Pakistan source of explosives

Dovah

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Nothing surprising but what baffles me is even with evidence against Pakistan why US is paying an "ally" that is actively plotting against its interests, perhaps they don't have a choice(supply lines for Afghanistan).

A Senate bill includes funds to train border guards and customs officials in Pakistan and Afghanistan. It also supports agricultural extension programs that encourage Pakistani farmers to use alternative fertilizers.
This money would be used to by even more explosives I think, if US thinks common Pakistanis don't hate it, then it hasn't learnt much in 10 years.
 
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thakur_ritesh

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Nothing surprising but what baffles me is even with evidence against Pakistan why US is paying an "ally" that is actively plotting against its interests, perhaps they don't have a choice(supply lines for Afghanistan).
i think its really a question of geo-strategic considerations and no more.

US does see the pakistani utility in the long run in a region which has china, india, a'stan, energy rich CAR/ME in its vicinity.

as far as i can see, americans are seeing mid to long term and they will be anyways out of this region so why buy an enemy in the long run. once americans drastically scale down their ops in a'stan and stop the drone attacks in pakistan it wont take long for the pakistani establishment to change the narrative towards the US from one being anti to not so anti.

just look at how the rhetoric between the two has dramatically scaled down, and americans are more putting the blame on mullen and one of the mullen's parting shot included the need of addressing the kashmir issue, the long standing demand of the pakistanis.

americans are clever enough to play all sides!
 

ejazr

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Agree with you on that thakur_ritesh,

I wouldn't be surprised if the recent catching of a senior Haqqani leader was done with covert help from the ISI. (NATO captures top Haqqani network elder)

The rhetoric has started coming down dramatically since then. The PA/ISI has basically said look, we can deliver you the Haqqanis and safeguard your interests, and here is a token gesture as well. The US wants to scale down with some sort of guaranteed presence or military bases in Afghanistan and if the PA/ISI (i.e. the Haqqanis) can guarantee that, then they will take it.

Here is what Hillary Clinton had to say on a Q&A session about Pakistan, very instructive and disappointment for those who think US-Pakistan relations have finished.

QUESTION: But to get to the fun part, my question involves the fact that since 9/11 our country has had a policy where anybody who harbors terrorists is considered a terrorist themselves. And it's now become pretty evident that Pakistan has been harboring the Haqqani Network for a while, not just harboring them but even helping them.

So my question to you as our chief diplomat is: How do you plan on balancing the pressure that we need to put on Pakistan to stop that with the fact that we also need them as an ally in the war on terror? And thank you again.

SECRETARY CLINTON: Thank you very much. And I think your question sums up the challenge and the policy that we have been pursuing. Our relationship with Pakistan is critical to the ongoing stability and peace of the region, as well as the fight against terrorism. And I think it is important to remind ourselves that Pakistanis have paid a much greater price in the war against terrorism and in the violence perpetrated on them over the last 10 years than, thankfully, we have. Nearly 30,000 people have been killed – civilians and military, scores of bombing attacks all over the country in places from mosques to markets to universities to police stations.

So the Pakistani people are trying to navigate through a very difficult security environment. And I like to remind myself and my colleagues of that because they have a great stake in trying to end terrorism against themselves, but they bring to their fight against terrorism deep concerns about the relationship with India, about what happens in Afghanistan after U.S. and coalition troops draw down, what happens in the greater region that could destabilize them further.

So it's a challenging position for us to be in and to advocate. But if you, for example, looked at Admiral Mullen's entire testimony, where he did express deep concerns about ties between the Pakistani Government and terrorist groups, including the Haqqani Network, and the absolute necessity for us to continue to work at this relationship, there were two sides to his address to the Congress.

Now, I also think it's important to take a little historical review. If you go on YouTube, you can see Sirajuddin Haqqani with President Reagan at the White House, because during the war against the Soviets in Afghanistan, the United States Government, through the CIA, funded jihadis, funded groups like the Haqqanis to cross the border or to, within Afghanistan, be part of the fight to drive the Soviets out and bring down the Soviet Union.

