RSS role in bombing samjhota express. mecca masjid

[JBH22]

Stop going off on your own trip.

Nobody accuses the Hindu of being racist, bigoted, besmirched or anything else.

Nobody wants the Hindu to be "weak, diminutive", "passive", "submissive" or anything else.

The reason minorities live in this country is because the Hindu is accepting, accommodating, ambitious and strong minded. The reason they live in this country is because India, this country of 80% Hindus, has a future.

But no, Hindus are not exonerated from all blame and guilt, merely because of their religion. Nor are they incapable of crimes or violence, just as Christians or Muslims or Sikhs are. And yes, they will be prosecuted before the law, just as a Christian, a Muslim or a Sikh may be.

Let us not forget. We may be democratic in our law making, but we are secular in its execution.

The law is Blind before every man.

If i switch on my TV i have serious reasons to disagree with you that's what i want anyone caught breaking the law must be punished accordingly. My problem is that if you commit terrorism you need to be killed that's it. The thing that i find disgusting is that some for their vested interest play hard on fighting Hindus so called "atrocities" and wrong doings while at the same time their urge to be politically correct at all times while talking if not denying actions perpetrated by minority groups.

I want know why Hindus plights are not equally denounced in the same way.

 

[Tshering22]

You know what? The whole point of this thread has been discussed through.

BOTTOMLINE:

1- RSS is NOT a terrorist organization but a nationalist one
2- Only some members were involved in the blasts and until the court proves them guilty nothing can be said.
3- Government must take equal measures and treat all genuinely equally unlike now.

Now I think Mods should simply close this thread.

 

[ejazr]

I have better suggestion to end this quandary,it should be settled through a toss of coin,heads Islamic terrorist,tails Hindu terrorists.PC should flip the coin really,it has more credibility than his agencies investigative skills.


P.S:I get it,when police screw up they blame Muslims,but when they a do a thorough investigation and no screw up,by default a Hindu hand should merge.

I have not heard anyone - politician or investigative officer- make the statement in your italics. There are plenty of investigative leads where terrorists who happened to be muslim were arrested and convicted.

But I don't understand why some people fail to agree that innocent Muslims have been picked up and tortured in terrorism cases. And then later when they were released due to lack of evidence from the Courts, they have their entire life destroyed because of the stigma of being a terrorist when it was not even true.

This is not only a Human Rights violation, it is also a national security risk because this is giving the false perception that the "terrorists" have been captured. While the actual terrorists are roaming around freely, innocents are being tortured and radicalised.

For a person who kills innocent people in Terrorist acts, he always think its a reprisal act wether its Hindu or Muslim. The thought that this is reprisal does not make it correct, espicially when innocent people are killed.

But like I said earlier, whats needed is no politicisation of terror. And ofcourse no need to link terror with any religion either. Let the investigative agencies do their job, and let that investigation stand in court. There are many reports on the court documents already as well as chargesheets, so lets hope that this is taken to the logical conclusion.

 

[NSG_Blackcats]

Confession made by any accused in Police custody can be easily challenged in court. I feel neither the CBI nor NIA have any evidence against RSS or any member of RSS. If CBI had evidence against Indresh Kumar; they should have arrested him instead of calling him for questioning. It seems Congress is playing the game for votes and to improve its tally in UP. Secondly as an investigating agency CBI has already lost its credibility. CBI is learning new lessons from our Home Minister about how to leak information to media to help its political masters (A letter written by Chidambarm to WB chief minister was leaked to media before it reached WB CM. This was done to make Mamata Happy.) I am yet to understand anything about this bull shit agency called NIA.

Congress Leaders like Diggy Raja is making new stories each day. Diggy Called on a landline number and now claiming he had spoken to the former ATS chief of Mumabi. I think it's high time this Congress led Govt needs to be kicked out.

 

[KS]

I have better suggestion to end this quandary,it should be settled through a toss of coin,heads Islamic terrorist,tails Hindu terrorists.PC should flip the coin really,it has more credibility than his agencies investigative skills.




P.S:I get it,when police screw up they blame Muslims,but when they a do a thorough investigation and no screw up,by default a Hindu hand should merge.

One of the wittiest posts I've come across.

