Reflections on Bangladesh

bose

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2010
Messages
4,921
Likes
5,961
Country flag
Can you provide some details on this?
My response below, if you think the below content is not appropriate for the public forum you may delete the post...

I do not have any official link to support the claim, what I was told as a kid what happened in 46 / 47's in Kolkata by my relatives who were very active during those killing times ....

In 70's as kid's we [ my brother] during school holidays used to go to Kolkata to stay with my relatives on the maternal side [ mother's]. The place was Keshav Sen Street in central Kolkata, and our house was very close to the Brahmo Samaj as one have to take a narrow by lane.

My maternal side was a big family with many young men then in 46 / 47's time... before and during the partition they have seen the incidents un folding... They were themselves actively involved in killings as a self defense then before and during partition... It was very difficult time then...

In 46's & 47's the Calcutta police was primarily Pathan dominated [ called up country people by locals ] with also some from UP & Bihar... there was hardly any Bengalis in the constable or lower rank

Muslim league was confident that they will get Calcutta along with Lahore for Pakistan... It did went well in the early days of killings where with the help of Pathans the Muslims have upper hand in the early days...

The Hindus like my relatives fought back hard in spite of the huge difficulties ... once it became apparent that Calcutta is not going over to Pakistan, the Pathan's started to leave for Pakistan, the void was filled by the Gurkhas servicemen to bring law and order in Calcutta...

Once the Gurkhas came in the tables were turned and Hindus youths along with the Gurkhas went after the Muslims, in the last days if Gandhi has not sat on fasting and riot was allowed to continue for some more months we could have seen some massive slaughtering of Muslims then... it is to be remembered that the refugees were also pouring in then from East Bengal and they were also in murderous mood with nothing with them to sustain and feed their family...

I still remember the stories.... what was way back in 46 / 47's

How they [relatives] used to trap Muslim boys in the bye lane [ Kola Bagan was close by] and were killed and body mutilated put into gunny bag and thrown into street...

They used to boast of their wrist strength and the technique used in killing with single stab into the body and with subsequent twisting the knife that require strength...

The Hindu boys from the neighborhood used to come out at a pre defined time [ there used to be flashing light as indicator] and along with the Gurkha with covering support used to go out for killings...

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am not sure you will consider it as authentic source nevertheless excerpts from the link.

http://bengalvoice.blogspot.in/2008/05/chapter-3-three-horrors-of-forties.html

Niaz Mohammed Khan, under Suhrawardy’s orders journeyed to the Northwest to recruit Punjabi Muslim and Pathan constables for the Calcutta Police. Pathans are Pashto-speaking Muslim tribesmen inhabiting the barren hills of the frontier
...

Harrison Road (now known as Mahatma Gandhi Road) is one of the arterial roads of Calcutta, connecting the two Railway terminuses at Sealdah and Howrah. On this road premises no. 100 was a rambling six-storey mansion inhabited by Hindu families. The building was also located at the very boundary of Hindu and Muslim dominated areas. One day several of these Pathan policemen barged into 100 Harrison Road and gang-raped a number of the women in the building. There was a huge furore, but none was prosecuted. One reason why the partition of the province of Bengal found favour with the Hindus of the province was ‘the misbehaviour of Punjabi Muslim policemen who had recently been recruited by the provincial government’

...
 

Peter

Pratik Maitra
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Messages
2,938
Likes
3,341
Country flag

I would like to add that before East Bengalis came to WB the Ghotis here were getting massacred. It was only after East Bengali refugees came here that the Hindus of Bengal could stop the Muslims from killing them and preventing rape of their women.

If East Bengalis like our family had not migrated, entire WB would have been under Pakistan. Infact even now in districts like Nadia there is a huge influx of Muslims and hardly any Hindus can be found near the place.

In fact we have Metiabruz,Khidderpore et al. This only shows how the previous/current WB govt allows Muslim gundas and hooligans to grow.
 
Last edited:

bose

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2010
Messages
4,921
Likes
5,961
Country flag
I would like to add that before East Bengalis came to WB the Ghotis here were getting massacred. It was only after East Bengali refugees came here that the Hindus of Bengal could stop the Muslims from killing them and preventing rape of their women.

If East Bengalis like our family had not migrated, entire WB would have been under Pakistan. Infact even now in districts like Nadia there is a huge influx of Muslims and hardly any Hindus can be found near the place.
We are all ghotis ... and there are something that I can not put in public forum ... I have tried to be put the thing in perspective without violating rules of the forum...
 

