Pakistan likely to use Nuclear weapons on India "a few days" into war: US ambassador

Discussion in 'Internal Security' started by LETHALFORCE, May 30, 2011.

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  1. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    Pakistan likely to use Nuclear weapons on India "a few days" into war: US ambassador (Wikileaks) | Real Time News India

    The US ambassador to Pakistan, Anne Patterson, argued strongly with her Government to sell Pakistan more F-16 fighter jets to, ironically, prevent a nuclear war between India and Pakistan.

    Patterson, in a 2009 cable, pointed out that Pakistan is likely to use Nuclear weapons against India in a matter a few days if the two countries go to war with each other again, because Pakistan would start losing the war by then.

    "To overcome overwhelming Indian military superiority, Pakistan developed both its nuclear and missile program and its air power," she wrote two years ago, according to Wikileaks.

    She pointed out that India had nearly double the number of jets (736 to 370 jets) that Pakistan has and many of them have the ability to fire missiles at targets that cannot be seen directly in front or are beyond the visual range. Pakistani jets, she points out, can only fire at targets in sight and urged the US to help Pakistan overcome the power imbalance.

    She pointed out that a Pakistan which is evenly or nearly evenly matched with India is less likely to attack India with Nuclear weapons than one which felt it stands no chance.

    "F-16 aircraft, armed with AMRAAM [beyond visual-range missiles], essentially buy time to delay Pakistan considering the nuclear option in a conflict with India. Given India's overwhelming military superiority, this would only be a few days, but these days would allow critical time to mediate and prevent nuclear conflict," she said.

    The Ambassador's comments make it clear that despite political statements on "no first use" of Nuclear weapons, the Americans expect the Pakistanis to use Nuclear weapons against India in case of a war, albeit a few days after the war starts.

    Patterson pointed out that, as of 2009, Pakistan didn't stand much of a chance of winning a war against India unless it used Nukes.

    "Pakistan's shortfalls in training and tactics multiply India's edge. Pakistan also plans to buy/jointly produce 150 inferior JF-17 fighters from China, but it is unclear how they will pay for them. Meanwhile, India plans to acquire 126 multi-purpose fighters (F-18 or equivalent) that will give India significant new technologies and further expand its air superiority over Pakistan," she worried.

    In another cable, she also pointed out that India will not be threatened by the F-16s as it is in the process of buying even more advanced jets.

    "The escalation of Indo-Pak tensions following the Mumbai attacks demonstrated to the Pakistanis that the threat from India still exists. The Pakistani F-16 program, however, will be no match for India's proposed purchase of F-18 or equivalent aircraft," she said.

    She also pointed out that her purpose in recommending the sale was not simply to even the odds against India.

    "We do deny Pakistan requests for arms sales that could upset the regional balance of power," she argued, adding that on February 20, she had recommended that Washington should reject Pakistan's request to buy the Coastal targeting Suppression System, which gives AGM-84 Harpoon ship missiles the capability of hitting land targets.

    "This acquisition would have given Pakistan an overt offensive capability to threaten India and served no counter insurgency purpose," she said.

    But, she said, the Pakistani army must be beefed up to help the US in fighting terror.

    "Our goal is to enable Pakistan to fight the militants using Pakistani safe havens so that we will not have to deploy U.S. troops to do the job. Post agrees that F-16s are not the ideal tool for targeting militants and we are working to enhance Pakistan's combat helicopter fleet/capabilities.

    "Pakistan already is using its F-16s in counter-insurgency operations in the tribal areas, but its inability to executive precision targeting or fly at night creates counter-productive civilian casualties and minimizes operations. The new/MLU aircraft and their munitions packages (with JDAMs and GBUs) will improve Pakistan's precision strike and night vision capability," she pointed out.

    Coincidentally, India's defence minister AK Antony raised a red flag on Saturday over Pakistan milking the US' War on Terror funds to strengthen its defences against India.