And I came across this comment on Pioneer,

Swapan D's op-ed on this topic gave me hearty laugh. Georgian delegate to Stalin
were suspected of stealing Stalin's pipe and Beria interrogated them. After a while Stalin found his pipe fallen below his table and phoned Beria to let the delegates go as he found his pipe. Beria replied, "But sir, half the delegate has already confessed to the crime and the other half died during interrogation!"
In Congi-Raj, all you have to do is to TRASH the HINDUS and get lucrative postings now and after

 

[Abir]

Swapan D's op-ed on this topic gave me hearty laugh. Georgian delegate to Stalin
were suspected of stealing Stalin's pipe and Beria interrogated them. After a while Stalin found his pipe fallen below his table and phoned Beria to let the delegates go as he found his pipe. Beria replied, "But sir, half the delegate has already confessed to the crime and the other half died during interrogation!"
In Congi-Raj, all you have to do is to TRASH the HINDUS and get lucrative postings now and after

Only a mind devoid person would say Hindus are trashed and demonised in India, yeah may be RSS version of Hindus, but then again, they deserved to be trashed.

Really whom are we fooling here? Congress might pull one or two rhetoric here and there but do you really believe they act as fair to all people regardless of their faith? They didn't have b**ls to stop RSS people to ravage the Masjid for that matter, neither they intended to stop them. Or is terror act also nationalist in a way when it is done by people from RSS?

About Congress leaking the documents, yeah they might do that for propaganda purpose but that Swami guy aka some Chaterjee aka some Sarkar actually himself wrote letters to President of India and Pakistan(corny it might seem) which was prevented to come online until Tehelka got access to it. There's more substance behind this drama than what meets the eye, he is not concocting a tale like Diggi raja.

Not directed to any person specifically but it's funny how RSS apologists show bigoted acts of Congress to justify their case.

 

[hit&run]

My out of the box observation, otherwise is as typical as it should be like any law abiding Indian.

What is the possibility that the confession is made to project themselves as a great heroes and protectors of Hindus, who can retaliate. Such attacks by Hindu groups are pure terrorism but the purpose was to send some message (competitive terrorism). By confessing/taking responsibility the guys are trying to make a statement and delivering the message all across. Are they just messengers?

Their purpose is not going to be defeated by confession, rather accomplished. One must watch further developments very precisely; any effort to make them heroes is going to project a bad image of ours as a bias terrorist apologist nation like Pakistan. If someone has done this act of terror and evidences are against him irrespective of his confession (like in USA they do not punish people on confession but evidence, not sure what happens in India), he must not get any privileges/glory from any political party/community but suffer like a looser.

 

[Abir]

My out of the box observation, otherwise is as typical as it should be like any law abiding Indian.

What is the possibility that the confession is made to project themselves as a great heroes and protectors of Hindus, who can retaliate. Such attacks by Hindu groups are pure terrorism but the purpose was to send some message (competitive terrorism). By confessing/taking responsibility the guys are trying to make a statement and delivering the message all across. Are they just messengers?

Their purpose is not going to be defeated by confession, rather accomplished. One must watch further developments very precisely; any effort to make them heroes is going to project a bad image of ours as a bias terrorist apologist nation like Pakistan. If someone has done this act of terror and evidences are against him irrespective of his confession (like in USA they do not punish people on confession but evidence, not sure what happens in India), he must not get any privileges/glory from any political party/community but suffer like a looser.

Apparently one of the reasons was to prevent Hindus to visit Dargahs! Don't you find a strange similarity with Talibans? They are terrorists and there is no two ways of it. If you try to ride the gravy train of using terror then as well be prepared to go down the same way as our western neighbour.

 

[Daredevil]

Apparently one of the reasons was to prevent Hindus to visit Dargahs! Don't you find a strange similarity with Talibans? They are terrorists and there is no two ways of it. If you try to ride the gravy train of using terror then as well be prepared to go down the same way as our western neighbour.

This is gross over interpretation based on grossly inaccurate investigations and trial by media attempts. There is still nothing substantial conclusions as to who has done the bomb blasts. Let courts decides the case based on facts and evidence. Try to interpret things on such flimsy investigation is not going to take you anywhere except for slandering people/communities with a broad brush.

 

[Abir]

This is gross over interpretation based on grossly inaccurate investigations and trial by media attempts. There is still nothing substantial conclusions as to who has done the bomb blasts. Let courts decides the case based on facts and evidence. Try to interpret things on such flimsy investigation is not going to take you anywhere except for slandering people/communities with a broad brush.

That was as confessed by Swami Aseemanand, do you know of any reasons why he would be lying? As the investigation is still in progress so we'd have to believe what the main accused has to say about the incident.

 

[Abir]

like in USA they do not punish people on confession but evidence, not sure what happens in India

US laws say conviction solely based on confession is void, but they do take confession as an evidence.

I'm not sure about IPC but English take confession as an evidence and IPC modelled after English laws mainly.