Peter

Pratik Maitra
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Messages
2,938
Likes
3,341
Country flag
We are all ghotis ... and there are something that I can not put in public forum ... I have tried to be put the thing in perspective without violating rules of the forum...
Sir, do you think that the WB people could prevent Muslims from killing if East Bengalis did not come over here. I am just curious to know what you think frankly.
 

bose

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2010
Messages
4,921
Likes
5,961
Country flag
Sir, do you think that the WB people could prevent Muslims from killing if East Bengalis did not come over here. I am just curious to know what you think frankly.
During those trouble days there was hardly anything called Ghotis & Bangals... The main actors from the Hindu side were basically indigenous people of the soil...

Kolkata demography changed after the people from East Bengal started coming in... in 46/ 47 it was very different with almost 40% Muslim population here...
 

pmaitra

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
33,262
Likes
19,593
@bose, it is fine. We don't always have proof and we should be able to present prima facie comments. The forum rules are leniently applied in far more serious cases.
 

Ancient Indian

p = np :)
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2014
Messages
3,403
Likes
4,199
During those trouble days there was hardly anything called Ghotis & Bangals... The main actors from the Hindu side were basically indigenous people of the soil...

Kolkata demography changed after the people from East Bengal started coming in... in 46/ 47 it was very different with almost 40% Muslim population here...
By single decission, thousands of families lost future and life on that fateful day.

I too heard stories about partition.
 

Peter

Pratik Maitra
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Messages
2,938
Likes
3,341
Country flag
By single decission, thousands of families lost future and life on that fateful day.

I too heard stories about partition.
Partition was a ploy to weaken Bengalis politically and snatch the political prowess away from us. Nehru did it so he and his cow belt supporters could rule India from Delhi.
 

Ancient Indian

p = np :)
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2014
Messages
3,403
Likes
4,199
Partition was a ploy to weaken Bengalis politically and snatch the political prowess away from us. Nehru did it so he and his cow belt supporters could rule India from Delhi.
Or it may be another grand scheme of British to let India crumble to dust.

Ganga and Sindh have one of the best fertile lands. If partition didn't happen, you would never have faced famines in your state.

Famines are rare in our country. But it happens in our modern times.
Congress and Pakistanis are dumb as fukc.
I doubt they can pull out any plots like that.
 

bose

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2010
Messages
4,921
Likes
5,961
Country flag
By single decission, thousands of families lost future and life on that fateful day.

I too heard stories about partition.
The people turned into animals then and lost their sense just for few people's lust for power...
 

Ancient Indian

p = np :)
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2014
Messages
3,403
Likes
4,199
The people turned into animals then and lost their sense just for few people's lust for power...
Britishers even made their own version of Independence for us.
How we lap it up as peaceful struggle of any nation history.

This will going to bite people in their ass in future.
 

AnantS

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2013
Messages
5,594
Likes
14,927
Country flag
My response below, if you think the below content is not appropriate for the public forum you may delete the post...

I do not have any official link to support the claim, what I was told as a kid what happened in 46 / 47's in Kolkata by my relatives who were very active during those killing times ....

In 70's as kid's we [ my brother] during school holidays used to go to Kolkata to stay with my relatives on the maternal side [ mother's]. The place was Keshav Sen Street in central Kolkata, and our house was very close to the Brahmo Samaj as one have to take a narrow by lane.

My maternal side was a big family with many young men then in 46 / 47's time... before and during the partition they have seen the incidents un folding... They were themselves actively involved in killings as a self defense then before and during partition... It was very difficult time then...

In 46's & 47's the Calcutta police was primarily Pathan dominated [ called up country people by locals ] with also some from UP & Bihar... there was hardly any Bengalis in the constable or lower rank

Muslim league was confident that they will get Calcutta along with Lahore for Pakistan... It did went well in the early days of killings where with the help of Pathans the Muslims have upper hand in the early days...

The Hindus like my relatives fought back hard in spite of the huge difficulties ... once it became apparent that Calcutta is not going over to Pakistan, the Pathan's started to leave for Pakistan, the void was filled by the Gurkhas servicemen to bring law and order in Calcutta...

Once the Gurkhas came in the tables were turned and Hindus youths along with the Gurkhas went after the Muslims, in the last days if Gandhi has not sat on fasting and riot was allowed to continue for some more months we could have seen some massive slaughtering of Muslims then... it is to be remembered that the refugees were also pouring in then from East Bengal and they were also in murderous mood with nothing with them to sustain and feed their family...

I still remember the stories.... what was way back in 46 / 47's

How they [relatives] used to trap Muslim boys in the bye lane [ Kola Bagan was close by] and were killed and body mutilated put into gunny bag and thrown into street...

