Pervez Musharraf 'crossed LoC before Kargil war'

Discussion in 'Pakistan' started by Yusuf, Feb 1, 2013.

  1. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    ISLAMABAD/NEW DELHI: Weeks before hostilities erupted between Indian and Pakistani troops in the Kargil sector in 1999, Gen Pervez Musharraf crossed the Line of Control in a helicopter and spent a night at a location 11 km inside Indian territory, a former aide to the military ruler has said.

    Col (retired) Ashfaq Hussain, who was a senior officer in the Pakistan Army's media arm, said Musharraf flew across the LoC on March 28, 1999 and travelled 11 km into the Indian side.

    Musharraf, who was accompanied by Brig Masood Aslam, then commander of 80 Brigade, spent the night at a spot called Zikria Mustaqar, where Pakistani troops commanded by Col Amjad Shabbir were present.

    Musharraf, who was then army chief, returned the next day. Hussain first made the revelation in his book 'Witness to Blunder: Kargil Story Unfolds', which was published in late 2008.

    He repeated the assertion last night on a television talk show on the Kargil episode in the wake of Lt Gen (retd) Shahid Aziz's assertion that the intrusions by Pakistani troops were planned by a group of four generals led by Musharraf.

    He further said Pakistani troops first intruded into the Indian side of the LoC on December 18, 1998, when Captains Nadeem and Ali and Havaldar Lalik Jan were sent on a reconnaissance mission.

    "They were never told about the aims and objectives of their mission. Even for a recce, they were not provided any briefing or objectives," he said.

    Shortly after this, several units were told to cross the LoC and occupy positions on the Indian side. Several units competed with each other to go further into the Indian side.

    The intrusions were spotted by a shepherd who informed Indian troops, he said.

    Like the initial reconnaissance mission, there were no aims or objectives set out for the entire Kargil operation, which was masterminded by Maj Gen Javed Hassan, then chief of the Force Command Northern Areas, Hussain said.

    Hassan drew up the plan to occupy Indian positions along the LoC and convinced then Rawalpindi Corps Commander Lt Gen Mahmud Ahmad, then Chief of General Staff Lt Gen Mohammad Aziz and Musharraf to back the venture, Hussain said.

    Hostilities between Indian and Pakistani troops broke out in early May, over a month after Musharraf crossed the LoC and spent a night on the Indian side.

    Besides troops from the Northern Light Infantry, soldiers from 31 Azad Kashmir Regiment, 24 Sindh Regiment, Frontier Force Regiment and artillery units participated in the Kargil operation, Hussain said.

    Hussain, who based his book on interviews with officers who participated in the fighting in Kargil, dismissed Musharraf's claim that the operation was a success.

    "It was a success only till Pakistani forces came face to face with the enemy. In winter, both sides abandoned their positions under a recognised procedure. Our troops crossed the LoC at a time when the enemy was not present. Our troops were not even informed why they were being sent across the LoC," he said.

    "I asked commanding officers and brigade commanders about the aims and objectives of the operation but none of them had answer," he added.

    The generals who planned the operation had believed that the Indian side would not detect the intrusions till late May or early June 1999 but their surmise proved to be wrong, Hussain said.

    Hussain also dismissed Musharraf's recent assertion that Pakistan had lost only 270 soldiers during the Kargil conflict.

    "According to my research, there were over 1,000 casualties on the Pakistani side. The official data (on casualties) was hidden and cannot be accessed," Hussain said.

    Referring to the main opposition PML-N's demand for a judicial commission to probe the Kargil conflict in the wake of Lt Gen (retd.) Aziz's revelations, Hussain said any such inquiry panel should seek all reports on the fighting from the army's General Headquarters so that the true figures for casualties could be made public.

    Though Aziz has said that information he had gathered suggested that then premier Nawaz Sharif was aware of the Kargil operation, Hussain contended that Sharif only learnt of the intrusions at an army briefing in Rawalpindi on May 17, 1999.