So when I meet for many hours, as I do, with Pakistani officials, they rightly say, "You're the ones who told us to cooperate with these people. You're the one who funded them. You're the ones who equipped them. You're the ones who used them to bring down the Soviet Union by driving them out of Afghanistan. And we are now both in a situation that is highly complex and difficult to extricate ourselves from." That is how they see it.


And they also have used groups in the past to support their ongoing conflict with India over Kashmir. And when I became Secretary of State, they were trying to basically appease the Pakistani Taliban who were attacking them. So they were trying to draw a distinction between the good terrorists and the bad terrorists, because we had funded the good terrorists together. And so they were dealing with this network of terrorism that had been better organized and directed because of al-Qaida, which brought a lot more funding into the border area between Afghanistan and Pakistan and much more of a sense of mission, because bin Ladin and those who worked with him had a very highly developed idea about how to inflict damage on the United States and others.

So one of our first rounds of discussions with the Pakistanis was how it was not in their interest to permit terrorists to take over territory, something they thought would appease them, which obviously did not and could not. So they began moving troops off their Indian border. They began going after the Pakistani Taliban.

So I think it's important that we appreciate their perspective about where we both are right now. That in no way excuses the fact that they are making a serious, grievous, strategic error supporting these groups, because you think that you can keep a wild animal in the backyard and it will only go after your neighbor? We have too many stories where that doesn't turn out like that.

So I think that we are pressing and pushing on every lever that we have in the relationship, and we have to be effective in trying to achieve our strategic goals, which is to prevent any attacks against us emanating from Pakistan, as well as to try to help stabilize Pakistan against this internal threat, and to create the best possible circumstances for Afghanistan to be able to have control over its own future. Those are all extremely difficult, and we are learning it, each piece of that, every single day.
 

agentperry

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a nation which see 10-12 hours of power cut daily(both for business and people) and neighbor afghanistan + got itself radicalized to limits, have no other option so feasible than making death toys.
 

Blackwater

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a nation which see 10-12 hours of power cut daily(both for business and people) and neighbor afghanistan + got itself radicalized to limits, have no other option so feasible than making death toys.
There was no electricity in lahore last night people have come to roads and ransacked govt property clash with police. Guess what, still no electricity lollllllllllllllllllll

after karachi, lahore also has no electricity:laugh::laugh::laugh::pound::pound::pound:
 

thakur_ritesh

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Ejazr,

There is another aspect worth considering.

With a battered economy, will the Obama administration go to the American public to seek votes with military operations in Pakistan which could involve bombers bombing and foots on ground which if it goes wrong could further dampen their prospects, which then will be projected as an unnecessary burden on the economy and a crucial ally in a very sensitive location lost, another failure on the foreign policy front and more ammo for the republicans.

From where I see, republicans will be pushing for military operations in Pakistan but would the democrats be as forth coming, I seriously doubt.

After what happened in a'stan in the last one month, Obama administration had to do a public point scoring and not be seen as one which will take things lying down and I think the objective is met. The high voltage rhetoric heavily conditioned the aid, which becomes a good scoring and selling point with the public, the ally in WoT is not lost, PA/ISI which were till recent past taking a beating have re-emerged as national heroes in Pakistan, so it seems it was a win-win for both.

I am sure haqqanis will be asked to take it easy from here on.
 

Zebra

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I think Secretary Clinton should reply to Pakistan that as you said - US equipped and funded Haqqni network in past .
Now lets US destroy the same network which was funded and eqqipped in past by US .
 

Zebra

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There was no electricity in lahore last night people have come to roads and ransacked govt property clash with police. Guess what, still no electricity lollllllllllllllllllll

after karachi, lahore also has no electricity:laugh::laugh::laugh::pound::pound::pound:

btw , Why they need electricity ? too much luxury for them . :D
They are ready to eat grass for 1000 years . :p
Let them live with their wish .
:amen:
 
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Blackwater

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btw , Why they need electricity ? too much luxury for them . :D
They are ready to eat grass for 1000 years . :p
Let them live with their wish .
:amen:
Only country in the world who love history and successfully achieved negative growth path towards stone age and going very fast in history
 

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