Power of logical deductions.

Discussion in 'Defence & Strategic Issues' started by rcscwc, Sep 30, 2010.

  1. rcscwc

    rcscwc Tihar Jail Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    280
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Delhi
    Remember, I am an egineer, brutally practial. I have no experience of civil or military intelligence. But... read on...


    In 1999, I was serving at Maithon, Jharkhand. I had some official work at Asnasol. I had TIME that day. So I decided to go site seeing. I ambled onto the platform of Burnpur station. I saw something wich intrigued me. Two railway coaches, seemed to be A/C type. All windowsw covered with steel plates welded to the body. NO DOORS!!


    Set me thinking. Can't be goods carriage or passenger coach. How do you enter a doorless coach? Could be fish carrier. But it had no stink, BUT how to load/unload? What WAS it? Not good for humans, not good for cargoe!! What was the GOOD of it?


    First conclusion: It was a military vehicle. Only they have a logic in the seemingly illogical things. AM I wrong?


    Next. It ccould not be an amunition/ordanance carrier. Problem of loading unloading.


    Next. It HAD to a MISSILE platform!! Then and there I worked out how it could deploy the missile(s). Hmmm. I deduced that it could not have more than two missiles. maybe ONE only.


    But why TWO coaches? One for missile(s) the other for control equipment.


    But both were sealed. Were they? The roof and wall section of the CARRIER must slide onto the other, baring the missile(s).

    But personnel? I could not find a third coach. So, one or both had to be AC. On very close examination, but not nearer than 20 feet, revealed both were AC!!


    Similar thing I found at Asansol too. And Panagarh yard? Less said the better. Thieves and spies can get in and out at will.

    Come on Sirs. Foreign spies too can deduce it after just one siting. They are bound to be smarter than me, it is their karobar, कारोबार, business.

    Where is the weakness?
     
  2.  
  3. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2009
    Messages:
    24,274
    Likes Received:
    11,283
    Location:
    BANGalore
    Why would a missile carrier be in asansol and in the open would be the first question? Or is the policy of to leave missiles near populations sites to prevent first strike that causes collateral?
     
  4. rcscwc

    rcscwc Tihar Jail Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    280
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Delhi
    Rail mounted carriers are different. Once in a while, such carriers must be stopped, unhooked and rehooked onto some other train. Such a facility is available at larger stations only. Moreover they must be "hidden", best is to attach them to a train instead of havng a two coach arrangement. From air it definitely would seem to be hidden, but from ground level no. Rail mounted carriers are not easy to track by following them. Mistake here was leave them on the platform instead of on a distant siding

    Rest is for experts here to analyse.
     
  5. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2009
    Messages:
    24,274
    Likes Received:
    11,283
    Location:
    BANGalore
    On a separate note, I had read somewhere that the soviets purposely kept missiles in populated areas. One to mix it with population and also prevent them from being taken out in any strike because of collateral. I have to dig this out.
     
  6. rcscwc

    rcscwc Tihar Jail Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    280
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Delhi
    Yusuf bhai, rail mounted platforms are not static. Otherwise that region is jam packed with mines, anyone could serve the purpose. But my observation was limited to one place only. OK. ok, Asansol and Burnpur are contigous. Such coaches you can expect at other places, coming and going.

    "Power of logical deductions"
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2010
  7. A.V.

    A.V. New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Messages:
    6,503
    Likes Received:
    1,106
    Location:
    Moscow, russia
    i have a feeling that two/third of the total movements are dummy the establishment very well knows that moving any such equipment will be widely traced and located from the sky as well as from the ground so when a particular equipment is moved in a direction say X they leave put two dummies originating from same location to direction y and z
    so what might appear to be a simple movement of suspected equipment and picked up by the sources is just to keep it more hidden and have a kind of false sense into believing
    i wont be surprised to see such coaches suddenly vanish out from a particular location and resurface from another location identical looking but different just to leave a false trail

    about the location near burnpur it makes sense to deploy SAMs in the area to protect the industrial location which will be prime target for any kind of air raids ,i have heard from my grandparents that during previous wars PAF planes had approached as close to burnpur for a strike but because of the complete blackout had to abort i dont know the reality just heard it but deploying missies in the area of ASANSOL AND DURGAPUR makes mighty sense not to forget the maithon dam and panchet dam closeby which also needs to be protected
     
  8. rcscwc

    rcscwc Tihar Jail Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    280
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Delhi
    Sir, I know the importance of Maithon and Panchet dams and Durgapur Barrage. After all I was responsible for regulating them, specially during the monsoons. I was Member Secretary. Ring any bells? I am one of the MOST criticised M-S, as I had to order releases 2which I KNEW would cause destruction. Not easy to sleep after such an order, Sir, I assure you.


    But Sir, what fantastic picnic spots are Maithon and Panchet!!
     
  9. A.V.

    A.V. New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Messages:
    6,503
    Likes Received:
    1,106
    Location:
    Moscow, russia
    dont call me 'sir' Respected Sir i am much younger and non deserving of that title , what i meant in the post was that it does make some sense to put some of these missiles closer to these locations although its highly populated areas but the concern that you raised that why they used an open mode which can be easily traced from the ground , i am sure the establishments uses many such dummies
    recently S-300 was spotted on the bombay sea link on way way this cant as 2 things :-

    1> a deliberate attempt by the army to let the enemies know that we are protecting these places even though it might be bluff same might be the case of open movement via rails to send the signal here we are placing something which might be true or might be dummy

    2> to make necessary steps for real protection
     
  10. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2009
    Messages:
    24,274
    Likes Received:
    11,283
    Location:
    BANGalore
    A question to ponder would be were they in fact IRBMs? in 1999 we did not have any long range ballistic missile operational. I dont think our SAMs are rail mobile. They all are on trucks IMO.
     
  11. rcscwc

    rcscwc Tihar Jail Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    280
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Delhi
    SAMs are quite small and can be mounted on trucks. IRBMs are larger and heavier. ICBMs use liquid fuel and have to fuelled not 2-3 days in advance and hence are static. Solid fuel missiles can be mobile. Maybe they were IRBMs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2010
  12. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2009
    Messages:
    24,274
    Likes Received:
    11,283
    Location:
    BANGalore
    Sir, India did not have an operational IRBM in 1999. The Agni I was yet to be inducted. So i really wonder which missile it could have been if at all.
     
  13. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2009
    Messages:
    31,663
    Likes Received:
    17,158
    Location:
    EST, USA
    Why not? I have lived in Bhubaneswar for 4.5 years and have seen Prithvi Missiles carried on Tatra trucks on NH 5 on way too many occasions. Such missiles carriers would move in short convoys and would stop whenever they felt necessary on the roadside.

    Now to answer the question of these railway coaches:
    Source: [IRFCA] Indian Railways FAQ: Rolling Stock - II
     

Share This Page