i think after the russian refusal,this is the last brick in the coffin of chinese arms imports........

    when it is stranded by sanctions from EU and USA,its only hope for advanced tech was Israel and Russia...with russia enlightining itself and americas hands across Israel's neck.....this will be a major setback to its policy of reverse engineering.......

    i think the chinese lack the creativity and original thought to come up with their own concepts and designs....
     
  14. Atul

    Atul Founding Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2009
    Messages:
    514
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    Navi-Mumbai
    The Chinese have a messy reputation of Replicating what ever they buy, May it be a MIG or a Sukhoi.

    A right step from Russia. The Russians should sell to genuine buyers rather then cloners...
     
  15. EnlightenedMonk

    EnlightenedMonk Member of The Month JULY 2009 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    3,831
    Likes Received:
    23
    What they buy ??? They even replicate what they don't buy... I'm referring to the Bajaj Pulsar and Amico Gulsar controversy... they're trying to copy the Pulsar as well !!!
     
  16. yang

    yang Regular Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2009
    Messages:
    358
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    China
    But the situation changed quickly nowadays

    In a website ,I have seen a news that the talks on Su -33 shipborne fighter between Russia and China are running smoothly.And <Hanhe Defense Weekly>reported that In march the 17th,one staff of Russian military enterprises said that the two side are having talks on the selling of Su-33,and they all hope to sign a contract soon,and he emphsized that the reports about Russia will cancel the contract with China is not true.<Hanhe Defense Weekly> had reported that to avoid being copied ,Russia had refused to selling her Su-33 to China not long ago.
    So the things are changing so quickly,like the weather here in spring.
     
  17. VayuSena1

    VayuSena1 Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2009
    Messages:
    200
    Likes Received:
    13
    What continues to surprise me is that despite China achieving near self-reliance, why does it continue to obtain Sukhois even for its aircraft carriers? Logical step for the Chinese Navy at this moment would be to develop a naval variant of the J-10. This could perhaps make them completely self-reliant.

    Are you aware of the reasons and if so, could you please explain to me? Thank you.
     
  18. yang

    yang Regular Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2009
    Messages:
    358
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    China
    As you said we are just self-reliance,and the core technology of the military equipment are chip ,engine...and they are all results of the labour of generations of technical personnel.So according to law of comparative advantage ,we choose to import the more advanced Su-33,that's more wisely but we don't import the air carrier from them.
     

Share This Page