They used to boast of their wrist strength and the technique used in killing with single stab into the body and with subsequent twisting the knife that require strength...

The Hindu boys from the neighborhood used to come out at a pre defined time [ there used to be flashing light as indicator] and along with the Gurkha with covering support used to go out for killings...

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am not sure you will consider it as authentic source nevertheless excerpts from the link.

http://bengalvoice.blogspot.in/2008/05/chapter-3-three-horrors-of-forties.html

Niaz Mohammed Khan, under Suhrawardy’s orders journeyed to the Northwest to recruit Punjabi Muslim and Pathan constables for the Calcutta Police. Pathans are Pashto-speaking Muslim tribesmen inhabiting the barren hills of the frontier
...

Harrison Road (now known as Mahatma Gandhi Road) is one of the arterial roads of Calcutta, connecting the two Railway terminuses at Sealdah and Howrah. On this road premises no. 100 was a rambling six-storey mansion inhabited by Hindu families. The building was also located at the very boundary of Hindu and Muslim dominated areas. One day several of these Pathan policemen barged into 100 Harrison Road and gang-raped a number of the women in the building. There was a huge furore, but none was prosecuted. One reason why the partition of the province of Bengal found favour with the Hindus of the province was ‘the misbehaviour of Punjabi Muslim policemen who had recently been recruited by the provincial government’

...
Interesting, so difference between Punjab & Bengal during partition was that latter listened to Gandhi & former had disdain for it. Similar stories and acts of voilence by Muslims in now Pakistan were heard from hindu/sikhs migrating to India. All I can say was barring Malerkotla, and minuscule few sprinkling of neutered muzzie , there were none left on Indian Punjab side... until thanks to wonders of railway ministers of recent decades who ensured finest of east to be redistributed all over India en masse.
 
Last edited:

AnantS

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2013
Messages
5,594
Likes
14,927
Country flag
We are all ghotis ... and there are something that I can not put in public forum ... I have tried to be put the thing in perspective without violating rules of the forum...
Bose, I would like to hear from Bengal perspective.. The two states that suffered most in 47 was Bengal and Punjab. The real history should not be allowed to muddled/forgotten due to WKK sentiment.
 

bose

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2010
Messages
4,921
Likes
5,961
Country flag
Britishers even made their own version of Independence for us.
The problem is we begged British [ read asked] for independence and not demanded as our birth right... British decided for us...

How we lap it up as peaceful struggle of any nation history.
The Congress leaders let the people down then and for them it fits well to show up as a peaceful struggle ...

This will going to bite people in their ass in future.
It is already biting us ...
 

AnantS

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2013
Messages
5,594
Likes
14,927
Country flag
After the surrender of Pakistan, the Indian Army provided protection to the Pakistani PoWs. This was a necessity as per international law. The Indian military is bound by the acceptable conduct of war.
Well. There are ways of doing things and its not that it has not been done before. India hurried because it feared US intervention at behest of Pakis anytime. India should have left Bangladesh after weakening Pak Army.

But let me tell you something I read somewhere. Some of PoW who were absorbed back in Pak Army later provided excellent intel to India latter in life.
 

Ancient Indian

p = np :)
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2014
Messages
3,403
Likes
4,199
The problem is we begged British [ read asked] for independence and not demanded as our birth right... British decided for us...



The Congress leaders let the people down then and for them it fits well to show up as a peaceful struggle ...



It is already biting us ...
We are well past the biting phase. What can be worst than our recent past?
Biting remark dedicated to our Europe grandmasters.

Bengali independence story is different from Delhi Independence story.
You used to have very passionate leaders.
Suddenly after independence, all of them disappeared.
Old man, it is very confusing and frustrating.
 

bose

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2010
Messages
4,921
Likes
5,961
Country flag
Interesting, so difference between Punjab & Bengal during partition was that latter listened to Gandhi & former had disdain for it. Similar stories and acts of voilence by Muslims in now Pakistan were heard from hindu/sikhs migrating to India. All I can say was barring Malerkotla, and minuscle few sprinkling of neutered muzzie , there were non left on Indian Punjab side... until thanks to wonders of railway ministers of recent decades who ensured finest of east to be redistributed all over India en masse.
I believe the Punjabis are more practical and had feet on ground while the Bengalis are more illusionary by nature...