    Giving into the demand, the Obama administration last year supplied 17 out of the 18 F-16 fighter jets that Pakistan wanted. F-16s are one of the most widely used fighter jets in the World, with deployments in most countries that buy jets from others.
     
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  3. Blackwater

    Blackwater Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Nothing new, we new begger will show there aukat if war broke...
     
  4. JBH22

    JBH22 Senior Member Senior Member

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    In the end we'll fvck them Uncle Sam no matter how sophisticated weaponry Pakistan will lose they forgot the M-48 Patton tanks which was considered to be among the best but IA destroyed it with outdated PT-76.
     
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  5. nitesh

    nitesh Mob Control Manager Stars and Ambassadors

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    So what comes open is that US supplied the AMRAAMs to be used against India, in spite of our objections, and showing it as war on terror support.

    But I don't think pakistan will wait for "few days". They will use it at the first signs of there defenses breaking
     
  6. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Great logic Ms Patterson!!!

    First a war between India and Pakistan will not last a few days. It will be less than 10 days. India will not give Pak an excuse to go nuclear. Use of tactical nukes by Pak will not stop India from winning the war.
     
  7. Solid Beast

    Solid Beast New Member

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    []][][][][][][][][][
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2011
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  8. Sikh_warrior

    Sikh_warrior Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    im not worried about the first nuke strike by pakistan on india, that will happen and we will take the hit and devastation!

    im worried about the retaliation by india....

    1. will it be allowed to carry out by the world community?
    2. will india bow to the pressure and will not carry out the retaliation?
    3. do we have the 2nd strike capabilities?

    ...forgot to mention the Balls of Steel (political will), we need to carry out the 2nd strike!!
     
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  9. maomao

    maomao Veteran Hunter of Maleecha Senior Member

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    I am sure if this govt. is in power, and we are struck first, MMS and Congress thugs will first send dossiers and then do peace meetings (given the fact that their own kith and kin are not vaporised; I have mentioned few scenarios/reasons in one of my earlier posts, regarding why this GOI does not act/react against terrorism on the same lines that if they and their near and dear ones are not hurt/affected then the business will go on as usual - same scams, looting, food rotting and people dieing of hunger et al)!

    However, few scenarios will arise, after the Nuke attack by failed state pakistan:

    1) When India gets biT$%e slapped by the failed jihadi/terrorist state and we do not respond by annihilation of the "pious" people; for sure, our shameless politician will get pat on the back from the US and the west, our media will be singing GOI's tune, people will be angry but would not do anything, Anna will do some bhuk hadtal, soon media black outs will occur over the real suffering of the countrymen caused by nuke attacks; moreover, US and west will put some sham sanctions on the failed state and its terrorist army (aka Al-Qiada aka pakistan army); our politicians, media-men (Burkha Dutt, vinod sharma, Vir sanghvi types), and Babus will get hefty sums into their swiss banks for playing fetch with US, then the business will go as-usual, eventually US will again start supplying DOLLARS and weapons on the pretext of WOT, our shameless politicians will act as if their mothers have been rapped in front of them and they could only watched as they are peaceful (which they are not when dealing with their own poor countrymen) and eventually they will go and ring the UN's door bell and cry out crocodile tear for Justice for our countrymen, therefore trying hard to divert direct conflict by the naive citizenry!! End result nothing and we get bumped and politicians and foreign mafiaso bosses operating in India get richer by few million/billion electronic dollars in Switzerland/Lichtenstein/Cayman Island/Mauritius/Hong Kong.

    or

    2) Armed forces will realize enough is enough, that too in unison against corrupt/nepotist GOI lead by corrupt, dumb, silly and party-hopper coterie of thugs. Soon, suitcases containing the red buttons will be forcefully taken form the Maino gang; if GOI protests by unleashing media blitzkrieg against the armed forces, then the armed forces would react swiftly to save their honor and save the country from nihilistic approach of the GOI (and containing the struggle between the GOI and armed forces on the pretext of NUKE attack on pakistan going viral internationally); immediately, few executions of top politicians will occur to give out a clear message to "Lungi Chap" sycophant politicians and babus, and they will run for their lives, leaving everything behind everything including corridors of power, then the COAS will assume command - what will follow will not just sooth the wound of the countrymen but will be a spectacle to be watched i.e. pakistanis aka delusional terrorists get vaporized and pakistan the "fort of islam" being turned into a nuclear wasteland!!
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2011
  10. nrj

    nrj Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    1. World community or anyone else is not in charge of our strategic assets. This is no Pakistan.

