Role of Indian Navy in Sino-Indian conflict

[hungo]

Hi i have been wondering what will be the role of the Indian navy in a conflict with China ?I would think it would be foolhardy to attempt to take on China in the South China sea itself.So i take it the Indian navy will be mostly used to block trade routes or interdict the odd PLAN vessel that come up?Are there any land attack options available to the navy to support land operations?

 

[civfanatic]

The IN will just be used to cut off Chinese supplies and block critical chokepoints, especially the Malacca Straits.

Any future Sino-Indian conflict will revolve around Arunachal Pradesh and Aksai Chin, so I don't see the navy supporting land operations.

But I am just an armchair general so I might be wrong

 

[sandeepdg]

Firstly , I would say that I hope we don't get into a conflict with the Chinese for another 15 years at the least !! We are hardly a naval power to reckon with as of now, and compared to the Chinese Navy we are outnumbered approximately 4:1 ! Having said that, I think in an conflict, as Civfanatic put it, we will just able to strangle critical checkpoints like the Malacca straits and cut Chinese cargo traffic as well as make armed patrols in the Bay of Bengal and the Indian Ocean, more importantly in the Bay of Bengal, to deter incursions by the Chinese warships and subs. That's all that we are capable of as of now.

 

[civfanatic]

Firstly , I would say that I hope we don't get into a conflict with the Chinese for another 15 years at the least !! We are hardly a naval power to reckon with as of now, and compared to the Chinese Navy we are outnumbered approximately 4:1 !

Call me an over-optimistic patriot, but I think the Indian Navy has its act put together better than the PLAN, except in the area of nuclear SSBNs. We are the only Asian power with a working aircraft carrier, after all.

We should realize by now that sheer numbers mean little in modern warfare.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Call me an over-optimistic patriot, but I think the Indian Navy has its act put together better than the PLAN, except in the area of nuclear SSBNs. We are the only Asian power with a working aircraft carrier, after all.

We should realize by now that sheer numbers mean little in modern warfare.

Your statement is logical!
We Indians realized the use of CVs in oceans and seas also we are the only one who progressed so far, China also know its value but they have bigger problems than us..

But i should also add, China is doing rapid progress in Indian Ocean, namely making plenty of bases for Submarines..
In times of WAR IN will face Chinese Subs at most..

 

[hungo]

I think for all their numerous surface fleet, IN will be able to hold it's own. The most serious and numerous threat IN will have to face will be in the form PLAN subs which will attempt to bring the shipping lanes under-watch as soon as the conflict starts.

BTW guys thanks for replying

 

[neo29]

Hopefully the P8's and anti submarine corvette's will take care of the noisy chinese subs. PLA-N may be large they will have to concentrate more on taiwan straits and sea of japan. Geographically we are better located though we have less vessels.

Chinese will do all it can to make sure we fear their navy. Coz they fear their supply routes will be affected. They will do all they can to protect their supply routes.

 

[civfanatic]

Does anyone know the serviceability rate of PLAN subs?

Thanks in advance.

 

[sandeepdg]

PLAN fields around a total of 10 SSBNs and SSNs and close to 47 diesel attack submarines. Nearly half of the diesel attack sub fleet includes the modern Kilo, Yuan and Song class subs, the rest being the old Romeo class subs. So the PLAN has not just superiority in numbers, but superiority in quality too !! As for the IN being the only aircraft carrier operator in Asia, that will soon change, when PLAN gets the two aircraft carriers of the Adamiral Kuzetsnov class by 2015 and another one by 2020, i.e. 3 ACs by 2020. The Varyag is nearing completion and may be deployed in a span of 2-3 years. The prime cause of worry in a conflict will be the Chinese sub fleet. Even though they are obsolete, the Romeo and Ming class subs can be used as force multipliers accompany the highly potent Han and Shang class SSNs. Even if a few SSNs, combined with few conventional attack subs enter the Indian ocean, it will be a terrible nightmare situation for the IN !!

 

[sandeepdg]

By the way, this is a good read from the Heritage Foundation, USA:

Submarine Arms Race in the Pacific: The Chinese Challenge to U.S. Undersea Supremacy

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Re...he-Chinese-Challenge-to-US-Undersea-Supremacy

 

[civfanatic]

PLAN fields around a total of 10 SSBNs and SSNs and close to 47 diesel attack submarines. Nearly half of the diesel attack sub fleet includes the modern Kilo, Yuan and Song class subs, the rest being the old Romeo class subs. So the PLAN has not just superiority in numbers, but superiority in quality too !!

