RFP issued for India navy amphibious vessels (LHD or LPD type)

Discussion in 'Indian Navy' started by plugwater, Oct 5, 2010.

  1. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    India today took a major step towards upgrading its Navy's maritime air reconnaissance capability and amphibious warfare strength by deciding to order four each of P8I Poseidon aircraft and Landing Pontoon Docks (LPDs) totally worth over USD 5 billion.

    The four P8I long-range maritime patrol aircraft will be an add-on to the eight that India ordered from the US in January 2009 for USD 2.1 billion or nearly Rs 10,000 crore. These four aircraft from the US aerospace major Boeing's stable would cost India about USD 1 billion (less than Rs 5,000 crore).

    The four LPDs, on the lines of INS Jalashwa that India bought from the US for USD 50 million in 2007, would come at a cost of Rs 16,000 crore and a global tender would be issued for its under the Defence Ministry's 'Buy and Make' production policy. Under this, India would make the warships through license from a foreign firm.


    The 17,000-tonne Jalashwa, formerly USS Trenton, is a Austin class amphibious warfare ship that can carry about 1,000 fully armed army men and has four beach landing craft and six helicopters.

    The two decisions were taken at the meeting of the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) headed by Defence Minister A K Antony and attended by the three armed forces chiefs and the defence secretary this evening, ministry sources told PTI.

    The decisions come close on the heels of Antony and Navy Chief Admiral Nirmal Verma's visit to the US last week when they had met the American security top brass to discuss both business and defence cooperation.

    Now the proposals for both these purchases would be sent to the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) for clearance, the sources added.

    With the purchase of four more P8Is, Navy will operate a total of 12 of these aircraft that would plug a major gap in its capabilities to keep an eye on adversaries in the Indian Ocean Region (IOR), in which China has been making significant forays in the last one year citing anti-piracy operations.

    The Poseidon will provide the Navy with an option of a long-range reconnaissance mission in the entire maritime domain in IOR that India has been claiming to be its area of responsibility.

    Currently, though, Navy is woefully short of maritime surveillance platforms, operating eight aging Tu-142 turboprops and five Ilyushin-38s (upgraded in recent years), both of Russian origin.

    It also has Israeli 'Heron' and 'Searcher-II' unmanned aerial vehicles to perform the same role, but at shorter distances.

    Modeled on Boeing 737 commercial airliners with cruise speeds of 445 knots, the P8Is can also perform anti-submarine and anti-surface warfare roles, as they will be armed with torpedoes, depth chargers and Harpoon missiles.

    These aircraft have a mission range of 600 nautical miles and six hours of loitering time. Along with mid-air refueling capacity, their range could be extended further to 1,200 nautical miles.

    The first of the P8Is are expected to be delivered to the Navy by Boeing in 2013 and the rest to follow in the next six years, the sources said.

    4 maritime patrol jets and 4 amphibious warships for Navy
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2010
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  3. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    I bet India will choose San Antonio class, another buy from USA.
     
  4. Anshu Attri

    Anshu Attri Senior Member Senior Member

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  5. StealthSniper

    StealthSniper Senior Member Senior Member

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    I don't think the US will give the San Antonio class warship to India, but if they do, it's a good buy.
     
  6. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    Recently they have offered us every new technology they have got. So i am sure they will offer us san antonio class.

    Regarding the type of amphibious vessel i not sure whether to choose amphibious transport dock or amphibious assault ship!!!
     
  7. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    A little bit of history:
    USS San Antonio is named after the second largest city in Texas, USA. The city itself is named after Spanish Mexican general and president Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna (Antonio de Padua María Severino López de Santa Anna y Pérez de Lebrón (21 February 1794 – 21 June 1876)), who laid a siege of Alamo. Literal transliteration would mean Saint Anthony i.e. Anthony of Padua or Anthony of Lisbon, a Catholic Saint; after whom Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna was named.
     