    V K Singh praises Musharraf's 'courage'

    Former Pakistan military ruler Gen Pervez Musharraf on Friday received praise for coming deep into Indian territory in Kargil in 1999 from former Army chief Gen V K Singh, who said it showed the "courage" of a military commander.

    Singh, who headed the Indian Army from 2010 to 2012, said there were "mistakes" on the Indian side that allowed Pakistani troops to cross over into Indian territory and let Musharraf go back safely.

    "As far as General Musharraf is concerned, I would like to put it in two ways. One, as a military commander, I would commend Gen Musharraf for coming 11 km (inside Indian territory) to stay with his troops for a night. It is the courage of a military commander that he came so far knowing that there was danger," Singh told reporters here.

    "Second, what was happening on our side you all know and facts are before you. Why did we allow him to go? Why did we allow them to enter? I would only say that there were some mistakes, which need to be rectified," he said.

    Singh was commenting on the revelation by a senior retired officer of Pakistan Army that Musharraf had stayed for a night inside Indian territory with his troops before the three-month conflict erupted in Kargil in 1999. The former Army chief said the revelation was just a confirmation that Pakistan had started the Kargil war. "What happened in 1999, we including the Indian Army know that Pakistan Army had started the Kargil war. There is nothing new in it," Singh said.

    He said Pakistan had been telling lies and "now only its officials are confirming our stand.

    Pervez Musharraf 'crossed LoC before Kargil war'; V K Singh praises ex-Pak army chief's 'courage' - TOI Mobile | The Times of India Mobile Site
     
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  3. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    More is coming out on Kargil.

    For me there is only one thing of concern in this report. If Musharraff came 11 kms into Indian terrority by a chopper, what was our air defence doing and were our radars tuned into "kaun Banega crore pati"?
     
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  4. nrj

    nrj Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    V K Singh praises Musharraf's 'courage'

    Former Pakistan military ruler Gen Pervez Musharraf on Friday received praise for coming deep into Indian territory in Kargil in 1999 from former Army chief Gen V K Singh, who said it showed the "courage" of a military commander.

    Singh, who headed the Indian Army from 2010 to 2012, said there were "mistakes" on the Indian side that allowed Pakistani troops to cross over into Indian territory and let Musharraf go back safely.

    "As far as General Musharraf is concerned, I would like to put it in two ways. One, as a military commander, I would commend Gen Musharraf for coming 11 km (inside Indian territory) to stay with his troops for a night. It is the courage of a military commander that he came so far knowing that there was danger," Singh told reporters here.

    "Second, what was happening on our side you all know and facts are before you. Why did we allow him to go? Why did we allow them to enter? I would only say that there were some mistakes, which need to be rectified," he said.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2013
  5. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

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    He must have come for a High Altitude Orgasm....

    Such unreal and artificial soldiers take pride is filmsy things like crossing the LoC which many do for peeing the otherside if nothing else. ( Wow I have peed into China and Pakistan... sort of acts)

    I heard the gunner commando crying that India has beaten and insulted Pakistan many a times including in Siachin (where he was resonsible for more than 50 SSG being massacred)...

    So while being on the Indian side of the LoC for the night, he might have had multiple orgasm.

    Musharaf being a Muhazir had greater need to prove himself more Paki than the others. A trait much prominent with the Muhazirs. Their identity crisis is much greater.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2013
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  6. Blackwater

    Blackwater Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Pervez Musharraf 'crossed LoC before Kargil war'


    Big slap on Indian defence:frusty::frusty::pound::pound::pound:
     
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  7. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

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    In much mountainious terrian with deep valleis it is very difficult to pick up a hellicopter.

    Recall our helicpter going across and landing at their helipad without detection.

    In winter months upto May Jun no one used to be deployed on LoC let alone AD. The AD radar cover of the area must be wide area and higher altitude cover. Lower intrusions are reporte by troops on ground baut there were no troops on ground.
     
