Public Protests in China: How much is allowed?

[ice berg]

So China needs Propaganda machine to sell truth... else the common Chinese are too susceptible to falsehood... great idea!!

All government sell one or another form of "truth". Does "votebank" ring a bell?

 

[bose]

All government sell one or another form of "truth". Does "votebank" ring a bell?

So there are different forms of truth ??

 

[ice berg]

So there are different forms of truth ??

A truth can be told in different ways.

A glass is half full and half empty. Both are "true". Yet the meaning can be different.

You understand?

 

[bose]

A truth can be told in different ways.

A glass is half full and half empty. Both are "true". Yet the meaning can be different.

You understand?

Nope"¦telling a truth has nothing to do with perceived forms of it...

Truth is plain and simple"¦ always prevails"¦

 

[ice berg]

Nope"¦telling a truth has nothing to do with perceived forms of it...

Truth is plain and simple"¦ always prevails"¦

How do you explain the glass is half full or half empty then?

Are they true or not?

 

[bose]

How do you explain the glass is half full or half empty then?

Are they true or not?

It is matter of interpretation... truth is not measurable...

 

[bennedose]

Truth can be told in different ways.

Glass half full: "China has an immense manufacturing industry"
Glass half empty" China's immense manufacturing industry consists of a large number of sweatshops where workers are paid a pittance"

Glass half full: "China's massive industrialization to produce the world's consumer goods has led to widespread employment and an unprecedented booming of the Chinese economy"
Glass half empty:"China has made use of its huge population by putting them to work in sweatshops, working for a pittance, enabling China to reduce production costs to unbeatable levels"

Glass half full: "Half of China's population is now well off with many people beginning to lead western style quality of life"
Glass half empty: "half of China's population have not seen or felt the economic miracle that the other half have seen and the country cannot afford a slowdown in growth"

Glass half full: "China has effectively cut down its population growth rate so that economic growth can reach more people faster"
Glass half empty: "China's coercive birth control policy has led to a massive disparity between the numbers of more favoured boys and less favoured girls. Abortions of the worst possible kind exist in China. China is heading for a demographic crisis where it will have too many old people and not enough young people

Glass half full: China's communist party has moved with the times and opened up Chinas economy leading to unprecedented growth and prosperity of the wholly united Han nation
Glass shalf empty: Chinas secretive communist party regime has used repressive methods and censorship to hide the massive environmental and social upheavals caused by its coercive policies. China has the largest internal security apparatus in the world as it seeks to suppress the sentiments of Tibetans and Uighur people

Glass half full: No one needs to fear China's peaceful rise
Glass half empty: China has simmering border and and territorial disputes with all its neighbours and even within occupied Tibet and its massive armed forces do not inspire confidence in a peaceful rise.

Glas half full: Compare India with China
Glass half empty. Lets talk about China and not change the subject

 

[Ray]

The glass is empty, but brainwashing that wipes the mind, can be easily be brainwashed & filled with propaganda that the glass is full.

 

[Ray]

All propaganda has to be based on some truth, otherwise you cant sell it to people.

Read Orwell's 1984and you dill understand how propaganda can be turned into the'truth'.

May strikes a reality chord of your circumstances.

 

[ice berg]

Read Orwell's 1984and you dill understand how propaganda can be turned into the'truth'.

May strikes a reality chord of your circumstances.

I dare say you have no idea about my circumstances, not by a looooooong shot.:thumb:

 

[ice berg]

Truth can be told in different ways.