    2. Nuclear attack on Indian soil will be responded with nuclear retaliation. Survival postulate is devised to surmount the International/Extraterrestrial pressure.

    3. We have second strike capability. Countries who undermine this aspect of Indian Strategic power are either too weak to be well informed or are smoking hash in some cave.

    ---

    There will be retaliation. Be it Cong or CPI holding the south block.

    Neither Pak nor China will ever mistake of getting that calculation wrong.

    @Topic

    US assigns a hell load of analysis job to its ambassadors all around the world so they come up with a partially futile logic which will address only the temporary situation.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2011
  11. The Messiah

    The Messiah Bow Before Me! Elite Member

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    So yankees are at it again...using threat like pak will use nukes due to military hardware imbalance so there solution is to arm pak so as to balance the power and then cry foul when India doesn't open up to them.
     
  12. LETHALFORCE

    LETHALFORCE Moderator Moderator

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    What will USA do to correct the balance in the future when an MIRV'd ICBM is tested? (it could even be this year).
     
  13. civfanatic

    civfanatic Retired Moderator

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    They'll just give them more F-16s.

    What else can they give? Yanks won't entrust Pak with advanced weaponry like F-35s, since anything in Pakistan usually ends up in Chinese databases. I'm sure the Chinese have also looked at Pak's F-16s in the past, considering that Pakistan first got its Falcons in the 80s when China was considered America's major Asian ally.

    At the current rate, Pakistan will still be receiving JF-17s and F-16s while India is moving into 5th gen.
     
  14. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    If Pakistan nukes India, obviously India should nuke Pakistan back to the early stages of the Indus Valley Civilisation.

    Now, if any country tries to prevent that, then that country, in principle, deserves to get nuked before Pakistan is nuked. If India has ICBM capabilities, no one will try to do something like that. Let us not forget how North Korea showed its fangs to the US and US backed off.
     
  15. civfanatic

    civfanatic Retired Moderator

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    Well, North Korea is not a good example in this case.

    They have no credible nuclear deterrent whatsoever.
     
  16. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Funny and ridiculous argument by Anne Patterson. Pakistan is less likely to attack? Pakistan has been exporting terrorists into India for decades. Is that not attacking India? They are already in the process of attacking India since 1989. Duh!
     
  17. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Well those were unconfirmed reports. If you recall the explosions in 2009 and the Taepo-Dong missiles. I am sure the US knew enough not to risk a conflict.
     
  18. civfanatic

    civfanatic Retired Moderator

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    Taepodong can hardly be considered a threat, especially to the U.S. which is located thousands of km away.

    The main deterrence that North Korea posesses is not nuclear in nature, but a huge assortment of artillery (i.e. many thousands of pieces) aimed at Seoul and major South Korean population centers, which are located very close to the North Korean border.

    The U.S. and North Korea can close to a conflict in 1994, but it was called off because the estimates of civilian casualties in the early phases of the war was in the vicinity of one million. Keep in mind that many of those artillery shells could contain chemical or even biological munitions.
     
  19. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Actually, according to this report, they are a threat: North Korea's Missile Could Hit US
     
  20. civfanatic

    civfanatic Retired Moderator

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    The report itself says that the Taepodongs are highly unreliable and innaccurate.

    I assume that the U.S. Patriot system is capable enough of knocking down a few Taepodongs, most of whom would not land on target anyway.

    North Korea's nuclear bluff is even more of a joke than Pakistan's, which is really saying something.
     
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