  8. cobra commando

    cobra commando Tharki regiment Veteran Member Senior Member

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    I wonder why so many revelations are coming out one after another in a very short period of time,why now :notsure:
     
  9. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    Says a lot for Musharraff abilities crossing the LOC and losing the war. Bravo
     
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  10. sesha_maruthi27

    sesha_maruthi27 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Ha ha ha ha ha.......:rofl: Just before the war he came to India and had met Srhi Atal Bihari Vajpee ji........
     
  11. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

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    Nothing of that sort. Places like Oldithang and Skardu are a common place for Intelligence community people to visit and return . I can go to Mansarover, stay there and return. Mush visited the safest place - a battalion Headquarter.

    These things are being highlighted to cut Musharraf's India connections and encourage India to arrest him next time he comes to India.

    Elections are not far off. All concentrated campign in Paki Media is to cut down the size of Mushy boys political ambitions by defaming him. No one including PA would like him to return he being an old Army hand.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2013
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  12. sesha_maruthi27

    sesha_maruthi27 Senior Member Senior Member

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    Think a war is around the corner now at any time.......:taunt: :flame:
     
  13. rock127

    rock127 Maulana Rockullah Senior Member

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    May be VK Singh believed in giving HALAL treatment to Mushraf instead of giving him a JHATKA treatment. :lol:

    And we all know it ended up as [SUP][/SUP]4,000 Pakis HALAL'd in 3 months and national shame for generations to come and now Musharaf has to live as a TRAITOR.

    Killing him instantly would have made him courageous martyr and a full fledged war. :taunt:
     
  14. Phenom

    Phenom Regular Member

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    Its more likely to be about internal Pak politics,

    May be Musharaff is planning to return and those who support him and oppose him are trying to sway public opinion to their side. One good thing as they wash their dirty linen in public, India is getting lots of information about their internal dynamics and power structure during and after the Kargil war.
     
  15. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Just before the war Vajpayee had gone to Lahore by bus and hugged Nawaz Sharief and Musharraf refused to meet ABV and salute him.
     
  16. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    We going there is not an issue. Pakis are tuned into star plus :D

    For me what does matter is how they can sneak into India. It's not that we cannot have low altitude radars.
     
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  17. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

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    Mushraff came to the rear / battalion Headquarters fully knowing that there was no Indian upto 300 km LoC. Why did not he come to the battle front when battle was joined.

    But yes, if he came and stayed for a night, he is parise worthy as a General. That the maximum a General can do.
     
  18. Bhadra

    Bhadra Defence Professionals Defence Professionals Senior Member

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    Well those issues stand resolved.

    The complete 8 Mountain Division resonsible for the defense of that secotor was in the Kashmir valley. One Brigade was to look after more than 300 km area in summers. That is maximum it could do as Kargil was considered untanable for winters.

    Now complete 8 mountain didvision is deployed. ( As per reports of Kargil Committee).

    So far sneaking into India is concerned, that they are doing that every day through IB, LoC, throgh BD and Nepal. What can one do ?

    Even when Army is deployed, enemy sneaking through in small numbers is never ruled out. That can not be prevented. No one in the world has been able to do it.

    Ask me to enter Paksitan throgh Pakistani Army deployment and I will do it.
     
  19. JBH22

    JBH22 Senior Member Senior Member

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    What this shows is that inspite of all handshakes and aman ki asha never concede anything to Pakistan.

    Pakistan understands the language of force and do not expect chivalry from such an enemy as to Indian defence preparedness I'm sure once Nato is out of Afghanistan something will happen.

    Hopefully slashing of defence budget,illiterate MoD bureaucrats and incompetent IA top brass don't use IA jawan as cannon fodder again and then use patriotic hymns to hide their incompetence.
     
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  20. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    We need to install really good radars. The numerous mountain peaks will anyway generate a lot of noise in radar signals. I have a feeling guarding those mountains will invariably need a lot of human investment. No one knows what is the level or preparedness in that part of the country.

    Concerning indeed.
     
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  21. W.G.Ewald

    W.G.Ewald Defence Professionals/ DFI member of 2 Defence Professionals

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    Bad enough having Battalion commanders in helicopters.
     

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