 

[Oracle]

That was as confessed by Swami Aseemanand, do you know of any reasons why he would be lying? As the investigation is still in progress so we have to believe what the main accused has to say about the incident.

And do we not know the efficiency of our investigating agencies? CBI could not even find the murderer in the Aarushi Murder case. Hold your horses, till things are proved in a court of law. Whoever is guilty, should not be spared.

 

[Abir]

And do we not know the efficiency of our investigating agencies? CBI could not even find the murderer in the Aarushi Murder case. Hold your horses, till things are proved in a court of law. Whoever is guilty, should not be spared.

Well in this case the accused seem to be doing the job for CBI, unless there is some vested interest behind his explosive confession which as well might put him behind the bar for rest of his lifetime, we'd have to stick to his version. I'll be more than happy if this he was proved to be doing propaganda for Congress for the sole purpose of maligning RSS.

 

[Daredevil]

That was as confessed by Swami Aseemanand, do you know of any reasons why he would be lying? As the investigation is still in progress so we'd have to believe what the main accused has to say about the incident.

Look at his confessions - they look like a sob movie story. We don't know if this confession is under duress. Even if this confession is taken on face value there should be corroborative evidence that they have actually perpetrated. For example, he should prove that who was the mastermind, how did they get explosives, who trained them in making explosives etc etc. And not to mention the fact that the same investigative agencies have previously declared that SIMI/LeT were involved in these blasts and US has also mentioned that SIMI/LeT were involved in this. And in addition to this also comes the facts about the involvement of David Headley as reported by his wife.

There are too many loose ends and data points to be reconciled and be presented in a more coherent and logical way to convince us. But that has not happened so far putting the credibility of these already decrepit investigative agencies into question again.

 

[vishal_lionheart]

The culprit in RSS and VHP should be hanged for killing innocent countrymen as early as possible, Pakistani militant kills the Indian and these people kill fellow countrymen. Who is the worst?

 

[S.A.T.A]

The real crux of the matter which seems to have been glossed over amidst all the self flagellation and general outpouring of anti Hindu vitriol in the mass media is the credibility of the nations law enforcement agencies.Thanks to its blatant politicization in the recent days,coming the wake of allegations of corruption on multiple front,by the Italian wench,her whelp and their cabal of louts,whose character and integrity is less conspicuous than water in Thar,have reduced India's stature in the comity of nations to that of a regular circus clown.

What is the credibility of this country's resolve to stand shoulder to shoulder with the rest o the world in the fight against International terrorism,if we our Crime investigation report are no better than monthly fashion periodicals,a new terror couture for every occasion.we are a fucking laughing stock,because the world now believes that everything India says must be taken with a pinch of salt.All the Dossier we have sent to Pakistan and the rest of the world are as worthless as toilet paper(Pakistanis anyway dont use toilet papers.All the self righteous liberal secularists can chew on that.

This entire trial by media has been orchestrated so as to ensure that the issue gains maximum political outage before it even reaches a trail,because there is good chance the case will collapse on its inherent contradictions and conflicting evidences.The section of media has happily played collaborator,not surprising considering the media,besides its traditional mottoes like honest and unbiased reporting,has acquired certain new age traits like acting as behind the curtain power brokers and political lobbysits,while all the time maintaining the charade of the guardians of democracy.

In this context its interesting to note that tehelka did not accidentally get hold of the so called Asimanand confession by some clever journalistic skulduggery,tehelka has for long played troubadour to congress's machinations against Hindu groups,remember the days when Tehelka became the favored podium for the likes of Arundhati roy and setalvad as they tried to hoist the charge of a Muslim pogrom,purported to have been choreographed and conducted by Hindus of Gujarat.Setalvat is now facing charges of perjury and falsification of affidavits among various other charges of concocting evidence and threatening Gujarat riot victims,tehelka has never been apologetic of its association with these counter nationalists,how can they,they have to earn their bread and onion.Surely tehelka is the not ultimate purveyor truth in indian journalism.

Moreover if anybody thought that tehelka stumbled into Swami Asimanand only recently over the blast case,then you are wrong.Tehelka as part of its defame the Hindus of Gujarat has been constantly targeting RSS and other hindu activists,esp those working in the tribal dominated areas.There is even evidence that tehelka among many of its paid to write up stories,included those that were targeted at swami Asimanand who at that time was involved in various activities involving tribals of Dang(Gujarat),this is just coincidence ?

read this blatantly pro evangelical and anti hindusim article that appeared on Tehelka in 2005....

