Personal Ideas About Cold Start`s Problems

[hit&run]

Same as what Indian response will be if tactical nukes are used. Full blown nuke war.
Cold war saw a period where the adversaries thought they could Win nuke wars. All they got was MAD

Yusuf he is on the hoof troll, and it was proved with his next and previous post to above assertion of yours. BTW I understand what you guys are doing.

 

[Yusuf]

Yusuf he is on the hoof troll, and it was proved with his next and previous post to above assertion of yours. BTW I understand what you guys are doing.

I think he is more naive more than anything else. His last question about what next is very genuine.

 

[hit&run]

I think he is more naive more than anything else. His last question about what next is very genuine.

Even a 5th standard kid can ask this question, 'what will happen next Papa'; because flow of the feed (bed time story) you guys are releasing to him.

It's going to be political decision and we will think of what will happen next. Any attrition we will suffer is going to be our collective loss and responsibility.

What will happen next can be simply calculated from the sheer size of India, irrespective of whatever threshold or arsenal Pakistan have.

PA knows once the nukes come into picture they will seize to exist. They will rather fight with our IBG with bravery (this is what they are doing and the Chinese troll hasn't watched what Pakistanis are doing at the borders before throwing his fictional questioners) or will simply offer their bums for Indian CSD spanking which will be triggered because of the sin they will commit making Indians angry and wait for another day or year to fight.

Antything after CSD should guarantee preemptive strike at our will, we will be fool if not be planing the same.

 

[Yusuf]

Even a 5th standard kid can ask this question, 'what will happen next Papa'; because flow of the feed (bed time story) you guys are releasing to him.

It's going to be political decision and we will think of what will happen next. Any attrition we will suffer is going to be our collective loss and responsibility.

What will happen next can be simply calculated from the sheer size of India, irrespective of whatever threshold or arsenal Pakistan have.

PA knows once the nukes come into picture they will seize to exist. They will rather fight with our IBG with bravery (this is what they are doing and the Chinese troll hasn't watched what Pakistanis are doing at the borders before throwing his fictional questioners) or will simply offer their bums for Indian CSD spanking which will be triggered because of the sin they will commit making Indians angry and wait for another day or year to fight.

Antything after CSD should guarantee preemptive strike at our will, we will be fool if not be planing the same.

May be he is a 5th grader?

Just giving him the benefit of the doubt

 

[asianobserve]

This Cold Start doctrine is highly questionable. It is all too dependent on Pakistan reacting in a certain manner to IAs 5-70 km incursions into Pakistani territory. What if Pak military reacts differently and immediately goes nuclear? Yes, in the end India might outshoot Pakistan in a nuclear shootout but at a very high cost to India.

What India should be developing and learning is Israeli style (or a some extent American style) covert actions against external threats. India should be strengthening its external security agency to the level of the Mossad, CIA and their Special Forces (a military force on its own uninhibited by laws of war). An formidable ability to do tit-for-tat unconventional action and to disable key enemy infrastructure deep within enemy territory (with full deniability). The Cold Start and the IA conventional forces should be there simply to deter an all-out Pakistani response to covert actions (I think nuclear weapons can do a better job here)...

 

[Armand2REP]

You'd be surprised. In drills the US ran as recently as 2005, suppression with 2000-3000 kg cluster munitions (equivalent to 4-6 cruise missiles or ballistic missiles) can cut the transport rate of a supply node by nearly 2/3rds during the strike and 1/3rd up to an hour after the initial strike.



Worried or not, those are the capabilities it has. Pakistan doesn't need the whole missile anyhow--just the guidance systems.

One hour is not an effective strike. Without the destruction of the facility it is nearly a nuisance.

The fabled radar seeker, where is it? Not even one test on a ship which would be useless against discriminating ground targets.

 

[trackwhack]

AFAIK the DF-21D is equipped with radar-based terminal guidance systems that let it hit moving targets with a CEP of under 100m and stationary targets with a CEP of under 60m using a spiraling, quasi-ballistic trajectory. The gyroscopes are there.

Yes. And our kinetic kill ABM systems are piloted by hybrid hamsters from mars. Do you even know what a quasi ballistic trajectory is? The df 21 is a ballistic missile stuck with a low yield nuke, setup to fall somewhere near a carrier. Go check what a quasi ballistic trajectory is before mouthing off bull crap.

 

[farhan_9909]

the whole cold war doctrine is disturbed with just a 60km missile

imagine the reaction after SLBM's and SLCM onto the Kpc-3 and Qing class submarine

 

[sayareakd]

what is the possibility of india-pak going into war?

yess more kargil were expected if we would have nt struck in the internal problems

but i don't expect anything from india considering there past..wasnt when the MKI was forced back after the mumbai attack..indian official admitted that it was a technical error.and a mistake enter.problem was we didnt had bvr that time otherwise mki would have never managed to go back

expect kargil type of war around 2020 again from pakistan side..

the cold war by india is just to appease people and parties like shiv sena.

1965 was miscalculation and so was 1999 kargil, 1971 you guys attack first. I wonder next miscalculation and you guys are only in history books as a nation.

 

[JBH22]

Why wage war against Pakistan and put our progress in jeopardy let Nato and Talibans take care.