Punjabis quickly understood that Hindus / Sikhs are not compatible with Muslim Punjabis and rightly did what should have been done then to free all of East Punjab of Muslims [ except Malerkotla for reason we know]... I am happy for Indian Punjab as they showed the correct way to deal with the Muslims then... I still remember as one of my father's friend a Sikh from West Punjab even in 70's refuse to take Mutton / Goat slaughtered by Muslims ... He will travel far to get mutton / goat slaughtered in Jhatka or Hindu style...

Hindu Bengalis then still could not overcome the Bengal partition and refused to believe that a Hindu Bengali has culturally and by thinking has moved away form a Muslim Bengali psyche... Romanticism of a illusionary united Bengal did them in... Bengalis suffered more displacement and killings during partition ...
 

Bornubus

Chodi Bhakt & BJPig Hunter
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2015
Messages
7,494
Likes
17,196
If "Hindutva" is responsible for partition, then we are grateful to them @pmaitra
 

pmaitra

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
33,262
Likes
19,593
Well. There are ways of doing things and its not that it has not been done before. India hurried because it feared US intervention at behest of Pakis anytime. India should have left Bangladesh after weakening Pak Army.
There was no scope of US intervention once the Soviet Union got involved.

But let me tell you something I read somewhere. Some of PoW who were absorbed back in Pak Army later provided excellent intel to India latter in life.
Quite possible. I'd like to discuss this issue in detail at a later time.

I believe the Punjabis are more practical and had feet on ground while the Bengalis are more illusionary by nature...

Punjabis quickly understood that Hindus / Sikhs are not compatible with Muslim Punjabis and rightly did what should have been done then to free all of East Punjab of Muslims [ except Malerkotla for reason we know]... I am happy for Indian Punjab as they showed the correct way to deal with the Muslims then... I still remember as one of my father's friend a Sikh from West Punjab even in 70's refuse to take Mutton / Goat slaughtered by Muslims ... He will travel far to get mutton / goat slaughtered in Jhatka or Hindu style...

Hindu Bengalis then still could not overcome the Bengal partition and refused to believe that a Hindu Bengali has culturally and by thinking has moved away form a Muslim Bengali psyche... Romanticism of a illusionary united Bengal did them in... Bengalis suffered more displacement and killings during partition ...
I have a different take on this.
  • Majority of the population of Bangladesh is secular.
  • Bangladesh still has a government that controls the military, unlike Pakistan.
  • Stern action is being taken against Islamists.
  • Pakistani supporters and collaborators, even to this day, do not have citizenship and live in concentration camps in Bangladesh.

Considering the above points, those that "refused to believe that a Hindu Bengali has culturally and by thinking has moved away form a Muslim Bengali psyche," were not entirely incorrect in their beliefs. Frankly, I don't believe this (moving away culturally and by thinking) is true for majority of Bangladeshis or Indian Bengalis.

Whatever happened during partition is unfortunate, and there was considerable instigation of violence by vested interests.

Partition might have been an unavoidable demographic reality, but violence was avoidable. That this happened proves that at least part of the political leadership sought to benefit from it.

If "Hindutva" is responsible for partition, then we are grateful to them @pmaitra
I presume that was a response to whoever claimed that "'Hindutva' is responsible for partition."

I said something different: "As one member pointed out, the Hindutwavadi members of Congress and Muslims League were responsible for Partition."

Partition was a ploy to weaken Bengalis politically and snatch the political prowess away from us. Nehru did it so he and his cow belt supporters could rule India from Delhi.
I don't think it is so simple.
  • Given the demographics of Bengal, it was always easy for the British to create a rift between Hindus and Muslims.
  • Tripura and Cooch Behar were Princely States, so their rulers would have continued being British bootlickers.
  • Majority of the Bengali Freedom Fighters who were imprisoned in the Cellular Jail were from East Bengal, and even to this day, had it not been for the people of East Bengal, the people of West Bengal (read Calcutta gentry) would have fared worse than they have so far. A population primarily involved in bureaucratic work is no match for a population that toils in the heat of the paddy and jute fields.
  • A good number of Freedom Fighters came from the so called "cow belt," so no need to be derogatory.
  • It is true, however, that Nehru certainly wanted to divide both Bengal and Punjab, as these two regions posed the greatest challenge to his forthcoming rule, whether this threat was real or imagined.
 
Last edited:

anoop_mig25

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2009
Messages
5,804
Likes
3,151
Country flag
Post Bagaldesh liberation we should have traded/bought some region with bangaldesh around chicken corridor so that it can be strength or around chittagong so as to have alternate route avaliable to us

Why did indian leadership missed that or as usual Indian lerders where mypoic when it came to strategic thinking
 

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top