Glass half full: "China has an immense manufacturing industry"
Glass half empty" China's immense manufacturing industry consists of a large number of sweatshops where workers are paid a pittance"

Glass half full: "China's massive industrialization to produce the world's consumer goods has led to widespread employment and an unprecedented booming of the Chinese economy"
Glass half empty:"China has made use of its huge population by putting them to work in sweatshops, working for a pittance, enabling China to reduce production costs to unbeatable levels"

Glass half full: "Half of China's population is now well off with many people beginning to lead western style quality of life"
Glass half empty: "half of China's population have not seen or felt the economic miracle that the other half have seen and the country cannot afford a slowdown in growth"

Glass half full: "China has effectively cut down its population growth rate so that economic growth can reach more people faster"
Glass half empty: "China's coercive birth control policy has led to a massive disparity between the numbers of more favoured boys and less favoured girls. Abortions of the worst possible kind exist in China. China is heading for a demographic crisis where it will have too many old people and not enough young people

Glass half full: China's communist party has moved with the times and opened up Chinas economy leading to unprecedented growth and prosperity of the wholly united Han nation
Glass shalf empty: Chinas secretive communist party regime has used repressive methods and censorship to hide the massive environmental and social upheavals caused by its coercive policies. China has the largest internal security apparatus in the world as it seeks to suppress the sentiments of Tibetans and Uighur people

Glass half full: No one needs to fear China's peaceful rise
Glass half empty: China has simmering border and and territorial disputes with all its neighbours and even within occupied Tibet and its massive armed forces do not inspire confidence in a peaceful rise.

Glas half full: Compare India with China
Glass half empty. Lets talk about China and not change the subject

Glass half full: You can find lots of information on the internet.
Glass half empty: There is a difference between information and knowledge.

 

[bennedose]

Glass half full: You can find lots of information on the internet.
Glass half empty: There is a difference between information and knowledge.

Glass half full: The Chinese try and pass off propaganda as knowledge
Glass half empty: There are enough sensible people to understand when the Chinese are bluffing and pretending that all is better than what it really is.

 

[Ray]

Knowledge can be acquired when there is freedom of independent thinking that is not govt 'assisted'.

Mao is 30% wrong & 70% right said Deng.

The Chinese parroted the same.

Was it knowledge, information or propaganda?

 

[ice berg]

Glass half full: The Chinese try and pass off propaganda as knowledge
Glass half empty: There are enough sensible people to understand when the Chinese are bluffing and pretending that all is better than what it really is.

LMAO, you are so busy trying to score a point, you forgot what those expressions mean.
May as well drop those and get on with it.

 

[bennedose]

LMAO, you are so busy trying to score a point, you forgot what those expressions mean.
May as well drop those and get on with it.

Rhetoric is a game that can be played easily by anyone. Let us stick to facts about China and ignore the semantics and diversions motivated by squirming.

No Indian denies that China has done well for its people and is doing well. But Indians like to question everything - and it appears you Chinese don't like questions about China. You only like praise. That makes for an interesting interaction because asking questions throws up things which Chinese are sensitive about and rather than giving a straight answer they get angry, or defensive or change the subject to how bad it is in India.

If I ask 10 questions and you guys react badly to four it means that those four questions are sensitive topics that need to be explored further. So rhetoric ain't going to stop the uncovering of uncomfortable truths. Yes of course we will praise China for many things. But this board does not consist only of mommas and daddies of Chinese single sons who will only praise what their 'ickle darling is saying about China and not ask things that make baby upset.

 

[Ray]

LMAO, you are so busy trying to score a point, you forgot what those expressions mean.
May as well drop those and get on with it.

He does not know?

Well, you can say so since you don't know who he is!

 

[amoy]

Glass half full: The Chinese try and pass off propaganda as knowledge
Glass half empty: There are enough sensible people to understand when the Chinese are bluffing and pretending that all is better than what it really is.

I think your real problem is u're adept at using " big" (and judgemental) words like "propaganda", "bluffing", "pretending", "sensible" rather than doing some drill-down such as data, hard evidence, examples... that makes your arguments so hollow.

when u attempt to call a bluff u'd better come up with something concrete.

pls feel free to rebuke below propaganda made on CCP payroll - Comparing India and China: Chasing the dragon | The Economist

 

[bennedose]

Amoy your only source of joy when faced with difficult questions about China is putting up that same graph for the second time that compares China with India. There is nothing to comment on that graph - it is all well known stuff - but you Chinese seem to like the graph so much that you keep posting it on here. If you make a similar graph comparing India with Sweden that graph will be even more skewed. But Swedes don't post that graph because they are not trying to play the "mine is bigger" game with Indians. You want admiration and hate it when questions that fall short of admiration are brought up.