 

[farhan_9909]

Why wage war against Pakistan and put our progress in jeopardy let Nato and Talibans take care.

you will get alot of likes for this statement my friend

 

[JBH22]

you will get alot of likes for this statement my friend

Cry me a river for that

 

[farhan_9909]

Cry me a river for that

does your official think so as well?

i hope they do think so

 

[Ray]

This Cold Start doctrine is highly questionable. It is all too dependent on Pakistan reacting in a certain manner to IAs 5-70 km incursions into Pakistani territory. What if Pak military reacts differently and immediately goes nuclear? Yes, in the end India might outshoot Pakistan in a nuclear shootout but at a very high cost to India.

What India should be developing and learning is Israeli style (or a some extent American style) covert actions against external threats. India should be strengthening its external security agency to the level of the Mossad, CIA and their Special Forces (a military force on its own uninhibited by laws of war). An formidable ability to do tit-for-tat unconventional action and to disable key enemy infrastructure deep within enemy territory (with full deniability). The Cold Start and the IA conventional forces should be there simply to deter an all-out Pakistani response to covert actions (I think nuclear weapons can do a better job here)...

Simplistically put, in any campaign/ battle, the advance is not on one single front. If it were so, then the adversary would be able to position his mobile/ blocking forces along that line of advance and the whole campaign would become a slugfest with no tangible result.

The crux of any battle is what is known as 'reserve management' wherein whether in defence or attack, the reserves are positioned to change the 'combat ratio' wherein the adversary's plan is brought to nought because, at the critical moment by moving in the reserves, the strength becomes too much to overwhelm.

Therefore, when attacking, since the attacker has the initiative, he moves on a multiple thrust line, they being the Main (which is what will change the complexion of battle), but at the same time to fool the adversary and make him commit his reserves prematurely or incorrect, have a subsidiary thrust, and, ideally a diversionary thrust and even a feint. The cardinal principle of all these thrusts is that they must appear to be similar. If they are not similar, then the enemy is not kept guessing and thus not fooled and can judiciously position his reserves and block the main thrust.

The above would indicate that in the fog of war, which is the Main cannot be discerned at the word 'go'. It takes time since the diversionary and the feint would peter out and will allow the enemy to have some idea where the real action is going on. This time lapse, as a thumb rule, could be between 48 to 72 hours.

Therefore, it would be safe to assume that Pakistan would not launch a nuclear war immediately after the Indian forces commence the Cold Start or whatever it is called.

The rest of your suggestions are valuable.

 

[JBH22]

does your official think so as well?

i hope they do think so

I speak for myself why extrapolate with official stance,are you here to speak for Pakistan govt or to express your views.

 

[farhan_9909]

I speak for myself why extrapolate with official stance,are you here to speak for Pakistan govt or to express your views.

just wanted to ask

answer with just yes or no was expected

 

[JBH22]

well i do agree pak won't go nuclear direct

we do have a very good conventional forces and assets

and it is nt as easy as you guys speak so otherwise india would have attacked pak

as far as i know over the past years paf has violated india airspace more than 10 times more,has killed many indian border soldiers.and are killing more
bt nothing from indian side

we had gone for kargil kind of war.nothing from indian side apart from kargil front..otherwise they could attack lahore and other parts of pakistan

So you do agree its most of the time that its Pakistan who creates shit and India is peaceful nation

 

[opesys]

.................
as far as i know over the past years paf has violated india airspace more than 10 times more,has killed many indian border soldiers.and are killing more
bt nothing from indian side

..................

When the Indian side is holding it's fire respecting the cease fire which was mutually agreed upon, Pakistani army sneakily killing Indian soldiers is not an act of bravery...neither is it called war...it is terrorism, height of cowardliness!

 

[Ray]

well i do agree pak won't go nuclear direct

we do have a very good conventional forces and assets

and it is nt as easy as you guys speak so otherwise India would have attacked pak

If you look at the history of wars with Pakistan, you would find that India does not attack.

It is Pakistan which attacks India, except maybe 1971.

1. First War immediately after Independence - Pakistan military with tribal hordes.
2. 1962 - Kutch and then Op Gibraltar of Pakistan.
3. Kargil. Too recent to recount.

India will not attack Pakistan and that is why inspite of grave provocations India has tried to talk peace.

And Manmohan is no Indira Gandhi.

That is why there has been no attack.

We are a nation wedded to Peace.

as far as i know over the past years paf has violated india airspace more than 10 times more,has killed many indian border soldiers.and are killing more
bt nothing from indian side

we had gone for kargil kind of war.nothing from indian side apart from kargil front..otherwise they could attack lahore and other parts of pakistan

You are not uptodate on the issue of cross LC firing.

By enlarging the conflict to Lahore or other parts, India would not have had the moral authority as she had to put Pakistan in the international doghouse. In every other war, there was silence over who is culprit. In the Kargil War, every single country blamed Pakistan, so much so, Mian Nawaz Sharif had to run to the US. Even in Pakistan, notwithstanding jingoism, there has been many articles, even by military professionals, lamenting the stupidity of Musharraf.

 

[sayareakd]

well i do agree pak won't go nuclear direct

we do have a very good conventional forces and assets

and it is nt as easy as you guys speak so otherwise india would have attacked pak

as far as i know over the past years paf has violated india airspace more than 10 times more,has killed many indian border soldiers.and are killing more
bt nothing from indian side

we had gone for kargil kind of war.nothing from indian side apart from kargil front..otherwise they could attack lahore and other parts of pakistan

that proves that you guys are insane and are savages. Nukes in your hand is bad for world peace.