RSS invents another ram myth to capture the Dangs

To counter missionaries' activities and the supposed proselytisation among tribals, Sangh Parivar outfits and other neo-Hindu groups (like Swadhyay Parivar and Swaminarayan) have adopted new methods and new means to Hinduise Adivasis, including invention of new traditions and myth making. Attempts at staving off the missionary 'offensive' have continued unabated, and the latest is a Kumbh mela to be organised by RSS from February 11-13, 2006, at Subir village, around 35 kms from Ahwa, the district headquarter of Dangs. The selection of the place is very significant, because it was here that militant Hinduism was first asserted.

The overall in-charge, Swami Asheemanandaji — a Bengali sadhu who has been active in Dangs for almost a decade — was unavailable for comment. But the local media has often quoted him saying: "Bharat is facing two big challenges in the 21st century. One comes from Islamic jehad and the other from Christian missionaries. To counter these challenges, we need to awaken the Hindu samaj. And this is what I have been doing here in Dangs. My main objective is to completely eradicate Christianity from this tribal district."

 

[Abir]

Look at his confessions - they look like a sob movie story. We don't know if this confession is under duress. Even if this confession is taken on face value there should be corroborative evidence that they have actually perpetrated. For example, he should prove that who was the mastermind, how did they get explosives, who trained them in making explosives etc etc. And not to mention the fact that the same investigative agencies have previously declared that SIMI/LeT were involved in these blasts and US has also mentioned that SIMI/LeT were involved in this. And in addition to this also comes the facts about the involvement of David Headley as reported by his wife.

There are too many loose ends and data points to be reconciled and be presented in a more coherent and logical way to convince us. But that has not happened so far putting the credibility of these already decrepit investigative agencies into question again.

Yes the confession do seem to be corny but there seem to be emotional element working behind the confession, so it fits the bill.

It can be under duress, but we have to consider these factors -

Swami was a powerful guy knowing the who's who of BJP and RSS.
He himself went to the magistrate with a request to record his confession.
He wrote the letters two days after he made the confession under Section 164 of CRPC. He had given these letters on a jail visit to his brother to post. Tehelka procured them from him.
His lawyer didn't mention the letters as part of the CBI's alleged coercion.

All points to one direction, Swami acting on his conscience.

I more or less agree with rest of your post that one is innocent until proven guilty, but this confession will work as an evidence against them. There are more evidences, check here.

 

[maomao]

^^^^ Sad but true.....Con-gress with its loot, plunder, pillage and Swiss bank accounts, knows it very well, that they stand exposed. Then, how will the coterie and sycophants plunder the nation further to fill their coffers? What best could be to blame Hindus in some terror charges and derive multiple benefits; Firstly, get back lost muslim vote bank, as these charges will surely gain support of mullahs. Secondly,divert corruption charges and give Lobbyist, anti-national, corrupt "Secular" media fuel to get back to its age old dirty tricks of being paid service providers of evangelists and jihadis, and project corrupt con-gress as a savior and pot of honesty so that illiterate and semi-illiterate people can feel confident and again vote this leech party to power. Thirdly, once again launch bandit Antonia Maino as mother India and project her "Dumb" cub, the "Mandbudhi Balak", the not so intelligent Raul Vinci as PM of India, this is dance of death by divisive/corrupt/shameless secular looters in India

 

[Daredevil]

Yes the confession do seem to be corny but there seem to be emotional element working behind the confession, so it fits the bill.

It can be under duress, but we have to consider these factors -

Swami was a powerful guy knowing the who's who of BJP and RSS.
He himself went to the magistrate with a request to record his confession.
He wrote the letters two days after he made the confession under Section 164 of CRPC. He had given these letters on a jail visit to his brother to post. Tehelka procured them from him.
His lawyer didn't mention the letters as part of the CBI's alleged coercion.

All points to one direction, Swami acting on his conscience.

I more or less agree with rest of your post that one is innocent until proven guilty, but this confession will work as an evidence against them. There are more evidences, check here.

I would like to make one thing clear is that I'm here not defending Aseemananda et al. If he is guilty please go ahead and punish as strictly as you can do as per the law. My only concern is that this case has been used as a 'trial by media' by congress to deflect the issues at hand be it 2g Scam, inflation, Bofors and various other corruption cases inflicting heavily on Congress party. Also it has to be seen this issue in the context of Diggy Raja's claims of Karkare calling before just before he is called. This all indicates to the point that Congress using 'Safrron Terror' as an issue to browbeat opposition and at the same time get Indian muslim votes (apart from deflecting corruption issues) in the coming assembly elections in 5 states.

 

[Daredevil]

Please don't make this issue a 'Hindu VS Muslim" debate or secularism debate. The thread title is clear and I request members stick to the topic. All other off-topic posts gets deleted.