Information about India does not answer questions about China. However it only proves the point that I have been trying to make - that Chinese get upset about some questions and try to veer the topic around to discussing India. But it's China we are talking about. Talking about India, or saying China is better than India is uninformative. You guys are all intelligent - but when it comes to some questions about China you guys pretend to be dumb. You are not dumb - I know it. There is something else that makes you guys react in this way.

Some questions will not be answered and I suspect this is how the communist party deals with you guys if any Chinese asks such question. The topic is brushed away. That tells me more about China than a lot of graphs.

Since you are so good at bringing up statistics about China, I want to see a peer reviewed graph about abortions in China. Let's see if you can come up with one. Now go back to your Chinese board - discuss it with the people there and come back here with a reply.

 

[ice berg]

Rhetoric is a game that can be played easily by anyone. Let us stick to facts about China and ignore the semantics and diversions motivated by squirming.

No Indian denies that China has done well for its people and is doing well. But Indians like to question everything - and it appears you Chinese don't like questions about China. You only like praise. That makes for an interesting interaction because asking questions throws up things which Chinese are sensitive about and rather than giving a straight answer they get angry, or defensive or change the subject to how bad it is in India.

Wrong, people prefer intelligent questions. Not simple questions that can be easily answered by a few seconds on google.

If I ask 10 questions and you guys react badly to four it means that those four questions are sensitive topics that need to be explored further. So rhetoric ain't going to stop the uncovering of uncomfortable truths. Yes of course we will praise China for many things. But this board does not consist only of mommas and daddies of Chinese single sons who will only praise what their 'ickle darling is saying about China and not ask things that make baby upset.

I think you are still not getting it.
It is about what questions you are asking and to some degree who is asking.
I cant speak for others. But I find most of the answers to your questions can be easily found on the internet.
That begs the question:
1.Are you lazy and expected to be spoon-fed?
2.Are you trolling and flamebait?

Most people probably think you are trolling, which is why the India China comparison comes up.
It is hard to digest that you " care" more about what happends in China when things are alot worse in India.
Isnt that a kind of denial when you point out those negative things in China yet refuse to discuss how related issues are dealed in India?
Since when is a comparison a form for denial?
In many cases it makes sense to compare those two countries.
Similar population, location, development circle. Modern history-colonism etc.

Why are you uncomfortable with the comparisons?
What country is normal natural to compare China with?

 

[bennedose]

I think you are still not getting it.
It is about what questions you are asking and to some degree who is asking.
I cant speak for others. But I find most of the answers to your questions can be easily found on the internet.
That begs the question:
1.Are you lazy and expected to be spoon-fed?
2.Are you trolling and flamebait?

Most people probably think you are trolling, which is why the India China comparison comes up.
It is hard to digest that you " care" more about what happends in China when things are alot worse in India.
Isnt that a kind of denial when you point out those negative things in China yet refuse to discuss how related issues are dealed in India?
Since when is a comparison a form for denial?
In many cases it makes sense to compare those two countries.
Similar population, location, development circle. Modern history-colonism etc.

Why are you uncomfortable with the comparisons?
What country is normal natural to compare China with?

I am sure Google will give you the answers to your questions. :cool2: But your questions again are a diversion from the topic. They are not answers to questions I have asked. It is easy to deflect questions by saying someone is a troll. But it is equally simple to say you are trolling. Of course you may be trolling, but you need to be exposed to some good tit-for tat counter trolling so you can see reason.

Fact is you wil not reply to any question about China where you have to specifically talk about Chinese problems. At best the more well informed Chinese poster will link some "peer reviewed sources". The rest will stonewall, give clever non answers, get angry and talk about india or simply say "Consult Google"

Either you guys are ill informed and pretending that you represent China or you are trolling. If you are not trolling, you are unable to provide any good information about things in China that Google is unable to provide.