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  8. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Could someone please specify how these new amphibious ships will help Indian Navy? India already has the capability to build amphibious ships. The INS Magar and INS Gharial were built by Hindustan Shipyard Limited and Garden Reach Shipbuilders and Engineers. How and in what ways is the Landing Pontoon Dock(s), the new class of ships (that India is going to import from the US) better than the Magar Class ships?

    It would be nice to know that the money is well spent and with the sudden escalation of defense deals with the US, it is only natural that a few eyebrows will be raised.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  9. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    Alll these amphibious ships will be built in India.

    20,000-crore boost for Navy’s snooping power - The Economic Times
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  10. Agantrope

    Agantrope Senior Member Senior Member

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    GRSE built the Magar as well as the Shardul Class Landing ships for the navy. GRSE is not sitting simple.

    New ships are in the heavy transport ship in the class of the 25,000Tonnes where Shardul and Magar are only 5-6K Tonnes class ships
     
  11. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    The news of some of the ships to be built in India sounds good. It is always a great idea to have ToT and then build them locally, or course allowing for the import of critical parts from abroad.

    The report (first post) however sounds like India is going to 'buy' the ships as part of the US$ 5 million deal.
     
  12. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    I see that there is an increase in size from 6K Tonnes to 25K Tonnes i.e. over 4 times. However, I do not see much of a challenge in simply enlarging a design or a concept. What I meant by my question was, what are the technical advantages that these new ships offer? Maybe more troops and tanks? However, that can be achieved even with domestic technology. Hindustan Shipyard or GRSE can handle that. They have been making tankers and other big stuff. Is India getting access to some critical knowhow?
     
  13. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    These amphibious ships are also useful for special ops, search and rescue, humanitarian aid etc. Bigger platform gives you an advantage to operate more helicopters from its deck. I am not sure about our capability to design these ships in here, its maybe because of the design complexity.
     
  14. StealthSniper

    StealthSniper Senior Member Senior Member

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  15. StealthSniper

    StealthSniper Senior Member Senior Member

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  16. Agantrope

    Agantrope Senior Member Senior Member

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    How about the french mistral???
     
  17. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Mistral Class amphibious ships are 19K Tonnes, are larger than Magar Class i.e. 6K Tonnes and smaller than San Antonio Class i.e. 25K Tonnes.

    The French Navy has two and the Russian Navy will acquire four of these.

    They could be quite useful to India as well.

    Sizewise, it is obvious. However, if all three classes were of the same size, which one would be the best? Insofar as my understanding goes, the answer to this question remains largely ambiguous.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  18. SHASH2K2

    SHASH2K2 New Member

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    Everything it has to do is with its capacity and ease of operation. We have not been able to build amphibious warships of such a high capacity. These ships will be a great force multiplier and we can reach enemies land through Sea as well.
     
  19. plugwater

    plugwater Elite Member Elite Member

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    Mistral is not LPD. Its an Amphibious assault ship.
     
  20. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Yes, that's a very important point. Magar Class and San Antonio Class are landing ships. One advantage of the latter is that is can be used to carry two hovercrafts. However, I guess, Mistral Class can also be modified to be a Landing Ship, but then it will probably be called 'Mistral 2 Class'.

    India is acquiring San Antonio Class and not Mistral Class probably because India feels it needs the former more urgently. If in the future a need for the latter is felt, I am sure India will acquire them.

    Is there some political angle to this deal? Don't know. Could be. There often are in such deals.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  21. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    I would like to point out that there are faster alternatives for deployment of tanks and armoured vehicles on enemy shores, the task that a landing ship is supposed to do. The best example would be the Ekranoplan.

    Some images showing it (1) cruising on the surface of the sea, (2) reaching the shore, (3) on land and (4) deploying vehicles:

    Ekranoplan_cruise.jpg Ekranoplan_shore.jpg Ekranoplan_land.jpg Ekranoplan_deploy.jpg

    Shown above is the A-90 Orlyonok (Орлёнок).

    References:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground_effect_vehicle
    http://www.travelcentre.com.au/travel/airshows/Russian/russia_ekranoplan.htm
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
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