The Yuan class is still under development, and the Romeo class, as you said, is so obsolete that the PLAN uses them mostly for training. The main bite of the PLAN submarine arm consists of 12 Kilo class and 10 Song class subs. In comparison, the IN has 10 Sindughosh(Kilo variant) and 4 Shishumar class subs. I won't include our Foxtrots because they are obsolete. I don't know why you say the PLAN subs have advantage in quality; we both operate the Kilo class, and I trust German engineering (the Shishumar is a variant of a German sub) a lot more than Chinese engineering.

As for the IN being the only aircraft carrier operator in Asia, that will soon change, when PLAN gets the two aircraft carriers of the Adamiral Kuzetsnov class by 2015 and another one by 2020, i.e. 3 ACs by 2020. The Varyag is nearing completion and may be deployed in a span of 2-3 years.

Can you provide a source saying that the PLAN will get two Admiral Kuznetsovs?? Also the Varyag has zero percent chance of becoming operational, as it doesn't even come with engines, a rudder, or its main operating systems. The PLAN will likely use it to practice carrier takeoff and landing.

The prime cause of worry in a conflict will be the Chinese sub fleet. Even though they are obsolete, the Romeo and Ming class subs can be used as force multipliers accompany the highly potent Han and Shang class SSNs. Even if a few SSNs, combined with few conventional attack subs enter the Indian ocean, it will be a terrible nightmare situation for the IN !!

I don't mean to belittle the Chinese SSN fleet, but the Han class subs are widely regarded as being inadequate. I mean, they can't even fire missiles while submerged! Not to mention its noisy reactor, poor radiation shielding, and other health hazards.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/type-91.htm

 

[Yusuf]

All this has been talked about in various threads relating to sino indian war and sino indian relations as well. Hungo you can have a look at those too.

Let me tell you only this, Plan will not venture close to indian waters and IN will surely not venture into chinese.
Chinese with its subs has to pass US subs first to get to India if you talk about subs. In case of a war, US will not be a bystander. It will surely pass intel to India when the chinese subs leave their port. With india getting cutting edge ASW, we will take care of their subs.
Their surface vessels will not come to our waters either BoB or AS.

 

[bhramos]

The Yuan class is still under development, and the Romeo class, as you said, is so obsolete that the PLAN uses them mostly for training. The main bite of the PLAN submarine arm consists of 12 Kilo class and 10 Song class subs. In comparison, the IN has 10 Sindughosh(Kilo variant) and 4 Shishumar class subs. I won't include our Foxtrots because they are obsolete. I don't know why you say the PLAN subs have advantage in quality; we both operate the Kilo class, and I trust German engineering (the Shishumar is a variant of a German sub) a lot more than Chinese engineering.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/type-91.htm

The chaniese have Improved Kilo class [Project 636], which are quite superior to our Kilo [Project 836EKM] but our kilos have been upgraded recently, but will these effect to chini kilo, i dont Know!
we can surely fire Land attack CM Klup missiles, that for sure.........

 

[arya]

. Even if a few SSNs, combined with few conventional attack subs enter the Indian ocean, it will be a terrible nightmare situation for the IN !!

well i dont know when we Indian people think about defence seriously

 

[arya]

Let me tell you only this, Plan will not venture close to indian waters and IN will surely not venture into chinese.
Chinese with its subs has to pass US subs first to get to India if you talk about subs. In case of a war, US will not be a bystander. It will surely pass intel to India when the chinese subs leave their port. With india getting cutting edge ASW, we will take care of their subs.
Their surface vessels will not come to our waters either BoB or AS.

what if usa don't then

dont you think you are 100% depend on usa

 

[hungo]

Yusuf i think the PLAN initially will undertake patrols and surveillance but as soon as IN makes a move, they will do so as well.Our surface fleet is well equipped to deal with a comparable threat.But if the PLAN uses it's sub to go on the offensive, then i don't think if our ASW systems will be a able to cope with them.

Thanks for the link sandeep

 

[Yusuf]

arya india is well capable of defending its waters. We don't need the US. I just stated that we can expect US to help us.
Second, China would enter IOR if at all not for any offensive op against IN but just to protect its supplies of oil. It will not get into a hunting contest with India. Its not as strong as USN to do as such. So the contest will start only when India chokes Mallaccas.

 

[civfanatic]

Yusuf do you think the IN is capable at present of holding the Malacca Straits from the PLAN in case of conflict?

If not at present when in the future will the IN be capable of doing this?

 

[Yusuf]

Yusuf do you think the IN is capable at present of holding the Malacca Straits from the PLAN in case of conflict?

If not at present when in the future will the IN be capable of doing this?

Yes it is capable of taking the PLAN in our own backyard. Our navy is also acquiring better boats, and force multipliers too that will keep our navy strong. If a war was to take place even today, I think india will easily choke the Mallaccas should it chose to do so. Its just a shout from andamans.

 

[arya]

well fact is we are lacking from china lots of thing need now but don't know what govt is thinking

IN cant stand against in present time against china